Yankee Stadium Pre-Renovation

[cgcoyne2]

OK, here's a little more. It was posts 487-490 of this thread. Spiderico did the major leg work and here are a few of his screenshots for reference.

In picture number 1, the guy the agent is following walks past a souvenir stand. To the right of this hanging from the ceiling looks to be pictures of Hall of Fame plaques from Cooperstown.

Picture number 2 shows the players hanging from the ceiling with nameplates below them.

Picture number 3 shows the hanging pictures and the center picture is clearly Yogi Berra, who was still playing in 1959.

Also the overall color of the interior is predominately greenish in color. The Yankee Stadium I know was predominately blue.

[frank72]

Hey guys,

For you "Older" Yankee fans that saw the video I posted in post #2733 I have a few observations and questions.

In the movie the agent and the guy he's following enter the stadium at gate 6,7 (rightfield). During the movie they're watching the game in section 6 of the mezzanine, which is behind homeplate, but the game action actually happens from a view closer to third base. The picture I attatched shows this. It's really no big deal.

Ok, now for the questions. Did you guys notice how narrow the concourse above the seating area is? The agent went over to the phone and you can clearly see that he gets there within a few steps. The outer wall is clearly there because you can see the louvered windows behind him while he's on the phone. Another question is about the street level. When both the agent and the guy he's following go downstairs did you happen to notice the things hanging from the ceiling to the right of the souvenir stand and to the left of the concession stand. They sort of look like pictures of the Hall of Fame plaques. Does anyone know what they were? Also did you notice the big pictures of the ballplayers right inside the Gate 6,7 entrance? The pictures have a plate or something below them with the players name on it. It also looks like a little blurb of info given for each player. One other thing. You'll notice in the clip that the stadium seat looks to be blue, not the green we've been led to believe was in the stadium before the 1967-68 refurbishment. It may be the coloring, I don't know.

Does anyone have any info about this stuff? I never went to the original stadium and always wish I did.

Not sure what you are referring to regarding the hall of fame plaques. Here is an example of the plaques on the pictures. This is from lelands auction

[cgcoyne2]

Excellent, thanks.

[Lpeters199]

From: http://uneteadetodounpoco.blogspot.com/

[cgcoyne2]

Now I'm at home and I can do some video capturing. These pictures show the plaque-like things hanging from the ceiling at the Gate 6-7 entrance.

[cgcoyne2]

Now here's some close-ups. I don't know about you guys but they look like copies of Hall of Fame plaques to me!!!

[frank72]

Wow - you must have eagle eyes or something. Nice observation. They do look very much like hall of fame plaques. I will be curious to hear if anyone remembers them. If they are what we think they are I have never seen one turn up before.

[brooklyndodger14]

Wow - you must have eagle eyes or something. Nice observation. They do look very much like hall of fame plaques. I will be curious to hear if anyone remembers them. If they are what we think they are I have never seen one turn up before.

Prior to 1967's refurbishing, all the food concession counters, on the lobby level at least, had black and white photographs depicting team pictures, individual player photos, key moments of season's past, or Yankees' Hall of Fame plaques. I had previously mentioned in another post that I remember the photo of Rizzuto squeeze bunting safely to drive in DiMaggio against the Indians above the stand in Gate 4.

After the 1966 season, all of the photos above the counters were replaced with color pictures of Canteen food offerings.

Dennis
BrooklynDodger14

[tdinan]

I've been looking and I can't find the poster that brought the movie from 1959, "FBI Story" to our attention. I'm sorry. I posted it to Youtube.com today. I rented the movie from blockbuster and cut out the 6 minute video section that shows Yankee Stadium from 1959.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JgM_wbcLnEE.

Very cool!

So it looks like the old Yankee Stadium actually had an open concourse?

[Lpeters199]

Yes, they're probably reposts from ESPN--but aren't they beautiful?

[Lpeters199]

Color shot from 1968:

[Paul W]

the green color that much of the stadium interior was painted was known within the front office circles as "topping money" green...

[Paul W]

more tv booth pix...
a. with (bottom to top) my dad, jim woods, jackie farrell and mell allen (in hat).
b. (l to right) red barber, mel allen (behind camera op.) & my dad
c. this open booth could be a dangerous place if your back is to the field and large crowd noise can drown out the voices nearby.
i heard that he turned a nice shade of blue when they carried him out of the booth...

[Paul W]

photos taken @ oys in '71 with gene michael and ron woods...
1. woods & michael relaxing in 1st base box seats
2. woods & my dad (unknown writer) in yanks dugout
3. me w/brother and frank messer outside club office entrance
4. baseball writers softball game

[Paul W]

1. w/siblings and harry dunlop '69
2. w/ brother in rf bullpen '67?

[RationalNYYfan]

It seems like there were actually less railings in the stands of RYS than there were prior to the renovation.

[Paul W]

It seems like there were actually less railings in the stands of RYS than there were prior to the renovation.

yes and the rounded corners and dark paint made them less noticeable...
the railings were installed as exposed metal and not painted until the 1960's

[Paul W]

view of oys @ 1956 old timers day from tv booth (a little blurry)...

[bandit12]

Hey guys,

For you "Older" Yankee fans that saw the video I posted in post #2733 I have a few observations and questions.

In the movie the agent and the guy he's following enter the stadium at gate 6,7 (rightfield). During the movie they're watching the game in section 6 of the mezzanine, which is behind homeplate, but the game action actually happens from a view closer to third base. The picture I attatched shows this. It's really no big deal.

Ok, now for the questions. Did you guys notice how narrow the concourse above the seating area is? The agent went over to the phone and you can clearly see that he gets there within a few steps. The outer wall is clearly there because you can see the louvered windows behind him while he's on the phone. Another question is about the street level. When both the agent and the guy he's following go downstairs did you happen to notice the things hanging from the ceiling to the right of the souvenir stand and to the left of the concession stand. They sort of look like pictures of the Hall of Fame plaques. Does anyone know what they were? Also did you notice the big pictures of the ballplayers right inside the Gate 6,7 entrance? The pictures have a plate or something below them with the players name on it. It also looks like a little blurb of info given for each player. One other thing. You'll notice in the clip that the stadium seat looks to be blue, not the green we've been led to believe was in the stadium before the 1967-68 refurbishment. It may be the coloring, I don't know.

Does anyone have any info about this stuff? I never went to the original stadium and always wish I did.


You have found an error of continuity that can be sent to http://www.moviemistakes.com/ I thought that was odd also that he entered into right field and was quickly on the 3rd base side. You will also notice that when he leaves the subway station, the stadium is empty from the exterior view, but then you see it full during the game.

I bet dollars to donuts the game shown and the filming of the actors watching the game...didn't happen on the same day.

[Lpeters199]

At 2:15 of this video clip from Serpico is the scene filmed near Yankee Stadium

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gqf5L7936Ms&feature=PlayList&p=3029F4C9D348CB5F&index=12

[YankeesFan]

OK, here's a little more. It was posts 487-490 of this thread. Spiderico did the major leg work and here are a few of his screenshots for reference.

In picture number 1, the guy the agent is following walks past a souvenir stand. To the right of this hanging from the ceiling looks to be pictures of Hall of Fame plaques from Cooperstown.

Picture number 2 shows the players hanging from the ceiling with nameplates below them.

Picture number 3 shows the hanging pictures and the center picture is clearly Yogi Berra, who was still playing in 1959.

Also the overall color of the interior is predominately greenish in color. The Yankee Stadium I know was predominately blue.


If you look at the last photo, there appears to be an opening under the stands. Is this the area that leads to the runway on the field level?

[YankeesFan]

Now I'm at home and I can do some video capturing. These pictures show the plaque-like things hanging from the ceiling at the Gate 6-7 entrance.

This last picture is even better at looking at the opening under the stands. Is this a tunnel leading to the field level seats?

[scooterfan]

1. w/siblings and harry dunlop '69
2. w/ brother in rf bullpen '67?

Thank you for your pictures. They're great!!!

[The Monument]

Paul W, thanks for those pix. Keep 'em coming if you have any more. In post 551 you forgot to mention Thurman Munson up top near the ramp.

[The Monument]

bandit12, you're right! Those seats look blue, not green. Another Stadium mystery to be solved.

[bandit12]

At 2:15 of this video clip from Serpico is the scene filmed near Yankee Stadium

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gqf5L7936Ms&feature=PlayList&p=3029F4C9D348CB5F&index=12

Very cool...Is that same view still there today? It would be interesting to see the same area with the RYS before it is demolished.

[Paul W]

Paul W, thanks for those pix. Keep 'em coming if you have any more. In post 551 you forgot to mention Thurman Munson up top near the ramp.

funny u mention him, those pix were taken the day of what were known as the "getty/yankees train clinics". getty gas was a yanks sponsor in early 70's and the ad agency where my dad was had the ny metro account and he got the lirr involved with running a special train with a flatcar covered w/astroturf that would stop at several stations for baseball instructional "clinics" on saturday mornings during the summer that had at least 3 yanks players, an announcer and equipment giveaways.

the day these pix were taken thurman was the 3rd player, but he arrived at the stadium late and did not want to "uni up" and was pretty grouchy all day.
that's why you don't see him with the other two in uni (that's not him in the background). i have a few other pix from that day somewhere, i'll try to find 'em.

i do remember other players etc. who went on these clinic trips - lindy mcdaniel, johnny ellis, rich mckinney and frank messer, marv albert.

those of you who lived on the island in the early 70's might remember these clinics. anybody have the schedule posters or other pix out there?

[Lpeters199]

On Aug. 22, 1982, my wife and I were leaving Genesee Valley Mall in Flint, Michigan, when the bright blue uniforms of two State Troopers coming toward us caught my eye. They were flanking none other than Joe DiMaggio, heading toward the Mall's baseball card convention. An ordinary day instantly turned into a moment that still stands out in my mind as if it happened yesterday. Below is the Flint Journal article from the next day.

Joe's character and personality have been discussed a lot in this thread, and I want to add this article. He made a very positive impression here.

[Lpeters199]

Some great pics here: http://www.stadiumpage.com/stadiumgraveyard/yank.html

[cgcoyne2]

The dimensions down each of the foul lines were 258 feet. It was actually 257.526' down each line, but my guess is they rounded up. This is according to the original Osborne Engineering plan for the foul lines, as well as several newspaper accounts of the day.

So yes, Andrew Clem's website is correct, or as you say, the gospel. His research is actually done with the help of Bruce Orser, a tape-measure home run researcher. Both of these people also (if I'm not mistaken) friends with Bill Jenkinson, who is probably the most knowledgeable person about field dimensions and home runs out there today.

For the 1924 season, the plate was moved forward about ten feet and possibly turned to the right a slight amount. There are only a few news articles for the rotation of the plate, but it's very obvious the plate was at the very least moved forward. Whatever the result, this made the dimensions what we are familiar with today, 295 down the right field line and 301 down the left.

It is important to note hoever that the 295 figure was only until the grandstand extension and concrete bleachers were put in place in 1937, after that time, the distance increased to 296, but remained the same down the left line.

