Rudy Jaramillo

[bronxkid]

I was fortunate enough to see Rudy Jaramillo in action over the weekend. He is a great hitting coach and in a world where people are selling DVD's his reputation is the best out there. The clinic was run very effectively and his thoughts will remain with me for a very long time.

Keep it simple!

http://www.rudyjaramillo.com/

:applaud:

[BallCoach06]

I agree.

I saw Coach Jaramillo speak a couple of years back. Great hitting coach and a pleasure to hear speak.

[fpdad]

Hey Dave, could you touch upon his main teaching points?
Listed on his site are "Five simple steps".

I teach my students to get to an slightly early toetouch, not heelplant, and this has really helped them with timing and not losing the pelvic load early.
They all like this and this seems to be a relatively easy teach that they can take to their game swings.

Jim/joof has gone down and met Rudy a few times; I think Jim likes the Rangers!
Thanks, Dave (dave s).

[kylebee]

I know a lot of people don't like his "front foot down early" stuff, but it has been invaluable in my teachings to HS kids who are constantly late with the front foot and don't get a good weight shift as such.

[FiveFrameSwing]

I know a lot of people don't like his "front foot down early" stuff, but it has been invaluable in my teachings to HS kids who are constantly late with the front foot and don't get a good weight shift as such.

On occasion I receive a student that has been taught such a pre-stride approach and I tell them on day one that they'll be saying good-bye to this momentum robing mechanic.

This past weekend Chris Yeager spoke on how he didn't like a pre-stride mechanic and told the audience that those that teach this are not teaching the MLB pattern.

[callyjr]

On occasion I receive a student that has been taught such a pre-stride approach and I tell them on day one that they'll be saying good-bye to this momentum robing mechanic.

This past weekend Chris Yeager spoke on how he didn't like a pre-stride mechanic and told the audience that those that teach this are not teaching the MLB pattern.


little confused by this, is he suggesting the MLB players don't stride? please clarify for me what your saying(sorry)

[Baseball gLove]

little confused by this, is he suggesting the MLB players don't stride? please clarify for me what your saying(sorry)


What he means is that striding too early could rob power from the swing.

[mudvnine]

On occasion I receive a student that has been taught such a pre-stride approach and I tell them on day one that they'll be saying good-bye to this momentum robing mechanic.

This past weekend Chris Yeager spoke on how he didn't like a pre-stride mechanic and told the audience that those that teach this are not teaching the MLB pattern.

Interesting that two MLB hitting instructors Jaramillo and Hudgens both teach the same thing, yet you tell your kids "they'll be saying good-bye" to it "on day one", without even seeing their timing dynamics and related swing mechanics . . . that sure seems a little odd. Do you adhere to this same "cookie-cutter" approach to all areas of your hitting instruction?

Five, do you really believe that momentum can only be gained/accomplished as a single continuous movement striding into foot plant?

[bronxkid]

Hey Dave when you have a chance you have my email. I did an email search and lost your addy. Can you send it to me again when you get a chance. Nice hearing from you as well.

Anyhow, What I took from it was my son was getting alot of weight on his front side. He worked with him for about 45 minutes or so and liked what I saw. He does like for you to get that front foot early but there is no denying his track record with Ranger hitters. Had a lengthy conversation in regards to Juan Gonzalez as my older brother lives in Puerto Rico and knows of him.

Rudy was a terrific guy and I liked what I heard and physically saw!

[FiveFrameSwing]

You can teach a pre-stride, but IMO you aren't teaching the kid the MLB pattern.

I have Rudy's material. Where is it that he recommends a pre-stride? I'd like to confirm that claim. I'm wondering if you might be confusing this with his recommendation for getting out of a "slump" and striding earlier?

As for the "cookie cutter" comment ... tough ... if a kid wants my instruction then that's what they'll get. If they wish to hit the "Yeager way" then the pre-stride goes out the window. They can have a no-stride, or a stride, but not a pre-stride.

