Ebbets Field in L.A.

[EbtsFldGuy]

Having read conflicting accounts of whether Dodger Stadium has any commemoration of the years in Brooklyn, I called their switchboard last Friday to try to connect to the Dodger Museum.

I was told that it has been inactive for 3 years now. When I asked if there is any commemoration of Ebbets Field or the Brooklyn years, I got a vague reply to the effect of yes, there are pictures.

To those of you who have committed what some may deem the mortal sin of patronizing the Dodgers in CA, can you offer any first hand report of whether Dodger Stadium has any such memorial of the glory years at 55 Sullivan Place?

[DODGER DEB]

I can tell you EbtsFldGuy, that prior to 1984 it was indeed a mortal sin to even mention the word "Brooklyn" in that left coast Statium.

We attended all the Old Timers Days out there from the first one in 1971 through 1984, because all OUR players took part in them, and it used to drive me crazy that there was never any mention of OUR BROOKLYN TEAMS, anywhere! I personally brought this to the attention of Peter O'Malley and did some serious battle over it. Of course all OUR guys that attended the Old Timers games were given Dodger uniforms, but hats that said "LA"; another thing that drove us nuts.

FINALLY in 1984, when we went out there to participate in the retiring of Pee Wee's # 1 and Drysdale's # 53, a few weeks prior to their being inducted into the Baseball Hall of Fame, I was "shown" the 1955 World Championship Pennant, OUR World Championship Flag, which was placed among the others they had on display. AND, OUR guys were given hats with a "B" on them.

I know Peter gave the 1955 World Championship Flag to the Brooklyn Dodger Baseball Hall of Fame, which is at KeySpan Park, in the mid-'90's, and with the sale of the team a few years years ago, I seriously doubt that anyone connected with the present ownership even knows where Brooklyn is, let alone OUR rich history that preceeded 1958.

c.

[Dodger Blue]

Dare I say, that I attended a Dodgers game earlier this year in Los Angeles. I did spend a good bit of time looking around Dodger Stadium for anything that might represent their history in Brooklyn and there really is very little.

The Dodgers have a very large store on the top level of the Stadium behind home plate and there were a few items for sale that mentioned Brooklyn (mostly the hats) but 95% or more only refers to the Los Angeles era.

They even had the nerve to be selling a shirt that stated "Dodgers baseball, established 1958" which I wanted to rip down and throw at somebody (but that is another story).

There is some small homage paid to the stars of Brooklyn that have made the Hall of Fame. But how could they avoid mentioning that Robinson, Reese, and Snider played for them?

There is also a small store on the lower lever next to The Vin Scully Press Boxes (at least they have some class) that sells collectable items but even here almost everything was about LA
(although they did have for sale that really nice item with the figurines of the 1955 Championship team).

Other than that, I am sad to say, everything I saw only refers to the "glory" of their years in Los Angeles.

[donzblock]

That's fine. Los Angeles can go to hell (from what I read about the increasing size of its Skid Row, it is doing just that), and there should be no mention of Brooklyn in that city of thieves. The Dodgers, the real ones, died in 1957.

[Paulmcall]

As some of you may know, I have been searching high and low for a decent photo of the rotunda.

The L A Dodgers do have one and I have contacted them about any other Ebbets Field memorabilia they may have.

The fact that they held on to this stuff shows someone had a sense of their heritage. It's odd that the Brooklyn Library, nor the Brooklyn Historical Society or Hall of Fame have a photo of the inside of that rotunda.

I even tried the Sporting News and they have a shot of Charlie Ebbets and four other big shots in the rotunda with a flower arrangement behind them when the park opened in 1913.
You really can't see anything of the chandelier or the floor or ceiling.

I hate to say it but I did have to talk to them.

[EbtsFldGuy]

Though I gave it some thought as a youth, I never did make it to the seminary.

So, while I lack the ecclesiastical power to grant absolution, I'll grant layman's absolution to those of you who have confessed to a visit to Dodger Stadium, or to contact with the pretenders out there.

Your efforts were all in a noble cause, sister and brothers of this Board.