Hope this helps.


Richard


EDIT: I would also like to point out that I have no idea where this 281 figure for the left field foul line came from, but I have never seen any evidence to support it. In fact, wikipedia even lists it as 285 feet in 1923.

Here are some pictures to show the difference. The pictures are from 1923 and 1932.

The pictures are from this site:
http://www.stadiumpage.com/stadiumgraveyard/yank.html

[The Monument]

The proof is in the pix. Thats a great shot from '23, one I've never seen before, and it convinces me that the RF line was 258' for that year.

[tdinan]

Very cool...Is that same view still there today? It would be interesting to see the same area with the RYS before it is demolished.


Yep, same exact view is there today. The location is Joyce Kilmer Park on the Grand Concourse, just across 161st St. from the Bronx County Courthouse.

Here is the approximate site today, courtesy of Google Maps:

[cgcoyne2]

I'll pull a "Gary" here and post a timely photo. Here's a shot of RYS from Kilmer Park last October when I happened to run into Gary at the stadium tour without knowing it.

[SultanOfWhat]

That's a fantastic 1923 RF foul line pic. Hadn't seen that one. This is the only one like that I'd seen previously:

http://lh4.ggpht.com/_Q_Zerpnj63I/SeYvfrbz8SI/AAAAAAAAFP4/ZtIuuk8XhVU/s800/From%20the%20mid%201920s%2C%20possible%201923.jpg

There would have been only a modest difference in home runs allowed down the line with that early configuration, though, as for only about 1 degree of the 90 degrees of fair territory were the stands situated for shorter home runs. Back then, as has been discussed here, a ball hit past the foul pole had to land fair to be judged a home run. No "curving" one around the pole.

That new 1923 pic also seems to substantiate that the field was "swung" around slightly to the right when the post-1923 season field alterations were done. In the 1923 pic, the RF foul line (the low, padded wall that runs into the RF bleachers) lines up with the aisle in the bleachers, while in the 1932 pic, is noticeably to the right of that point.

1923:
http://lh5.ggpht.com/_Q_Zerpnj63I/SmC6JM6EaqI/AAAAAAAAH8s/-AHTu50mfMI/s800/SwungRF1923%20Yankee%20Stadium.jpg

1932:
http://lh5.ggpht.com/_Q_Zerpnj63I/SmC6Kd3HDMI/AAAAAAAAH8w/5w6LObg_Buc/s800/SwungRF1932%20Yankee%20Stadium.jpg

[cgcoyne2]

...

That new 1923 pic also seems to substantiate that the field was "swung" around slightly to the right when the post-1923 season field alterations were done. In the 1923 pic, the RF foul line (the low, padded wall that runs into the RF bleachers) lines up with the aisle in the bleachers, while in the 1932 pic, is noticeably to the right of that point.

Good pick-up.

[TJH1923]

I'll pull a "Gary" here and post a timely photo. Here's a shot of RYS from Kilmer Park last October when I happened to run into Gary at the stadium tour without knowing it.

Here is a similar shot I took April 2007.

[bandit12]

Here is a similar shot I took April 2007.

I'll pull a "Gary" here and post a timely photo. Here's a shot of RYS from Kilmer Park last October when I happened to run into Gary at the stadium tour without knowing it.

Yep, same exact view is there today. The location is Joyce Kilmer Park on the Grand Concourse, just across 161st St. from the Bronx County Courthouse.

Here is the approximate site today, courtesy of Google Maps:

Thanks guys.

[Lpeters199]

Some short Babe Ruth clips from Getty Footage. The last one gives a good view of the old center and left fields. The Babe was just a big kid who loved life--and the greatest ballplayer ever.

http://www.gettyimages.com/Search/Search.aspx?contractUrl=2&language=en-US&family=editorial&p=babe%20ruth&assetType=film&src=quick#3

[stuarthouse]

The proof is in the pix. Thats a great shot from '23, one I've never seen before, and it convinces me that the RF line was 258' for that year.

As has been previously noted, the 258' measurement was more theoretical than functional and this scarce photo does a great job of illustrating that. For anyone to hit a cheapie into that splinter of land would have indeed been an oddity. Beyond that the real right field fence was a bit short of 300'. There also was a terrace in front of the fence and the fence itself was about 10-12' high, the top portion of which was like chicken wire so as not to obstruct the view from the lowest bleacher seats. The 1924 movement of the plate about 10' toward center corrected this anomaly.

[Mary Ellen]

These look similar to the way the NYPL mounts photos.

[SultanOfWhat]

As has been previously noted, the 258' measurement was more theoretical than functional and this scarce photo does a great job of illustrating that. For anyone to hit a cheapie into that splinter of land would have indeed been an oddity. Beyond that the real right field fence was a bit short of 300'. There also was a terrace in front of the fence and the fence itself was about 10-12' high, the top portion of which was like chicken wire so as not to obstruct the view from the lowest bleacher seats. The 1924 movement of the plate about 10' toward center corrected this anomaly.

Here's a closeup of the RF fence, with Ruth handing out his Babe Ruth's Home Run candy bars to fans. As you suggest, there is an upward slope to the ground towards the fence. The fence seems to be about 9 feet high at this point.

http://lh4.ggpht.com/_Q_Zerpnj63I/SmIBUY5ozsI/AAAAAAAAH-s/Sxdi1Ze2gxQ/s800/Babe%20tossing%20his%20own%20brand%20candy%20into% 20the%20outfield%20bleachers.jpg

Here's a reference pic, with an arrow where Ruth is standing in the first pic (BTW, that's the Babe in RF):

http://lh5.ggpht.com/_Q_Zerpnj63I/SmIEclfEWWI/AAAAAAAAH_I/RrF0-39yFnM/s800/Yankee%20Stadium%20%281929%29Ruth%20CandyArrow.jpg

[Paul W]

these chairs look the same, could be?

[spiderico]

OK, here's a little more. It was posts 487-490 of this thread. Spiderico did the major leg work and here are a few of his screenshots for reference.

In picture number 1, the guy the agent is following walks past a souvenir stand. To the right of this hanging from the ceiling looks to be pictures of Hall of Fame plaques from Cooperstown.

Picture number 2 shows the players hanging from the ceiling with nameplates below them.

Picture number 3 shows the hanging pictures and the center picture is clearly Yogi Berra, who was still playing in 1959.

Also the overall color of the interior is predominately greenish in color. The Yankee Stadium I know was predominately blue.

Thanks for the credit on the original screen captures. Did that a few years ago. Anyway, heres a few more shots of that souvenir stand over the years. It was right inside of gate 6. You enter the gate and make a hard left. Only gate with a souvenir stand and ramp right when you walk in. Heres the screen cap from the movie, another from 60's I believe and one I took last year.

[Gylmar]

Thanks for the credit on the original screen captures. Did that a few years ago. Anyway, heres a few more shots of that souvenir stand over the years. It was right inside of gate 6. You enter the gate and make a hard left. Only gate with a souvenir stand and ramp right when you walk in. Heres the screen cap from the movie, another from 60's I believe and one I took last year.

After all these years the souvenir stand was still located in the same place right to the end of last season, thanks for the info and thanks for the pics! :nod:

[Sean O]

You can really see how much better the place looked when the concourses were more open. Before they sealed off the ramp windows and lowered the ceiling to an unbelievably claustrophobic height, the openness provided a completely different feel.

So much of the crowded feeling is due not simply to the number of people, but how cramped someone is in their surroundings. A tight, narrow hallway feels so much more uncomfortable than an open-air space the exact size. Using Fenway as an example, compare the crush of people in the tiny corridor around 1st base under the stands to the open-air staircase leading to Van Ness/Yawkey after the game. The latter contains far more people, but the former is the worst part of the park.

Yankee Stadium was eminently fixable, it simply required undoing the '70s renovation and rethinking the rest.

[ChineseDemocracy]

I think it was the escalator pod outside of Gate 6 that gave it the claustrophobic look inside. If you look UP in the third picture, the concrete seems fresher than the rest of the areas in that picture.

[YankeesFan]

Thanks for the credit on the original screen captures. Did that a few years ago. Anyway, heres a few more shots of that souvenir stand over the years. It was right inside of gate 6. You enter the gate and make a hard left. Only gate with a souvenir stand and ramp right when you walk in. Heres the screen cap from the movie, another from 60's I believe and one I took last year.

Hi, two questions:

1 - Why is the ceiling lower as you enter at gate 6 in the renovated stadium?

2 - As you look up the ramp in the original stadium, you can see windows to look outside. The entrance for gate 6 looks to be flush with the wall near the ramp. In the renovated stadium, it looks like this wall was removed to allow the entrance for the garage type doors under the escalator tower. Basically, if the original windows on the ramp were still there, you would not truly be looking outside.

Hope I was able to explain #2 clearly. :)

Thanks.

[YankeesFan]

OK, here's a little more. It was posts 487-490 of this thread. Spiderico did the major leg work and here are a few of his screenshots for reference.

In picture number 1, the guy the agent is following walks past a souvenir stand. To the right of this hanging from the ceiling looks to be pictures of Hall of Fame plaques from Cooperstown.

Picture number 2 shows the players hanging from the ceiling with nameplates below them.

Picture number 3 shows the hanging pictures and the center picture is clearly Yogi Berra, who was still playing in 1959.

Also the overall color of the interior is predominately greenish in color. The Yankee Stadium I know was predominately blue.


Hi-

My question is in regards to the third photo. If you look to the right of the usher, there appears to be what looks like a runway ramp leading to the field level seats. It is difficult to determine if this is indeed a runway. I recall reading that in the pre-renovated stadium, that all the runway ramps from the field level seats did not access the field level concourse. Would anyone know what this area brought you?

- Thanks.

[Lpeters199]

From: http://www.lelands.com/index.aspx

Most or all of these are probably reposts, but all of them are worth another look.

[Lpeters199]

From: http://www.lelands.com/index.aspx

[Lpeters199]

From: http://www.lelands.com/index.aspx

[Lpeters199]

Not Yankee Stadium, but two sets of goal posts in Yale Bowl!

[The Monument]

Good stuff. Why did you sneak in that Shea picture?

[ChineseDemocracy]

Maybe the Yanks were playing at Shea during the reno.

[Gylmar]

Great pics! It's always nice to remember the other sports and events that took place at OYS. :D

I remember the two sets of goal posts at the Yale Bowl! :crazy

[Lpeters199]

Good stuff. Why did you sneak in that Shea picture?

I didn't. Those pictures were only viewable on Leland's as a group, so I couldn't post them individually. Had to take the bitter with the sweet.

[locke40]

I can't, for the life of me, understand how in 1923, with the limited resources and building materials, they could build a stadium that is so much cleaner and more pleasing to the eye, then in 2009 with the unlimited resources and technology. When I say cleaner, I mean the architectural lines and principles; the NYS is almost unbearable to watch on TV because of all the clutter and lack of foresight with many of the building principles. I honestly sit up many nights dreaming of what it would be like to watch a game at the OYS, and how different it would be if they still played in a mint-green, Statue of Liberty colored, stadium. You wouldn't be able to find a ticket anywhere, and it could hold 60,000 people.

