Tim Lincecum

[slugger33]

I was recently showing someone Tim Linececum's pitching delivery and he said this:

"Very, very bad idea to try to copy Tim Lincecum's pitching style. When he throws, he is one of the most "over the top" pitchers there are. To achieve this 'over the top' release, his head is pulling out at release(to his glove side). This decreases efficiency (distance from where ball is released to batter). Also, this puts a TON of stress on the shoulder, and coming from a guy throwing 100mph+, his arm is gunna be shot in 5 years max.

Other than the pulling his head out at release, he's awesome with his long stride, perfect opposite and equal, etc."

Do you agree or disagree?

[RIstar]

I think I have studied Tim Lincecum more then most people. Also to throw over the top he tilts his shoulders and moves his head very little which will do no harm. I do not see him getting hurt any time soon since he throws with his whole body.

Great mechanics is what he has. Also no you shouldn't try to be just like him just take the important stuff and try to become as explosive and up tempo as you can'

For me I like to turn my back to the hitter I can then un coil my upper body and lower body alot faster and fly down the mound harder. Do what feels best to you.

My mechanics http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XRLY1lGfaMA

[jamesh23]

I was recently showing someone Tim Linececum's pitching delivery and he said this:

"Very, very bad idea to try to copy Tim Lincecum's pitching style. When he throws, he is one of the most "over the top" pitchers there are. To achieve this 'over the top' release, his head is pulling out at release(to his glove side). This decreases efficiency (distance from where ball is released to batter). Also, this puts a TON of stress on the shoulder, and coming from a guy throwing 100mph+, his arm is gunna be shot in 5 years max.

Other than the pulling his head out at release, he's awesome with his long stride, perfect opposite and equal, etc."

Do you agree or disagree?


I believe that was in one of the threads I posted in over on bodybuilding.com correct? with the mlb player gifs haha I asked how to copy his mechanics and thats what the kid told me, thats awesome that we both post at both sites. whats your username overthere?

[beemax]

I faced Lincecum, and my Dad scouted him in high school and at the U. of Washington. He loved his delivery, and said that he was the most dominant pitcher he had ever seen in college. I agree. He was far and away the most dominant pitcher I have ever faced. That's also taking into consideration who I faced in college, pitchers such as Mike Pelfrey, Ian Kennedy, Brandon Morrow, and Casey Janssen (just to name the guys who have been in the majors to this point).

Before any of you question his mechanics, keep in mind that he has never been injured, and that he had weeks in college where he would close on Friday, start and throw 7+ innings Saturday, then close on Tuesday. He is 5'11" at best, 165lbs at most, and he has touched 100mph, depending on who you have talked to (I know that he touched 99mph when I faced him in 2006). I think before anyone rushes to judgement on his mechanics being poor, we should look at what he does extremely well. Just take a step back and think about how many guys with his stature have the stuff this guy has. He must be doing something right, shouldn't he? To be that small and throw that hard, with a great curveball.

As for throwing over the top, here are a few guys who it has worked for.

http://www.brownsteins.net/Ulpan/Images/SandyKoufax_lg.jpg

http://barrybonds.mlb.com/images/2007/05/03/lS5D683i.jpg

http://www.baseball-almanac.com/players/pics/juan_marichal_autograph.jpg

Here is Jim Palmer

javascript:mediaPlayer.play({w:'http://mfile.akamai.com/31386/wmv/mlb.download.akamai.com/31386/open/members/palmer_j/palmer_jim_bio_400.wmv',%20type:'v_free'});

You can also throw Warren Spahn into that mix.

javascript:mediaPlayer.play({w:'http://mfile.akamai.com/31386/wmv/mlb.download.akamai.com/31386/open/members/spahn_w/spahn_warren_bio_400.wmv',%20type:'v_free'});

(Sorry, the video links didn't come up. I got Palmer and Spahn from the HOF website if you want to look them up.)

4 of those 5 men are in the Hall of Fame. The other has Hall of Fame stuff-the best fastball and curve that I have ever faced.

I think we can learn something from all of them.

[slugger33]

I believe that was in one of the threads I posted in over on bodybuilding.com correct? with the mlb player gifs haha I asked how to copy his mechanics and thats what the kid told me, thats awesome that we both post at both sites. whats your username overthere?
Yeah that's it. I'll pm it to you.

[beemax]

RIstar, I really like your delivery (and I know my brother does too).

[Chris O'Leary]

I have done an analysis...

- Pitcher Analysis - Tim Linececum (http://www.chrisoleary.com/projects/Baseball/Pitching/ProfessionalPitcherAnalyses/TimLincecum.html)

...of the clip below of Tim Lincecum...

http://www.chrisoleary.com/projects/Baseball/Pitching/Videos/Video_Pitching_TimLincecum_C_Large_001.gif

I mostly like what I see.

Yes, he's a little max effort, but his arm action and timing are good. His PAS elbow gets a little high, but drops before his shoulders start to turn. His hip/shoulder separation is the best I've ever seen.

