War of The Ballparks- Finals

[dbacksfan95]

PNC Park .vs. Yankee Stadium

[YankeeFanUK]

i have been to both parks...PNC has THE best view of downtown ( and the Clemente bridge ) in the majors..i really like the small intermate size & the rotunda in left is cool BUT Yankee stadium IS the stadium..steeped in history..nuff said

[Yoda]

again this has nothing to do with history.


:shrug:


What place would you rather plant your butt and watch a game?

[YankeeFanUK]

again this has nothing to do with history.


:shrug:


What place would you rather plant your butt and watch a game?

of all the parks ive been to i`d say Pac Bell...but Yankee Std IS home...as Stan the Man says NUFF SAID :)

[Yoda]

Damn, he said "nuff said."


I've got nothing on that. :(

[PeteU]

While Yankee Stadium may have a storied history, I don't think it even comes close to PNC as a ballpark.

[MarcianoNY]

again this has nothing to do with history.


:shrug:


What place would you rather plant your butt and watch a game?
We're not pickin out a flat-screen TV or a car here folks! I may lose my faith in humanity if PNC wins. Sure its a great place, but this is Yankee Stadium we're talkin about here!! I mean what is the criteria, cause "war of the ballparks" is a little vague. Are we talkin greatest ballpark or most friendly ballpark or ballpark in the nicest neighborhood or what? I voted Yankee Stadium, as you may have guessed.

[YankeeFanBx]

I will not reveal who I voted for. :cool:

[Yoda]

We're not pickin out a flat-screen TV or a car here folks! I may lose my faith in humanity if PNC wins. Sure its a great place, but this is Yankee Stadium we're talkin about here!! I mean what is the criteria, cause "war of the ballparks" is a little vague. Are we talkin greatest ballpark or most friendly ballpark or ballpark in the nicest neighborhood or what? I voted Yankee Stadium, as you may have guessed.

It's the yankees that make yankee stadium great.

From what I've heard from people that have been there and the comments from Yankees fans on this board it's a dump. :shrug:

Bad sightlines. Cramped concourse. Food that tastes like it's from a hospital. Ignorant ushers.

[MarcianoNY]

It's the yankees that make yankee stadium great.

From what I've heard from people that have been there and the comments from Yankees fans on this board it's a dump. :shrug:

Bad sightlines. Cramped concourse. Food that tastes like it's from a hospital. Ignorant ushers.

Have you ever been to Yankee Stadium? Because in that last sentence you made it sound like Iraq. Yes, some of those things are true but of course Yankee fans whine about little things like any other fans; it doesn't change the fact that we love our stadium. The fact that it may be outdated and may need to be replaced is completely irrelevant to the question of whether or not it's a great ballpark. It's like comparing an old muscle car like a '69 Dodge Charger to a 2008 Toyota Camry and saying, the Camry is a greater car because it comes with AC, airbags and gets 30+ MPG. Any car lover would laugh you out of the room. To me its the same with ballparks; I would think that most "ballpark lovers" would tell you that Yankee Stadium, Fenway, Wrigley, etc, are greater than any new stadium in a heartbeat; no matter how comfortable, attractive, or generally nice that new stadium may be. It's just not the same.

[Yoda]

I'll be there in July.

[MarcianoNY]

Good for you. I think you'll see that, for all its flaws, it's far from a dump. It's Yankee Stadium; the heart and soul of the Bronx and the greatest of the great old ballparks.

[Yoda]

I'm not trying to dog YS here.

But I guess I'm just viewing the poll a little differently.


And I'm PUMPED to see YS (and Shea) this summer.

You guys will probably get tired of me saying that, though

[cgcoyne2]

I love Yankee Stadium!!!!

I'm a HUGEEEEEEEEE Yankee fan!!!!

BUT!!!!

Yankee Stadium is a DUMP!!!!

Babe Ruth is dead, his ghost ain't helping me get a damn hot dog inside the concourse. I'm not that big (5'10", 185) and there is no room to walk around when the place is HALF full. Can you imagine if it's full!!!!

Lou Gehrig said he was the "luckiest man on the face of the earth", Because he didn't have to come back to Yankee Stadium.

I've been to PNC Park. It wins hands down over Yankee Stadium.

Oh Yeah, PNC also doesn't have that pompous ass, John Sterling.

Next Question!

[jimmyjimjimz]

Once again, I voted for Yankee Stadium. There's no way I'll ever vote against Yankee Stadium, unless it's for the worst ballpark ever.

[MarcianoNY]

I love Yankee Stadium!!!!

I'm a HUGEEEEEEEEE Yankee fan!!!!

BUT!!!!

Yankee Stadium is a DUMP!!!!

Babe Ruth is dead, his ghost ain't helping me get a damn hot dog inside the concourse. I'm not that big (5'10", 185) and there is no room to walk around when the place is HALF full. Can you imagine if it's full!!!!

Lou Gehrig said he was the "luckiest man on the face of the earth", Because he didn't have to come back to Yankee Stadium.

I've been to PNC Park. It wins hands down over Yankee Stadium.

Oh Yeah, PNC also doesn't have that pompous ass, John Stirling.

Next Question!

Well, you are from Jersey... we shouldn't expect you to understand. (Just playin!) I don't know maybe I'm nuts but there's something nostalgic about the tighter concourses... part of that is the fact that when you're at a big game, it actually feels crowded. I like that; makes it more exciting. But aside from that I'm not questioning the fact that the new ones will be an improvement. It's just that I don't feel you should count things like "how fast you can get a hot dog" into whether or not Yankee Stadium is a great ballpark. And it is NOT a dump. Everybody wants to run with that "its a dump" thing now and they don't know what they're talkin about. AND, what does John Sterling have to do with the stadium?

[Twins91871977]

PNC, if Yankee Stadium were so great, they wouldn't be replacing it. My 2 cents.

[PeteU]

I think some people (*cough *cough Yankees fans *cough *cough) are looking sentimentally instead of objectively. Objectively, PNC is a much better ballpark than Yankee Stadium.

I mean, I have nothing but warm, fuzzy feelings and memories towards Memorial Stadium, but that's not going to say it was the best ballpark ever as ballparks go.

[MarcianoNY]

I think some people (*cough *cough Yankees fans *cough *cough) are looking sentimentally instead of objectively. Objectively, PNC is a much better ballpark than Yankee Stadium.

I mean, I have nothing but warm, fuzzy feelings and memories towards Memorial Stadium, but that's not going to say it was the best ballpark ever as ballparks go.

Of course we are. But I would say the same thing about Fenway or Wrigley in a heartbeat. It comes down to what you think is important... like my car analogy from before.

[dbacksfan95]

Of course we are. But I would say the same thing about Fenway or Wrigley in a heartbeat. It comes down to what you think is important... like my car analogy from before.

so you think that yankee stadium isn't good just because you can't get your ass to a concession stand to buy a damn hot dog? I agree, that does suck, but I mean come on. If that's your criteria,you're totally crazy.

[MarcianoNY]

so you think that yankee stadium isn't good just because you can't get your ass to a concession stand to buy a damn hot dog? I agree, that does suck, but I mean come on. If that's your criteria,you're totally crazy.

No, that's not my criteria. You got me wrong. I'm saying that shouldn't be a legitimate criteria. People are so spoiled these days.

[dbacksfan95]

No, that's not my criteria. You got me wrong. I'm saying that shouldn't be a legitimate criteria. People are so spoiled these days.

oh.ok.sorry.i got ya now.

[dbacksfan95]

bump
let's get some more votes!

[dbacksfan95]

PNC is up by 1 vote

[Yoda]

now lock the voting!

[Chevy114]

When comparing the two I like pnc the best, they are one of the few to get the total package right. Right amount of seats, great view, open air, nice concourses.

Yankee is probably cool too, but it looks cramp and the renovations take away from the old time feel everyone says I should have for it.

[whoisonit]

Another vote for PNC !

[dabigyankeeman]

now lock the voting!


too late, i tied it.

a stadium, a building, a city, etc is made up of many things, not all physical, that all add up to what that thing is.

what has happened in yankee stadium since 1923 is part of that building, and thats what puts it over the top.

Is Dubai a better city (or country or whatever the hell it is) than New York because its all new and shiny? no, because it doesnt have the history that New York does. thats my story and i'm stickin to it!

[Yoda]

too late, i tied it.

a stadium, a building, a city, etc is made up of many things, not all physical, that all add up to what that thing is.

what has happened in yankee stadium since 1923 is part of that building, and thats what puts it over the top.

Is Dubai a better city (or country or whatever the hell it is) than New York because its all new and shiny? no, because it doesnt have the history that New York does. thats my story and i'm stickin to it!

