Striiiiiike Twoooooo!!

[RodCarew]

What do you tell your hitters when they get 2 strikes on them at the plate?

I've been telling my team for years to "protect the plate".. and I coach them to choke up an inch and shorten their swings.. just try to put the ball in play..

One thing I've noticed this year - is that cue of "protecting the plate" has got a lot of my kids swinging at bad pitches and striking out...I think it has them afraid of letting anything past them and getting the backwards K.

I'm wondering if there is a better mental cue or saying I should be using to teach the kids to hit with 2 strikes..

any thoughts??

thanks,

[Jim W.]

If they are behind in the count I have them think "go to right".

[cubsphill]

when we have two strikes on us, our coach will say things like "lotta confidence now!" "COMPETE!"

[mudvnine]

Two-strike hitting is something we work quite a bit on in practice; I don't want hitters trying to "figure it out" themselves while they are at the plate. We work on taking the inside part of the plate away, "shortening up", and fouling off "borderline" pitches at the last split-second.

This way, when they are at the plate in the game with two strikes, they have a "plan" and the only cue I give them is "Ok, two-stike hitting, foul it off if you have to".

They are looking middle/in to drive, outer-half opposite field, and outside off the plate an inch or two (maybe 3 or 4 depending on the umpire ;) ) to let it get deep and foul it off with the hands to the on-deck circle.

This works for us, good luck.

[Nater44]

I might have a slightly different approach from the previous posts. I work with hitters in being offensive producers, since that is their job in the first place when they step into the box. Having said this, you obviously get 3 chances to produce something valuable for your team.

Because of this thinking, I do not want my athletes shrinking into a defensive position while being on offense and limiting their offensive potential with two strikes. Just make contact, put the ball in play, etc. are all examples of defensive thinking. Few would argue that the just put the ball into play and make contact advice would rarely be given to a hitter outside of the two strike scenario. I would much rather take a highly aggressive hitter who swings and misses on his third strike than a hitter who changes his approach into a defensive mindset. That defensive mindset is more damaging in the long run than an aggressive hitter who can be taught to focus that energy more constructively.

Having said that, there is great value is shifting the focus of what to do with a pitch later in the count. There is a higher percent chance of an off speed or outside pitch being thrown later in the count, therefore working on taking the ball the other way would be appropriate.

Just some thoughts to add to the mix of thinking.

[Strike1]

"One swing of the bat! Is all it takes"
I heard this from a coach last year. It stuck with me and make's a lot of sense!
I think it says it all and take's the pressure off the kids. They know to protect the plate and to be a disciplined batter. If you get them changing there swing, stance, etc...... You don't have them thinking about seeing it and hitting it! You have them thinking what can I change so I can maybe hit it.
I'm talking about 12 and 13 year old boys!

[mudvnine]

"One swing of the bat! Is all it takes"
I heard this from a coach last year. It stuck with me and make's a lot of sense!
I think it says it all and take's the pressure off the kids. They know to protect the plate and to be a disciplined batter. If you get them changing there swing, stance, etc...... You don't have them thinking about seeing it and hitting it! You have them thinking what can I change so I can maybe hit it.
I'm talking about 12 and 13 year old boys!

Yes, I'm talking about younger hitters (through HS) also and we're not necessarily changing swings or stances, but more of a mindset. Nater44 wants a "highly aggressive hitter" as do we, but I do not equate aggressive with "swing for the fences" as I've seen in too many two-strike approaches.

Strike1, did you ever hit with two strikes as a youngster and would anything said to you have taken the pressure off of you? These kids know who has the advantage with two strikes and nothing you're going to say is going to take "the pressure off the kids" unless you give them the tools and the confidence to know they can excel under these types of situations.

Different than Nater44, I would rather have my hitters swing and put the ball into play, rather then "swings and misses on his third strike". To me we are thinking "offensively" wanting to put the ball into play and forcing production from the defense versus the third strike and not having the defense do anything at all.

