Over emphasis on hips

[Sonny Schmidt]

I profoundly believe the over emphasis regarding hip rotation is a 'nick' which prohibits younger players from reaching their full-swing potential. That facts remain, when the swing initiated , the hips rotate 30% slower then the bathead - in which matches the velocity of the hands.


I challenge anyone with evidence to prove myself wrong.

[Jesse]

Are you saying the bathead matches the velocity of the hands during the swing?

[Baseball gLove]

Your "Myself" is wrong. The conclusion that hips are the engine that allow the best hitters to drive the ball, comes from the analysis of the best hitters in baseball. Do you think we'd care about how the Mendoza-line hitters swing the bat?

My son used to be a hands first hitter. When I taught him to go hips 1st, shoulders 2nd, then hands, then bat head, the effect was immediate. He went from beating out soft grounders and getting Texas leaguer base hits, to driving the ball hard, sending the ball 280 to 300 feet with his first few swings. Not bad for a kid that weighed 106 pounds. Now he is 6'1" weighs 146 and has sent one ball over 400 feet. Another 25 pounds on his frame couldn't hurt.

[wogdoggy]

Your "Myself" is wrong. The conclusion that hips are the engine that allow the best hitters to drive the ball, comes from the analysis of the best hitters in baseball. Do you think we'd care about how the Mendoza-line hitters swing the bat?

My son used to be a hands first hitter. When I taught him to go hips 1st, shoulders 2nd, then hands, then bat head, the effect was immediate. He went from beating out soft grounders and getting Texas leaguer base hits, to driving the ball hard, sending the ball 280 to 300 feet with his first few swings. Not bad for a kid that weighed 106 pounds. Now he is 6'1" weighs 146 and has sent one ball over 400 feet. Another 25 pounds on his frame couldn't hurt.

sounds like pound for pound he really puts the hurt on the ball...:applaud:

[Baseball gLove]

sounds like pound for pound he really puts the hurt on the ball...:applaud:


He couldn't pull the ball until I taught him the new swing. Another benefit to the rotational swing is that it allows him to see the ball longer. Mark H got me started on the right path.

[FindAGap12]

I profoundly believe the over emphasis regarding hip rotation is a 'nick' which prohibits younger players from reaching their full-swing potential. That facts remain, when the swing initiated , the hips rotate 30% slower then the bathead - in which matches the velocity of the hands.


I challenge anyone with evidence to prove myself wrong.

Of course the hips go slower than the hands, they are much larger muscles...but that does not mean that they are not thoroughly involved in a good swing.

And the hands never travel anywhere near the speed of the bat head. In an MLB swing, the bat head is traveling around 70 mph, the hands are maybe at 12-15 mph. It's the record-player example, the part of a record closest to the center (like the hands) travels much slower than the outer edge of the record (the bat head).

[Mark H]

He couldn't pull the ball until I taught him the new swing. Another benefit to the rotational swing is that it allows him to see the ball longer. Mark H got me started on the right path.

That's why I spend time on the net. It feels really good to hear from time to time that someone was helped. Thanks.

[Mark H]

I profoundly believe the over emphasis regarding hip rotation is a 'nick' which prohibits younger players from reaching their full-swing potential. That facts remain, when the swing initiated , the hips rotate 30% slower then the bathead - in which matches the velocity of the hands.


I challenge anyone with evidence to prove myself wrong.

I see plenty of kids who emphasize the hands but don't rotate the hips etc well and they don't hit well at all. As to proving you wrong that's going to be difficult when, reading your post, I can only draw vague inferences of what you might mean. In any case, I'm not on here to debate. Tom is your man for that. I'm on here to point parents and kids away from bad information and toward good information as I see it. OTOH, I would be interested in understanding your point if you would be kind enough to elaborate.

[Chris O'Leary]

My son used to be a hands first hitter. When I taught him to go hips 1st, shoulders 2nd, then hands, then bat head, the effect was immediate. He went from beating out soft grounders and getting Texas leaguer base hits, to driving the ball hard, sending the ball 280 to 300 feet with his first few swings. Not bad for a kid that weighed 106 pounds. Now he is 6'1" weighs 146 and has sent one ball over 400 feet. Another 25 pounds on his frame couldn't hurt.