Actually there's human history going back thousands of years in dubai. :shrug:

[jerseyyankeefan]

Two words -- Monument Park...no other team has THAT history.

[dabigyankeeman]

Actually there's human history going back thousands of years in dubai. :shrug:


yeah, but what have they done compared to what has been done in new york?

[Yankees12]

I think this is quickly turning into a Yankees fans vs. Yankees haters poll.

That's not to say that every single person who voted didn't have legitimate reasons for voting the way they did - many did - but still, this is certainly going along "partisan" lines, so to speak.

Of course, the divisiveness of the Yankees certainly contributes to that, as does the lack of criteria for what determines the "best" stadium in this contest. Either way, this poll is starting to become more indicative of who hates the Yankees and who loves the Yankees, with a ballpark twist to it.

[Yoda]

I don't hate the Yankees by any means.


I just feel that a good majority of the opion on this matter is clouded by history and feelings of the past.

This poll to me is simply "where'd you rather go see a game?"

IF PNC and YS were right next door, which would you choose?

[Sean Ryan]

I don't hate the Yankees by any means.


I just feel that a good majority of the opion on this matter is clouded by history and feelings of the past.

This poll to me is simply "where'd you rather go see a game?"

IF PNC and YS were right next door, which would you choose?

It's not even close.

[Yoda]

It's not even close.

Feel like elaborating?

Any other reason except for "It's Yankee Stadium!" or "History?"

[Sean Ryan]

Feel like elaborating?

Any other reason except for "It's Yankee Stadium!" or "History?"

IF PNC and YS were right next door, which would you choose?


When answering this question, most of it has to with the team that plays in it. When it comes to going to a baseball game, I usually could careless what the building looks like.

So who would I rather see play a game? The Yankees or the Pirates? Again, it's not even close.

[Yoda]

Sheesh



Ok. Scotty from star trek beams up the Yankees and there's a screw up.

We now have two identical Yankees teams.

So, hearing that PNC is a huge hit they build a new one right next door to the current YS to house the second team.

You have a ticket to a game but with all the confusion management is allowing you to pick which game you see. The game at PNC, or the game at YS.

Which do you choose and why?

[Sean Ryan]

Sheesh



Ok. Scotty from star trek beams up the Yankees and there's a screw up.

We now have two identical Yankees teams.

So, hearing that PNC is a huge hit they build a new one right next door to the current YS to house the second team.

You have a ticket to a game but with all the confusion management is allowing you to pick which game you see. The game at PNC, or the game at YS.

Which do you choose and why?

Couldn't tell you, never been to the PNC

:rofl:

[Yoda]

*runs into traffic*




I love this place.

In all fairness i haven't been to YS.


So when I go we'll have to do this again :hp:hp:dance:eek:

[cgcoyne2]

Remember what I said first.

I'm a big Yankee fan.

But PNC is a nicer place to see a game.

But how about this???

I liked Jacob's Field better than PNC last year when I visited both.

Just my opinion.:dance

[MarcianoNY]

Remember what I said first.

I'm a big Yankee fan.

But PNC is a nicer place to see a game.

But how about this???

I liked Jacob's Field better than PNC last year when I visited both.

Just my opinion.:dance

I think it also depends on what you expect. If you're going for the nicer place to see a game, you could very well be right. But I think a lot of die-hard Yankee fans, contrary to what Steinbrenner thought when he wanted to move the Yanks to the Meadowlands, relish the fact that that the Yankees, big as they are, still play in an old park in an inner-city borough that has a reputation, both real and exaggerated, for being rough. Of course its cramped. It's an old inner-city ballpark, albeit partially covered by a somewhat newer skin. Fenway and Wrigley are the same. They're cramped, have no parking, have ushers, parking attendants and food vendors who basically don't give a rat's ass about you; and are sometimes described as dumpy... but they're great. Miller Park is a "nicer" place to see a game than Yankee Stadium or Fenway - people, seats, food, parking, etc, are all "nicer." But does a game there compare with Yankee Stadium (or Fenway, to show I'm not as biased as you might think)? Not to me. History IS the park and the park IS history. They are one and the same.

[cgcoyne2]

I think it also depends on what you expect. If you're going for the nicer place to see a game, you could very well be right. But I think a lot of die-hard Yankee fans, contrary to what Steinbrenner thought when he wanted to move the Yanks to the Meadowlands, relish the fact that that the Yankees, big as they are, still play in an old park in an inner-city borough that has a reputation, both real and exaggerated, for being rough. Of course its cramped. It's an old inner-city ballpark, albeit partially covered by a somewhat newer skin. Fenway and Wrigley are the same. They're cramped, have no parking, have ushers, parking attendants and food vendors who basically don't give a rat's ass about you; and are sometimes described as dumpy... but they're great. Miller Park is a "nicer" place to see a game than Yankee Stadium or Fenway - people, seats, food, parking, etc, are all "nicer." But does a game there compare with Yankee Stadium (or Fenway, to show I'm not as biased as you might think)? Not to me. History IS the park and the park IS history. They are one and the same.


You make it immpossible for me to argue with you!!!

Very good points!!!

[Chevy114]

I do feel like its a matter of opinion when I went to wrigley, I felt the ghosts of past. When I went to turner field, I finally found out why teams love open air new stadiums. The question I have since I have never been is do you still feel the ghosts of the past at ys anymore?

[MarcianoNY]

I do feel like its a matter of opinion when I went to wrigley, I felt the ghosts of past. When I went to turner field, I finally found out why teams love open air new stadiums. The question I have since I have never been is do you still feel the ghosts of the past at ys anymore?

This is a point of contention among some Yankee fans on here, but I say yes. You can feel the history that permeates Monument Park and there is definitely something magical to me about walking out of the old-school, dark concourses that generations of fans have walked through and then seeing this flood of green grass and blue seats. Very unique experience. If you get a chance to go to a game before it closes, go and see for yourself.

[Chevy114]

This is a point of contention among some Yankee fans on here, but I say yes. You can feel the history that permeates Monument Park and there is definitely something magical to me about walking out of the old-school, dark concourses that generations of fans have walked through and then seeing this flood of green grass and blue seats. Very unique experience. If you get a chance to go to a game before it closes, go and see for yourself.

I would love to go, but man would that be hard.

[Philtration]

I have no reason to hate the Yankees.
I did use to dislike George Steinbrenner but that was before I understood what he really wanted. He wants to win and if they lose in game 7 of the World Series then he views that as a failure instead of trying to milk it for the next 10 years.
Not being happy with 2nd place is what made them who they are.
To be honest... most of the Yankee bashing is just jealousy.
What they have done in MLB history is something to admire.

Why try to piss on them or their fans for being the best baseball team of all time?
Someone had to be the best and it just so happens that they have been light years above the rest of the teams and you cannot deny that.
If it were your own favorite team that accomplished even half of what they have then you would see things in a different light.

[YankeeFanUK]

i knew there was a reason i liked the Pale Hose :)

[MarcianoNY]

For those convinced Yankee Stadium is a "dump":
http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/baseball/yankees/2008/05/11/2008-05-11_grub_at_local_stadiums_is_grubfree_.html

[Chevy114]

I have no reason to hate the Yankees.
I did use to dislike George Steinbrenner but that was before I understood what he really wanted. He wants to win and if they lose in game 7 of the World Series then he views that as a failure instead of trying to milk it for the next 10 years.
Not being happy with 2nd place is what made them who they are.
To be honest... most of the Yankee bashing is just jealousy.
What they have done in MLB history is something to admire.

Why try to piss on them or their fans for being the best baseball team of all time?
Someone had to be the best and it just so happens that they have been light years above the rest of the teams and you cannot deny that.
If it were your own favorite team that accomplished even half of what they have then you would see things in a different light.

When I piss on the yankees and their fans, I don't piss on them for being the best. I piss on them for reasons like they overpay washed up players making the free agency periods a joke these days. My two fav. examples of what the yankees have created are barry zito and eric gange neither of them are yankees, but both got overpaid just like the yankees players do.

My other issue with them is the "home grown" issue. If you aren't "home grown" then anytime you slip up you are in the dog house i.e. arod getting mvp and still getting booed by yankee fans. Funny thing most people talk about that home grown 1996 team, but 90% of the players were home grown on other teams.

Overall the yankees are a good team in a big city that a lot of players would love to play. Like most atheletes they want to win at all cost so I can't blame them for being unhappy with 2nd place. It's just the little things that bother me.

[MarcianoNY]

My two fav. examples of what the yankees have created are barry zito and eric gange neither of them are yankees, but both got overpaid just like the yankees players do.