How sad that the Chavez Ravine crowd cannot find it in their corporate hearts to recognize the place where the storied Dodger tradition began - a place which today sits in sad testimony to what was!

[Paulmcall]

Some of the best Dodger memorabilia is at the Brooklyn Hall of Fame at Keyspan Park at Coney Island.
There is also a small display case in the Brooklyn Marriott down by the bridge that is on loan from the Historical Society.
That stuff I saw in Feb.
If it would help get my book done, I'd go to L.A. too but it doesn't look like I'll have to.

[Mike Nealon]

That is why I've started ebbets-field.com, if you look at the front page "Preserving Brooklyn's Lost Shrine", it should not be forgotten. Those who feel that strong about the heritage of Ebbets Field and the Brooklyn Dodgers, and heck Brooklyn of yesteryear, we should bond together. And make sure all sorts of artifacts are preserved for generations to come. If we rely on the L.A. Dodgers let's face facts the Brooklyn Dodger past will die with people like yourself. Perhaps starting a S.A.B.R. chapter for Brooklyn Dodger fans? Just a thought.

[DODGER DEB]

Most of what is still around is in the Brooklyn Dodgers Hall of Fame at KeySpan Park.

I can't believe there is anything out in La La Land that still belongs to us. If, in fact, they do have a photo of Our Rotunda.....great, I say let's get it! Perhaps they might also have some long lost files, and don't know what they are, which we might be able to persuade them to pass on to us.

Any other precious Brooklyn items are probably in the hands of people like us!

c.

[Paulmcall]

I have a message out for the guy in charge of that Brooklyn stuff.

I'll let you know what they have when I find out.
I agree. It would be nice to bring any lost photos back to their place of origin.

I was sort of disappointed in what I saw (more like what I didn't see) when I came to Brooklyn to do research.

Perhaps some photos were lifted over the years at the places I was at. It would be easy to do. (P.S. I didnt' swipe any).

Of course, it didn't help that the Eagle went under either.

[Dodger Blue]

I suppose the LA Dodgers do maintain some historical records and photos in their files. If for no other reason than to start lawsuits against people in Brooklyn trying to use "their" name (as they did against the Brooklyn Dodger bar a few years ago). It is just that they don't seem to find any need to show it off to the public.

In fairness to the Dodger organization however (not that I want to be fair to them, but...), part of this may be due to the nature of LA fans who seem to be among the most apathetic I have ever seen. The game I went to was against the Phillies early in the season (when both teams were still thought to have a chance at the division title). It was a weekday evening game but the stands were never more than half full and most "fans" were gone by the 5th inning.

Another good repository of Brooklyn Dodger artifacts is the Hall of Fame in Cooperstown. They at least realize the importance of Brooklyn's contribution to the game.

I agree with Mike, that it would be a good idea to try to catalog or bring together whatever we can of Ebbets Field and Dodger history. Perhaps this can be somehow tied into the 50th anniversary celebration. I am concerned like many of you that when those of us who were around to see them are gone, will Brooklyn continue to remember their Dodgers?

[Paulmcall]

Well, I'm hoping my book can be entertaining as well as educational to people about the Brooklyn Dodger legacy.
In my research, I've noticed the Hall of Fame did not have a photo of the rotunda and they would like one!

Since L.A. does have one (and who knows what else), I am trying to go into the devil's den and find out what I can.
Wish me luck.

[EbtsFldGuy]

When a friend told me in July that he would to to LA and visit Dodger Stadium in August, I asked him to see if he could find any signs or mention of the Brooklyn years.

Last night he told me that when he was there last week, he asked an usher if the stadium had any commemoration of Ebbets Field or the team's Brooklyn history. The immediate answer he got was to go to the gift shop and he might find something there.

Then my friend clarified his question, by first asking the usher if he was familiar with the entire stadium. Told that he was, my friend asked if there were any photos or other signs of Ebbets Field or the pre-1958 Dodgers.

The answer was a solid "No."

People like that probably consider people like us odd to still be interested in and lament the passing of a franchise that died 46 years ago.

