Freddy Sanchez

[Ubiquitous]

The Pirates are rumored to have Freddy on the block or at least willing to hear offers. Cubs need a hitter and a secondbasemen. He has an option year that is pretty reasonable for next year and the Cubs have talent to trade. I think it would be a pretty good trade for the Cubs and add another line in the talent pipeline that starts in Pittsburgh and ends in Chicago.

[cubsfan129]

Now that you mention it that does sound good. He could get on base for us and score some runs.

[Ace Venom]

Here's the problem. The Cubs can't afford to add payroll.

[rockin500]

Here's the problem. The Cubs can't afford to add payroll.
not many teams can. Teams in this climate, just cant add much payroll. the cubs are no different than most of the other teams. hell, even the yankees cant add payroll.

[Ace Venom]

That's what you get for taking on a ridiculous amount of payroll in the offseason. There's still a second half to play.

[rockin500]

That's what you get for taking on a ridiculous amount of payroll in the offseason. There's still a second half to play.

it didnt matter how much payroll they added. they probably werent going to be able to add anyways. The OTHER thing is, they dont have enough pieces to make the big trades. They never had enough for guys like Halladay (does any team really have what toronto wants?)

[Ubiquitous]

They can definitely afford to add Sanchez to payroll. He is owed less than 3 million dollars for this season and has a 600K buyout for next season. Nobody is going to stop Hendry from making that trade because of money. As for pieces, of course the Cubs have the pieces for Sanchez. He isn't Halladay and the asking price Sanchez is not going to be outrageously high. The Cubs have the space and the players to make the trade happen. Obviously it is possible that someone else can come along and give them a sweeter offer but the point is the Cubs could make a serious run at him if they wanted too and hopefully Hendry is doing that.

[Ace Venom]

The Cubs have the space and the players to make the trade happen. Obviously it is possible that someone else can come along and give them a sweeter offer but the point is the Cubs could make a serious run at him if they wanted too and hopefully Hendry is doing that.

As long as they don't deal Fontenot, they should be fine for the future. Fontenot can be molded into a reliable utility infielder (2B/3B) and provides the left handed bat the Cubs can use.

[Ubiquitous]

If Fontenot is the lynchpin to this deal I would gladly trade him. Hell, I have no problem trading him for a reliever. Fontenot is one of those fungible assets that teams should milk when they are cheap and not hesitate to trade away for something that might be better or more useful.

[Ace Venom]

My guess is the Pirates might want something a little more impressive than Mike Fontenot.

[Ubiquitous]

My guess is the Pirates might want something a little more impressive than Mike Fontenot.

As I believe as well. I was responding to your view that you didn't want Fontenot to be dealt.

[Bob Sacamento]

They can definitely afford to add Sanchez to payroll. He is owed less than 3 million dollars for this season and has a 600K buyout for next season. Nobody is going to stop Hendry from making that trade because of money. Sanchez's 2010 option of 8 million becomes guaranteed if he reaches 635 plate appearances in 2009 or 600 plate appearances and an All Star selection in 2009. Sanchez has 333 plate appearances currently. Yes the Cubs can afford him financially afford him but it'd be at the expense of chasing much on the free agent market. We've got some players getting raises such as Theriot, Marmol, Dempster, Soriano, Fukudome, Bradley along with a few other small raises. The major money we're losing is Harden (7M), Gregg (4.2M), Johnson (3M), Heilman (1.6M), Cotts 1.1M).


As for pieces, of course the Cubs have the pieces for Sanchez. He isn't Halladay and the asking price Sanchez is not going to be outrageously high. The Cubs have the space and the players to make the trade happen. Obviously it is possible that someone else can come along and give them a sweeter offer but the point is the Cubs could make a serious run at him if they wanted too and hopefully Hendry is doing that.Pirates aren't shopping him cheaply, they want an MLB ready contributor up the middle or pitcher that won't cost much for the next few years. Something the Cubs are severely lacking, maybe a Sean Marshall, Randy Wells, Jose Ascanio, Jeff Stevens, Mike Fontenot, ....

[Ubiquitous]

The Cubs will have new ownership in place and generally speaking new ownership is not afraid to spend. Plus money is coming off the books next year and the year after that as well. The Cubs should be looking to retool this offseason and the next.

Harden
After 2010 Bradley, Lee, Lilly, and Miles. That is 34 to 35 million coming off after 2010. After this year the Cubs have 17 million coming off the book with guaranted raises of a little over 12 million dollars. Pretty much no matter what happens the Cubs are going to have to raise payroll next year in order to compete in 2010 and as well as beyond 2010. Either that or they are going to have to pull off some major trades involving big money players.

The Cubs have the young cheap major league ready talent available to make the trade.

[cubbies1945]

That does sound pretty Good. They need to go after him. They can affod him and they can't be affraid to spend. Go Cubbies!!!!

[Mild Sauce]

We could always pray that the Pirates take him for Soriano.

[Ubiquitous]

If the Cards really did get Holliday then the Cubs really need to go and get Sanchez if they want to have a chance at the playoffs.