Wrong. The Yankees did not create this trend. Historically, the Yankees have rarely been trendsetters in the high salary push. It's usually idiot small-market owners that offer players ridiculous salaries they can't afford, pushing the market value to a height they can't keep up with. Naturally, big-markets like New York, Boston and L.A. are always gonna come out on top when salaries go up. So you should be complaining when a team like the Rangers offers A-Rod a ridiculous contract they can't maintain for publicity's sake, not when the Yankees snatch him up.

[Philtration]

When I piss on the yankees and their fans, I don't piss on them for being the best. I piss on them for reasons like they overpay washed up players making the free agency periods a joke these days. My two fav. examples of what the yankees have created are barry zito and eric gange neither of them are yankees, but both got overpaid just like the yankees players do.

My other issue with them is the "home grown" issue. If you aren't "home grown" then anytime you slip up you are in the dog house i.e. arod getting mvp and still getting booed by yankee fans. Funny thing most people talk about that home grown 1996 team, but 90% of the players were home grown on other teams.

Overall the yankees are a good team in a big city that a lot of players would love to play. Like most atheletes they want to win at all cost so I can't blame them for being unhappy with 2nd place. It's just the little things that bother me.

I don't see how the Yankees are responsible for other teams overpaying for an overrated player like Zito or a washed up guy like Gagne.
Those were bad deals made by people who do not know what they are doing and that is their own fault. That is like saying that Toyota is responsible for the guys at Kia building crappy cars.
The Yankees must have picked the right players to over pay or they would be in the same boat as the Baltimore Orioles.
Not only do those overpaid player have to perform but they have to do it on a bigger stage with a brighter light shining down on them at all times. They have to be able to deal with the pressure of putting on those pin stripes and playing in front of demanding fans and a ball busting media.
Not for the faint of heart.

Red Sox fans spent years complaining about the Yankees big pay role yet they did not win a ring until they did the exact same thing. Funny how they have embraced that method now eh?
The Yankees have the largest pay role yet they still make money. That is because they run the team like a real business and they are very good at it. They understood how to put together a great TV deal while everyone else was clueless. They know how to market their team. They know that winning baseball will fill the park and fans will pay up to see great players and not cute teams that lose (except on the North side of Chicago)
They beat other teams on and off the field and that is how you have to do it to be on top.

[dbacksfan95]

bump......

[jimmyjimjimz]

why is no one voting for Yankee Stadium? You all must be from Boston.

honestly, if you've never been to a stadium, you shouldnt judge it.

[placount]

why is no one voting for Yankee Stadium? You all must be from Boston.

honestly, if you've never been to a stadium, you shouldnt judge it.

have you been to pnc?

[cgcoyne2]

why is no one voting for Yankee Stadium? You all must be from Boston.

honestly, if you've never been to a stadium, you shouldnt judge it.

Again, I'm a Yankee fan.

I love Yankee Stadium.

I've been to PNC.

It's just better.

Next question.

[cgcoyne2]

For those convinced Yankee Stadium is a "dump":
http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/baseball/yankees/2008/05/11/2008-05-11_grub_at_local_stadiums_is_grubfree_.html


I love the stadium dogs.

I was sitting there when the hot dog guy came by and sold some dogs to the guy next to me. It smelled so good I had to buy one. I told the hot dog guy he was doing that on purpose.

Gotta love the Yankee Dogs!!!!!

[Urbanshocker13]

Tied!!! 36-36!!


Yeah Yankee stadium has the cramped concourses, bad food and Nazi Ushers! BUT, you understand how special the place is when you first walk up the tunnel and you see the green grass and blue seats of the huge stadium, and you get that feeling, When you hear bob Shepards voice over the PA and the organ playing. The way sounds travels in the stadium, the way it looks when you are in it, the aww inspiring scale. You just get a feeling when you watch a game there that's hard to put in words. It's just something about the atmosphere when you are inside. The history of the place has something to do with it but that's not all the place has a feel by it's self. There is allot of great ballparks now, especially the new ones but there is something different about Yankee stadium.

[bigtime39]

I've been to Yankee Stadium twice. Both times on the 1B side. Once down low, and once up high. And, frankly, I wasn't that impressed. It is what it is. When they designed the place, they made decisions I find questionable (especially the deep, narrow patch of foul ground behind home plate). To tell you the truth, I liked Tiger Stadium better.
But this poll--if you base it on stadium design alone--ought to be a slam dunk for PNC. On a purely objective basis, PNC is a better place to see a ball game. Period.
It likely won't win this vote, because of the dominance of Yankee$ fans on this board, but it is the better yard.

[PeteU]

Either way, this poll is starting to become more indicative of who hates the Yankees and who loves the Yankees, with a ballpark twist to it.


I don't hate the Yankees.

Okay, that's not true. But that's just because I'm an Orioles fan by birth. That and that little pissant Jeffrey Maier and the hero treatment he got from Yankees fans for his act of fan interference.

But I'm not going to deny that of all the franchises, the Yankees have the most history and legacy.

Nor am I going to deny that Yankee Stadium, even in its renovated form, is a place of great baseball history where many great players have taken the field.

But objectively speaking, it doesn't come close to being as scenic and attractive a ballpark as PNC.

[placount]

It likely won't win this vote, because of the dominance of Yankee$ fans on this board, but it is the better yard.

thats for sure

[Chevy114]

I don't see how the Yankees are responsible for other teams overpaying for an overrated player like Zito or a washed up guy like Gagne.
Those were bad deals made by people who do not know what they are doing and that is their own fault. That is like saying that Toyota is responsible for the guys at Kia building crappy cars.
The Yankees must have picked the right players to over pay or they would be in the same boat as the Baltimore Orioles.
Not only do those overpaid player have to perform but they have to do it on a bigger stage with a brighter light shining down on them at all times. They have to be able to deal with the pressure of putting on those pin stripes and playing in front of demanding fans and a ball busting media.
Not for the faint of heart.

Red Sox fans spent years complaining about the Yankees big pay role yet they did not win a ring until they did the exact same thing. Funny how they have embraced that method now eh?
The Yankees have the largest pay role yet they still make money. That is because they run the team like a real business and they are very good at it. They understood how to put together a great TV deal while everyone else was clueless. They know how to market their team. They know that winning baseball will fill the park and fans will pay up to see great players and not cute teams that lose (except on the North side of Chicago)
They beat other teams on and off the field and that is how you have to do it to be on top.

What I meant is how they overpaid for farnsworth, randy johnson, musinnia, and roger clemsons (the last go around). By no means are they as stupid as the gaints for zito, the rangers for arod, and the rays for greg vaughn, but they still are a big reason other teams can't compete and it makes the off season fun.

[Rob R]

I don't hate the Yankees by any means.


I just feel that a good majority of the opion on this matter is clouded by history and feelings of the past.

This poll to me is simply "where'd you rather go see a game?"

IF PNC and YS were right next door, which would you choose?

To see a ballgame and soak in a classical baseball environment filled with tradition and no silly frills or contrived gimmicks, Yankee Stadium, hands down.

If I want to visit an amusement park, complete with wrought iron roller coasters, PNC, though I'd prefer Disney in Orlando over Pittsburgh. :)

[Yoda]

To see a ballgame and soak in a classical baseball environment filled with tradition and no silly frills or contrived gimmicks, Yankee Stadium, hands down.

If I want to visit an amusement park, complete with wrought iron roller coasters, PNC, though I'd prefer Disney in Orlando over Pittsburgh. :)

Roller coasters?

If any park is an amusement park it's Comerica. They have kiddy rides and all sorts of tomfoolery.

[Lafferty Daniel]

Roller coasters?

If any park is an amusement park it's Comerica. They have kiddy rides and all sorts of tomfoolery.

Maybe he thinks the Roberto Clemente Bridge is a roller coaster. :laugh

[Lafferty Daniel]

Looks - PNC > YS

Location - PNC > YS

Fan Amenities - PNC > YS

View - PNC > YS

Food - PNC > YS

Ticket Prices - PNC > YS

Comfort - PNC > YS

YS has PNC beat with history and that's about it.

[JeepingBaseball]

I've been to Yankee stadium, I root for them against Boston, thou I'm a Mets fan. Been to PNC too.

Yankee stadium has the history and sentimental aspects attached to it, but to enjoy a game? PNC wins.

This isnt about history, this isnt about loyalty, this isnt about winning or losing.

PNC is just a better smarter well designed park with comfort.