I have had exactly the same results with clients at the HS, D-1 college, and minor league levels.

This rotational stuff works.

[jbooth]

I profoundly believe the over emphasis regarding hip rotation is a 'nick' which prohibits younger players from reaching their full-swing potential. That facts remain, when the swing initiated , the hips rotate 30% slower then the bathead - in which matches the velocity of the hands.


I challenge anyone with evidence to prove myself wrong.

The hips going slower is irrelevant, they pass more force through the kinetic chain to the arms and hands.

Try to hit a ball over the fence without turning your hips. To get power the hips are absolutely THE most important part of the swing. When Barry Bonds had a injury to his front knee he was hitting a lot of warning track shots. When his leg healed the hits went over the fence.

David Ortiz had a back knee injury and had the same issue.

As for preventing young players from reaching their potential, you've got it backwards. Until they learn to use the lower body they're not going to get very far, or hit the ball over the fence.

I've had many 11 year-olds go from hitting it well short of the warning track to hitting it 220 feet, just by getting them to use the lower body correctly.

One 14 YO student who is only 5' 6" and about 140lbs hits it 340' and I've always emphasized hips with him. Another hit it 320 with a wood bat when he was 13 and about 125 pounds. I watch HS kids quite often who hit without good hip turn, and the ball never goes out. It rarely even get to the warning track.

[callyjr]

I profoundly believe the over emphasis regarding hip rotation is a 'nick' which prohibits younger players from reaching their full-swing potential. That facts remain, when the swing initiated , the hips rotate 30% slower then the bathead - in which matches the velocity of the hands.


I challenge anyone with evidence to prove myself wrong.


take a look at your leg muscles and then look at your arms. Which muscle is bigger? Whichever one it is, wouldn't you want to use the bigger muscle to swing the bat with.

Cally

[callyjr]

That's why I spend time on the net. It feels really good to hear from time to time that someone was helped. Thanks.

it feels good to tell someone to look at some videos and you want to take credit for his swing? LOL

[Baseball gLove]

it feels good to tell someone to look at some videos and you want to take credit for his swing? LOL

I gave Mark H credit for my son's swing. He opened my eyes a little over 2 years ago and so now both of my kids hit the ball hard.

[callyjr]

I gave Mark H credit for my son's swing. He opened my eyes a little over 2 years ago and so now both of my kids hit the ball hard.
I give you and your son credit for your sons swing. You took the time to seek help and learn. Mark simply points people to a website.

[tom.guerry]

you can't isolate one area to the exclusion of others or to the point where it becomes a motion that is way different from one that fits into the whole motion.

I think Epstein communicates it well as hips lead hands, but at same time, hands have to stay in and you have to know how to adjust,etc.

certainly many kids need to learn hip action that keeps them leading. but they also hjave to learn that the hands are in control of what the hips are doing. if they just turn the hips like heck, then they can lose the abiltiy to keep the upper and lower body synched.

[jbooth]

you can't isolate one area to the exclusion of others or to the point where it becomes a motion that is way different from one that fits into the whole motion.

Sure. A good swing is one where all the movements flow in perfect synch, hips being first.

certainly many kids need to learn hip action that keeps them leading. But, they also have to learn that the hands are in control of what the hips are doing.

If the hips lead, how can the hands be controlling them?

[Go Cardinals]

I profoundly believe the over emphasis regarding hip rotation is a 'nick' which prohibits younger players from reaching their full-swing potential. That facts remain, when the swing initiated , the hips rotate 30% slower then the bathead - in which matches the velocity of the hands.


I challenge anyone with evidence to prove myself wrong.

I agree... I think that the hips get a feeling of being used, but is cause naturally.

[Go Cardinals]

If the hips lead, how can the hands be controlling them?

The hips don't really lead. The hands start first.