Sad.

[donzblock]

I went to Dodgers Stadium in 1967 and don't apologize one whit for doing so. I went there to boo the Dodgers, and boo the hell out of them I did. The Dodgers lost, Willie Davis with his "batting title swing" struck out several times, and the game was very satisfying. The LA fans appeared to be moribund and incapable of understanding the significance of a boo directed at their team.

[DODGER DEB]

Professor, believe me when I tell you, THEY are incapable of understanding ANYTHING connected to this game WE love so much!

As I have said before, sitting among them is pure torture for fans like US! It raises your blood pressure listening to them - and then you keep shaking your head and get angry all over again; that THIS is WHAT they left US for.......

OUR DODGERS were LOVE and LOYALTY to US. To THEM, it is just another place to go.....if they have nothing better to do!

c.

[EbtsFldGuy]

A piece on New York 1 cable TV station today showed yet another tangible sign of the Dodgers' once having lived here.

The piece featured Greenwood Cemetery in Brooklyn, and showed graves of famous NY'ers interred there: among them, FAO Schwartz, Leonard Bernstein, and our own Charles Ebbets! His headstone was shown, with the simple "Ebbets" standing silently and eloquently alone.

The cemetery website (listed below) offers a walking tour, in case you're back in Brooklyn and are interested.

The symbolism of the Ebbets grave being in Brooklyn and O"Malley's being in Culver City, CA speaks for itself.


http://www.green-wood.com/

[donzblock]

The symbolism becomes even richer when you realize that those California faults will eventually move O'Malley to the bottom of the ocean floor or Alaska.

[Elvis]

That's fine. Los Angeles can go to hell (from what I read about the increasing size of its Skid Row, it is doing just that), and there should be no mention of Brooklyn in that city of thieves.

Nice post.

[Elvis]

...part of this may be due to the nature of LA fans who seem to be among the most apathetic I have ever seen.

Hmmm, that's not nice.

[Elvis]

Professor, believe me when I tell you, THEY are incapable of understanding ANYTHING connected to this game WE love so much!

As I have said before, sitting among them is pure torture for fans like US! It raises your blood pressure listening to them - and then you keep shaking your head and get angry all over again; that THIS is WHAT they left US for.......

OUR DODGERS were LOVE and LOYALTY to US. To THEM, it is just another place to go.....if they have nothing better to do!

c.

Yes Mod, all us dumb, spoiled Los Angeles fans have nothing better to do. It's true, we are so stupid that we are incapable of understanding the game of baseball.

[DODGER DEB]

Professor, believe me when I tell you, THEY are incapable of understanding ANYTHING connected to this game WE love so much!

As I have said before, sitting among them is pure torture for fans like US! It raises your blood pressure listening to them - and then you keep shaking your head and get angry all over again; that THIS is WHAT they left US for.......

OUR DODGERS were LOVE and LOYALTY to US. To THEM, it is just another place to go.....if they have nothing better to do!

c.


EVERY WORD, and I do mean EVERY WORD, I wrote then is the ABSOLUTE TRUTH!

I wrote not from something I read, but from what I EXPERIENCED FIRST HAND, sitting in that place....many, many times!

Further, anyone who would, even in jest, put OUR GIL HODGES in the same breath with the "Big O" proves conclusively that they haven't got a clue about where WE are coming from nor how much OUR BROOKYLN DODGERS meant/mean to US...and why WE still fight so hard to this day, to keep their cherished memory alive.

c.

[Dodger Blue]

It may not be nice to refer to LA baseball "fans" as apathetic, but it certainly is true. It seems to me they are far more concerned with getting on the freeway heading home then worrying about "their" team wins the ball game.

How many of you ever left Ebbets Field early?

[DODGER DEB]

It may not be nice to refer to LA baseball "fans" as apathetic, but it certainly is true. It seems to me they are far more concerned with getting on the freeway heading home then worrying about "their" team wins the ball game.

How many of you ever left Ebbets Field early?


Hey, DB, nice to hear from you again! We've missed you!

The answer to your question....