[Philtration]

What I meant is how they overpaid for farnsworth, randy johnson, musinnia, and roger clemsons (the last go around). By no means are they as stupid as the gaints for zito, the rangers for arod, and the rays for greg vaughn, but they still are a big reason other teams can't compete and it makes the off season fun.

Yet the Yankees have to be penalized for their success by paying more luxury tax than any team in the league. WTF?
How is it fair that they must prop up other teams that cannot run their own team in a responsible manner or draw fans in their local area?
How is this the Yankees (and now the Red Sox) problem or responsibility?
The Yankees had to pay MLB $23.88 million after the 2007 season while the Red Sox paid $6.06 million.
That $26.88 million is more than the Marlins entire payroll. Why can’t they use that money (which they earned fair and square) to put into their own team or stadium?

Why stick it to the guys who have played by the rules, run a successful business, win on the field and do not run their team into the ground?
The league does not owe Minnesota, Washington or Tampa a MLB team.

I still voted for PNC.

[Lafferty Daniel]

Yet the Yankees have to be penalized for their success by paying more luxury tax than any team in the league. WTF?
How is it fair that they must prop up other teams that cannot run their own team in a responsible manner or draw fans in their local area?
How is this the Yankees (and now the Red Sox) problem or responsibility?
The Yankees had to pay MLB $23.88 million after the 2007 season while the Red Sox paid $6.06 million.
That $26.88 million is more than the Marlins entire payroll. Why can’t they use that money (which they earned fair and square) to put into their own team or stadium?

Why stick it to the guys who have played by the rules, run a successful business, win on the field and do not run their team into the ground?
The league does not owe Minnesota, Washington or Tampa a MLB team.

I still voted for PNC.

Because Major League Baseball has principles of socialism in order to make the league balanced competitvely, otherwise we would see the 30 team structure broken down into smaller leagues based on market size.
Whether you agree with this economic structure or not, it is crucial for the long term growth of the league. That being said, I don't agree how some teams spend, or don't spend this revenue, but to say that Minnesota doesn't deserve a team is complete bullsh*t.

[Philtration]

Because Major League Baseball has principles of socialism in order to make the league balanced competitvely, otherwise we would see the 30 team structure broken down into smaller leagues based on market size.
Whether you agree with this economic structure or not, it is crucial for the long term growth of the league. That being said, I don't agree how some teams spend, or don't spend this revenue, but to say that Minnesota doesn't deserve a team is complete bullsh*t.

I never said that.
I used the Twins as an example because their own owner offered them up for contraction just a few years ago.
If a city does not support a team then why try to force it? Why put a team in Washington D.C. after they have had not one but two teams fail there already?
How many teams in MLB is enough? Thirty-two? Forty?
Oakland, Kansas City, Tampa, Pittsburgh, Florida … they are at the bottom of the league in attendance year after year. Can the bay area support two teams? How about the state of Florida? Can the Royals compete when the Cardinals are so close?

Was putting a team in Tampa a good idea?
Obviously not.

By the way.. you say that MLB has principles of socialism in order to make the league balanced competitively yet I see so many people crying that it is not fair at all and blame teams like the Yankees for this.
Which is it?
Do the rules make the league balanced or do large market teams still have an advantage?
MLB can learn a lot about evening out the balance of their league from the NFL.

[Rob R]

Maybe he thinks the Roberto Clemente Bridge is a roller coaster. :laugh

Or maybe you don't get the joke?

And yeah, the design of all the wrought iron at PNC makes it look more like Great Adventure than a ballpark. Ever drive toward and approach one of those amusement parks? That's PNC.

But whatever floats people's boats. Seems some are more attracted to gaudy, forced eye candy than traditional ballparks. It reminds me of those suburbanites who prefer their sparkling-clean strip malls, Wal-Mart's and Pizza Hut to some of New York's breathtaking architectural design, outstanding food and boutiques. Their reaction upon visit? "New York looks too old and dirty." Some just don't get it and cannot be convinced otherwise.

[MarcianoNY]

Because Major League Baseball has principles of socialism in order to make the league balanced competitvely, otherwise we would see the 30 team structure broken down into smaller leagues based on market size.
Whether you agree with this economic structure or not, it is crucial for the long term growth of the league. That being said, I don't agree how some teams spend, or don't spend this revenue, but to say that Minnesota doesn't deserve a team is complete bullsh*t.

No, the fact that when I buy a yankee hat money goes into that douche-bag Pohlad's pockets is complete bullsh*t. This is not Russia. This is not North Korea. We all saw how that worked out.

[MarcianoNY]

To see a ballgame and soak in a classical baseball environment filled with tradition and no silly frills or contrived gimmicks, Yankee Stadium, hands down.

If I want to visit an amusement park, complete with wrought iron roller coasters, PNC, though I'd prefer Disney in Orlando over Pittsburgh. :)

THANK you Rob

[bigtime39]

Yet the Yankees have to be penalized for their success by paying more luxury tax than any team in the league. WTF?
How is it fair that they must prop up other teams that cannot run their own team in a responsible manner or draw fans in their local area?
How is this the Yankees (and now the Red Sox) problem or responsibility?
The Yankees had to pay MLB $23.88 million after the 2007 season while the Red Sox paid $6.06 million.
That $26.88 million is more than the Marlins entire payroll. Why can’t they use that money (which they earned fair and square) to put into their own team or stadium?

Why stick it to the guys who have played by the rules, run a successful business, win on the field and do not run their team into the ground?
The league does not owe Minnesota, Washington or Tampa a MLB team.

I still voted for PNC.

OTOH, why stick it to the guys who own teams that didn't just happen to be stolen from Baltimore and plopped into the largest media market in the world 100+ years ago?
The Yankee$ pay luxury tax because their payroll exceeds the point where all 30 owners (who aren't nearly socialistic enough) agreed a luxury tax would kick in. Their payments increase every year because they flout that limit every year.
There should be more revenue sharing in MLB, not less.

No, the fact that when I buy a yankee hat money goes into that douche-bag Pohlad's pockets is complete bullsh*t. This is not Russia. This is not North Korea. We all saw how that worked out.

Every time a hat from every other team is sold, Hamfisted Hank gets his cut...so I think I'd back off on the whole merchandise shtick.
Also, the more socialized a sports league is, the more random the outcomes, and the better it is for every team not located in NYC. 26 World Championships in 80ish years is not evidence of god's benevolence. It's not a sign that all is right with the world...it's evidence that your league is seriously screwed up.

If the Yankee$ want to be the freakin' Globetrotters, I'd be the first to welcome their departure from MLB. BTW, don't forget to take the Red $ox with you. That way ESPN can show the entire 162-game series, and the rest of us can get on with our lives.

[Seattle1]

I voted for PNC Park due to the fact that it's way better than Yankee Stadium.

:cool:

[cgcoyne2]

...MLB can learn a lot about evening out the balance of their league from the NFL.

You can not compare the NFL and MLB.The NFL only plays 16 games and they do not have guaranteed contracts. Also ALL games are on free TV in the local market.

[jimmyjimjimz]

have you been to pnc?

No' I've never been to PNC. I'm not judging it, though. I'm not saying it sucks. All I'm saying is that I grew up going to Yankee Stadium, and the Yankees have been my all time favorite sports team all my life, so I'm voting for the place I grew up going to.

[Lafferty Daniel]

No, the fact that when I buy a yankee hat money goes into that douche-bag Pohlad's pockets is complete bullsh*t. This is not Russia. This is not North Korea. We all saw how that worked out.

So what is your suggestion to fix this issue? Salary cap?

[bigtime39]

So what is your suggestion to fix this issue? Salary cap?

Oh, come on! MLB already has a salary cap. No, wait, it's got 30 of 'em! And since the Yankee$' is by far the biggest, that's just the way they like it!

[metfan2987]

I love Yankee Stadium!!!!

I'm a HUGEEEEEEEEE Yankee fan!!!!

BUT!!!!

Yankee Stadium is a DUMP!!!!

Babe Ruth is dead, his ghost ain't helping me get a damn hot dog inside the concourse. I'm not that big (5'10", 185) and there is no room to walk around when the place is HALF full. Can you imagine if it's full!!!!

Lou Gehrig said he was the "luckiest man on the face of the earth", Because he didn't have to come back to Yankee Stadium.

I've been to PNC Park. It wins hands down over Yankee Stadium.

Oh Yeah, PNC also doesn't have that pompous ass, John Sterling.

Next Question!

By far one of the worst experiences of my life was sitting in the upper deck at Yankee Stadium. The game wasn't horrible, although the seat was obviously uncomfortable with no leg space, I didn't really care about that. The only bad thing as far as the game went was that I wasn't able to see left field at ALL (I sat right by third base). Thats what a stadium like Shea has over YS, the fact that it was designed for baseball and football so anywhere you sit you can see anything (for the most part).