IMO, nothing good ever comes from a swing and a miss, third strike; however the possibilites of something good happening are ten-fold when putting the ball into play.

By working on two-strike hitting in practice, we give our hitters a plan and confidence when they are faced with the same situation in a game. They're not up there wondering what they're supposed to do to "protect the plate" and they're not "thinking what can I change so I can maybe hit it", they KNOW how to handle the two-strike scenario, they've done it hundreds of times in practice and are comfortable in the situation.

[azmatsfan]

I emphasize pitch selection with my kids. (9/10). I tried to get them to understand that you want to take a pitch on the black at the knees with no strikes, but you need to swing at that same pitch with 2 strikes.

[Mark H]

If they are behind in the count I have them think "go to right".

Agreed. Look away and let it come deep. If you are late you still have a shot at fouling off the inside pitch. If you are early on the outside pitch, you're just done.

[callyjr]

choking up is the last thing I would think of telling my kids. Why would you want a shorter bat when a low and away pitch is coming.

I like to have them looking for a off speed pitch or outside pitch. Seems to get them focused on the pitcher and what they should be receiving in the situation, my boys are only 9/10 level though so more often then not they just get the same pitch down the middle ,but they are usually ready for it.

going the other direction, lately, every time the count is 2-0 my entire dug out knows and they all try and say something to the batter to be ready.

cally

[mudvnine]

Agreed. Look away and let it come deep. If you are late you still have a shot at fouling off the inside pitch. If you are early on the outside pitch, you're just done.

So now you're to just guessing and hoping the pitcher goes outside with two strikes? With this que, how is a kid supposed to react in time for the inside fastball and if he just does happen to, how does he not get sawed-off at the hands everytime?

Why not just read the pitch and hit it where it's pitched and if you're unsure, then foul it off? In my experience, guessing has never worked.

[Mark H]

Well I wouldn't say guessing has never worked. I hear pros talk a lot about anticipating the pitch and letting the one they did not anticipate go speaking of less than two strikes. My thought is, with two strikes, better to foul off something faster and more inside than you anticipated versus being ahead of something off speed and away in which case you just sit down.

[Mark H]

choking up is the last thing I would think of telling my kids. Why would you want a shorter bat when a low and away pitch is coming.

I like to have them looking for a off speed pitch or outside pitch. Seems to get them focused on the pitcher and what they should be receiving in the situation, my boys are only 9/10 level though so more often then not they just get the same pitch down the middle ,but they are usually ready for it.

going the other direction, lately, every time the count is 2-0 my entire dug out knows and they all try and say something to the batter to be ready.

cally

I completely agree.

[phantom]

I've heard coaches say.....

Just pepper it.....or....Just like pepper....Put the ball in play!!!

or

Look fastball!!!.....and adjust to the curve!!!!!

[phantom]

The best thing to say is a positve action message.

1. Hit it hard!

2. Hit it to the gap!

3. Stay aggressive!!

and stay away from the word 'DON'T"......anything you don't want them to do.....they'll always do......

[Mark H]

Yes. Seems like every time I hear a coach say lay off the high stuff, it seems the only thing the kid's brain remembers is "high stuff". ;) Better to state do this rather than don't do that.

[CoachB25]

Here is my Non-Scientific Approach! I say this quote, "Come on (insert player's name) say you can! One pitch, ONE HIT! Every base hit took one pitch!"

I have never believed in shortening up, putting it in play. I've never believed in choking up on the bat. Do what you practice. I know some are guess hitters. I don't know about that. Instead, I tell my hitters that they should be so good that they can't get beaten by the fastball. Therefore, look to drive the ball opposite and if it is inside and hard, then you can still catch up. It's seems to have worked.

[cosmo34]

I concede nothing with two strikes. A strike is still a strike, and in order to hit you have to be able to hit stikes. All I need is one pitch to do damage. Whether that comes at 2-0 or 0-2, I'm always looking for something to put the barrel on.