NEVER!!!

c.

[Dodger Blue]

Nice to be back Dodger Deb. Sorry it has been so long.

[Elvis]

EVERY WORD, and I do mean EVERY WORD, I wrote then is the ABSOLUTE TRUTH!

c.

To say that people in Los Angels are "incapable of understading the game of baseball", is quite insulting and inappropriate ESPECIALLY from a moderator! You're basically calling me stupid. If I described the fans in Brooklyn the same way, you'd be all over me saying I'm "crossing the line!" and I better "watch it!".

Why are you allowed to insult us like that???

Respect is a two-way street. When you go around calling Angelinos stupid and apathetic, don't expect respect in return!!

[ColtscorrAL]

To say that people in Los Angels are "incapable of understading the game of baseball", is quite insulting and inappropriate ESPECIALLY from a moderator! You're basically calling me stupid. If I described the fans in Brooklyn the same way, you'd be all over me saying I'm "crossing the line!" and I better "watch it!".

Why are you allowed to insult us like that???

Respect is a two-way street. When you go around calling Angelinos stupid and apathetic, don't expect respect in return!! It should never get personal on a forum. Conversely, you should never take what's posted personally. It's a place to exchange views and while, of course, there's going to be disagreements, it should never be allowed to get personal. There must always be respect for the poster. I can understand the passion many have for what happened when the Dodgers moved. It's understandable. But you've got to remember, not all of had the bond with the team that many on this board had. Some of us are still Dodger fans. I enjoy this site, but lately it's becoming a bit antagonistic and touchy. :waving

[EbtsFldGuy]

To say that people in Los Angels are "incapable of understading the game of baseball", is quite insulting and inappropriate ESPECIALLY from a moderator! You're basically calling me stupid. If I described the fans in Brooklyn the same way, you'd be all over me saying I'm "crossing the line!" and I better "watch it!".

Why are you allowed to insult us like that???

Respect is a two-way street. When you go around calling Angelinos stupid and apathetic, don't expect respect in return!!


Elvis,

Hard to argue with your logic on this one.

[Chelle]

I went to LA Dodger Stadium 2 months ago on a visit. I wanted to get my Dad, a Brooklyn Dodger fan, a T-Shirt. I stole his last brooklyn dodger t-shirt a few years back and it's in rags. I thought it would be nice to get him a replacement one. I figured at Dodger stadium they would have the retro shirts (at every stadium I've ever been to they have retro team shirts....and I just assumed)...but they didn't.

I asked the lady at the team store if she had a Brooklyn Dodger shirt and she started to get antagonistic with me. Asked me if I was one "of those" people (I didn't know what she meant...but reading a bit of this forum...now I know..LOL)

I just wanted to get a shirt for my dad! I didn't see anything on my visit that spoke of the Brooklyn team.

Having lost the Baltimore Colts, I totally can relate to the loss of team. It's heart wrenching. I still root for them...they are my team...always will be.

[Elvis]

I asked the lady at the team store if she had a Brooklyn Dodger shirt and she started to get antagonistic with me. Asked me if I was one "of those" people (I didn't know what she meant...but reading a bit of this forum...now I know..LOL)

I just wanted to get a shirt for my dad! I didn't see anything on my visit that spoke of the Brooklyn team.


Well, Chelle, retro stuff is quite different from relocation stuff. I'm not sure, but I doubt if the St. Louis Rams team shop has any Los Angeles Rams shirts, and the same for the Indianapolis Colts shop. And I can GUARANTEE that the Oakland Raiders team shop doesn't sell LA Raiders gear!

As far as the lady in the Top of the Park shop, I'm sure she's had to deal with some pretty antagonistic and bitter Brooklyn fans in her time there. Can't say I blame her for being at least a little skittish about people asking for Brooklyn merchandise. I'm sure she's gotten an unpleasant earfull on more than one occasion. :)

[Chelle]

True, although a friend of mine did find a Baltimore Colts t-shirt for me in Indy...but I don't think it was at the official store.