The reeeally bad thing about it was twofold. First of all, the concourse area was absolutely horrific. I was very surprised how bad it was, I was not expecting it to be so. Before going I had only really been to Shea, and I was expecting it to be around the same size in the concourse...not so. Second of all, it was absolutely a NIGHTMARE to walk out of those tunnels at the end of the game. I felt like I was gonna suffocate. To make another Shea comparison (keep in mind, im only making shea comparisons because its like the only other place i've been), the ramps there are open to the outside, making it muuuch less claustrophobic.

Therefore, the history of Yankee stadium is not enough to take over its shortcomings, and the new stadium was definitely necessary. Although the experience at Yankee stadium may be better than Shea for some people because of the "aura" (which I personally think is kinda bull), Shea has less of those overcrowding issues and siteline issues. But honestly, they're both dumps.

[MarcianoNY]

So what is your suggestion to fix this issue? Salary cap?

Salary cap is fine with me, than maybe our (Yankees) management would think twice about dumping ungodly huge contracts on players like Carl Pavano and Kei Igawa. And since the Yankees sell more than 27% of league merchandise (I would be willing to bet that Boston is at least another 25%), I'm standing by what I said... the fact that all the profits are split EQUALLY is communism at its best. AND you can think what you want to think, but New York hasn't won 26 championships because it's a screwed up system. Sure, it could be "fair" and different half-assed teams with half-assed owners could win every year, but who would care? The Marlins have won two championships thanks to revenue sharing and did anybody in Florida give a damn? Socialism encourages owners to dog it year after year, maybe win one year when they happen to get a good hand, then dump the big contracts and start the cycle again until it's their turn to win again.

[MarcianoNY]

Oh, come on! MLB already has a salary cap. No, wait, it's got 30 of 'em! And since the Yankee$' is by far the biggest, that's just the way they like it!

That is such a load... Steinbrenner's net worth is a speck compared to Pohlad and several other impoverished small-market owners. The difference is, for the 8 millionth time, the Steinbrenners view the franchise as an investment to take care of, as opposed to a quick way to milk money off gullible fans and revenue sharing to put in the owner's and shareholder's pockets. The Yankees were one of the most run-down franchises when Steinbrenner took over, and look at them now. You can't not admire that.

[Rob R]

THANK you Rob

You're welcome. When it comes to ballparks, some of us here think along the same lines. I'm trying to be objective and the fact that I'm a Yankees fan has nothing to do with my stadium preference although it might give me a different perspective and perhaps a better appreciation for tradition; something a Marlins fan (to pick one) may not understand.

That said, I just don't understand the love for these pseudo-retro stadium, replete with tons of wrought iron (see roller coaster), arched scoreboards, contrived angles of the outfield walls (even though there are no space limitations), the inevitable huge Coca Cola sign (although I don't think PNC has this) and planted warehouses. Camden was interesting, but now a majority of stadiums are mimicking that look and in the process are becoming no different than those atrocious 70's clones. Give me something different...unique, with at least a hint of progressive and new thoughts on design.

I couldn't care less about the winner of this poll, but just like some Yanks fans may be blindly voting for Yankee Stadium, it's obvious that some people do "get it" and prefer Yankee Stadium, but their hatred toward the Yanks prevents them from voting that way. If I were a betting man, I'd say that the latter is the majority. As Yankees fans we're used to it.

[MarcianoNY]

You're welcome. When it comes to ballparks, some of us here think along the same lines. I'm trying to be objective and the fact that I'm a Yankees fan has nothing to do with my stadium preference although it might give me a different perspective and perhaps a better appreciation for tradition; something a Marlins fan (to pick one) may not understand.

Exactly. Look, I've said it over and over on here: If it was between Fenway and PNC I would vote Fenway in a heartbeat... and yes, history would be a part of that vote too, even if it doesn't mean 26 championships were won there. Some people get it, some people don't.

[Rob R]

I suggest that MLB enforce some kind of rule forcing those teams receiving revenue sharing to apply a substantial percentage of the monies toward their respective team's player payroll. Then, they should do a yearly audit on these money-grabbing, crybaby, crooks like Pohlad, just to keep them "honest."

[Rob R]

Exactly. Look, I've said it over and over on here: If it was between Fenway and PNC I would vote Fenway in a heartbeat... and yes, history would be a part of that vote too, even if it doesn't mean 26 championships were won there. Some people get it, some people don't.
At the risk of sounding elitist, I believe that most Yankees fans, and the organization, get it.

Otherwise, the new Yankee Stadium would be just another HOK clone. Has anybody, voting for PNC-type parks, asked why HOK went totally against their grain when building the new Yankee Stadium? There's a reason for this; something that those voting for Yankee Stadium in this poll "get."

[MarcianoNY]

The other thing I don't think people are thinking about is, as nice as PNC is on the inside, the exterior does not really impress me that much. Like a lot of HOK 'retro' parks, WHERE IS THE FOCAL POINT?! It looks really disjointed; random towers and escalators and iron all over the place - in both Citi Field and New Yankee Stadium, the two HOK parks that were actually designed with REAL tradition in mind, there is one unified shape from top to bottom and your eyes are led in an orderly fashion from top-to-bottom, side-to-side. The old parks like Shibe, Forbes, Ebbets always had a focal point, architecturally speaking. Besides the fact that they should've used that nice, real stone on the bottom on the whole thing, but instead they went with that trendy, suburban-looking concrete on top. Just a couple things to think about for those people who are basically voting for a postcard of the Pittsburgh skyline.

[placount]

At the risk of sounding elitist, I believe that most Yankees fans, and the organization, get it.

Otherwise, the new Yankee Stadium would be just another HOK clone. Has anybody, voting for PNC-type parks, asked why HOK went totally against their grain when building the new Yankee Stadium? There's a reason for this; something that those voting for Yankee Stadium in this poll "get."

against the grain where? on the exterior where they were just trying to look like... another old stadium? what on the inside of the new stadium goes against the grain? I guess I've never seen anything in these designs or what has already been built thats so fresh.

and yes you do sound elitist.

[placount]

I suggest that MLB enforce some kind of rule forcing those teams receiving revenue sharing to apply a substantial percentage of the monies toward their respective team's player payroll. Then, they should do a yearly audit on these money-grabbing, crybaby, crooks like Pohlad, just to keep them "honest."

I'll be the first to say that Pohlad should be spending more on his team. I just think you're misguided in calling him a crybaby crook. He's cheap. I don't think hes ever put a dime into baseball that he didnt make from baseball. Outside of the revenue sharing the Twins don't make a lot of money as they have one of, if not the worst stadium deals in baseball. Which by the way is being replaced in two seasons thanks in a large part to Mr. Pohlad himself.

The payroll for the twins has been going up steadily since they began playing well at the turn of the century, it hasn't skyrocketed and I think the team should in a way be commended for that. Aside from Santana the Twins let one real star go, and hunter's best years are most likely behind him. In that same time theyve given decent contracts to several other homegrown players like Mauer, Morneau, and Cuddyer. I know he isn't exactly homegrown but Nathan also got an extension recently.

I think it might be hard as a yankee fan for you to realize that most teams really don't have the means to drop 50+ million in new contracts on the free agent market every year. Revenue sharing or no revenue sharing the Twins are forced to work within a smaller budget for their free agency spending, and lately they've failed at it. Perhaps this year will prove to be a shift in that though as Hernandez has pitched well, and Monroe seems to be hitting decent as of late.

[Philtration]

OTOH, why stick it to the guys who own teams that didn't just happen to be stolen from Baltimore and plopped into the largest media market in the world 100+ years ago?
The Yankee$ pay luxury tax because their payroll exceeds the point where all 30 owners (who aren't nearly socialistic enough) agreed a luxury tax would kick in. Their payments increase every year because they flout that limit every year.
There should be more revenue sharing in MLB, not less.


100 years ago?
I would have let that go by now. So they should have stayed in Baltimore and not moved to as you pointed out "largest media market in the world"?
That was just smart business. Something that a lot of teams know nothing about.
Yes the other owners all agreed that they should get some of the Yankees money for not being able to run their team as successfully. No big surprise there eh?
How would you feel if the janitor where you worked was getting $5000 a year from your salary because he could not get his act together just to make things even?

[MarcianoNY]

against the grain where? on the exterior where they were just trying to look like... another old stadium? what on the inside of the new stadium goes against the grain? I guess I've never seen anything in these designs or what has already been built thats so fresh.

and yes you do sound elitist.