Choking up and shortening up doesn't make sense. I don't care if I strikeout, so long as I went down swinging with intent to hit the ball and have a quality at bat. IMO, if you're up there "not looking to strikeout", you're in the wrong business. You've gotta have confidence that you can hit in any count. You can't let the fear of striking out get in the way (B.R.?) Pitcher still has to throw a strike, so why not have the confidence and intent to still try and hit that pitch hard?

I will say that I almost exclusively look for pitches away when down in the count. In my experiences, most pitchers I've faced stay away, and pretty much exclusively away when I've got two strikes. Knowing that, I look for pitches away and on the rare occurace they do come inside, I'm still quick enough to foul it off, or if I really get beat, I tip my hat.

[Mark H]

Well stated.

[mudvnine]

Cosmo, I thought we were discussing "younger hitters" that's why I posted this: "Yes, I'm talking about younger hitters (through HS) also and we're not necessarily changing swings or stances, but more of a mindset."
Now if we were discussing higher levels of play, then I agree with you 100%, but unfortunately, younger pitchers are still finding their control and umpiring is suspect (yes, even in HS), so even though younger pitchers intend to go "down and away", them actually hitting that spot can be a coin toss, so anticipating a pitch in any location can be counter-productive. And when these umpires are calling a 23" strike zone, they better be prepared to foul off a bunch of pitches.

Now before ALL you guys chime in that YOUR young pitcher(s) can "hit their spots" save it, I've seen enough of all levels over the past 35 years to be swayed by your new phenoms. The few that can actually do it get drafted (if they have the velocity to go with it), so if your young pitcher has been drafted then I'm impressed, if not. . . :shrug:

[cosmo34]

I don't work with younger kids, so I was just offering how I look at it.

You're right, it's not something that I would preach to youngsters. I just felt like chiming in on my approach, and felt the thread was more open-ended.

Though I guess I could say it's been the same approach since I was a youngin. At least the principles of not caring when I got to two strikes and refusing to choke/shorten up.

[FiveFrameSwing]

I don't work with younger kids, so I was just offering how I look at it.

You're right, it's not something that I would preach to youngsters. I just felt like chiming in on my approach, and felt the thread was more open-ended.

Though I guess I could say it's been the same approach since I was a youngin. At least the principles of not caring when I got to two strikes and refusing to choke/shorten up.

Personally I liked your response enough to copy it. Well stated.

[cosmo34]

Glad I can help fellas.:D

[StraightGrain11]

choking up is the last thing I would think of telling my kids. Why would you want a shorter bat when a low and away pitch is coming.

I like to have them looking for a off speed pitch or outside pitch. Seems to get them focused on the pitcher and what they should be receiving in the situation, my boys are only 9/10 level though so more often then not they just get the same pitch down the middle ,but they are usually ready for it.

going the other direction, lately, every time the count is 2-0 my entire dug out knows and they all try and say something to the batter to be ready.

cally

I agree - DON'T CHOKE UP - but for a slightly different reason (but I like your's cally, good point :thumbsup:).

When you are used to swinging a __in. bat, you are used to the feel of the bat and where it's sweetspot is. When you "choke up", you change this!!! You have now changed the location of the sweetspot - along with the overall feel of the bat. It (the bat) is now shorter, and, as you said, you will now be "quicker" - which means you've now, also, changed your timing!!! So now we've gone from a "pressure situation" of 2-strikes, to a pressure situation being compounded with complications due to unecessary changes. If you want to "change something", change your approach - not the vital intricacies of your swing.
If your swing is that long, that you need to choke-up with 2-strikes, then you need to be changing some things in your overall swing - or use a shorter bat to begin with.

I once had this discussion with one of my players. The head coach always likes to tell our kids, every year, to "choke up with 2 strikes". The player bought into it, and it led to the following [short] discussion:
I asked the player "why would you choke up with two strikes?" His response was "because I feel I have better bat control that way". The discussion ended when I asked him "why don't you hit that way all the time, then?" If it's that big of an "advantage", then take advantage of it as much as you can - not "just with 2-strikes".