I do hold different standards for those that seek my instruction, and those that are on my HS team and see a different hitting instructor. When a kid seeks me out for instruction then certain mechanics, such as a pre-stride, aren't allowed ... if that's what they wish to do then they are welcome to go elsewhere and not waste my time.

[mudvnine]

You can teach a pre-stride, but IMO you aren't teaching the kid the MLB pattern.

I teach what the hitter becomes most comfortable and proficient with . . . stride, pre-stride, no stride, I adapt to them and not the other way around.

If they wish to hit the "Yeager way" . . . Then why not have them buy the DVDs and get their information directly from Chris, saving them time and money?

If you teach only one "guru" you are missing out on a lot of other fantastic stuff out there.

. . . if that's what they wish to do then they are welcome to go elsewhere and not waste my time.

But if they stay and try the 100% "Yeager Way" and never become comfortable or proficient with it, it's OK to waste their time . . . and money?

I don't know Five, I had you figured differently in the not too distant past, I guess I was wrong and that's too bad. :dismay:

[Coach Run Prevention]

Pre-striding does rob the hitter of momentum and I don't blame Five for not teaching it.

[BigGeorge]

[QUOTE]I teach what the hitter becomes most comfortable and proficient with . . . stride, pre-stride, no stride, I adapt to them and not the other way around.

If a student is casting or has bat drag, do you adapt to that or try to correct such an obvious flaw? I think that a pre-stride move could easily be considered a flaw or more correctly, a “fix” that veils an underlying imperfection.



Then why not have them buy the DVDs and get their information directly from Chris, saving them time and money?


The CY material is mechanic-centric. As a hitting instructor, 97% of what I try to convey matches Yeager’s mechanics and I do recommend to students that the purchase at least the Kinetic Link DVD. But Yeager’s does not really address anything beyond mechanics. Drills, approach, count strategy, pattern recognition, strike zone awareness, conditioning and training, visual tracking, practice habits, etc are just a few of the things young (and older) hitters need in addition to CY’s material. There also needs to be someone who can evaluate whether the student is grasping and applying correctly the techniques to be learned (aided by high-speed video analysis). Books and DVD’s are but a small part of the learning process. On-field coaching is in my experience far superior to book and video education.


But if they stay and try the 100% "Yeager Way" and never become comfortable or proficient with it, it's OK to waste their time . . . and money?


I feel that the “Yeager Way” is the most accessible and simplified approach I have ever seen and is the quickest and best method to get a young hitter comfortable and proficient. I realize that not every student is suited to the approach I push. That’s okay. Maybe Epstein or someone else would be a better match for a particular student. I haven’t really yet seen a student that didn’t make decent progress but I am certainly willing to acknowledge that I might come across that in the future.

[mudvnine]

Pre-striding does rob the hitter of momentum and I don't blame Five for not teaching it.


If a student is casting or has bat drag, do you adapt to that or try to correct such an obvious flaw? I think that a pre-stride move could easily be considered a flaw or more correctly, a “fix” that veils an underlying imperfection.

Hmmm . . . well sorry George, I won’t even dignify your first question with an answer, but regarding “pre-stride” (I believe it to be better termed as “early-stride”) has been discussed here before (http://www.baseball-fever.com/showthread.php?referrerid=8503&t=80765)and I don’t believe it to be a universally accepted (http://www.baseball-fever.com/showpost.php?p=1256981&postcount=8) “flaw" as the others you mentioned.

It has been shown that momentum is still developed from the early-stride, separation, weight back position. You and Five may argue degrees of momentum, but to my knowledge, that is still only speculation and unproven.

Allowing an “early-stride” in young, new, or struggling hitters helps them with timings issues in the early stages of swing development, increasing the time for pitch recognition and allowing adjustments to it. As the hitter matures and becomes more proficient, it is an easy transition by simply, slowly, adjusting their load sequence to launch timing.