I think he explained very clearly what he meant - none of HOK's world-famous "warehouses" plopped into left field, no choo choo trains running across the roof, no pretentious and contrived angled fences, no "red brick/green seat 'motif'", etc. And as far as being elitist, I think what he's trying to say is that you can't really expect the average fan who grew up thinking that the Metrodome or Three Rivers Park is a place to play baseball in to care about or have the same understanding of tradition that Yankee fans or Red Sox or Cubs fans do. For the most part, you can't really blame someone who's had to put up with a dome or a cookie-cutter for seeing one of these retro "amusement-ballparks" and thinking that that's the only thing a baseball stadium can be.

[Chevy114]

Again HOK builds what you want, if you think the fans want stupid gimmics like a train or a steamboat, then they build it. If want a clone of camden yards because you think it will revitalize your downtown then they build it. Yet if you want a steel moderenized park on the water like the rays asked for they build.

I am happy yankee stadium looks nothing like camden, coors, or busch but at the same time im sadden by the fact that they just remade a new stadium.

[MarcianoNY]

True, but the point isn't whether HOK wanted it or the owners. The point is anyone who thinks a baseball stadium needs to look like Disneyworld is an idiot.

[Lafferty Daniel]

I think he explained very clearly what he meant - none of HOK's world-famous "warehouses" plopped into left field, no choo choo trains running across the roof, no pretentious and contrived angled fences, no "red brick/green seat 'motif'", etc. And as far as being elitist, I think what he's trying to say is that you can't really expect the average fan who grew up thinking that the Metrodome or Three Rivers Park is a place to play baseball in to care about or have the same understanding of tradition that Yankee fans or Red Sox or Cubs fans do. For the most part, you can't really blame someone who's had to put up with a dome or a cookie-cutter for seeing one of these retro "amusement-ballparks" and thinking that that's the only thing a baseball stadium can be.

We are still talking about PNC, right? How exactly is this an "amusement ballpark?"

[MarcianoNY]

We are still talking about PNC, right? How exactly is this an "amusement ballpark?"

See my above post with the pic of the front entrance. In this case I'm going off what Rob said - all the random wrought iron makes it look like an amusement park. What exactly is the purpose of that big iron/steel contraption above the entrance anyways? The exterior of the building looks so haphazard.

[Lafferty Daniel]

See my above post with the pic of the front entrance. In this case I'm going off what Rob said - all the random wrought iron makes it look like an amusement park. What exactly is the purpose of that big iron/steel contraption above the entrance anyways? The exterior of the building looks so haphazard.

I've never seen an amusement park entrance that looks like that.

[YankeeFanUK]

the iron/steel contraptions are the rotundas....its actually a great view to watch the game from ( the rotunda in the left field corner )...it is easily one of THE best of the new parks built since Camden BUT it isnt YS..nuff said

[Lafferty Daniel]

the iron/steel contraptions are the rotundas....its actually a great view to watch the game from ( the rotunda in the left field corner )...it is easily one of THE best of the new parks built since Camden BUT it isnt YS..nuff said

I think most of us can agree that both PNC and Yankee Stadium are both great ballparks. Personally speaking, these two ballparks are a lot of fun in their own way.

[YankeeFanUK]

also the staff at PNC are fantastic...i always do the Park tour whenever i go to a new one and they were really helpfull & generous in Pitts...there were only 2 of us doing the tour on the day i went and they allowed the both of us to go on the pitchers mound ...they also gave us a **** load of free stuff ( t-shirts, caps, programme guide etc )

[MarcianoNY]

I think most of us can agree that both PNC and Yankee Stadium are both great ballparks. Personally speaking, these two ballparks are a lot of fun in their own way.

Overall I agree. You would think that would be a given seeing as how they are the top two in the poll, but a lot of the talk on this thread has dissolved into Yankee Stadium trashing so naturally Yankee fans are gonna get defensive. I think a lot of people are assuming that all the Yankee fans are blindly voting for their stadium, but like I've said, for me personally it has more to do with developing an appreciation for the many great aspects of an old stadium that many would consider a "dump," which seems to be the word du jour to describe Yankee Stadium. Whether we see the same kind of fanfare given to PNC Park when it is replaced, time will only tell, but somehow I doubt it. Like I said it remains to be seen. But you can't sit here and tell me that Yankee Stadium is not a great ballpark.

[Lafferty Daniel]

Overall I agree. You would think that would be a given seeing as how they are the top two in the poll, but a lot of the talk on this thread has dissolved into Yankee Stadium trashing so naturally Yankee fans are gonna get defensive. I think a lot of people are assuming that all the Yankee fans are blindly voting for their stadium, but like I've said, for me personally it has more to do with developing an appreciation for the many great aspects of an old stadium that many would consider a "dump," which seems to be the word du jour to describe Yankee Stadium. Whether we see the same kind of fanfare given to PNC Park when it is replaced, time will only tell, but somehow I doubt it. Like I said it remains to be seen. But you can't sit here and tell me that Yankee Stadium is not a great ballpark.

It'd just be nice if all fans would be a little more objective.

[YankeeFanUK]

It'd just be nice if all fans would be a little more objective.

i think ive been objective..ive been to PNC and YS and gave an honest opinion

[Lafferty Daniel]

I was talking about some of the previous posters that didn't really back up why they like YS better other than tradition or it's their home ballpark. You were objective.

[Yoda]

See my above post with the pic of the front entrance. In this case I'm going off what Rob said - all the random wrought iron makes it look like an amusement park. What exactly is the purpose of that big iron/steel contraption above the entrance anyways? The exterior of the building looks so haphazard.

That steel part is actually functional.

It helps support this ramp behind home plate.

sorry the pic doesn't clearly illustrate that, it's not what I was going for when I took it.

http://i193.photobucket.com/albums/z70/Chips347/4satch/P1030458.jpg

[YankeeFanUK]

That steel part is actually functional.

It helps support this ramp behind home plate.

sorry the pic doesn't clearly illustrate that, it's not what I was going for when I took it.

http://i193.photobucket.com/albums/z70/Chips347/4satch/P1030458.jpg

that ramp is one of the two rotundas in the park...

[PeteU]

That steel part is actually functional.

It helps support this ramp behind home plate.

sorry the pic doesn't clearly illustrate that, it's not what I was going for when I took it.

http://i193.photobucket.com/albums/z70/Chips347/4satch/P1030458.jpg


Not to mention that it makes decent sense in Pittsburgh, aka the Steel City.

[Yoda]

that ramp is one of the two rotundas in the park...

They can have 4 for all I care.

I was just pointing out that it's not random decoration. There's some point to it being there.



This icon rules: :debate:

[YankeeFanUK]

one of the best features of PNC Park is actually outside...they close off the Clemente bridge to traffic an hour before game time....walking over the bridge with the Alleghany river below you and PNC in view is a great experience

[Yoda]

Pittsburgh is a great city.


I wouldn't mind living there.

[YankeeFanUK]

They can have 4 for all I care.

I was just pointing out that it's not random decoration. There's some point to it being there.



This icon rules: :debate:

whats your beef ?..i was just saying that the ramp is one of the Rotundas...did you not get your cereal this morning

[YankeeFanUK]

downtown Pittsburgh is dirty & grimey BUT its ok..the Duck tour is fun :)

[Yoda]

whats your beef ?..i was just saying that the ramp is one of the Rotundas...did you not get your cereal this morning

No beef here :shrug:


I had a fruit smoothie for breakfast.


downtown Pittsburgh is dirty & grimey BUT its ok..the Duck tour is fun :)

Dirty and grimey? Compared to what?

I found it to be clean

[YankeeFanUK]

No beef here :shrug:


I had a fruit smoothie for breakfast.




Dirty and grimey? Compared to what?

I found it to be clean

compared to a lot of American cities ive been too...im guessing a lot of it is due to the steelworks of the past..most of the tops of buildings are black BUT i quite liked it..New York followed by Chicago & Detroit are my faves

[Yoda]

compared to a lot of American cities ive been too...im guessing a lot of it is due to the steelworks of the past..most of the tops of buildings are black BUT i quite liked it..New York followed by Chicago & Detroit are my faves


Pittsburgh is filthy and grimey but New York or Detroit isn't?




What part of the UK are you from?

Do you know anyone named Ed Ruston?

[MarcianoNY]

Pittsburgh is filthy and grimey but New York or Detroit isn't?




What part of the UK are you from?

Do you know anyone named Ed Ruston?