[Ursa Major]

I'm more of the camp of telling kids to hit with two strikes just the way you do with fewer strikes, but expand your strike zone. I think it's a fallacy to assume that you have more bat speed by "shortening" your swing -- at least at the 12 and under age groups. Almost everything they'll see will be a fastball (unless there's only zero or one strike), and you want them to use those good mechanics you taught them to get the bathead into the strike zone as quickly as possible.

I also like the idea of looking for the low outside pitch, because that's the toughest pitch to reach and kid pitchers with any savvy will try (if they're way ahead in the count) to try to get you to chase out there. If they cross you up by going inside, you can at least make some contact, even if it's only a foul dribbler up the third base line. But, if you're looking for something in the middle of the plate and the pitcher does hit the low outside strike (at least in the eyes of your umpire), then you're chances of even touching it are much smaller.

[FiveFrameSwing]

choking up is the last thing I would think of telling my kids. Why would you want a shorter bat when a low and away pitch is coming.


Just an FYI, but the vast majority of those that I see "choke up" also move up closer to the plate at the same time.

[TG Coach]

I've always coached kids it's not the end of the world to strike out. It happens. I just don't want them getting called out on strikes. Some kids know when a pitch is an inch off the plate. I tell them they better know their umpires before taking that pitch with two strikes. The hitter normally has to protect at least an inch off the strike zone with two strikes. Sometimes a weak umpire gets fooled by the curve. The hitters have to followthe curve through the zone so they don't take the backdoor strike that was never in the strike zone.

I hate the term "choke and poke." Do hitters take "choke and poke" batting practice? I want the hitter to take his normal swing. If a kid is striking out too much maybe some changes need to be made to his approach at the plate.

When the hitter is ahead in the count I want him zoning in on a pitch he can rip. Otherwise I want a quality swing. What I don't want to see is a kid taking two out of three strikes.

Last, do your coaching in practice and between innings. Don't throw advice at the hitter when he's at the plate unless it's a quick cue on something he's doing wrong.

[TG Coach]

Just an FYI, but the vast majority of those that I see "choke up" also move up closer to the plate at the same time.

A good pitcher will knock them off the plate on the next pitch, then come outside with the following pitch.

[FiveFrameSwing]

A good pitcher will knock them off the plate on the next pitch, then come outside with the following pitch.

I understand. The battle as to who owns the plate is a big part of this game. If the hitter develops a swing that allows him to crowd the plate then he picks up a big advantage.

[mudvnine]

I understand. The battle as to who owns the plate is a big part of this game. If the hitter develops a swing that allows him to crowd the plate then he picks up a big advantage.

Exactly! :thumbsup: :applaud:

[jacksimpk]

I've found most of my 9-11 yo's get to two strike by either

1. Not having great perception and letting called strikes go by.

2. Having inexperienced and or in consistent umpires that call strikes outside the zone.

So my advise to 2 strike hitters has more to do with minimizing the effect of judging the ball on the way in and bad umpiring. I tell them "If you can reach the ball hit it". I also tell them in the dug out "Your not up there to negotiate with the umpire. When its flying through the air it won't matter if it was a ball or not." In general this seems to actually work. They get the idea of what a strike "Looks" like and end up going down looking. The concept of "I can reach the ball" works better. It minimizes the 3rd strike bad call situation. Maybe you guys in travel ball have better umpires, I'm sure those coaching and playing high school do.

[jacksimpk]

Last, do your coaching in practice and between innings. Don't throw advice at the hitter when he's at the plate unless it's a quick cue on something he's doing wrong.

Oh god absolutely. I get so tired of in game coaching. It wears on my nerves and never really does much good. Be a leader, inspire calmness and confidence, but leave coaching for practice.