Also, regarding the comments above...

1. His head is fairly steady through the release point.
2. There's nothing bad for the shoulder about throwing from a high arm slot.

[TG Coach]

I read Lincecum's delivery was designed by his dad. It was designed specifically to overcome his physical limitations (size) and optimize the best of each part of mechanics from certain current and former MLB pitchers. I'd call it a "do not try this at home" delivery. It may only work for Lincecum.

[Go Cardinals]

I done an analysis...

- Pitcher Analysis - Tim Linececum (http://www.chrisoleary.com/projects/Baseball/Pitching/ProfessionalPitcherAnalyses/TimLincecum.html)

...of the clip below of Tim Lincecum...

http://www.chrisoleary.com/projects/Baseball/Pitching/Videos/Video_Pitching_TimLincecum_C_Large_001.gif

I mostly like what I see.

Yes, he's a little max effort, but his arm action and timing are good. His PAS elbow gets a little high, but drops before his shoulders start to turn. His hip/shoulder separation is the best I've ever seen.

Also, regarding the comments above...

1. His head is fairly steady through the release point.
2. There's nothing bad for the shoulder about throwing from a high arm slot.

What pitch was that. The way he releases it, it looks like a curveball.

[RIstar]

Beemax who is your brother? Also if you want you can comment on my pitching mechanics thread called Ristars Mechanics {balanced} or something along the lines of that.

[XV84]

Throwing from over the top itself isn't any more stressfull than other arm slots. Mike Marshall will tell you it puts the least stress, because it gives the arm a straighter path to the plate. The tilting of the shoulders decreases forearm flyout. In actuality it increases efficiency because his arm doesn't have to go around his body. Instead it goes over his body.

If Lincecum blows out his arm, it's because he throws so hard regardless of his arm slot.

What pitch was that. The way he releases it, it looks like a curveball.

It was a fastball to Pujols middle of the plate hit right back up the middle for a single. I know because I made the original clip.

[Chris O'Leary]

What pitch was that. The way he releases it, it looks like a curveball.

I don't know.

I'd say a fastball because it looks like he's pronating in Frame 65 and his fingers are behind the ball in Frame 64.

[tom.guerry]

where is just the facts when there is a topic he actually understands ?

[jamesh23]

alright so I've seen the slow mo videos from the front, does anyone have clips that are from the back and side? chris?

[XV84]

If Lincecum is going to blow his arm because of his arm slot, will it happen to this guy, who has nearly the same motion and arm slot, as well? Both pitches were fastballs.

http://i203.photobucket.com/albums/aa173/xvue84/pitching%20clips/lincecumVSgallardo.gif
http://i203.photobucket.com/albums/aa173/xvue84/pitching%20clips/lincecumVSgallardosuperslow.gif

[Go Cardinals]

If Lincecum is going to blow his arm because of his arm slot, will it happen to this guy, who has nearly the same motion and arm slot, as well? Both pitches were fastballs.

http://i203.photobucket.com/albums/aa173/xvue84/pitching%20clips/lincecumVSgallardo.gif
http://i203.photobucket.com/albums/aa173/xvue84/pitching%20clips/lincecumVSgallardosuperslow.gif

Wow, your right... I never saw that arm slot in them before!

[Go Cardinals]

Did you film the Gallardo one too? And that other Lincecum one?

[scorekeeper]

Maybe Mrs. Lincecum ought to be lookin’ for a good divorce attorney! It seems like the hubby might have been steppin’ out! ;)

[Go Cardinals]

Is it just me or does it look like lincecum's arms are longer compare to his body that Gallardo's?

[XV84]

Did you film the Gallardo one too? And that other Lincecum one?

I made the clips from footage I found on the internet.

Is it just me or does it look like lincecum's arms are longer compare to his body that Gallardo's?

Lincecum is just skinnier than Gallardo. Lincecum is listed at 5'11, 170, while Gallardo is 6'1", 209.

[ChrisLDuncan]

Is Lincecum's action easily repeatable? Can he hold up for 15-20 years?

[XV84]

I wonder if Lincecum's father modeled his delivery after cricket bowlers? This is Shoaib Akhtar, fastest cricket bowler in the world, clocked at 100 mph before.

http://i203.photobucket.com/albums/aa173/xvue84/pitching%20clips/lincecumVSakhtar.gif
http://i203.photobucket.com/albums/aa173/xvue84/pitching%20clips/lincecumVSakhtarslow.gif

[APPpitch]

Wow. I've never actually seen a cricket throw slowed down. Thanks for posting that. The only thing I would change on Lincecum is his wide leg sweep. If he could get that landing foot under his knee and streamline his delivery a wee bit more, maybe you get an extra mph or two and an extra 2-4 inches farther down the mound, but thats it. That kid is doing more with less than any other kid since Pedro Martinez, the early years.

-scott

[Deemax]

The only thing I would change on Lincecum is his wide leg sweep.

This is not a flaw. The HOF is loaded with pitchers who sweep thier lead leg wide.