[yankees650B]

I can't, for the life of me, understand how in 1923, with the limited resources and building materials, they could build a stadium that is so much cleaner and more pleasing to the eye, then in 2009 with the unlimited resources and technology. When I say cleaner, I mean the architectural lines and principles; the NYS is almost unbearable to watch on TV because of all the clutter and lack of foresight with many of the building principles. I honestly sit up many nights dreaming of what it would be like to watch a game at the OYS, and how different it would be if they still played in a mint-green, Statue of Liberty colored, stadium. You wouldn't be able to find a ticket anywhere, and it could hold 60,000 people.

I've been thinking the exact same thing. the old stadium flowed, if that makes any sense. it fit together and looked like it was suppose to. the new stadium looks slapped together and half done.

[Lpeters199]

I've been thinking the exact same thing. the old stadium flowed, if that makes any sense. it fit together and looked like it was suppose to. the new stadium looks slapped together and half done.

"Flowed" is a good word choice for OYS. In what ways? Compare these two overhead pics of OYS vs. RYS (I think Yankee Stadium is the wrong name for the new park).

OYS: Field and stands only. The field and the stands flowed into one.
RYS: Interior outfield fence looks cheap, and the areas between inner fence and stands are cluttered with bullpens, monument park, etc. A severe case of no flow.

OYS: Low right and leftfield fences. The field flows right into the stands, so the fans weren't separated from the game. They were able to go hand-to-hand with outfielders for home run balls.
RYS: Even where the outfield walls meet the stands, their height gives fans and game an artificial separation.

OYS: The roof was substantial and provided shade and cover for upper deck fans. The roof made OYS look like a real structure that gracefully flowed around most of the park.
RYS: Roof--what roof? Just open air, like an oversized high school stadium. The whole park looked like bleachers.

OYS: The left and right field corners flow smoothly into the infield seats.
RYS: Both corners are choppy looking--not unusual in most great old parks, but they weren't Yankee Stadium.

Yeah, "flow" works very well. Thanks, yankees 650B.

[locke40]

Why are there so many intelligent and perceptive baseball stadium enthusiasts on this site, but not one in the architectural firms of today? Why is that we know more about Yankee history than anyone in charge in the Yankee front office? Lonn Trost saying the new stadium will feel more like the pre-renovated is such a load of crap.

On a side note, the Yankees are about to take sole possession of first place! :nod::nod::nod::nod::nod:

[Gylmar]

Why are there so many intelligent and perceptive baseball stadium enthusiasts on this site, but not one in the architectural firms of today? Why is that we know more about Yankee history than anyone in charge in the Yankee front office? Lonn Trost saying the new stadium will feel more like the pre-renovated is such a load of crap.

On a side note, the Yankees are about to take sole possession of first place! :nod::nod::nod::nod::nod:

Hey locke40, I love the way you display the "old style" Yankees Top-Hat logo with the blue brim, that's my favorite version of the logo! :nod:

[The House That Ruth Built]

Hey locke40, I love the way you display the "old style" Yankees Top-Hat logo with the blue brim, that's my favorite version of the logo! :nod:

And I thought locke40 and I were the only 2 who prefered the older tophat logo.

[locke40]

Hey locke40, I love the way you display the "old style" Yankees Top-Hat logo with the blue brim, that's my favorite version of the logo! :nod:

And I thought locke40 and I were the only 2 who prefered the older tophat logo.

I cringe every time I see the top-hat logo with the white brim at NYS or anywhere on TV. It's a blatant display of laziness. Does the Yankee front office know ANYTHING about their own history? Do they care? The top-hat logo with the blue brim was the original design from 1946; it's suppose to be that way!! I was actually watching clips of the 1996 World Series the other day, and my jaw dropped when I saw the top-hat logo with the blue brim painted on top of the Yankees' dugout. I honestly think some idiot intern in the graphics department sometime after 1996 decided to change the blue to white; probably because the blue isn't an official Yankee color.

I want to start some kind of petition or some sort of movement that will get the attention of the Yankees, and have each logo in the stadium and each JPEG or PNG image on their computers changed back to the original logo. Anyone have any ideas?

[tugger]

Yeah, "flow" works very well. Thanks, yankees 650B.


http://www.geocities.com/classics4ever/alice/cast/images/holliday_grits.jpg

[Lpeters199]

http://www.geocities.com/classics4ever/alice/cast/images/holliday_grits.jpg

Oh...My...God

[Lpeters199]

You're all New Yorkers--I'm not--so will someone tell me who #20 is in this picture? Thanks.

[Yankees73]

You're all New Yorkers--I'm not--so will someone tell me who #20 is in this picture? Thanks.

In my best Bob Sheppard voice...
#20... The Second Baseman...Horace Clarke... #20..

[Gary Dunaier]

Yeah, "flow" works very well. Thanks, yankees 650B.



http://www.geocities.com/classics4ever/alice/cast/images/holliday_grits.jpg

I prefer this one...

http://fitsnews.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/02/flo.jpg

[Lpeters199]

I prefer this one...

http://fitsnews.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/02/flo.jpg

You people are sick, but I liked your stadium. It seems to me that the press deserted the Yankees when they were losing--I haven't seen very many pictures taken after the facelift (1967?) and before the renovation. Were the New York photogs simply front runners?

[Lpeters199]

Not the old stadium, but a nice picture:

[stadiumbuilder]

I can't, for the life of me, understand how in 1923, with the limited resources and building materials, they could build a stadium that is so much cleaner and more pleasing to the eye, then in 2009 with the unlimited resources and technology. When I say cleaner, I mean the architectural lines and principles; the NYS is almost unbearable to watch on TV because of all the clutter and lack of foresight with many of the building principles. I honestly sit up many nights dreaming of what it would be like to watch a game at the OYS, and how different it would be if they still played in a mint-green, Statue of Liberty colored, stadium. You wouldn't be able to find a ticket anywhere, and it could hold 60,000 people.The word that comes to my mind every time I see the new place is 'awkward'. Features are fighting each other, not working together. There's WAY too many ads. I don't think the way they ended the grandstands in right and left look good at all, I'm not getting used to that like I thought I would. The fences are way too close, and if as a designer you feel you have to tell everybody with a giant "YANKEE STADIUM" over the entire left center bleachers where they are, it shows some insecurity on their part. It's like -"see,see, it is yankee stadium, it says so right there".

[VAPYankees4]

The word that comes to my mind every time I see the new place is 'awkward'. Features are fighting each other, not working together. There's WAY too many ads. I don't think the way they ended the grandstands in right and left look good at all, I'm not getting used to that like I thought I would. The fences are way too close, and if as a designer you feel you have to tell everybody with a giant "YANKEE STADIUM" over the entire left center bleachers where they are, it shows some insecurity on their part. It's like -"see,see, it is yankee stadium, it says so right there".

It's not like their the only ones. I actually like the YANKEE STADIUM sign up there.

[cgcoyne2]

Why are there so many intelligent and perceptive baseball stadium enthusiasts on this site, but not one in the architectural firms of today? Why is that we know more about Yankee history than anyone in charge in the Yankee front office? Lonn Trost saying the new stadium will feel more like the pre-renovated is such a load of crap.

On a side note, the Yankees are about to take sole possession of first place! :nod::nod::nod::nod::nod:

Lonn Trost is like the current idiots on the Supreme Court. You know those clowns that have never read the Constitiution, the thing they're supposed to potect. Lonn Trost hasn't got a clue. ABOUT ANYTHING!!!!!

[Mike Wagner]

Lonn Trost is like the current idiots on the Supreme Court. You know those clowns that have never read the Constitiution, the thing they're supposed to potect. Lonn Trost hasn't got a clue. ABOUT ANYTHING!!!!!


Isn't it because everything swirls about the almighty dollar? I haven't seen the new Yankee Stadium yet. All I know is what I read on Baseball Fever and the photos I see posted.

From the photos, I feel very distracted by all the ads. Even old Yankee Stadium had ads, but up to a point. Food and ticket prices are ridiculously high. I've read about "Levine's Moat" for the rich folks. Needless to say, what ballplayers are earning is obscenely high.

It seems to me the fans are complaining because back before prices and salaries went bonkers, families and friends went to the ballgame to connect with each other AND the ballplayers. The ballplayers felt like part of our family, even though we've never met. But, we knew their statistics. We studied their baseball cards and imitated them when we played baseball, softball, or stickball.

Nowadays, we can't get near most of them, as they are sealed off from us at the stadiums - maybe not all stadiums, but many of them. There's no chance for autographs or verbal interaction. Because the almighty buck ru(i)ns everything, today's generation misses out on the closeness we had with the game years ago. We still root for our team (Yankees for me!), but I honestly don't feel as close to these players as I did back in the 1960s and 1970s, because baseball and the fans had a special kinship that has been largely taken away by $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$.

How many pictures of Babe Ruth and other greats have you seen where they're surrounded by loving fans? It's rare to see that today. It's a big shame. Interaction with our heroes and the feeling of being at home is what made us love the game of baseball.

When the Yankees played at Shea Stadium in 1974-75 during the renovation, I never felt at home. It's nothing against the Mets or Met fans. I knew our home was in the Bronx. When we returned to Yankee Stadium in 1976, I stepped into Yankee Stadium and said, "It's great to be home again!" I instantly felt comfortable because I knew I was at home in Yankee Stadium. Renovated or not, it was Yankee Stadium - HOME!!!

Like I said earlier, I have not been to the new Yankee Stadium yet, as I'm currently living in Texas. I don't know when I'll be in New York. I've read mixed reviews and feelings about the new Yankee Stadium. I DO hope it will feel like HOME to ALL Yankee fans, as we don't have a choice in the matter.
I think a big part of this to happen would be for the Yankee organization (and baseball for that matter) to have the players and fans interact more. Respect and loyalty should be a two way street. And, prices should be reasonable. Yes, baseball is a business, and yes, a profit should be made, as in any business. But, the profit should be REASONABLE.

Sometimes you have to go back to your roots to be grounded and remember where you came from.

-Mike Wagner

[stadiumbuilder]

My son and I went to PNC park last week, and that old time feeling and connection is alive and well in Pittsburg. For $27 we sat behind the Pirates dugout. Before the game started we watched the fans go down to the dugout area to talk to and get autographes from their favorite players, just like Yankee fans did 30 years ago. Great atomospere, they couldn't have located this park any better. It is comfortable and friendly, the only negative I could see was lousy food. Pirates won 8-7 on a walkoff HR and the crowd went nuts. I was wearing my Yankee cap and to my surprise, nobody bothered me. One Pirate fan mentioned to me something about how good our Yankee team is looking and I said "I just want my old stadium back" and he said, "Yea, I was in the old one many times and I don't blame you". When we were leaving a Yankee fan grabbed me to shamefully say he liked this place better, he didn't want to, but he just did. We talked for a while about how it is now and how it used to be. We got the impression in Pittsburg they were happy to have us there. My one and only trip to the new stadium, my impression was that the Yankees were happy to have my wallet there. I'll stick with YES network and an occasional road trip.

