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#1
08-05-2006, 09:33 AM
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Travis Hafner Thread
I'm not an Indians fan, but I have to take the time to point out not only how incredibly dangerous this man is at the plate, but how underrated he is as well.
I hate to pick on David Ortiz because he's a phenomenal hitter, but he's the poster boy for MLB right now, and generally regarded as one of the best "clutch hitters" in recent memory. Yet check out some of these stats: Close & Late: Hafner - .386/.500/.727/1.227 Ortiz - .302/.362/.778/1.140 RISP Hafner - .311/.457/.755/1.212 Ortiz - .303/.422/.582/1.004 RISP W/ 2 OUT Hafner - .300/.500/.800/1.300 Ortiz - .288/.431/.558/.989 Hafner with the bases loaded this season is 7/10 with 5 grand slams. That's friggin insane. The single season grand slam record is 6, held by Don Mattingly. Hafner has led the American League in OPS+ in each of the past 2 years, and may very well do it for the third consecutive season this year. To put that into perspective, Alex Rodriguez, David Ortiz, and Vladimir Guerrero have never once led their league in OPS+, let alone do it 2 years in a row. Manny Ramirez has only done it once. Frank Thomas has done it 3 times, but never in consecutive seasons. Hafner is criminally underrated. He wasn't even placed on the All-Star team this year. 
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#2
08-05-2006, 09:43 AM
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Well, he was criminally underrated last year and the year before too. It's kind of a badge of honor and/or bone of contention among Tribe fans. He's our Mike Sweeney or Edgar Martinez, and he WILL make the All-Star team some day soon.
That's fine -- I would just as soon have opposing pitchers not know who he is and let his career 150 OPS+ do the talking, but alas, opposing managers know him all too well. He draws tons of walks when he isn't hitting the hell outta the ball, like our old DH/1B did a half dozen years ago. Part of his "problem" is that he has no defensive value at all, and likely won't ever again. Even Thome had SOME defensive value, altough Tribe fans who remember him at third base may dispute that. He compares well to other premium DHs like Ortiz and Thome and is about as great as Frank Thomas was back in his heyday. Maybe a little less effective than Big Hurt was, but not by much. I'm happy to have Pronk on my Yahoo fantasy team. Last edited by Ytown Tribe fan; 08-05-2006 at 09:50 AM.
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#3
08-06-2006, 07:32 AM
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Who should really be P.O.d about this are Ranger fans.
Imagine having Hafner at DH to go along with Blalock, Teixeira, Young, Wilkerson & Kinsler. December 6, 2002: Travis Hafner traded by the Texas Rangers with Aaron Myette to the Cleveland Indians for Einar Diaz and Ryan Drese. Another of John Hart's great trades. That has to go down as one of the worst trades of all time. As I recall Hart has a couple of the other worst trades too. For instance, while Hart was Cleveland's GM: November 18, 1998: Brian Giles traded by the Cleveland Indians to the Pittsburgh Pirates for Ricardo Rincon. July 28, 2000: Richie Sexson traded by the Cleveland Indians with a player to be named later, Kane Davis, and Paul Rigdon to the Milwaukee Brewers for Bob Wickman, Steve Woodard, and Jason Bere. The Cleveland Indians sent Marco Scutaro (August 30, 2000) to the Milwaukee Brewers to complete the trade.
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citizen of the Cosmos Last edited by baseball junkie; 08-06-2006 at 07:43 AM.
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#4
08-06-2006, 09:44 AM
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#5
08-06-2006, 10:10 AM
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True Wickman has some value. But I'm pretty sure the homegrown David Riske could have done the job possibly as well and cheaper and without having to give up Sexson. Hart also once traded the 23-year-old Sean Casey for Dave Burba.
But back to Hafner....biggest All-Star snub of the decade?
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citizen of the Cosmos
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#6
08-06-2006, 12:25 PM
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I'm a big Pronk supporter. He's having a better year than Ortiz but since Ortiz and his Sox are fighting for 1st place and the Indians have been out since about May, Ortiz gets all the press and all the MVP hype, especially from guys like Joe Morgan.
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#8
08-06-2006, 04:51 PM
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#9
08-06-2006, 07:32 PM
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Not sure if it's the biggest ASG snub of the decade, since Pronk only had two full seasons under his belt before this one. There have been plenty of players with great careers who never made an ASG, and many others who had to wait three or four years before making the All Star team, including several HoFers.
There are also about a dozen HoFers who played well past 1933 who never made an All-Star team, although most were in decline by then. Two big exceptions are Jim Bottomley and Waite Hoyt, who were still playing very well for five years or so after 1933, but never got selected. The best players of the last 20 years or so who were never All-Stars are Tim Salmon, Eric Karros, Todd Zeile, Bill Doran and Greg Gagne. Pronk is a better hitter than all of them.
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#10
08-07-2006, 07:53 PM
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Still Pronk is filthy, it's just one of those where he plays things. If Hafner were in either Boston or NY, of course you'd hear of him. Although, if the Indians followed up their 90+ win season, with some contention this year, that would help too. Them being 16 games under .500 hurts no matter where he plays ie. being clutch for a loser isn't as clutch.
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 Since the Tigers have already lost a '09 World Series. THIS year must be PAYBACK!!!!! GO GET EM TIGERS!!!!!!
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#11
08-07-2006, 07:55 PM
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yea Jamie Walker made him take some pretty ugly swings
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