The CY material is mechanic-centric. As a hitting instructor, 97% of what I try to convey matches Yeager’s mechanics and I do recommend to students that the purchase at least the Kinetic Link DVD. But Yeager’s does not really address anything beyond mechanics. Drills, approach, count strategy, pattern recognition, strike zone awareness, conditioning and training, visual tracking, practice habits, etc are just a few of the things young (and older) hitters need in addition to CY’s material. There also needs to be someone who can evaluate whether the student is grasping and applying correctly the techniques to be learned (aided by high-speed video analysis). Books and DVD’s are but a small part of the learning process. On-field coaching is in my experience far superior to book and video education.

Yes, thanks, I have Yeager’s DVD’s, know what they contain and have taken a lot from them to use in my teaching . . . I was being facetious about simply giving them the DVDs.

I feel that the “Yeager Way” is the most accessible and simplified approach I have ever seen . . . I realize that not every student is suited to the approach I push. That’s okay. Maybe Epstein or someone else would be a better match for a particular student.

How long and how much money later until you realize this and let the student/parent in on it and what have their reactions been or do you not say anything and just keep taking their money?

[FiveFrameSwing]

Pre-striding does rob the hitter of momentum and I don't blame Five for not teaching it.

Thank you.

I'm in the process of converting 3 kids out of their pre-stride habit. They don't have to do this ... they have a choice to seek instruction elsewhere.

When I get a new kid, I map out a program after watching them take BP. I inform them, and their parents, of the changes that I expect them to make if we are to continue. The choice is there's to make.

There are certain mechanics I will not accept in a student. Another issue is one of "bat drag" ... here I'll have a parent of a kid that has had success at a low-level and thinks their kid is fine with their low-efficiency swing ... but again, the choice is their's to make ... they will either work with me in correcting this aspect of their swing or they will seek instruction elsewhere.

My interest is purely in seeing the kids continously improve. If a kid isn't interested in my program, then so be it. I have no interest in frustrating them or myself. I'm fairly well booked and receptive to students moving on.

[BigGeorge]

Originally posted by mudvine

Hmmm . . . well sorry George, I won’t even dignify your first question with an answer, but regarding “pre-stride” (I believe it to be better termed as “early-stride”) has been discussed here before (http://www.baseball-fever.com/showthread.php?referrerid=8503&t=80765)and I don’t believe it to be a universally accepted (http://www.baseball-fever.com/showpost.php?p=1256981&postcount=8) “flaw" as the others you mentioned.
It has been shown that momentum is still developed from the early-stride, separation, weight back position. You and Five may argue degrees of momentum, but to my knowledge, that is still only speculation and unproven.
Allowing an “early-stride” in young, new, or struggling hitters helps them with timings issues in the early stages of swing development, increasing the time for pitch recognition and allowing adjustments to it. As the hitter matures and becomes more proficient, it is an easy transition by simply, slowly, adjusting their load sequence to launch timing.

As I alluded to, “flaw” is too strong a word. “Fix” more aptly describes the pre-stride (or early stride) mechanism that you support. I personally would rather identify the underlying flaw that leads to the need for a quick (and often temporary) fix. “Swing for Life” is a concept I support. “Fixes” often work for a while but are exposed as a player moves up.






How long and how much money later until you realize this and let the student/parent in on it and what have their reactions been or do you not say anything and just keep taking their money?


As I said, mechanics are but a small piece of the big picture. What I “sell” goes far above and beyond the application of mechanical technique. In fact, I have had a couple of students who needed only slight changes to their swing technique. That didn’t mean there wasn’t substantial work to be done. There was. I feel very comfortable that I needn’t even address swing technique to add greatly to the value of the product I provide. I have never had a player/parent request a refund nor even address displeasure to the progress attained. If a parent felt strongly enough, I wouldn’t hesitate to offer one.

[FiveFrameSwing]

I teach what the hitter becomes most comfortable and proficient with . . . stride, pre-stride, no stride, I adapt to them and not the other way around.


This is an area that we differ on. There are certain mechanics that I won't tolerate ... and the pre-stride is one of them.