The bat head starts to move to the ball even before the foot hits the ground. Get those clips you showed a while back of players like manny into foot plant.

I have a clip to prove it, but don't know how to put it on.

Anyone who wants to see this clip, PM me your email.

[jbooth]

I agree... I think that the hips get a feeling of being used, but is cause naturally.

Possibly, it comes naturally to about 5 percent of hitters. In the 10 years that I have coached young hitters, it isn't natural. In fact, it takes a lot of work to get the 95% to use the hips well, and half of that 95% never get it right, and they don't continue to compete with those who do get it.

[Mark H]

The bat head starts to move to the ball even before the foot hits the ground. Get those clips you showed a while back of players like manny into foot plant.

.


Without addressing any of your points I would point out the hips begin rotating ahead of the shoulders even before the front foot hits the ground.

[Mark H]

it feels good to tell someone to look at some videos and you want to take credit for his swing? LOL


Since I obviously did NOT take credit for his swing this sentence would be an example of the common logic fallacy known as a "straw man argument" where someone attributes positions or statements to you that you never took and then attacks you for taking those positions which in fact you never took. This method was commonly used on here by teacherman before he was tossed. It's a dishonest underhanded attack tactic also common in politics.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Straw_man

[azmatsfan]

You're in good company, Mark. cally jr has a habit of this.

[Go Cardinals]

Without addressing any of your points I would point out the hips begin rotating ahead of the shoulders even before the front foot hits the ground.

But why?

Please tell me how. Use this clip:

http://i203.photobucket.com/albums/aa173/xvue84/hitting%20clips/fukudomesuperslow.gif

Or any other japanese players

[Go Cardinals]

Possibly, it comes naturally to about 5 percent of hitters. In the 10 years that I have coached young hitters, it isn't natural. In fact, it takes a lot of work to get the 95% to use the hips well, and half of that 95% never get it right, and they don't continue to compete with those who do get it.

I think we are talking about different ages. I am simply talking about my experience, I have work with a couple young hitters. I'll try the drill next time, although I don't think the hips are forced.

I think the key to the mlb swing isn't a torque or rotation or whatever... it is one legged hitting or you could say back leg hitting. Slap hitters shift then swing, while power hitters shift as they swing.

Examples:

Good Swing/ power hitter:
http://hittingillustrated.com/library/Pujols2.gif

Ok swing, but slap hitter:
http://www.teachersbilliards.com/hitzone/JMauer9.gif

[BoardMember]

I profoundly believe............

Why does that sound so familiar?

Oh ya, now I remember! Ms. South Carolina!

"I personally believe, that US americans can't find america on a map, because some people out there in our nation, they don't have maps. And such as South Africa, and the Iraq........and everywhere, such as................:eek:

I sometimes think of my buddy Tom Guerry when I listen to this clip, and it makes me laugh:

Ms. South Carolina............ (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lj3iNxZ8Dww)

[Go Cardinals]

Why does that sound so familiar?

Oh ya, now I remember! Ms. South Carolina!

"I personally believe, that US americans can't find america on a map, because some people out there in our nation, they don't have maps. And such as South Africa, and the Iraq........and everywhere, such as................:eek:

I sometimes think of my buddy Tom Guerry when I listen to this clip, and it makes me laugh:

Ms. South Carolina............ (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lj3iNxZ8Dww)

Once again BM, thanks for adding value to our discussion

BTW, I may do a showcase in your area, I'll pm more info if I do.

[BoardMember]

Once again BM, thanks for adding value to our discussion

BTW, I may do a showcase in your area, I'll pm more info if I do.

How did your lesson go with Tommy? Hmmmmm?????

I was dissapointed when I wasn't invited.......

I though you were going to teach me how to hit........:sorry:

[mudvnine]

The hips don't really lead. The hands start first.

The bat head starts to move to the ball even before the foot hits the ground. Get those clips you showed a while back of players like manny into foot plant.

I have a clip to prove it, but don't know how to put it on.

Anyone who wants to see this clip, PM me your email.