Actually I'll back that up... it depends what your definition of "grimey" is. If it's a synonym for "ghetto" then there are plenty of "grimey" places in New York. But physically, Pittsburgh is grimier due to the fact that it made the transition from heavy industry to primarily service industry much later than New York or Chicago, for example. A lot of cities in Pennsylvania have cleaned up but still exhibit lasting signs of pollution. I agree Pittsburgh is one of the most underrated cities but the smell of the air would take some getting used to - I think Pittsburgh has the 2nd most polluted air behind L.A. for big cities in the U.S.

[PeteU]

As an Orioles fan, I must say that Oriole Park at Camden Yards is a great ballpark. The fact that it has seemingly been copied so many times only speaks more towards its greatness.

But as much as an Orioles fan that I am, and as nice of a ballpark that I do believe OPACY to be, had OPACY been put up against PNC Park, I would still say PNC is the better of the ballparks objectively (although OPACY is a close runner up).

Sometimes you've got to put fan loyalty aside in these things.

[MarcianoNY]

As an Orioles fan, I must say that Oriole Park at Camden Yards is a great ballpark. The fact that it has seemingly been copied so many times only speaks more towards its greatness.

But as much as an Orioles fan that I am, and as nice of a ballpark that I do believe OPACY to be, had OPACY been put up against PNC Park, I would still say PNC is the better of the ballparks objectively (although OPACY is a close runner up).

Sometimes you've got to put fan loyalty aside in these things.

Just out of curiosity, how much stock do you put into the role of the Pittsburgh skyline and the overall location/orientation of the park? Do you count this as part of the park, or would you still give PNC the same rating if it were transplanted to the South Bronx or Detroit, for instance... because the skyline and overall view is spectacular, I'll give you that. I'm curious to see if people would still rank the park the same if it were viewed in a vacuum or a less-picturesque location.

[Yoda]

Actually I'll back that up... it depends what your definition of "grimey" is. If it's a synonym for "ghetto" then there are plenty of "grimey" places in New York. But physically, Pittsburgh is grimier due to the fact that it made the transition from heavy industry to primarily service industry much later than New York or Chicago, for example. A lot of cities in Pennsylvania have cleaned up but still exhibit lasting signs of pollution. I agree Pittsburgh is one of the most underrated cities but the smell of the air would take some getting used to - I think Pittsburgh has the 2nd most polluted air behind L.A. for big cities in the U.S.

Really?

Wow. I was there last summer and walked the whole time. Seemed ok to me, no smells or fumes.


The only thing that was "dirty" to the eye is we walked by some open air market. It was cool though, all sorts of stuff and cheap eats.

[MarcianoNY]

Really?

Wow. I was there last summer and walked the whole time. Seemed ok to me, no smells or fumes.


The only thing that was "dirty" to the eye is we walked by some open air market. It was cool though, all sorts of stuff and cheap eats.

It's not that bad, there aren't fumes or anything, it's just a lingering cloud of pollution that's pretty much stuck above the Allegheny Plateau.

[Chevy114]

Just out of curiosity, how much stock do you put into the role of the Pittsburgh skyline and the overall location/orientation of the park? Do you count this as part of the park, or would you still give PNC the same rating if it were transplanted to the South Bronx or Detroit, for instance... because the skyline and overall view is spectacular, I'll give you that. I'm curious to see if people would still rank the park the same if it were viewed in a vacuum or a less-picturesque location.

Isn't that the point to have both a nice functional stadium and a great view?

[bigtime39]

As an Orioles fan, I must say that Oriole Park at Camden Yards is a great ballpark. The fact that it has seemingly been copied so many times only speaks more towards its greatness.

But as much as an Orioles fan that I am, and as nice of a ballpark that I do believe OPACY to be, had OPACY been put up against PNC Park, I would still say PNC is the better of the ballparks objectively (although OPACY is a close runner up).

Sometimes you've got to put fan loyalty aside in these things.

The biggest thing Camden Yards suffers from as a ballpark was that it was the first of its kind. Each subsequent park has been able to use OPaCY as the baseline, and tweak or adjust from there. The (relatively few) mistakes made in Baltimore could be edited out in subsequent stadiums.

[Chevy114]

The biggest thing Camden Yards suffers from as a ballpark was that it was the first of its kind. Each subsequent park has been able to use OPaCY as the baseline, and tweak or adjust from there. The (relatively few) mistakes made in Baltimore could be edited out in subsequent stadiums.

Also it gets lost in the shuffle in my opinion everyone just chalks it up to just another brick retro stadium these days.

[YankeeFanUK]

Also it gets lost in the shuffle in my opinion everyone just chalks it up to just another brick retro stadium these days.

the original and still one of the best...my first trip to Camden was back in 97 and i was extremelly impressed with it..and i still am

[Rob R]

The biggest thing Camden Yards suffers from as a ballpark was that it was the first of its kind. Each subsequent park has been able to use OPaCY as the baseline, and tweak or adjust from there. The (relatively few) mistakes made in Baltimore could be edited out in subsequent stadiums.

I agree 100%. When I first visited Camden the first year it was built, I was blown away by it, and being a fan of the Yanks, Yankee stadium and Yankee history and tradition, it truly takes a lot to impress me.

At the time the retro look was welcoming, especially in comparison to the 60's- 70's cloned monstrosities. Though Camden is still leaps and bounds nicer than the ballparks of the 60's and 70's, it has now fallen victim and lumped in with the HOK "clone" label and doesn't impress as much.

That said, I should still remember Camden as the first of its kind and give it its proper respect. It really does deserve more appreciation.

[dbacksfan95]

PNC PARK WINS!

[RuthMayBond]

PNC PARK WINS!There is justice :applaud:

[jimmyjimjimz]

PNC PARK WINS!

I don't think every member of this board voted, so I think you should at least keep the poll open until game 7 of the Yankees-Mets 2008 World Series ends and the Yankees close Yankee Stadium as the world champions. Or, keep it open till everyone voted. The people from Boston who are jealous that we're getting a new stadium's votes shouldn't count.

The other thing I don't think people are thinking about is, as nice as PNC is on the inside, the exterior does not really impress me that much. Like a lot of HOK 'retro' parks, WHERE IS THE FOCAL POINT?! It looks really disjointed; random towers and escalators and iron all over the place - in both Citi Field and New Yankee Stadium, the two HOK parks that were actually designed with REAL tradition in mind, there is one unified shape from top to bottom and your eyes are led in an orderly fashion from top-to-bottom, side-to-side. The old parks like Shibe, Forbes, Ebbets always had a focal point, architecturally speaking. Besides the fact that they should've used that nice, real stone on the bottom on the whole thing, but instead they went with that trendy, suburban-looking concrete on top. Just a couple things to think about for those people who are basically voting for a postcard of the Pittsburgh skyline.

There's a picture in that post that I couldn't add of the outside of PNC Park. To me, if I walked past that place, I'd think it was a shopping mall. It looks NOTHING LIKE a baseball stadium. Yankee Stadium does. Does PNC Park have the history that Yankee Stadium has? No. So what if Yankee Stadium is small and cramped. It won't be like that next year.

[whoisonit]

PNC PARK WINS!

By a landslide. Yankee Stadium is now officialy known as the Walter Mondale of baseball parks ! :party:

[jimmyjimjimz]

By a landslide. Yankee Stadium is now officialy known as the Walter Mondale of baseball parks ! :party:

I don't know who Walter Mondale is, so I don't know if that's an insult or not, but if it is an insult, your stadium sucks too, especially if youre from Boston.

[placount]

I don't know who Walter Mondale is, so I don't know if that's an insult or not, but if it is an insult, your stadium sucks too, especially if youre from Boston.

:cry::cry:

[Yoda]

There's a picture in that post that I couldn't add of the outside of PNC Park. To me, if I walked past that place, I'd think it was a shopping mall. It looks NOTHING LIKE a baseball stadium. Yankee Stadium does. Does PNC Park have the history that Yankee Stadium has? No. So what if Yankee Stadium is small and cramped. It won't be like that next year.

Why is the person who doesn't know who Walter Mondale is so concerned about history?

[jimmyjimjimz]

Why is the person who doesn't know who Walter Mondale is so concerned about history?

um

just because someone doesn't know who Walter Mondale is

doesn't mean they don't care about history.

maybe they were born after walter mondale died? or after his 15 seconds of fame were up?

[Yankees12]

um

just because someone doesn't know who Walter Mondale is

doesn't mean they don't care about history.

maybe they were born after walter mondale died? or after his 15 seconds of fame were up?


Walter Mondale is still alive, and had far more than 15 minutes of fame.

[bigtime39]

I don't think every member of this board voted, so I think you should at least keep the poll open until game 7 of the Yankees-Mets 2008 World Series ends and the Yankees close Yankee Stadium as the world champions. Or, keep it open till everyone voted. The people from Boston who are jealous that we're getting a new stadium's votes shouldn't count.