I also don't care about the student's particular comfort level when they make a change. In fact, I'll ask the student if they "feel" different and I expect the answer to be "yes" ... because IMO if it doesn't "feel" different to them then they won't learn the new mechanic. Often the student will say that it does feel different and sometimes they say it feels "wierd" ... to which I answer "good ... it is important to me that you feel that this is different ... because I want something different".

[FiveFrameSwing]

I don't know Five, I had you figured differently in the not too distant past, I guess I was wrong and that's too bad. :dismay:

Glad we cleared up any misconceptions.

[FiveFrameSwing]

The CY material is mechanic-centric. As a hitting instructor, 97% of what I try to convey matches Yeager’s mechanics and I do recommend to students that the purchase at least the Kinetic Link DVD. But Yeager’s does not really address anything beyond mechanics. Drills, approach, count strategy, pattern recognition, strike zone awareness, conditioning and training, visual tracking, practice habits, etc are just a few of the things young (and older) hitters need in addition to CY’s material. There also needs to be someone who can evaluate whether the student is grasping and applying correctly the techniques to be learned (aided by high-speed video analysis). Books and DVD’s are but a small part of the learning process. On-field coaching is in my experience far superior to book and video education.



Very well said.

I'll add that Chris Yeager does provide drills ... and they are amazingly simple for students to follow and show continual progress. During the course of roughly 5 warmup drills I'm able to use cues to highlight the mechanics that Chris Yeager stresses.

As with you ... I also recommend that my students purchase his material. I do this because I want my students armed and protected with good information.

[FiveFrameSwing]

I feel that the “Yeager Way” is the most accessible and simplified approach I have ever seen and is the quickest and best method to get a young hitter comfortable and proficient. I realize that not every student is suited to the approach I push. That’s okay. Maybe Epstein or someone else would be a better match for a particular student. I haven’t really yet seen a student that didn’t make decent progress but I am certainly willing to acknowledge that I might come across that in the future.

Very well said BG.

Chris Yeager's drills are amazingly simple and promote continual improvement.

[FiveFrameSwing]

Mud,

IMO an "early stride" and a "pre-stride" are completely different.

-FFS

[mudvnine]

Mud,

IMO an "early stride" and a "pre-stride" are completely different.

-FFS

Interesting, please explain, maybe we're closer on this then I thought, just using different terminology.

Who knows, maybe I don't like "pre-stride" either and just don't know it yet. :nod: :D

[BigGeorge]

Very well said.

I'll add that Chris Yeager does provide drills ... and they are amazingly simple for students to follow and show continual progress. During the course of roughly 5 warmup drills I'm able to use cues to highlight the mechanics that Chris Yeager stresses.

As with you ... I also recommend that my students purchase his material. I do this because I want my students armed and protected with good information.

Could you quickly go over the your 5 drills for me. I have literally hundreds of drills that I have acquired over the years and it wasn't too difficult to come up with some applicable drills for myself (mostly stride drills) but it would beneficial to see what you are thinking. Thanks.

[LClifton]

http://i40.tinypic.com/2nq5ogk.jpg
http://i42.tinypic.com/6qb5ea.jpg
http://i43.tinypic.com/szxspd.jpg
http://i41.tinypic.com/29cv1bq.jpg

[FiveFrameSwing]

LC,

I don't consider the video clips you posted to be what I consider a "pre-stride" swing.

-FFS

[LClifton]

LC,

I don't consider the video clips you posted to be what I consider a "pre-stride" swing.

-FFS
I think I understand what you mean....pre-stride being a more pronounced stop or pause. Not good.

Two of the clips are the impression I get from fpdad's description of what he does with his kids.

The other two clips simply illustrate a more "conventional" stride.

[FiveFrameSwing]

I think I understand what you mean....pre-stride being a more pronounced stop or pause. Not good.

Two of the clips are the impression I get from fpdad's description of what he does with his kids.

The other two clips simply illustrate a more "conventional" stride.

Exactly ... IMO a pre-stride is striding early and pausing, with sufficient pressure on the lead foot.