[VAPYankees4]

Either way not everyone is going to be happy. The stadium is built now live with it. I know i personally preferred the old stadium over this one. But i'm not going to sit and complain about it all day. All i want is them to save a part of the old stadium and that's it. As far as the tradition and all that. That disappeared after they lost to the diamondbacks in the world series. After that they started spending tons of money so they never developed that same chemistry they had in the 90's.

[jimmyjimjimz]

My son and I went to PNC park last week, and that old time feeling and connection is alive and well in Pittsburg. For $27 we sat behind the Pirates dugout. Before the game started we watched the fans go down to the dugout area to talk to and get autographes from their favorite players, just like Yankee fans did 30 years ago. Great atomospere, they couldn't have located this park any better. It is comfortable and friendly, the only negative I could see was lousy food. Pirates won 8-7 on a walkoff HR and the crowd went nuts. I was wearing my Yankee cap and to my surprise, nobody bothered me. One Pirate fan mentioned to me something about how good our Yankee team is looking and I said "I just want my old stadium back" and he said, "Yea, I was in the old one many times and I don't blame you". When we were leaving a Yankee fan grabbed me to shamefully say he liked this place better, he didn't want to, but he just did. We talked for a while about how it is now and how it used to be. We got the impression in Pittsburg they were happy to have us there. My one and only trip to the new stadium, my impression was that the Yankees were happy to have my wallet there. I'll stick with YES network and an occasional road trip.


Good. More tickets for me and the people who actually care about their team.

[RationalNYYfan]

Either way not everyone is going to be happy. The stadium is built now live with it. I know i personally preferred the old stadium over this one. But i'm not going to sit and complain about it all day. All i want is them to save a part of the old stadium and that's it. As far as the tradition and all that. That disappeared after they lost to the diamondbacks in the world series. After that they started spending tons of money so they never developed that same chemistry they had in the 90's.

IMO the Yankees were still 'that same team' in 2002 and 2003. It was in 2004 when the spending began and the chemistry just completely fell apart. "The Last Night of the Yankee Dynasty" by Buster Olney is reeeeeally interesting and he talks all about how completely different the Yankees became after 2003 and even more so after they lost the ALCS in 2004.

I tend to think that 2009 might be the start of a different era though, with the new blood and the new strength in the farm system.

[jimmyjimjimz]

I tend to think that 2009 might be the start of a different era though, with the new blood and the new strength in the farm system.

I'm starting to think that too.

[Lpeters199]

Corbis Motion has some high quality video clips. This is a search for Yankee Stadium: http://www.corbismotion.com/wicker/searchResults.do?search.type=intermediate&search.keywords=yankee+stadium

[voodoochile]

A couple of you guys said that you weren't from New York, and have yet to see the new stadium, except in photos. I live in Southern California and have made the trip to NY for a week nearly every summer since 2001 just to see the Yankees play in pinstripes. Last week not only did I see four games at the new facility, but also a Paul McCartney concert at Citi Field. The McCartney ticket was provided by a friend who lives in Long Island, is a hard core Yankee fan as I am, and considers Citi Field a dump compared to the new Yankee Stadium.

I grew up in South Philly and made it to the pre-renovation stadium a few times, and I still recall it . . . barely. The renovation removed not only physical aspects of the stadium, but some of the soul as well. I haven't put in the time as many of you have, but my opinion is that this new venue is not Yankee Stadium.

If you recall the "cookie cutter" stadiums, this is only the latest of the new phase where they split the second and third decks to give the illusion of five smaller decks. Yankee Stadium appears to resemble everything built in the past decade, albiet slightly larger in places and with the old field dimensions, but the resemblence is there.

I sat in the upper deck for the first game where I was stuck in the middle of a 25 seat row. The newer stadiums usually have this long row broken down to ten seats per row, give or take. I don't have to tell you the hassles involved sitting there. The remaining three games I spent in the right field bleachers. Best seat in the joint for $12.00, and as an added attraction I was in section 203 with the Bleacher Creatures. Don't knock it until you've tried it.

I was happy when they decided to retain the "Yankee Stadium" marquee, but thinking about it now, they should've gotten a sponser and called it W.B. Mason Yankee Stadium or Modell's Yankee Stadium. This way they wouldn't be giving the illusion that it was actually Yankee Stadium.

[voodoochile]

Now that I think about it, "Nathan's HOT DOG Stadium" might be a more suitable name for it.

[Mike Wagner]

Dear voodoochile,

Thank you for your honest input. I know you and the rest of the fellas on Baseball Fever are top notch Yankee fans who care about the team and Stadium.

As I've said, since I haven't gone to the new Yankee Stadium, I'm going by what all of you are saying. I'm just sorry most of what I read appears to be negative regarding the new Yankee Stadium.

My impression from the photos and what most of you are saying is that it's a truly beautiful building, but I guess it's missing it's soul. The original Yankee Stadium had soul. I guess that's what you get for going with a cookie cutter stadium and focusing too much on the rich fans and making money, and not caring about the average person who cares about the team, stadium, and the history of baseball.

If I'm wrong, please correct me.

Respectfully,
Mike Wagner

[locke40]

Dear voodoochile,

Thank you for your honest input. I know you and the rest of the fellas on Baseball Fever are top notch Yankee fans who care about the team and Stadium.

As I've said, since I haven't gone to the new Yankee Stadium, I'm going by what all of you are saying. I'm just sorry most of what I read appears to be negative regarding the new Yankee Stadium.

My impression from the photos and what most of you are saying is that it's a truly beautiful building, but I guess it's missing it's soul. The original Yankee Stadium had soul. I guess that's what you get for going with a cookie cutter stadium and focusing too much on the rich fans and making money, and not caring about the average person who cares about the team, stadium, and the history of baseball.

If I'm wrong, please correct me.

Respectfully,
Mike Wagner

Mike,

I will agree at first glance, the stadium is appears to be a good looking building. However, given that most of us on here are stadium enthusiasts, the more you inspect the place, and the more time you spend looking around, there is a lot wrong with how it was designed. I can't get over (and I never will) the fact that the decks are pushed back so far. I sat in section 207 on the main level, and I kept looking down the first baseline and saying to myself, "how can they fix the decks, to make them straight and more like the old stadium?" It can't happen. They won't be able to fix the structure, and it is very sad. The old stadium was designed perfectly with all three levels following a logical and straight path down the lines. The NYS curves out then back in just past the 1st and 3rd bases, just like a lot of other HOK parks.

Another complaint that I hear from my friends (who aren't in the least bit stadium enthusiasts) is the lack of shade. The old stadium provided cover from the brutal summer sun, while the new stadium provides absolutely none at any level.

Stadiumbuilder provided a very accurate description when he said the NYS looks like it is fighting itself, regarding the design. The old stadium was natural; you could actually see the skeleton (the support columns), and it had it's own personality; it lived and breathed, and looked like it was designed by a real person. The new stadium has nothing that stands out, and looked like it was designed by a computer.

[stadiumbuilder]

.... which in all likelyhood, it was.

[stadiumbuilder]

I've been watching that 1998 series clip baseballman1243 posted on the yankee stadium 2009 thread over and over and to me, that video memory drives a point home better than any words can. It was post #5198 for anybody that hasn't seen it. Even renovated, YS was very special. Very large and intimate at the same time. The crowd was linked together as one, and when things went well, which they often did, the place rocked like no other ever will. That video clip drives this loss home for me more than any of the demo pictures. I really like this 2009 version of the Yankee team. Lots of home grown talent mixed with some fresh faces, good chemistry, even a little speed, but.......for the first time ever, I don't care if they're playing at home or on the road.

[Mike Wagner]

Dear locke40 and stadiumbuilder,

It really saddens me that the new Yankee Stadium is not what it's cracked up to be, based on what I've been reading on the Baseball Fever sites. It's a shame that the "experts" refuse to respect intelligent input from true fans who want a stadium that would potentially be better than the one it would be replacing.

Once something is done, it's done, good or bad, right or wrong. I would certainly try for good and right. With the reviews I've read, it sounds like the Yankees blew a great opportunity to surpass the many fine qualities of the old Yankee Stadium. Newer is not necessarily better. It can be. But, there's no guarantee.

I've been curious about something. Is the new Yankee Stadium a memorial to George Steinbrenner &/or the Steinbrenner family? I know he's been wanting a new stadium for years.

Also, I have a question for those of you that have been to both the new and old Yankee Stadiums. Compared to old Yankee Stadium, whether renovated or pre-renovated, is the new Yankee Stadium a single, double, triple, home run, or grand slam?

The same ratings for Shea Stadium vs. Citi Field.

I'm very curious. I know I'll get honest answers because you guys are honest and you know your stuff.

-Mike Wagner

[RationalNYYfan]

There are lots of things I would have liked to see in the new stadium to make it look like more than just a ballpark, and I'm not talking about a Hard Rock cafe...

I mentioned in another thread that I thought it would be amazing if Monument Park was turned into a legitimate park. MP could be to NYS what Central Park is to New York City. When you enter MP, you literally feel as if you are no longer in Yankee Stadium, but a completely separate entity. They should have made it stretch throughout the entire outfield, while paying homage to Central Park as well as some previous Yankee greats. Imagine putting a pond (that's right, a pond) and grass and trees and a small cobblestone bridge beyond the outfield. People in MP would walk beneath the bridge and people on the bridge may be at the CF cafe or whatever. And while walking through this miniature replica of Central Park there are the 5 monuments at one end and the retired numbers at the other end. The various plaques comemorating papal visits, 9/11, Bob Sheppard, etc. could be appropriately scattered throughout the park.

I think it would be beautiful and very distinctive, and I'm really passionate about that idea.

[Mike Wagner]

Dear RationalNYYfan,

What a neat idea!!! I never would have thought of that. That's why I LOVE Baseball Fever!!!! So many intelligent people with great, reasonable ideas.
I've read quite a few complaints about Monument Park being cramped.

I was hoping the new Yankee Stadium would have had the outfield wall pretty much like it was in Yankee Stadium before the renovation. It had a lot of character, and you knew it was Yankee Stadium.

It seems to me that incorporating much of the old with the new would take the sting out of losing the original stadium. It sounds like the focus is on too much glitz, glamour, and money, and not on baseball. That's my take on the posts I've read. From the photos I've seen, there are just way too many ads!!!!!

-Mike Wagner

[stadiumbuilder]

Mike, it's impossible to put a comparitive rating on the new park. My personal opinion affects only me, I loose something (maybe more than a little something) with the new place, others will have varied feelings. Even the people on here who love it think monument park is a disaster. It needs a do-over, maybe they could take a look at Rationalny's idea for starters, sounds interesting to me. The Met fans I'm friendly with who've been to citi field are very happy with their new place for the most part, but shea actually needed to be replaced, so their transition was more urgent and therefore easier. The new YS was built for revenue enhancement, not as a steinbrenner monument. And nobody besides voodoochile and myself have complained about being buried in a very long row of expensive seats. Seats 11 and 12 and they were a nightmare to get in and out of for $95. Again, if you haven't already, look at post 5198 in the new stadium thread, that says it all.

