Obtuse angled grandstands

[stlfan]

I was looking at seating diagrams and such, especially over at Andrew Clems site. It seems that at least Braves Field and Tiger Stadium were built where the main grandstands were built at an obtuse angle rather than at a right angle or an acute angle like a majority of parks are built. Tiger Stadium isn't as obvious as Braves Field. I wonder why they were built this way.

[Pelt]

The structure of Braves Field itself doesn't seem that bad to me, although it definitely isn't on a right, or acute angle. What makes it look especially off is that the field itself seems turned too far clockwise.

http://www.ballparks.com/baseball/national/braves01.jpg

[PowerAlley21]

stlfan, The obtuse angle is an interesting observation. My only guess is that due to the restricted site in which the ballpark was built, the designers (Osborn) found they can yeild a slightly higher seat count by "fanning" out the geometry behind home plate which in turn, would permit larger and deeper bleacher sections on otherwise a small site.

[spark240]

http://pics4.city-data.com/cpicc/cfiles18884.jpg

This is Salem Municipal/Kiwanis Field (http://www.ballparkreviews.com/salemva/munic.htm#), one-time home of the Salem Bucs (Carolina League).

[cgcoyne2]

http://pics4.city-data.com/cpicc/cfiles18884.jpg

This is Salem Municipal/Kiwanis Field (http://www.ballparkreviews.com/salemva/munic.htm#), one-time home of the Salem Bucs (Carolina League).

Is this where some of the old Yankee Stadium seats went during the Yankee Stadium renovation?

[Manhattan]

Is this where some of the old Yankee Stadium seats went during the Yankee Stadium renovation? I am wondering about Yankee Stadium and I also am wondering about Dodger Stadium.

[chip]

Wrigley Field is rotated about 7 degrees counter clockwise.
Here is the way the field would be if it were laid out square
with the stands.

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y6/telemudd/Wrigley2.jpg

[spark240]

Is this where some of the old Yankee Stadium seats went during the Yankee Stadium renovation?

That's right.

[Transplanted Fan]

Tiger Stadium and Wrigley Field weren't built with obtuse-angled grandstands as such. Like another poster previously illustrated, those parks' grandstands were right angles originally parallel with the foul lines: the teams later rotated the diamond so that one side moves into the field, while the other moves away.

Here's another park to add to the list: Gill Stadium in Manchester, New Hampshire. (http://www.ballparkreviews.com/manches/gill.htm)

[stlfan]

I think the reason Wrigley's is so strange is because early in the parks life (I believe before they double decked it) the stands on the first base side were completely moved more towards the street. Does anyone have the complete story?

[Pelt]

Found this on www.ballparktour.com regarding Braves Field in Boston.

" When the dead ball era ended in the 1920's as Babe Ruth was practically re-inventing the home run, many ballparks reconfigured their dimensions to take advantage of the new homer craze. Braves Field was no exception. In 1928 the Braves moved in the fences substantially, added bleacher sections in left and center field, and shifted the diamond a few degrees clockwise. From the late 1920s until the early 1940s the Braves tinkered with the location of the outfield fence and bleachers several times. In 1936 they moved home plate backward by about 15 feet, and in 1937 they cut out a triangular section of the right field pavilion to stretch the distance down the right field line to a respectable 318 feet (From 296 ft.). The bleachers in left and center were eventually removed, and the outfield fence from left to right-center was raised to 20, and eventually 25 ft. high. In 1941, Sky-boxes were installed on the roof, and in 1946 as part of a $500,000 facelift, light towers were erected and a new electric scoreboard was installed in left field."

And shifting the field clockwise really contributed the the extreme look of the obtuse angle. I'm not finding anything so far, as to what the field looked like before they shifted the diamond - having a more symmetrical look in relation to the grandstands.

[Pelt]

I think the reason Wrigley's is so strange is because early in the parks life (I believe before they double decked it) the stands on the first base side were completely moved more towards the street. Does anyone have the complete story?

From wiki:

"By 1922, William Wrigley had decided that after nine seasons, both the seating and the playing field of cozy Cubs Park were ready for a major expansion. Rather than rebuilding the grandstand from scratch, Wrigley hired original architect Zachary Taylor Davis to make the expansion around the existing structure. The grandstand would be sliced into three pieces, with the home plate section placed on rollers and moved roughly 60 feet west (away from right field), and the left field section about 100 feet northwest. Both gaps were to be filled in with more seating, resulting in a significantly longer grandstand and the noticeable "dog leg" shape of the stands on the first base side visible to this day. Additionally, the foul ground and the height of the fence in front of it would be reduced by additional rows of box seats added in front of the existing grandstand. The diamond and the foul lines would be rotated 3 degrees counterclockwise from their earlier orientation, allowing for those extra box seats."

And here is a cool photo just for the hell of it:

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[Gary Dunaier]

And here is a cool photo just for the hell of it:

Not as cool as it could have been... it's backwards. Corbis screwed up on this one.

[Pelt]

Good catch. I'll flip it for them.

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[NYFan1stYankFan2nd]

Good catch. I'll flip it for them.

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Y'know, I asked this question here ages ago, figuring it was relevant what with all the photographic talent flooding this place:

"How does a photo in a book/newspaper/website get FLIPPED?" Isn't putting a picture in one of these pretty straight forward, as opposed to correctly inserting a slide in one of those old slide carousel projectors?"

Just curious.

[soup]

wow how interesting. I had no idea why the field was so strangely oriented

[stlfan]

I've been playing around with photoshop trying to recreate the original orientation on Wrigley and I am convinced that it wasn't as simple as moving the home plate area 60 ft away from right field and the 3rd base stands 100 ft northwest. Either the 3rd base stands had been turned a few degrees clockwise when moved or the 1st base stands were pivoted a few degrees counter clockwise from the right field corner. When trying to reassemble and move the pieces to the original configuration, the degree in which the grandstand wrapped around the field was too narrow to have fit the diamond. I'll work some more on it during lunch.

[stlfan]

Ok, don't take this as absolute gospel but I worked on this in photoshop. Of course this isn't exactly accurate since when they did these moves it was still only a single deck park. I am convinced that first they moved the entire stadium counter clockwise 3° using the far right corner as a pivot point (photo2). Next they split it up into 3 sections, the first base side, home plate area and third base side. The first base side stayed where it was, home plate and the third base stands were moved 60 ft away from the right field wall and then the third base stands were moved again northwest and turned yet another 3° counter clockwise (photo3). The gaps in the stands were then filled in (photo4).

[Pelt]

That's great stuff, stlfan. Even though it's a bit off, simply for logistcal reasons (like the overhead photo angle and upper deck, etc...), your pics still illustrate what they did.

I'm surprised that there were no pics taken of such an undertaking. Or are there? You'd think that an engineering feat, such as this, would have been documented with photos.

[stlfan]

I know what you mean Pelt. In that regard, there really aren't too many pics out there that I have seen showing Wrigley prior to the move.

[teamrap]

The structure of Braves Field itself doesn't seem that bad to me, although it definitely isn't on a right, or acute angle. What makes it look especially off is that the field itself seems turned too far clockwise.

http://www.ballparks.com/baseball/national/braves01.jpg

Braves Field's baseball diamond was actually rotated

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