In the third clip you posted, I consider that more of a no-stride approach. IMO as he lifts his front foot up and brings it forward, he is "loading" his backside and retaining a center of pressure on his backside until his "shift & throw" ("load / shift / throw")

Just my opinion.

I do value, and respect, your posts and opinions.

-FFS

[LClifton]

Exactly ... IMO a pre-stride is striding early and pausing, with sufficient pressure on the lead foot.

In the third clip you posted, I consider that more of a no-stride approach. IMO as he lifts his front foot up and brings it forward, he is "loading" his backside and retaining a center of pressure on his backside until his "shift & throw" ("load / shift / throw")

Just my opinion.

I do value, and respect, your posts and opinions.

-FFS
Good point (the bolded). A significant part I left out / forgot to include in the description.

Point being, I think, is that I have a kid that has been told to "get the front foot down" and she does exactly that---all the way down, weighted...then the swing must "salvage / scrape" power from somewhere. Usually not good.

[FiveFrameSwing]

Good point (the bolded). A significant part I left out / forgot to include in the description.

Point being, I think, is that I have a kid that has been told to "get the front foot down" and she does exactly that---all the way down, weighted...then the swing must "salvage / scrape" power from somewhere. Usually not good.

Yes, I have three students like this now.

I have them perform walk-ups ...

They do walk-ups while making a sidearm throw, and then perform a sidearm throw without a walk-up ... and they are expected to eliminate the pause.

They perform walk-ups while performing one-arm top-hand swings, and repeat the drill without walk-ups. Again I work with them to remove the pause.

They perform walk-ups while performing split-grip swings, and they repeat the split-grip swings without the walk-ups. Again I work with them to eliminate the pause.

I begin BP by having the students perform walk-ups, and as they transistion to taking cuts without walk-ups I continue to work with them to eliminate the pause.

This is the approach I use. Welcome your suggestions.

[omg]

I teach what the hitter becomes most comfortable and proficient with . . . stride, pre-stride, no stride, I adapt to them and not the other way around.

Then why not have them buy the DVDs and get their information directly from Chris, saving them time and money?

If you teach only one "guru" you are missing out on a lot of other fantastic stuff out there.



But if they stay and try the 100% "Yeager Way" and never become comfortable or proficient with it, it's OK to waste their time . . . and money?

I don't know Five, I had you figured differently in the not too distant past, I guess I was wrong and that's too bad. :dismay:

Here is the secret: if a hitter BELIEVES your method is fantastic then he will improve regardless of whether you are teaching Yeager, Rudy, or Happy Gilmore. And if he doesn't believe then forget it. Sometimes this has to do with the instructors motivational skills, the instructors attained status, the instructors"bells and whistles", and the students age and experience but SELDOM does it have anything to do with content.

[mudvnine]

Here is the secret: if a hitter BELIEVES your method is fantastic then he will improve regardless of whether you are teaching Yeager, Rudy, or Happy Gilmore. And if he doesn't believe then forget it. Sometimes this has to do with the instructors motivational skills, the instructors attained status, the instructors"bells and whistles", and the students age and experience but SELDOM does it have anything to do with content.

Dog gone it omg, I think you're on to something and I think your theory might explain somethings that are being discussed in another thread . . . good work and observation.

By the way, I have Mr. Gilmore's hitting DVDs on my Xmas wish list . . . he has excellent drills to promote Early Lead Arm Extension. :D

http://i62.photobucket.com/albums/h107/caddilac711/4004.jpg

[omg]

Dog gone it omg, I think you're on to something and I think your theory might explain somethings that are being discussed in another thread . . . good work and observation.

By the way, I have Mr. Gilmore's hitting DVDs on my Xmas wish list . . . he has excellent drills to promote Early Lead Arm Extension. :D

http://i62.photobucket.com/albums/h107/caddilac711/4004.jpg

Check out the early LAE and the torque. Definitely a brilliant hybrid of linear/rotational.