It better not, that would be like a boxer starting to punch before his foot hits the floor. . . try it, it just doesn't work.

Starting the hands (or bat head) before the foot hits the ground is a sure fire way to get your hands out in front of your hips, starting the weight transfer prematurely equating to an unbalanced swing, and not generating the power, had you wanted a fraction of a second more to plant the foot and activate the hips.

All good things are built on great foundations. . .

[LAball]

He couldn't pull the ball until I taught him the new swing.

My son has hips first then maybe shoulder and hands together and can hit it to center or the opposite field, but he doesnt pull it. Whats the new swing?

[Mark H]

But why?

Please tell me how. Use this clip:

http://i203.photobucket.com/albums/aa173/xvue84/hitting%20clips/fukudomesuperslow.gif

Or any other japanese players

The why is because it's the most effective way to hit. How is addressed well by Dixon and Englishbey. Why only japanese players? You really would have a handle on all this by now if you had stuck with Englishbey but if you are going with the Teacherman and Tom Guerry duo you really should insist on the in person lessons Tom promised.

[Go Cardinals]

It better not, that would be like a boxer starting to punch before his foot hits the floor. . . try it, it just doesn't work.

Starting the hands (or bat head) before the foot hits the ground is a sure fire way to get your hands out in front of your hips, starting the weight transfer prematurely equating to an unbalanced swing, and not generating the power, had you wanted a fraction of a second more to plant the foot and activate the hips.

All good things are built on great foundations. . .

I think I stated two important things that you are missing:

1- I said it is actually extremely impossible or at least hard to do
2- its a feeling, it feels like you are swinging before the the foot comes down, but you aren't really.

Go out and try for yourself, oh and film it too.

Also, I said I have several videos to prove that the hands start before the foot comes down. PM your email.

I was actually surprised that only 1 person pm'd me.

I don't claim to have the answers, I just know how I describe it.

[Go Cardinals]

My son has hips first then maybe shoulder and hands together and can hit it to center or the opposite field, but he doesnt pull it. Whats the new swing?

When the hips go, the torso will follow... naturally.

[Ursa Major]

I think we are talking about different ages. I am simply talking about my experience, I have work with a couple young hitters. I'll try the drill next time, although I don't think the hips are forced.

I think the key to the mlb swing isn't a torque or rotation or whatever... it is one legged hitting or you could say back leg hitting. Slap hitters shift then swing, while power hitters shift as they swing.

Examples:

Good Swing/ power hitter:
http://hittingillustrated.com/library/Pujols2.gif

Ok swing, but slap hitter:
http://www.teachersbilliards.com/hitzone/JMauer9.gif
Connor, I think you're suffering from Tony Gwynn syndrome -- "I can do it good but I can't explain it well." Pujols is showing tremendous early hip movement, and the Mauer clip (he's a "slap hitter"??) is meaningless, because that isn't close to his game swing. And you're the first person I've ever heard suggest that a MLB swing is "one-legged... back leg hitting." That's like saying the important part of a tennis serve is throwing the ball up into the air.

And, Cally, why are you launching into Mark. Yes, he constantly reminds newbies to focus on the best hitters in the world as both a starting point and means to check if you're drifting away from sound mechanics. But, over the years, he's offered much, much more when the conversation gets more detailed. What's the point of being smarmy and dumping on him?

[Go Cardinals]

Connor, I think you're suffering from Tony Gwynn syndrome -- "I can do it good but I can't explain it well." Pujols is showing tremendous early hip movement, and the Mauer clip (he's a "slap hitter"??) is meaningless, because that isn't close to his game swing. And you're the first person I've ever heard suggest that a MLB swing is "one-legged... back leg hitting." That's like saying the important part of a tennis serve is throwing the ball up into the air.

And, Cally, why are you launching into Mark. Yes, he constantly reminds newbies to focus on the best hitters in the world as both a starting point and means to check if you're drifting away from sound mechanics. But, over the years, he's offered much, much more when the conversation gets more detailed. What's the point of being smarmy and dumping on him?