[Mike Wagner]

Dear stadiumbuilder,

Thank you for your wisdom.

-Mike

[voodoochile]

Try this on for size. I was excited knowing that I would soon be watching the Yankees in the new stadium last week, but when I was finally inside I felt nothing. On the other hand, when I went to the stadium across the street I could feel the blood flowing through my body as I approached it. I'd get pumped up just knowing I was going inside. Maybe it was the thought of being where some of the best baseball ever played took place, something that the new venue has yet to experience.

The fact that the old stadium looked old gave it that flavor of days gone by when World Series Championships were played every other year on average, and the Yankees would win two out of three. Personally, I could care less if the concourses aren't wide, or if the walls have been painted 1000 times. My only concern is on the field.

The new stadium is huge, let there be no doubt about it, but the bottom line is that it's just another baseball field with seats surrounding it. Furthermore, management demonstrated their lack of interest in regards to any historical significance when they buried Monument Park under the center field bleachers in a dungeon-like atmosphere, and how can they call that place Yankee Stadium when Yankee Stadium is across the street? Yankee Stadium, Jr. would be more like it.

[Maxlugar]

Corky Stadium.

[Mike Wagner]

Dear voodoochile,

I'm very sorry you felt nothing. We've all felt great anticipation of going somewhere, then it turns out to be a dud. I truly hope all Yankee and baseball fans come to accept and love the new Yankee Stadium as we have the old one.

I think it most likely would have been more accepted if a lot of the features of the old Yankee Stadium would have been incorporated into the design, and if more thought were given to all the fans, and not the ones with $$$$$$$$.
After all, a ballpark is suppposed to be for all the fans of your favorite team.

Perhaps if the Yankees would incorporate some of the unique features of the original Yankee Stadium, and some of the great ideas found on Baseball Fever,
fans would feel much more comfortable and accepting of the new Stadium.

Computer design is good up to a point. You also have to design such a venue as a ballpark with your heart as well. This is especially true with such a beloved structure as the original Yankee Stadium with its glorious history and unique design.

-Mike Wagner

[voodoochile]

Very well said, Mike. I may have jumped the gun by saying that I felt nothing when I should've said that I felt no excitement. Missing was the thrill of seeing the Yankees continue their heritage in the stadium where it all began. That's what I missed when I entered NYS. It's like what Stadiumbuilder said about how the OYS would rock like no other. Two days ago when the Yankees tied the Dodgers for the best record in baseball, OYS would've shook its foundation.

There was a mystique about OYS that captured the wonder of opposing teams. It's been written that some players, even entire teams, would arrive early just to have the opportunity to soak it all in. Many even claimed that the mystique gave the Yankees an edge, and I believe that it did.

I once read (and I wish that I could recall where) that during the introductions of the Pittsburgh Pirates before game one of the 1927 World Series that some of the Pirates actually wet their pants waiting for their names to be called. Whether this is true or not, it demonstrates the real meaning of home field advantage, especially at Yankee Stadium.

Then there's the more recent story (my memory seems to have taken a vacation at 60) when Posada, I believe, told a new player when things were looking bad for the Yankees in a series game, "The ghosts haven't arrived yet." It wasn't long after he made that statement that they won in dramatic fashion.

I don't believe the ghost stories any more than the rest of you, but it's that mystique that gave them an edge, sort of like the Curse of the Bambino. I was sorry to see that go, because I used to have a lot of fun with it. There were Red Sox fans who actually searched for a piano that Babe Ruth allegedly threw into a pond once, thinking that if they retrieved it from the bottom of the pond that the curse would be broken. This I actually read in the paper. You can't beat that for a superstition.

I have thought hard to find a reason why I'm not real excited about NYS, and I believe that I have found the answer. Deep down inside I hold a grudge. This may sound childish, but I blame NYS for what's about to happen to OYS.

[jimmyjimjimz]

Two days ago when the Yankees tied the Dodgers for the best record in baseball, OYS would've shook its foundation.


Yeah, obviously. The foundation is 86 years old. Old foundation usually shakes when there's a lot of people jumping up and down.



Now that I think about it, "Nathan's HOT DOG Stadium" might be a more suitable name for it.


Why would they name Yankee Stadium after a hot dog? That makes no sense. And even if they did name it after Nathan's, I don't know if you know this, but, Nathan's is a Brooklyn company. Why would they name a stadium in The Bronx after a company founded in Brooklyn? That doesn't make much sense.

[RationalNYYfan]

JJJ you misinterpret EVERYTHING

[voodoochile]

Yeah, obviously. The foundation is 86 years old. Old foundation usually shakes when there's a lot of people jumping up and down.






Why would they name Yankee Stadium after a hot dog? That makes no sense. And even if they did name it after Nathan's, I don't know if you know this, but, Nathan's is a Brooklyn company. Why would they name a stadium in The Bronx after a company founded in Brooklyn? That doesn't make much sense.

Sorry fella's, but I was gonna' let it slide, but after reading the hot dog response I just couldn't contain myself.


JJJ, the term "shook the foundation" is merely a figure of speech, meaning that the crowd was so pleased at what had just occured that they were beside themselves (check that) so overcome with emotion that the energy they produced seemed like they were shaking the foundation. I'm sure you've been there when the crowd was so excited that the upper deck vibrated a little.

Regarding Nathan's HOT DOG Stadium, how can you possibly know so much about Nathan's and not have a clue in regards to sponsorship? Is Citi Bank's headquarters in Flushing? I'm not certain that Citi Bank even has an office in Flushing, yet there's a stadium called Citi Field there.

I've read your posts on many threads over the past few months, and I personally believe that you're sitting back laughing like hell at us all. But I'm a nice guy and will give you the benefit of the doubt simply because I admire your approach, and enjoy a good laugh myself, even at the expense of others. No harm, no foul, as they say. (Leave it alone.)

My context of HOT DOG was to use it as someone who shows off, as when a ballplayer makes a diving catch when he didn't really need to dive. He's considered hot dogging it, or being a hot dog.

Although Nathan's is a Brooklyn based company, there is nothing to prevent them from sponsoring Yankee Stadium if they wish to do so. If they made a deal, then they would pay the Yankees big bucks to promote themselves by naming the stadium after their company. The name "NATHAN'S" would be in big green letters where "YANKEE STADIUM" is now. Since I feel that NYS is more of a showcase that anything else, and if Nathan's sponsored them, in my opinion I believe that "NATHAN'S HOT DOG STADIUM" would be a perfect name for the ballpark. Get it? Showcase, hot dog?

[Mike Wagner]

Dear voodoochile,

I will ALWAYS have a deep love and respect for the original Yankee Stadium. It's the most historic baseball stadium in the game's history, as well as in the soul of America because it has witnessed so many other non-baseball and non-sporting events.

The new Yankee Stadium can do so as well. I do hope that as time goes on, we will all embrace the new Stadium in our hearts as we have the original.

I firmly believe part of the reason would come about based on the treatment of the fans by the Yankee organization. It hasn't been sounding too great from the posts I've read. Loyalty, love, and respect in life should be a two-way street. When you take your supportive fans for granted and don't treat them right, many will abandon you - and rightfully so.

I also firmly believe the Yankee organization &/or the City of New York should be deeply ASHAMED and EMBARRASSED for not wanting to save Gate 2 of the original Yankee Stadium. Yankee Stadium is a major part of what has given the Yankees the mystique and fan base over the course of its life. Of course, the many great names that have put on the sacred pinstripes are also a major source of that great history. They go hand in hand.

The original Yankee Stadium has had its time in the sun. The same will be true of the new Yankee Stadium. However, to deny the saving of a portion of the old Yankee Stadium will be a huge hole in the soul of the new Yankee Stadium. Many loyal fans will NOT forget or forgive the Yankees and the city for allowing such a miscarriage of common decency to occur.

Fans will look at the land where the original Yankee Stadium proudly stood, and they will not understand why none of the original structure has been allowed to stand to be visited by millions of current and future baseball fans.
That will be the hole in the soul of the new Yankee Stadium. It will be a question that will forever be asked, and there will be no satisfactory answer- because there is none. There's no excuse whatsoever!!!!!!!!

To save Gate 2 of the old Yankee Stadium will lead to positive feelings for the Yankee organization and City of New York. I believe that is where much of your grudge lies, voodoochile. And, I can't blame you. To save Gate 2 would, I believe, soothe much of the ill feelings of many people I've read on Baseball Fever.

The original Yankee Stadium is a major source of the roots of our love for the team. To totally destroy the whole sacred structure and leave nothing standing will alienate many Yankee fans - and rightfully so.

To save Gate 2 will show that the Yankees &/or the City of New York might actually give a damn about the fans who have supported the team for so many years. It would also help heal the wound of losing our beloved original Yankee Stadium. To visit Gate 2 before or after a ballgame would be something to look forward to. To have nothing to visit on the site of the original Stadium will leave a void in our hearts and souls that will never heal.
And, it will harm our feelings towards the Yankees and the City.

-Mike Wagner

[Mike Wagner]

Dear voodoochile,

I forgot to mention that the grudge you feel, and no doubt many Yankee fans, are because we feel betrayed by the Yankee organization. It could be because of the loss of the old Yankee Stadium, exhorbitant cost of food and certain tickets, the attitude of Yankee management, and other reasons.

Most anything can be worked out or fixed to the satisfaction of both sides. It's always best when both sides work together to reconcile differences. Once trust is lost, it can be impossible, or nearly impossible to earn back.

From the posts I've read on numerous Baseball Fever sites, I truly hope the Yankees gain back the trust and respect of previous Yankee owners.

-Mike Wagner

[voodoochile]

Mike,

I know precisely why I hold a grudge, and a reconciliation is impossible. Like you said, both parties need to work it out, however, one party has closed and locked the doors to any discussion.

Yankee Stadium was numbered long before any of us knew that a new stadium was even in the making. There was no board meetings, upper management discussions or power lunches regarding the disposition of Yankee Stadium. When the deal was made to build a new ballpark, it was assumed what would become of the old ballpark. Why treat it any different than the other stadiums that were left crumbled in a heap? These people are financial wizards. They have no time to play around with an old, unused ballpark. When they play golf, they do business. When they go sailing, they do business. Historical significance, landmark, baseball shrine? It will turn a larger profit dismantled piece by piece. In fact, it may even surpass in profits the 10.5 million dollars that it cost to construct it in 1923. Any thought to retain it, or any portions of it, more than likely flashed in their minds, then quickly vanished when the negative cash flow alarm triggered. They can't help it, because that's the way they operate. We have absolutely nothing in common with them, especially our thought process. Everything that they do must generate a cash flow, or they don't do it. They would never understand the reasons why we would want Yankee Stadium retained. Never.