Checked the standings lately? Have you? Eh? Want to take a look at 'em and get back to us on that prediction? The Yankee$ are going to have to keep the old building open for a while if they want to close it as WS champions.

[bigtime39]

I don't know who Walter Mondale is, so I don't know if that's an insult or not, but if it is an insult, your stadium sucks too, especially if youre from Boston.

If you don't know who Walter Mondale is...
I'm sorry, very sorry for the state of your education. You might want to consider requesting a refund from every school you've ever attended.
It explains a lot, though.

[YankeeFanUK]

I don't know who Walter Mondale is, so I don't know if that's an insult or not, but if it is an insult, your stadium sucks too, especially if youre from Boston.

glad to see that school eduacation has`nt gone to waste..the youth of today :)

[Yoda]

Even if he didn't know who he was it takes about 15s to find out via teh internets

[jimmyjimjimz]

Checked the standings lately? Have you? Eh? Want to take a look at 'em and get back to us on that prediction? The Yankee$ are going to have to keep the old building open for a while if they want to close it as WS champions.

first of all, you spelled Yankees wrong. It's Yankees not Yankee$.

second, remember last year? They sucked in the begining of the season. Then what happened? Oh yeah, they wound up making the playoffs.

[StanTheMan]

Walter Mondale clearly voted for PNC park. He is from Boston, and he is related to the guy who buried the Ortiz Jersey in the cement. Mondale's daughter slept with Buck Dent, took photos and will someday publish them, ruining the guy. He hates Nathan's Hot Dogs, and puts ketchup on them when he eats them. He abhors thin crust pizza, knowing thick crust is better. His chowder is always a cream base... that tomato based Manhattan stuff sucks, says Mondale. He agrees that the youth of America are idiots.

He does not, however, worry too much about anonymous internet polls, especially those voted on by .000000001% of baseball fans. And he's smarter for it.

[jimmyjimjimz]

Walter Mondale clearly voted for PNC park. He is from Boston, and he is related to the guy who buried the Ortiz Jersey in the cement. Mondale's daughter slept with Buck Dent, took photos and will someday publish them, ruining the guy. He hates Nathan's Hot Dogs, and puts ketchup on them when he eats them. He abhors thin crust pizza, knowing thick crust is better. His chowder is always a cream base... that tomato based Manhattan stuff sucks, says Mondale. He agrees that the youth of America are idiots.

He does not, however, worry too much about anonymous internet polls, especially those voted on by .000000001% of baseball fans. And he's smarter for it.

what's wrong with putting ketchup on hotdogs? That's the only way I eat them.

[placount]

what's wrong with putting ketchup on hotdogs? That's the only way I eat them.

the ignorance grows exponentially!

[bigtime39]

first of all, you spelled Yankees wrong. It's Yankees not Yankee$.

second, remember last year? They sucked in the begining of the season. Then what happened? Oh yeah, they wound up making the playoffs.

And then what happened? Oh, yeah, the Yankee$ made their now-traditional first round exit...it's somewhat surprising how little $200MM buys you these days...:rofl:

Oh, and BTW, I spelled Yankee$ exactly as it should be spelled. Gotta acknowledge what brought you everything you've ever gotten! :think:

[Yoda]

the ignorance grows exponentially!

This is America, he can put whatever he wants on his dog.



I just watched some show on the travel channel that talked about all the varieties of hot dogs you can get. The last place they showed some some joint in Jersey called Jimmy Buffs. They served what seems to be the most disgusting thing I've ever seen. It was a hotdog in some sort of roll with potatoes, grilled onions, I think cheese and maybe tomatoes.

The fat slob who owned the place firmly believed it was the best thing ever.

I don't want to start a Hot Dog War but it looked nasty as hell

Here's a pic:

http://www.jimmybuff.com/images/thedouble.jpg


http://soxandthecity.net/smilies/attachment-8.php.gif

[jimmyjimjimz]

And then what happened? Oh, yeah, the Yankee$ made their now-traditional first round exit...it's somewhat surprising how little $200MM buys you these days...:rofl:

Oh, and BTW, I spelled Yankee$ exactly as it should be spelled. Gotta acknowledge what brought you everything you've ever gotten! :think:

how about we change the spelling of Boston Red Sox to Bo$ton Red $ox? How do you like that?

[StanTheMan]

what's wrong with putting ketchup on hotdogs? That's the only way I eat them.

Ketchup on a hot dog is VERY anti-New York. Far from me to judge anothers Hot Dog condiment preferences (spicy or brown mustard, sweet relish, and add onions when at the golf course ONLY. it's really that simple people!!!)... I was going for anything anti New York for Mr. Mondale.....

[StanTheMan]

how about we change the spelling of Boston Red Sox to Bo$ton Red $ox? How do you like that?

If the Red Sox outspend everyone for about three decades, and have the highest amount of TV revenue in all of baseball it will be VERY appropriate at that time. Meet me back here in this thread in the year 2038 and we'll see if it happened!!!

[Yoda]

If the Red Sox outspend everyone for about three decades, and have the highest amount of TV revenue in all of baseball it will be VERY appropriate at that time. Meet me back here in this thread in the year 2038 and we'll see if it happened!!!

By then the YS thread will have 1239801492546857638 posts

[bigtime39]

how about we change the spelling of Boston Red Sox to Bo$ton Red $ox? How do you like that?

The correct and appropriate usage is simply Red $ox. You shouldn't use capitals in the middle of words, and city names aren't generally part of the usage.

If your keyboard has a lowercase '$', and you're really committed to the "Bo$ton" thing, I guess I can't really stop you, but personally, I wouldn't go there.

[Chevy114]

Im 24 barely old enough to know anything, and thanks to being a history teacher I know walter mondale ran against ronald regan in his 2nd term and lost.

His 2 claims to fame were having the first ever female vp canadite and using the wheres the beef line from wendys as a campaign sologan. Again the democrats tried to be young and hip and appeal to pop culture with both of these ideas but sadly walter didn't even come close to winning.

[Yoda]

The correct and appropriate usage is simply Red $ox. You shouldn't use capitals in the middle of words, and city names aren't generally part of the usage.

If your keyboard has a lowercase '$', and you're really committed to the "Bo$ton" thing, I guess I can't really stop you, but personally, I wouldn't go there.

Since when is a dollar sign a capitalized character?

[jimmyjimjimz]

Im 24 barely old enough to know anything, and thanks to being a history teacher I know walter mondale ran against ronald regan in his 2nd term and lost.

His 2 claims to fame were having the first ever female vp canadite and using the wheres the beef line from wendys as a campaign sologan. Again the democrats tried to be young and hip and appeal to pop culture with both of these ideas but sadly walter didn't even come close to winning.

oh, ok. So he's the guy Gereldine Ferrara ran with?

I know, I probably spelled her name wrong. Oh well, I'm not Albert Einstein.

[Chevy114]

oh, ok. So he's the guy Gereldine Ferrara ran with?

I know, I probably spelled her name wrong. Oh well, I'm not Albert Einstein.

Yup thats him. He also ran for vp with jimmy carter, but thats not as famous as his other two facts.

[RuthMayBond]

I don't think every member of this board voted, so I think you should at least keep the poll open until game 7 of the Yankees-Mets 2008 World Series ends and the Yankees close Yankee Stadium as the world champions.Hm, they'd have to get out of last place before that

[whoisonit]

Hm, they'd have to get out of last place before that

It's the ghost's of historic old YS. Like Horace Clark & Mike Pagliarullo.
... and Stump Merrill. They like last place.

[jimmyjimjimz]

Yup thats him. He also ran for vp with jimmy carter, but thats not as famous as his other two facts.

so he was Jimmy Carter's vice president too? or did Jimmy Catrer lose the election that year?

[StanTheMan]

Yup thats him. He also ran for vp with jimmy carter, but thats not as famous as his other two facts.

Yep........ The Ketchup on the Hot Dogs
and
his daughter sleeping with Bucky Dent and holding onto the photos until the right moment comes along.......

[Chevy114]

so he was Jimmy Carter's vice president too? or did Jimmy Catrer lose the election that year?

He was jimmy carter's vp, then they lost to regan in the next election. After that he ran for president himself and lost to regan again.

[placount]

first of all, you spelled Yankees wrong. It's Yankees not Yankee$.

second, remember last year? They sucked in the begining of the season. Then what happened? Oh yeah, they wound up making the playoffs.

really it should be spelled ¥an ₭€ €$ as we all know theyve spent a little of all those currencies