Ursa I understand what you are saying, but I think feel can have a lot to do with it.

check out my swing through 2 months:

http://www.teachersbilliards.com/Connorsidebyside041208.gif

The swing on the left is forced. My hips slide, and the swing starts late.

The middle on is better I am starting to try and "hit the ball before my foot comes down". I haven't achieved as much yet.

The 3rd one is the best. After I tried this, the next day, I hit a 340ft home run. I honestly can't tell you anything else about what I do in my swing. All I try to do is get the feel of swinging before the foot comes down. When doing this, I dropped several frames and have better control.

Left swing I was always too early or too late. Swing on right, if I got this feeling of my swing starting before my foot gets down (which it actually doesn't) made me go 4-5, 1 walk in two days.



Ok, now this whole thing with my claims about mauer:

http://www.teachersbilliards.com/hitzone/JMauer6a.gif http://www.teachersbilliards.com/hitzone/JMauer7.gif http://www.teachersbilliards.com/hitzone/JMauer8.gif

These are much better in terms of what I am talking about compared to 08

Mauer's 08 game swing is similar to my swing on the left (I am not claiming to be mauer. I am simply using my swing as an example, because I know what I did).

I tried to take big cuts and get big hits with that swing, but in order to be good with that swing I will have to slap. My axis of rotation was my over my front leg. Mauer is getting close to that.

When I put on a good swing, I feel a rear hip axis of rotation. I don't know if this is actually happening, but that is what I feel. Then, if everything else was in place (therefore in sequence) I feel the hips naturally working.

Again, I am not trying to come off as an expert or a pro. I am simple describing what it feels like when I put on a really good swing.


Watch any japanese hitter. They slap to hit opo and stay back more (rear hip axis?) to pull with power.

http://www.hittingillustrated.com/library/Matsui.gif http://www.hittingillustrated.com/library/Iwamura1.gif http://www.teachersbilliards.com/KazMatsui.gif


Watch old church and compare it to new

http://hittingillustrated.com/library/Church1.gif

It looks like he starts the bat sooner.

http://newyork.mets.mlb.com/media/video.jsp?mid=200805132692879

[jbooth]

1- I said it is actually extremely impossible or at least hard to do

No it isn't.

2- its a feeling, it feels like you are swinging before the the foot comes down, but you aren't really.

Then you haven't felt the correct feeling.

Also, I said I have several videos to prove that the hands start before the foot comes down. PM your email.

Start what? Moving around in some fashion? Sure, moving at the ball before the foot lands? Absolutely not.

[Go Cardinals]

Start what? Moving around in some fashion? Sure, moving at the ball before the foot lands? Absolutely not.

I said starting to go to the ball before the foot comes down.

No it isn't.

Is that really all you say to disagree?

My turn....... yes it is



Then you haven't felt the correct feeling.


I don't think you understand what I'm saying

[mudvnine]

I think I stated two important things that you are missing:

1- I said it is actually extremely impossible or at least hard to do
2- its a feeling, it feels like you are swinging before the the foot comes down, but you aren't really.

Go out and try for yourself, oh and film it too.

Yeah, I think I must have misinderstood what you were saying. I thought that you meant the hands (or bat head) were moving FORWARD to the ball prior to the foot planting on the ground.

If you are talking about the hands/bat head moving as in a "seperation or trigger" movement then I think we're in agreement.

Or, if you use the thought process of the "bat head starts to move to the ball even before the foot hits the ground" as a personal "mental trigger" that works for you, that's fine also; just wouldn't want to use that as a teaching cue for training younger hitters.

I gotta tell ya, you confused me once again when you posted, "Go out and try for yourself, oh and film it too". . . exactly what is it that you want me to try. . . . move my hands to the ball before my foot's down, move my hands back before my foot's down, "feel like" I'm moving my hands to the ball before my foot's down . . . ?