- Eddie

[Mike Wagner]

Dear Eddie,

The money wizards may run the world, but they can ruin it as well. It takes just one GREEDY Madoff to screw up countless lives. To look at money only is wrong, as untold unemployed and struggling people can tell you. How much money and power is enough to make them happy?

I fail to see how saving a slice of Yankee Stadium will be negative with regard to cash flow or anything else. Visitors in the area will want to see the sacred wall. They will walk the area and spend money in local restaurants and souvenir shops.

Communication is a teriffic way to avoid grudges and resentment. We who want to save Gate 2 are not necessarily living in the past. We respect the past and the greatness the original Yankee Stadium has witnessed. The new Yankee Stadium has a proud history to look forward to, with many pennants and World Series yet to be won.

The New York Yankees are the New York Yankees, just as Disney is Disney, and Colonial Williamsburg is Colonial Williamsburg. Each is noted, loved, and respected for a particular niche in life.

For the current Yankee management &/or NYC to completely level old Yankee Stadium and leave nothing standing, will alienate many people, myself included. We're not asking for much. If the Yankees and NYC prove to have so little regard for baseball fans by not saving Gate 2 and the proud heritage of old Yankee Stadium, then they will have totally spit in the face of the Yankee legends who made the New York Yankees the New York Yankees. They will also spit in the face of George Steinbrenner.

In 1973, then Yankee president, Michael Burke said, when the Yankees almost left the city, "You don't just pick up the team and leave the city because of a few dollar signs. What sets a baseball team apart from, say, a dry-cleaning business is that particular nature of a ball club. You're a citizen of the city with civic responsibilities. If you have any sense of this city, you have a committment."

After proudly purchasing the Yankees with others in 1973, George Steinbrenner stated, "The Yankees are important to New York, but they're also especially important to baseball and to the whole nation. The Yankees are baseball. They're as American an apple pie. There are still great things about the past that are worth going back to and grabbing into the present. I think that's so with the Yankees."

The Yankees deserve great accolades for staying in New York. They also deserve great respect and applause for their winning ways. While I didn't vote for the new Stadium, I only want what's best for the Yankees and our new home. Saving Gate 2 would complete the circle of respecting the past, then stepping across the street to the present and future.

I understand everyone is in business to make money. But, money isn't everything. To have a heart, and save a part of the original, historic home of the Yankees will only be beneficial for the team and the city. To leave nothing of it standing will bring such negative publicity to the Yankees and the city that not even the best public relations firm in the world can put a positive spin on it.

Eddie, I wish the best for the Yankees and the new Stadium. As a Yankee fan and one who loves the old Stadium and its proud history, I'm hoping the power brokers have enough heart and enough respect for the old Stadium and baseball fans to keep Gate 2 up forever. Respect and loyalty are a two-way street.

I think the bottom line is that we're all so fed up with those with money and power not normally giving a damn about the average Joe and his feelings, wants, and needs. We ask for what we believe is something reasonable, and usually get shot down. We're tired. We just want to see them do what is fair and right. This is one of those times.

-Mike

[RationalNYYfan]

Very well said. I can't help but notice how the words of Michael Burke really only apply to the team's location. Besides being nice enough to only move the Yankees across the street (instead of in NJ), all other loyalty or respect of the team's past is forsaken if it means more money.

[voodoochile]

We can go back and forth with this for years, Mike, and we can petition the Yankees to retain Gate 2, the flagpole or even a urinal, but I believe that their plans are already set in stone.

There may be a surprise in store for us, however. They appear to be tight lipped about anything and everything, but maybe there is one person among them who is compassionate, though I'm not counting on it, who has enough muscle to pull something off. As it stands, as per George's statement at the televised unvieling of NYS, "The old Yankee Stadium will be retained", or words to that effect. What he really meant to say was, "We will retain the playing field, after we tear it up and sell it." Thank you, Mr. Steinbrenner. You are leaving us with something that you cannot possibly sell. The earth. The foundation OF the playing field. What a guy.

I had posted something somewhere a couple of years ago in regards to preserving land as an historical site, and these particular parcels of land, many of which retained the structures that pertained to the history of such land, all have two things in common. They all make up an area of at least five square miles along with a staggering loss of life.

The first that comes to mind are Gettysburg, Valley Forge and Little Big Horn. There are many others, but while Gettysburg and Valley Forge are linked to the birth of this country, the slaughter at Little Big Horn was the result of an overly enthusiastic General Custer who rode blindly into an Indian encampment of 5,000 battle veterans. Little Big Horn National Monument and Battlefield encompasses roughly 50 square miles, and we can't get one square block.

Custer was no hero. Babe Ruth was a hero. Had Custer first peeked over the ridge and saw 5,000 indians, he would've split. He may have had controversy associated with his name for life, but he would have lived. A 50 square mile historical site for being stupid, and we can't get enough ground to make a sandbox.

My point is that land is preserved and made an historical site if it meets a certain criteria; death. If we had known this going in, I'm sure Trot Nixon wouldn't have been missed. I may be a little off base here, but I'm really fed up with executives, whether it be in baseball, enployment, law enforcement, merchants, all of them. They don't need to sit down and think about where all their money is coming from. They know, but they don't really give a s--t.

As far as I'm concerned, if Yankee management does not offer a substantial compromise, such as retaining Gate 2, or something of equal prominence, they can roll up the blueprints for their "Heritage Field" and establish a new entry point that is currently an exit only.

That's my opinion, and I'm sticking with it. Feel free to beat the hell out of it if you like.

[Mike Wagner]

Dear Eddie,

I can't argue with you because I'm in full agreement with you. Business executives SHOULD realize that we all live on the same planet, and that some things DO matter more than just the bottom line ($$$$$$).

In my research in my book about the Renovation of Yankee Stadium, I've had the HONOR of contacting such individuals. They did not know me from a hole in the wall, but they sent me information that was of great help, sent me &/or e-mails, and one wonderful gentleman even wrote a small section pertaining to his company, as he could tell I was confused about the construction process of his company. THESE ARE EXECUTIVES/PRESIDENTS OF COMPANIES THAT SHOULD BE EMULATED BY EVERY COMPANY IN THE WORLD!!!!!!!! They didn't know me, but kindly helped me, even though they are truly busy people. The result is that they have earned my love, respect, and the fact that I would do anything to help them if needed. I firmly believe in a two-way street. Their kindnesses will NEVER be forgotten!!!!!!!

Another great leader is Jorge Munoz. I just saw this on Yahoo! Mr. Munoz is a bus driver who for the past 4 years has delivered food to homeless people at the Roosevelt Avenue/Jackson Heights train station - to the tune of 70,000 meals all told!!!!! GOD BLESS HIM AND HIS FAMILY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! He spends half of his $700. salary doing this - buying food and supplies, and getting food donations (www.anangelinqueens.com). He's also on youtube.

These are the kinds of people that should be in charge of companies!!!!!!!!! They have wonderful hearts and souls. A profit and the almighty dollar are good up to a point. But, you can still have tons of money and still feel empty inside. More money won't cure the emptiness. Helping other people less fortunate than you, or doing the right thing (in this case, Saving Gate 2), has only positive ramifications for those in charge, those receiving such kindnesses, and as a society as a whole. The above are wonderful examples of how business executives/leaders are/should be. We must help each other.

Baseball has been America's sport since 1839. We grew up idolizing and imitating so many of our heroes. Growing up in West Hempstead, Long Island, NY, I ALWAYS chose the Yankees in stickball/baseball/softball games. The Yankees were ALWAYS my sacred heroes, playing in sacred Yankee Stadium.

Should the quest to save Gate 2 fail, the Yankees and NYC will NEVER live it down through eternity!!!!! The reasons are that there is not reasonable excuse for such an action, baseball fans through current and future generations will ask "Why? did they let such a tragedy occur?" and there's no reasonable explanation or excuse to hold water for such a terrible event.

What happens is up to those who hold the power and money. All we can do is hope to God that they also have a deep sense of what baseball has meant to generations of people (themselves included). They should also realize that Yankee Stadium is as sacred as the hallowed Civil War and other battlefields you've mentioned, and that to totally destroy such a sacred site will leave a scar upon the Yankees and the city, as Gate 2 is still standing. No matter what the plans say, it's still proudly standing. Just as changes are made to new buildings when it's necessary, the same would apply here.

We are just honest people who are fighting for what's right, fair, and just. No, Eddie, I can't argue with you because you're right. Look at Mr. Jorge Munoz. He deserves to be a leader because of his love for people, and what he's doing to help his fellow people. He's a role model for ANY executive - or any human being for that matter, Eddie. Let's hope those in charge of the New York Yankees and New York City come close to being the esteemed leader that Mr. Munoz is!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

-Mike Wagner

[Mike Wagner]

I gave the wrong web site for Jorge Munoz. It should be
www.anangelinqueens.org not com. I apologize for this error.

-Mike Wagner

[stadiumbuilder]

If I had Gates or Buffet kind of money, I would make the city an offer they couldn't refuse for what's left of the stadium and build it back exactly as it was in the early '70's minus the asbestos. Bliss for some and a worst case nightmare scernario for others, but what a project! Wooden seats, copper frieze and a very expensive rental for whoever wanted to play baseball there. Head to head with the new place as a tourist attraction. And I'd sell concessions at a 50-100% markup, saving patrons on their way to a Yankee game a bundle. Now I've got to go wake up and get back to work...

[jimmyjimjimz]

If I had Gates or Buffet kind of money, I would make the city an offer they couldn't refuse for what's left of the stadium and build it back exactly as it was in the early '70's minus the asbestos. Bliss for some and a worst case nightmare scernario for others, but what a project! Wooden seats, copper frieze and a very expensive rental for whoever wanted to play baseball there. Head to head with the new place as a tourist attraction. And I'd sell concessions at a 50-100% markup, saving patrons on their way to a Yankee game a bundle. Now I've got to go wake up and get back to work...

where would you put the park land that the team owes?

[Mike Wagner]

Dear stadiumbuilder,

That sounds great to me, too. But, what about Macombs Dam Park II? The people in the area were promised a nice park. That promise should be kept.
Or, is there a very blighted area that should be turned into a nice park that they deserve?

-Mike

[stadiumbuilder]

You gotta read between the lines "make the city an offer they can't refuse". If somebody else wants parkland that bad they can go earn their own $50 billion and out-bribe me.

[RationalNYYfan]

If I had Gates or Buffet kind of money, I would make the city an offer they couldn't refuse for what's left of the stadium and build it back exactly as it was in the early '70's minus the asbestos. Bliss for some and a worst case nightmare scernario for others, but what a project! Wooden seats, copper frieze and a very expensive rental for whoever wanted to play baseball there. Head to head with the new place as a tourist attraction. And I'd sell concessions at a 50-100% markup, saving patrons on their way to a Yankee game a bundle. Now I've got to go wake up and get back to work...

If I grow up to be a billionaire (or maybe trillionaire depending on how crappy our dollar will become after our current fiasco!) I will buy New Yankee Stadium or perhaps the entire organization myself and I'll fix all the crap that's wrong with our current stadium on my own dime. All it takes is some compassion and willingness to take history over profit!