Then again, many of the Baltimore fans completely gave up on the Colts when the false Baltimore football team came to town. Brooklyn not having a replacement team....well, I guess the fire burns a bit brighter.

[Yankeebiscuitfan]

I went to LA Dodger Stadium 2 months ago on a visit. I wanted to get my Dad, a Brooklyn Dodger fan, a T-Shirt. I stole his last brooklyn dodger t-shirt a few years back and it's in rags. I thought it would be nice to get him a replacement one. I figured at Dodger stadium they would have the retro shirts (at every stadium I've ever been to they have retro team shirts....and I just assumed)...but they didn't.

I asked the lady at the team store if she had a Brooklyn Dodger shirt and she started to get antagonistic with me. Asked me if I was one "of those" people (I didn't know what she meant...but reading a bit of this forum...now I know..LOL)

I just wanted to get a shirt for my dad! I didn't see anything on my visit that spoke of the Brooklyn team.

Having lost the Baltimore Colts, I totally can relate to the loss of team. It's heart wrenching. I still root for them...they are my team...always will be.


True, although a friend of mine did find a Baltimore Colts t-shirt for me in Indy...but I don't think it was at the official store.

Then again, many of the Baltimore fans completely gave up on the Colts when the false Baltimore football team came to town. Brooklyn not having a replacement team....well, I guess the fire burns a bit brighter..

Wise posts Chelle :clapping

Reading your posts, I remember that I was at Dodger Stadium back in 1995. I wore my Brooklyn Dodgers cap and a Brooklyn Dodgers T-shirt. I sat next to a LA Dodger fan and he was quite enthousiastic about my outfit. So obviously SOME LA Dodgers fans know where their roots are...;)

[ColtscorrAL]

Wise posts Chelle :clapping

Reading your posts, I remember that I was at Dodger Stadium back in 1995. I wore my Brooklyn Dodgers cap and a Brooklyn Dodgers T-shirt. I sat next to a LA Dodger fan and he was quite enthousiastic about my outfit. So obviously SOME LA Dodgers fans know where their roots are...;)While both teams up and left a loyal following, the way Irsay did it created a lot of bitterness. I don't think it would be wise to wear Colts gear to a game in Baltimore. Many of those folks lack a sense of humor when it comes to the BLUE SHOE.

[CaliforniaCajun]

EVERY WORD, and I do mean EVERY WORD, I wrote then is the ABSOLUTE TRUTH!

I wrote not from something I read, but from what I EXPERIENCED FIRST HAND, sitting in that place....many, many times!

Further, anyone who would, even in jest, put OUR GIL HODGES in the same breath with the "Big O" proves conclusively that they haven't got a clue about where WE are coming from nor how much OUR BROOKYLN DODGERS meant/mean to US...and why WE still fight so hard to this day, to keep their cherished memory alive.

c.

You know how I feel about everything, and I'm a native Angelino. My lifelong affection of the Dodgers has cooled because of reasons you cite every day.

I think the Dodgers have gone into and out of nostalgia over the years, depending on the need to (1) draw upon the greatness of the past when they wanted to boost their image and (2) identify with their current marketplace.

What I also think is that the Dodgers paid a lifetime price for leaving their fans and taking a new community as its mistress. Walter O'Malley will forever be infamous and Branch Rickey will forever be loved. Chances are you didn't like The Big O before you got wise to the fact they were going to move. Rickey wouldn't have moved the Dodgers. His character was different. :atthepc

[D6+]

In reading threads such as this one, it reinforces my opinion that when a team decides to move to another area, the team nickname, team colors, team records, and anything else associated with the team history should remain in the city that lost its team. Much like with the Cleveland Browns, after they moved to Baltimore.

In the case of the Dodgers, it's bad enough that Walter O' Malley moved the team from Brooklyn to Los Angeles. Taking everything though made an extremely bad situation worse to the nth degree. IMO, this is a major reason why so many Brooklyn Dodgers fans still have resentment towards the current Los Angeles franchise that uses it's name, colors, and history.

[EvanAparra]

What do you all think of the new Mets stadium to be built, that looks much like it will be a tribute to Ebbets?