Sorry Cards, not trying to be argumentative, it's just that I'm not sure where you're going with this? In all three of your videos, its obvious that your foot is on the ground before the hands or bat start forward. The same holds true for the Mauer and Japanese videos. :shrug:

My whole response was to your statement "The hips don't really lead. The hands start first", which I disagree with. Check your PM for my email address, I'll look at your videos that you say will prove your point.

MV9

[Go Cardinals]

Yeah, I think I must have misinderstood what you were saying. I thought that you meant the hands (or bat head) were moving FORWARD to the ball prior to the foot planting on the ground.

When I say the hands start to go... they start to go rearward



Or, if you use the thought process of the "bat head starts to move to the ball even before the foot hits the ground" as a personal "mental trigger" that works for you, that's fine also; just wouldn't want to use that as a teaching cue for training younger hitter.

I gotta tell ya, you confused me once again when you posted, "Go out and try for yourself, oh and film it too". . . exactly what is it that you want me to try. . . . move my hands to the ball before my foot's down, move my hands back before my foot's down, "feel like" I'm moving my hands to the ball before my foot's down . . . ?



Sorry Cards, not trying to be argumentative, it's just that I'm not sure where you're going with this? In all three of your videos, its obvious that your foot is on the ground before the hands or bat start forward. The same holds true for the Mauer and Japanese videos. :shrug:

I guess I wasn't clear, but its probably my fault

I said it is hard to actually do. Try it. Do exactly what you described to me. Do this and film it. It is hard to actually do it. At first, if you don't do it right naturally, it will feel like this.


"Go out and try for yourself, oh and film it too". . . exactly what is it that you want me to try. . . . move my hands to the ball before my foot's down, move my hands back before my foot's down, "feel like" I'm moving my hands to the ball before my foot's down . . . ?


All of the swings are 5 frames from first bathead movement. Something is different about all of the. Please tell me.


My whole response was to your statement "The hips don't really lead. The hands start first", which I disagree with. Check your PM for my email address, I'll look at your videos that you say will prove your point.
MV9

http://hittingillustrated.com/library/Vlad6.gif

The bat first goes rearward after hips, but before the front foot goes down.

The one I emailed to you is edited to show it only the stuff in the swing before the foot goes down.

[MoKan]

I think we are talking about different ages. I am simply talking about my experience, I have work with a couple young hitters. I'll try the drill next time, although I don't think the hips are forced.

I think the key to the mlb swing isn't a torque or rotation or whatever... it is one legged hitting or you could say back leg hitting. Slap hitters shift then swing, while power hitters shift as they swing.

Examples:

Good Swing/ power hitter:
http://hittingillustrated.com/library/Pujols2.gif

Ok swing, but slap hitter:
http://www.teachersbilliards.com/hitzone/JMauer9.gif


Wow, I hope my boy can grow up to be an OK swing/slap hitter and lead the league in hitting and have over a 500 slugging % at the age of 23.

Next time why not compare a game swing instead of a half-a** cage swing

[FiveFrameSwing]

If the hips lead, how can the hands be controlling them?

The hands don't control the hips. The top hand is synchronized to the lower body, allowing one to place a focus on their hands.

Dr. Chris Yeager has some hand synchronization drills that I have my students perform. IMO it didn't really matter if the kids thought their hands were controlling the swing, because I was getting the swing I wanted and it was producing.

So go ahead and think the hands are controlling the swing, but only after they are properly synchronized to the lower body.

[FiveFrameSwing]

Without addressing any of your points I would point out the hips begin rotating ahead of the shoulders even before the front foot hits the ground.

Thank you Mark.

Hearing this from you is significant. The ommission of hip/shoulder upper-body separation was one of the few remaining issues that I didn't believe Steve had correctly.

[LAball]

Im believe the proper MLB hip swing is the best swing in general. But amature level can do well with an upper body swing if they train. Some people might not be able to understand a hip and whip swing and actually make there swing worse while attempting to learn it and never succeeding.

[FiveFrameSwing]

http://i203.photobucket.com/albums/aa173/xvue84/hitting%20clips/fukudomesuperslow.gif



I like this video.