[Yankee4life]

I've had a similar fantasy. They could use the billions I'd pay them to find other traditional parkland, and I'd make the restored (I'd shoot for circa 1960) YS a community facility. We could host kids' sports camps on the field in the summer, have weight rooms, meeting rooms, even overnight accommodations for overnight campers. We wouldn't try to compete with NYS, but we could have retro baseball games, HS and college football, and maybe even a Giants preseason game. Bottom line: both missions could be accomplished. The community would get its "parkland" and an historic masterpiece would be preserved. Now if I could only find those billions...

[voodoochile]

I believe that the parkland in question is land to be used for the immediate neighborhood, which narrows it down to an area in the vicinity of Yankee Stadium(s). Laying artificial turf on the roof of a parking structure with hoops at either end does not justify a basketball court, let alone a park.

There are only two locations that are adequate in size, and meet the needs and reqirements of the neighborhood that are worthy of a park. However, there are baseball stadiums sitting on both of them.

By virtue of "squaters rights", "eminent domain", or "I was here first", new Yankee Stadium has got to go.

[Gary Dunaier]

new Yankee Stadium has got to go.

It can't go! I ain't et at NYY Steak yet!

[jimmyjimjimz]

I've had a similar fantasy. They could use the billions I'd pay them to find other traditional parkland, and I'd make the restored (I'd shoot for circa 1960) YS a community facility. We could host kids' sports camps on the field in the summer, have weight rooms, meeting rooms, even overnight accommodations for overnight campers. We wouldn't try to compete with NYS, but we could have retro baseball games, HS and college football, and maybe even a Giants preseason game. Bottom line: both missions could be accomplished. The community would get its "parkland" and an historic masterpiece would be preserved. Now if I could only find those billions...


no one wants to watch a sporting event with a pole in front of them these days. That's why they took those stupid poles out in the 70's, and why they didn't put them in the new stadium, and why no other new stadiums have them. The only people who like them, for some reason, are Cubs fans and people from Boston, like Susan Waldman.


It can't go! I ain't et at NYY Steak yet!


Once again, I don't know if it's the age gap or whatever, but I don't understand what that means.

[Mattingly85MVP]

no one wants to watch a sporting event with a pole in front of them these days. That's why they took those stupid poles out in the 70's, and why they didn't put them in the new stadium, and why no other new stadiums have them.

US Cell has them in the upper deck, and they put them there during their recent renovations to make the place look better than what they originally did- looks a million times better

[Paul W]

franchises don't do what the sox did for esthetics, they do it for the MONEY...
they removed cheaper seats sold day-of-game to achieve the "fenway effect" - smaller capacity = more advanced sale with fees attached.
you don't see them taking away more expensive seats with marginal sight-lines, do 'ya? the more you pay the more you get. what the sox did was not as embarrassing as what the a's did at the mausoleum.
did the franchise pay for the changes or did the illinois taxpayers? bet i know.

back in the 50's yankee front-office people (two of which i'm intimately associated with) used to say "...never had any problems selling world series seats behind poles..." see newspaper clip

good clubs never had that problem...

btw - those "stupid" poles allowed the upper/cheaper seating to be closer than the current parks, see - tiger stadium.

[locke40]

franchises don't do what the sox did for esthetics, they do it for the MONEY...
they removed cheaper seats sold day-of-game to achieve the "fenway effect" - smaller capacity = more advanced sale. you don't see them taking away more expensive seats with marginal sight-lines, do 'ya? the more you pay the more you get.

back in the 50's yankee front-office people (two of which i'm intimately associated with) used to say "...never had any problems selling world series seats behind poles..." see newspaper clip

good clubs never had that problem...

btw - those "stupid" poles allowed the upper/cheaper seating to be closer than the current parks, see - tiger stadium.

I laugh at people who criticize support columns; they simply do not understand the mechanics of the game of baseball. It's not like you are watching a movie where seeing the whole thing uninterrupted is vital to the enjoyment the show; baseball is simply different. Going to a game for 2-3 hours is more about the atmosphere; I can guarantee that no one is going to a game and watching every single second of the entire field of play, without blinking or diverting their attention. If you sit behind a support column, you probably will be able to see about 95% of the actual playing field, with a sway to the left or right to see the other 5%. This is a minor inconvenience; very, very, very minor compared to the benefits of sitting right on top of the action.

According to some unofficial study done a few years ago by Rick Reilly, the ball is in play, on average, 12 minutes per game. So, modern architects decided to place the middle and upper levels ridiculously far away and removed from the action, so people can see a few seconds of actual baseball action? I honestly don't care in the least bit if I can see Jeter going back on a pop-fly, but then missing him actually catch the ball because it happened behind a column; I will know he caught it because of the crowd reaction, or I can watch the replay on the scoreboard two seconds later. Why push thousands of people far away from the action, making them non-factors when it comes to home-field advantage, for the potential to miss a few seconds of action?

If I ever find myself in the position to design a baseball stadium/park/field or whatever, you know that I am using support columns, even if to simply put a roof over the stands. That's another thing missing from many (if not all) modern stadiums: a large imposing roof to cover the fans from the brutal summer sun, or the occasional rain showers. The architects of yester-year were so much smarter, and had better forethought than these new crop of architects, even with all our fancy technology and internets.

[stadiumbuilder]

And I have to add, again, as a kid on a very limited budget, I never had to sit anywhere near a support column, they simply weren't a factor. I'm not advocating their use in modern architecture, but they just weren't the big deal they were made out to be. The Yankees used that as a selling point for getting a renovation, but they also claimed the concrete decks were degrading which was absolutely untrue. The team and the front office needed the renovation more than the stadium did. They talked about crumbling concrete, but if there had been any, I would have picked it up and brought it home with me. After more years without a pennant than they were used to, some kind of a change, anything, was welcome.

[tugger]

btw - those "stupid" poles allowed the upper/cheaper seating to be closer than the current parks, see - tiger stadium.

Ever sit in the back half of the lower level at Tiger? Was like watching the game through a mail slot.

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_zjgdh5BlcWQ/SRJg1D9EP8I/AAAAAAAAADA/V81L5NSTKNk/s400/Stainless+steel+mail+slot+cover.JPG

[Gylmar]

Ever sit in the back half of the lower level at Tiger? Was like watching the game through a mail slot.

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_zjgdh5BlcWQ/SRJg1D9EP8I/AAAAAAAAADA/V81L5NSTKNk/s400/Stainless+steel+mail+slot+cover.JPG

I did many times, the crowd reaction was how you knew that a homerun was hit into the upper deck. You would see the ball go up and never come back down! :laugh

[Mario Mendoza...HOF Lock]

And can I get a bowl of tofu and an umbrella drink while I'm watching the game without poles. :rolleyes:

The cost of watching a game in an old stadium sometimes is poles. If you don't like the poles, sit in the front rows, watch on TV or better yet, go play golf. It's not likely you'll be missed at the park, either by the other REAL fans or the poles.

And yes, I go on record as saying they should have left the poles at RYS. 60's & 70's "modernism" for the most part sucked.

[voodoochile]

It can't go! I ain't et at NYY Steak yet!


Gary,

If you are referring to what I think you are, which is the $15.00 steak sandwhich, you definetely have to bite the hell out of one of those babies. If someone hadn't refered it to me I would've let it ride because of the price, but DAMN that thing was good, and the horseradish is killer. Get two and eat one for me.

[voodoochile]

This debate about OYS vs RYS vs NYS is putting some undue pressure on some people, I for one. They shoulda' done this, or they shoulda' done that. The new place sucks, the old place sucks. But I think that I may have figured out why some like NYS and dislike OYS/RYS, and vice versa.

It's no different than anything else that is part of our everyday routine. Check it out. I don't own a cell phone or an iPod. I still don't know what an MP3 player is, and I don't care. I hate computers, and if I hadn't set mine up to the point that it's too difficult to go back before I owned it, I'd blow it up. I have three cars, but the one I drive is the 1967 Camaro that my Father purchased new in '67. I dislike NYS, wasn't real thrilled about RYS, but I loved OYS.

Without even thinking, you should be able to determine how old I am within a couple of years. With that said, I would venture to say that those of you who match at least half of what I just disclosed about myself are at least 45 years old, and would just as well watch a ballgame in Old Yankee Stadium, and I mean before the renovation. Prior to 45 years old you probably lean towards RYS, and if you are in your 20's you like the new place.

Now this isn't the final word by any means, but only a theory that has yet to be tested, but I will tell you this. My Daughter is 27 years old and she likes RYS, and I believe it's because she has never seen OYS.

Just out of curiosity, I'd like to hear which stadium you guys like along with your age group, for instance, young, middle aged or older, if you don't want to disclose it. I could be wrong, but I don't think so. It will be interesting to find out.

[SparkyL]

Folks,

I agree with all of you, but we have taken this thread seriously off-topic.

May I suggest that we continue this discussion on the "Outrage over NYS thread"?

http://baseball-fever.com/showthread.php?t=90037&page=27

[Mike Wagner]

Dear voodoochile,

I'm 54 years old. I tend to go through mentalpause, so my memory isn't always the best.

But, I certainly prefer old Yankee Stadium before the renovation. I remember the unique characteristics of the monuments in center field, of course the gorgeous, imposing frieze tha no other stadium had, and the huge field.

Entering the stands from the concourse, my breath was always taken away by the beauty of the green grass that suddenly appeared out of nowhere.

I always felt so at home and comfortable at the Stadium. I always liked the "Buy DiNoto's Bread and Rolls" sign on the apartments in right field.

I still enjoyed the renovated Stadium, but cherished the original one with all of its wonderful character and history.

My favorite games were the Old Timers games where I could see Joe, Mickey, Yogi, Whitey, and others play. I remember Mickey hitting a home run in an Old Timers Day game to left field.

I cannot comment on the new Yankee Stadium, as I haven't been there. I leave that up to the people who have gone.

-Mike Wagner

[Lpeters199]

Response to Voodoochile:

I'm 63 years old, and OYS was best before the 1967 paint job. The mint green seat color and the weathered copper frieze could never have been improved on. I was there once, for the second All-Star game in 1960. The stadium then was nothing short of majestic.

[locke40]

I am 25 years old, and I prefer the pre-renovated Stadium before the white wash that Lpeters199 spoke about. Even though I was never physically in OYS, I feel like I have been there a million times.

[Gary Dunaier]

I cannot comment on the new Yankee Stadium, as I haven't been there. I leave that up to the people who have gone.

The New Yankee Stadium Is A Palace. It Has Everything A Modern Baseball Fan Could Ever Want In A Ballpark. It Is By Far And Away The Greatest Athletic Facility Venue In The United States Of America And The Whole World And Is Far Superior To The Crumbling Ruin Where The Yankees Used To Play. Good Riddance To The Old Yankee Stadium And Welcome To The Bronx Heritage Field Which Will Be A Major Asset To The Community More Than Macombs Dam Park Ever Was.