[Bob Sacamento]

If the Cards really did get Holliday then the Cubs really need to go and get Sanchez if they want to have a chance at the playoffs.Yep they nabbed Holliday but it wasn't cheap, costing them their top prospect in Brett Wallace along with two solid young players. Odds are strong that Holliday doesn't extend with the Birds now, and will play free agency. Cubs need to make a move now, doubt we do anything big, maybe another reliever...

[Ubiquitous]

In terms of the here and now it doesn't really matter what the Cards gave up within their system. The Cubs future is screwed up anyway what with the contracts they have and all. There time is now and consequently this hurts the Cubs chances from doing something now.

As for Brett he is a good young prospect that isn't going to be able to stay at third in the bigs and he needs to come a long way to be the kind of hitter that can be a good player at first or in the corner outfield positions. Sure he might get there but that is a long way away.

[Ace Venom]

There's also news that Ted Lilly will miss his next start with shoulder soreness. The news keeps getting worse. Getting Sanchez is out of the question now because the starting rotation has kept us in contention. Hendry's not going to go after the big name pitcher who won't get traded by Toronto, but he needs to go out and nab a starting pitcher now. This is especially urgent because Dempster is going to miss another start and Harden hasn't been that great this year.

[Ubiquitous]

How is getting Freddy Sanchez out of the question now?

[Ace Venom]

How is getting Freddy Sanchez out of the question now?

We need pitching. Ted Lilly will likely be going to the DL. We also need another catcher because Soto can't seem to stay off the DL this year. I have a good feeling that with Ted Lilly likely headed for the DL, the Cubs are likely going to try to make a play for a new starting pitcher before the trade deadline.

[Jntg4]

I wouldn't say it is out of the question. The Cubs have some former starters in our bullpen. Heilman (not a good idea), and Marshall. And we are still only 2 behind SFG and COL for the wild card.

[Ubiquitous]

We need pitching. Ted Lilly will likely be going to the DL. We also need another catcher because Soto can't seem to stay off the DL this year. I have a good feeling that with Ted Lilly likely headed for the DL, the Cubs are likely going to try to make a play for a new starting pitcher before the trade deadline.

And even if all that is true the Cubs still need a second basemen.

[rockin500]

And even if all that is true the Cubs still need a second basemen.

they probably arent going to be able to get both. so if they get one, i dont see them being able to get an adequate piece at the other position.

[Ubiquitous]

The Cubs have pitchers so they really don't need pitchers and the only pitcher out there worth anything is Roy and the Cubs are not going to go after him. There is nothing out there for the catching position which leaves second base as about the only hole the Cubs can address through a major trade.

[Ace Venom]

And even if all that is true the Cubs still need a second basemen.

Mike Fontenot has been hitting better lately. The big problem the Cubs have had is not Mike Fontenot, but Aramis was out with his shoulder injury and Bradley and Soriano forgot how to hit for so long.

[Bob Sacamento]

Mike Fontenot has been hitting better lately. The big problem the Cubs have had is not Mike Fontenot, but Aramis was out with his shoulder injury and Bradley and Soriano forgot how to hit for so long.Yes Fontenot has been hitting better of late, but with our poor bench/substitutions/depth, Mike looks better as a utility player. Sanchez is a top rated offensive 2B in baseball, especially the NL. His defense is adequate, but that consistent offensive stick is something the Cub offense is lacking; we get hot and cold, while Freddie is a steady bat. I've already said before that Sanchez's 2010 contract of 8.5M could pose a problem, but with the Pirates low balling Freddie's extension recently, he could be had at a good rate. The Pirates will probably be looking for a cheap an expendable arm something like of a Sean Marshall or Randy Wells or comparable, along with a young close to MLB talent. Depending on Sanchez's interest, the Cubs might be able to swing him for Mike Fontenot and a midlevel prospect arm.

[Ubiquitous]

Mike Fontenot has been hitting better lately. The big problem the Cubs have had is not Mike Fontenot, but Aramis was out with his shoulder injury and Bradley and Soriano forgot how to hit for so long.

And the Cubs can do nothing in regards to Aramis' injury nor Soriano or Bradley forgetting how to hit, but they can fix second base.

[rockin500]

And the Cubs can do nothing in regards to Aramis' injury nor Soriano or Bradley forgetting how to hit, but they can fix second base.

but if they do remember how (and it appears that both of them have, and aramis is looking good) do they really need to "fix" 2nd?

[Ubiquitous]

Second base is hitting .226/.280/.314 with mediocre at best defense. Since when does a team not need to fix a hole like that?

[rockin500]

Second base is hitting .226/.280/.314 with mediocre at best defense. Since when does a team not need to fix a hole like that?
at what cost, though. is the upgrade enough of one if you have to give up something on the major league roster? I'd rather not give up fox or marshall or wells for sanchez.

[Ubiquitous]

Sean Marshall is sitting in the bullpen and that looks to be where he is going to play out his career for the Cubs. I really don't mind the Cubs trading a LOOGY and spot starter for a season and a half of a secondbasemen, especially since their secondbasemens have been so dreadful right now.

As for Fox, he isn't the price tag for Sanchez nor is Wells.