Notice how the lead arm is hugging the upper body at contact. Very nice.

[FiveFrameSwing]

I think the key to the mlb swing isn't a torque or rotation or whatever... it is one legged hitting or you could say back leg hitting. Slap hitters shift then swing, while power hitters shift as they swing.

Examples:

Good Swing/ power hitter:
http://hittingillustrated.com/library/Pujols2.gif

Ok swing, but slap hitter:
http://www.teachersbilliards.com/hitzone/JMauer9.gif

I've been away for a spell working with a high school team.

Please explain the concept of "one legged hitting".

[FiveFrameSwing]

I said starting to go to the ball before the foot comes down.



Is that really all you say to disagree?

My turn....... yes it is




I don't think you understand what I'm saying

GoC ... I haven't had a chance to check out this board much in the last 2-3 months. I must say that your writing style and demeanor has changed significantly over that time.

Are you sharing your account with someone?

[Mark H]

Thank you Mark.

Hearing this from you is significant. The ommission of hip/shoulder upper-body separation was one of the few remaining issues that I didn't believe Steve had correctly.

There is a lot of misinformation repeated over and over about Englishbey so it's not surprising you should have such an impression. Having said that, I see lots of Little Leaguers at the local park exhibiting great huge gobs of separation and most of them hit like #$%^ so the story is not short.

[Mark H]

Im believe the proper MLB hip swing is the best swing in general. But amature level can do well with an upper body swing if they train. Some people might not be able to understand a hip and whip swing and actually make there swing worse while attempting to learn it and never succeeding.

I have long said you have to consider a hitter's gifts and goals. If a hitter is already hitting as well as they want to at the highest level they intend to play leave it alone and let them hit whatever goofy way is working for them whatever label their mechanics may carry. Scott has often said any system violently executed will improve most youth hitters (if I have the quote reasonably close). Now if a hitter wants to hit the best pitchers in the world, that's a different question.

[Go Cardinals]

GoC ... I haven't had a chance to check out this board much in the last 2-3 months. I must say that your writing style and demeanor has changed significantly over that time.

Are you sharing your account with someone?

I'm just using better punctuation and choosing my words more carefully.

[Freestate]

I give you and your son credit for your sons swing. You took the time to seek help and learn. Mark simply points people to a website.

Someone gives Mark a compliment, and you feel the need to follow that with a put down? Is that your life philosophy? Try to undo anything nice said about other people?

Best single piece of hitting advice I ever received was from Mark. To wit: compare anything you hear/see about hitting to slow motion video of the best hitters in the world.

[tom.guerry]

the hands are the site of control for upper body and lower body tends to synch with lower body.

also, where/when you load the hands determines the direction and timing of weight shift.

The legs tend to synch with the arm motions.

these things set pretty tight limits around how the hips work.

alos with the GO, the shoulders are tilting to support the hands turning the barrell and the shoulder tilt synchs with the firing of the hips.

this top down control of bottom up action/control of weight shift/control of bledning of somewhat seoparate upper and lower body actions is also the same general pattern you use in throwing in season, so you are already doing this hundreds of times a day if your overhand throw motion is high level.

[jbooth]

the hands are the site of control for upper body and lower body tends to synch with lower body.

also, where/when you load the hands determines the direction and timing of weight shift.

The legs tend to synch with the arm motions.

these things set pretty tight limits around how the hips work.

alos with the GO, the shoulders are tilting to support the hands turning the barrell and the shoulder tilt synchs with the firing of the hips.

this top down control of bottom up action/control of weight shift/control of bledning of somewhat seoparate upper and lower body actions is also the same general pattern you use in throwing in season, so you are already doing this hundreds of times a day if your overhand throw motion is high level.

I guess you live in that same alternate universe that Richard lives in, where physics and anatomy are different.

What you stated above is complete illogical nonsense that defies Newton's Laws and the structural actions of body movement.

One might mentally trigger actions from a thought process that focuses on the hands, but anatomically and physically, the hands have nothing to do with moving the hips or anything else of the body, in a baseball swing.