[rockin500]

Sean Marshall is sitting in the bullpen and that looks to be where he is going to play out his career for the Cubs. I really don't mind the Cubs trading a LOOGY and spot starter for a season and a half of a secondbasemen, especially since their secondbasemens have been so dreadful right now.

As for Fox, he isn't the price tag for Sanchez nor is Wells.

uh, marshall is the only lefty in the pen. is there anyone in the system that you would trust to be a lefty in the pen down the stretch?

fact is, you need a lefty in the pen. two would be nice, but one is essential. otherwise you are putting yourself at a significant disadvantage.

and marshall is not worth sanchez right now.

[Ubiquitous]

uh, marshall is the only lefty in the pen. is there anyone in the system that you would trust to be a lefty in the pen down the stretch?

fact is, you need a lefty in the pen. two would be nice, but one is essential. otherwise you are putting yourself at a significant disadvantage.

and marshall is not worth sanchez right now.

Significant disadvantage to what? As a reliever Sean Marshall or pretty much any left handed reliever will have the supposed advantage against one batter in the game and the rest of the time if the manager opts to leave him in then the pitching team will be the one at a significant disadvantage.

You don't need a lefty in the pen and two would be a complete waste of roster space. A LOOGY is simply not even close to being worth the same value as an above average middle infielder.

[rockin500]

Significant disadvantage to what? As a reliever Sean Marshall or pretty much any left handed reliever will have the supposed advantage against one batter in the game and the rest of the time if the manager opts to leave him in then the pitching team will be the one at a significant disadvantage.

You don't need a lefty in the pen and two would be a complete waste of roster space. A LOOGY is simply not even close to being worth the same value as an above average middle infielder.
but marshall is NOT just a LOOGY.

how many contending teams in recent memory were without a solid left handed reliever?

Freddy sanchez just isnt going to help the team all that much. nice player, but he's not going to be the difference between them making the playoffs and staying home.

[Ubiquitous]

but marshall is NOT just a LOOGY.


But he is being used as one.


how many contending teams in recent memory were without a solid left handed reliever?

Considering pretty much everybody tries to have a LOOGY nowadays I'd say that the fact that contending teams have a LOOGY isn't actually proof that they need one. But to answer the question we would have to go all the way back to the 2008 season and our Cubs to find a contending team without a solid left handed reliever.

Every team has a "closer" that doesn't mean they need one.





Freddy sanchez just isnt going to help the team all that much. nice player, but he's not going to be the difference between them making the playoffs and staying home.


And Sean is definitely not going to be the difference.

[Ubiquitous]

I'll also add that the Pirates even have the LOOGY available for trade should the Cubs require one. The Pirates have Grabow available as well and it wouldn't be a big stretch to create a deal in which Grabow and Sanchez come to Chicago with the Cubs sending over some youngsters.

[Bob Sacamento]

uh, marshall is the only lefty in the pen. is there anyone in the system that you would trust to be a lefty in the pen down the stretch?

fact is, you need a lefty in the pen. two would be nice, but one is essential. otherwise you are putting yourself at a significant disadvantage.

and marshall is not worth sanchez right now.I think you might be overvaluing Marshall just due to our shortcomings in the lefty pen spot. Just because a pitcher is left handed doesn't mean that he's the best option to throw to a lefty. Hell Marmol, Gregg, and Guzman have all been just as effective against lefties as Sean has.

Still if you want a lefty to trust in the organization, I'd personally love to see LHRP flamethrower John Gaub, part of the DeRosa haul, get a shot at the show and he might see a September call if he gets added to the 40 man roster. But right now there is no excuse not to, in the 50 lefty batters he's faced this year he's given up 6 singles, while striking out 18 of them.

And on the trade front we are looking hard at the Pirates' John Grabow and the Nats' Joe Beimel but both teams are looking for higher return prospects than Jim wants to give out.

[Bob Sacamento]

I'll also add that the Pirates even have the LOOGY available for trade should the Cubs require one. The Pirates have Grabow available as well and it wouldn't be a big stretch to create a deal in which Grabow and Sanchez come to Chicago with the Cubs sending over some youngsters.Obtaining both would be optimal especially for dishing out team-controlled young players and prospects. I'd be willing to give up some sort of combo of Randy Wells, Sean Marshall, Mike Fontenot, Darwin Barney, Tony Thomas, Casey Coleman, Jay Jackson, Marcos Mateo, Welington Castillo, just to name a few. And I still don't think that would get it done; Probably a Cashner and/or Castro would be on the top of the Pirates' list.

[Bob Sacamento]

Wow, turned out the haul for Freddie Sanchez was higher than anyone thought. The Giants gave up 20 year old AA starter Tim Alderson who was ranked the fourth best Giants prospect this year in a deep SF system. Josh Vitters or Andrew Cashner were about the closest high-end prospect we had to Alderson.

[rockin500]

Wow, turned out the haul for Freddie Sanchez was higher than anyone thought. The Giants gave up 20 year old AA starter Tim Alderson who was ranked the fourth best Giants prospect this year in a deep SF system. Josh Vitters or Andrew Cashner were about the closest high-end prospect we had to Alderson.
the giants overpaid IMO. and apparently in a lot of giant fans' opinions.