:crazy

Yes, I have been drinking the Steinbrenners' "Kool Aid," as a matter of fact... quite a bit of it, actually... why, did anyone else want some? :waving

[tugger]

The New Yankee Stadium Is A Palace. It Has Everything A Modern Baseball Fan Could Ever Want In A Ballpark. It Is By Far And Away The Greatest Athletic Facility Venue In The United States Of America And The Whole World And Is Far Superior To The Crumbling Ruin Where The Yankees Used To Play. Good Riddance To The Old Yankee Stadium And Welcome To The Bronx Heritage Field Which Will Be A Major Asset To The Community More Than Macombs Dam Park Ever Was.


Raymond Shaw is the bravest, kindest, warmest, most wonderful human being I've ever known in my life.

[the stadium guy]

My favorite games were the Old Timers games where I could see Joe, Mickey, Yogi, Whitey, and others play. I remember Mickey hitting a home run in an Old Timers Day game to left field.


-Mike Wagner

Hi Mike,

Was that the 1973 Old Timer's game? I was there too, and I remember it like it was yesterday. Whitey pitching to Mickey, Mick pulls one foul down the left field line, Mel Allen (announcing the game) says "Straighten it out, Mick"...and wouldn't you know it...he sends the next pitch into the left field seats for a home run...it was the only homer I ever saw Mickey hit in person!

Brad

[Mike Wagner]

Dear Brad,

I believe it was 1971, 1972, or 1973. Somewhere I have a NY Daily News photo of it. I sent it to Mickey and he signed it. On the back of the photo it has the year. I don't remember the exact year. It probably is what you're thinking.

I also followed Joe DiMaggio out of an Old Timers Day game in that time period. He signed for me and the others that were there. I remember he also refused to sign for Mead Chasky, as Joe said he already signed for him. I also got Mickey's autograph, as well as numerous others. Mickey was wearing some sort of cowboy type brown vest. I believe Tom Catal was driving the sportscar that Mickey went into.

One thing I truly love about those days is that our baseball heroes were very accessible. That made us feel so close to them.

-Mike

[ChineseDemocracy]

Response to Voodoochile:

I'm 63 years old, and OYS was best before the 1967 paint job. The mint green seat color and the weathered copper frieze could never have been improved on. I was there once, for the second All-Star game in 1960. The stadium then was nothing short of majestic.

Topping money green. I wonder if I can find that exact shade of green in a paint store? I would love to trim my walls with that color.

Green seats, green frieze, and a green structure on the inside. It worked quite well for Yankee Stadium.

[locke40]

Topping money green. I wonder if I can find that exact shade of green in a paint store? I would love to trim my walls with that color.

Green seats, green frieze, and a green structure on the inside. It worked quite well for Yankee Stadium.

I always thought the pinstripes really stood out against the green of the old Stadium. Not to mention, it was the very color of the Statue of Liberty. The old Stadium was very American, and also very New York.

That's funny that you should bring up painting the trimming of your walls that gorgeous green color. When I walk to work in the morning, downtown near the East Village, I always say to myself that the fire escapes, the window decorations, and the crowning of the old buildings would look much better if they were painted that sea foam green (or Topping money green, as you refer to it) of the OYS.

[Bobby_Ayala]

I laugh at people who criticize support columns; they simply do not understand the mechanics of the game of baseball. It's not like you are watching a movie where seeing the whole thing uninterrupted is vital to the enjoyment the show; baseball is simply different. Going to a game for 2-3 hours is more about the atmosphere; I can guarantee that no one is going to a game and watching every single second of the entire field of play, without blinking or diverting their attention. If you sit behind a support column, you probably will be able to see about 95% of the actual playing field, with a sway to the left or right to see the other 5%. This is a minor inconvenience; very, very, very minor compared to the benefits of sitting right on top of the action.

According to some unofficial study done a few years ago by Rick Reilly, the ball is in play, on average, 12 minutes per game. So, modern architects decided to place the middle and upper levels ridiculously far away and removed from the action, so people can see a few seconds of actual baseball action? I honestly don't care in the least bit if I can see Jeter going back on a pop-fly, but then missing him actually catch the ball because it happened behind a column; I will know he caught it because of the crowd reaction, or I can watch the replay on the scoreboard two seconds later. Why push thousands of people far away from the action, making them non-factors when it comes to home-field advantage, for the potential to miss a few seconds of action?

If I ever find myself in the position to design a baseball stadium/park/field or whatever, you know that I am using support columns, even if to simply put a roof over the stands. That's another thing missing from many (if not all) modern stadiums: a large imposing roof to cover the fans from the brutal summer sun, or the occasional rain showers. The architects of yester-year were so much smarter, and had better forethought than these new crop of architects, even with all our fancy technology and internets.
Munhak Baseball Stadium in South Korea has a large roof with no view-obstructing support columns.
http://static.panoramio.com/photos/original/8125980.jpg

[locke40]

Munhak Baseball Stadium in South Korea has a large roof with no view-obstructing support columns.
http://static.panoramio.com/photos/original/8125980.jpg

That looks kind of weird, in my opinion. Support columns give photographs a nice perspective on how far the decks are, or in the above example, how far out that roof really extends.

But, I will agree with you that the NYS would look a lot better with a roof like Munhak Baseball Stadium in South Korea. That cheap frieze would at least hang over the field.

[Gehrig27]

I too love the old Topping green. The seat piece I have has a pretty decent sample on it and I keep saying that I'm going to get it matched at a paint store; It really was the perfect compliment to Yankee Stadium and the team in general. I often wonder how fans today would've reacted to that color in the new stadium (probably poorly).

[ChineseDemocracy]

I too love the old Topping green. The seat piece I have has a pretty decent sample on it and I keep saying that I'm going to get it matched at a paint store; It really was the perfect compliment to Yankee Stadium and the team in general. I often wonder how fans today would've reacted to that color in the new stadium (probably poorly).

They would figure the Yanks were copying the Red Sox and cry foul. Then the Sox fans would have something else to talk about...

[Mygirljess]

Hi Mike,

Was that the 1973 Old Timer's game? I was there too, and I remember it like it was yesterday. Whitey pitching to Mickey, Mick pulls one foul down the left field line, Mel Allen (announcing the game) says "Straighten it out, Mick"...and wouldn't you know it...he sends the next pitch into the left field seats for a home run...it was the only homer I ever saw Mickey hit in person!

Brad

I was at that game too! I remember seeing Mickey Mantle hit a home run in Yankee Stadium in that Old Timer's Game, though I never actually saw him play in a real game. I don't know for sure what year but I'm guessing 1972. My grandfather said he was the best player ever. But my Dad said DiMaggio was the best (kind of confusing). I said what about Willie Mays? They said no way, but I know they were prejudiced. Not against blacks, but against any player that was not a Yankee!

[enigma4289]

Munhak Baseball Stadium in South Korea has a large roof with no view-obstructing support columns.
http://static.panoramio.com/photos/original/8125980.jpg

Actually Munhak does have obstructing support columns.
http://static.panoramio.com/photos/original/22946695.jpg

[scooterfan]

Hi Mike,

Was that the 1973 Old Timer's game? I was there too, and I remember it like it was yesterday. Whitey pitching to Mickey, Mick pulls one foul down the left field line, Mel Allen (announcing the game) says "Straighten it out, Mick"...and wouldn't you know it...he sends the next pitch into the left field seats for a home run...it was the only homer I ever saw Mickey hit in person!

Brad

Is that true about Mel Allen emceeing Old Timers Day in 1973? Mel returned to Yankee Stadium for the first time since his firing on Mickey Mantle Day in 1969. Anyone remember his next official appearance at the stadium?

[Mike Wagner]

Dear Mygirljess,

In researching my book about the renovation and history of Yankee Stadium, Ihere is a portion of the book that may clarify your confusion. I guess Pete Sheehy, the long time clubhouse man for the Yankees, would know. He's seen them all.

-Mike Wagner



While Pete Sheehy enjoyed Babe Ruth, he loved Lou Gehrig. The Babe would frequently ask Pete to get him a “bi,” short for bicarbonate. “The Babe was a big, lovable fellow – always a kid. The Babe never had a uniform fitted in his life. He had to take it right off the shelf.” As for Lou Gehrig, Pete said, “What a sweet man he was. He became one of my best friends, a quiet gentle fellow, no conceit, no bombast at all.”

“DiMaggio was a shy man.” Joe DiMaggio would always have the trusted Sheehy get him a “Cup of coffee, Pete, but only half a cup.” Pete said that of all the players, DiMaggio was the most perfect. “DiMaggio never made a mental mistake, he was the greatest all-around player of them all. I rate him with the greatest.”

“No man ever swung a bat with more power,” was his assessment of Mickey Mantle. “He was a powerful man. Too bad he didn’t have stronger legs.”

Whether getting coffee, Coca Cola, more boxes of baseballs to autograph, picking up clothes the players dropped on the floor, polishing shoes, or washing and hanging up uniforms, Pete was there. Of the famous pinstripes, Sheehy once said, “I think it’s a beautiful uniform. It’s conservative, but it’s beautiful. I don’t know. It does something to you.” While he was mostly in the clubhouse during the games, he said, “I sneak out for an inning or two, but it’s before and after the games that I get to see the players most. And that’s when you really get to know them.”

[RationalNYYfan]

I'm looking at some OYS pictures right now...was the entire park open concourse?

[ol' aches and pains]

Raymond Shaw is the bravest, kindest, warmest, most wonderful human being I've ever known in my life.

Why don't you pass the time by playing a little Solitaire? :waving

[SparkyL]

I too love the old Topping green. The seat piece I have has a pretty decent sample on it and I keep saying that I'm going to get it matched at a paint store; It really was the perfect compliment to Yankee Stadium and the team in general. I often wonder how fans today would've reacted to that color in the new stadium (probably poorly).

Topping money green. I wonder if I can find that exact shade of green in a paint store? I would love to trim my walls with that color.

Green seats, green frieze, and a green structure on the inside. It worked quite well for Yankee Stadium.

Color match found: Benjamin Moore Lehigh Green, #HC-131

[voodoochile]

Well, my suspicions in regards to the older generation (the baby boomers) favoring the OYS appears to pan out. Mike Wagner (54), Lpeters199 (63) and myself (60) voted for OYS along with a surprise by locke40 who is 25.

locke 40 reminds me of myself. I recall telling my Father many years ago that I thought that I was born too late, and would've been better off had I been born when he was. He responded by saying that he told his Father the exact same thing. I based my thoughts on not having the opportunity to see players like Ruth and Gehrig play. If selling my soul to the devil for a favor wasn't an eternal agreement, I would do just that to watch Ruth hit one of his towering home runs.

Gary Dunaier feels that OYS has run its course, and praises NYS, but this was from a response to another post, not a response to mine, and I don't know his age. But I believe that he may be old enough to off-set locke 40's answer. So basically, the old folks favor the old stadium, and there were two others who seemed to like OYS just from mentioning their adoration of the seafoam green paint.

I seem to have the disease that hits you at the half century mark that Mike Wagner mentioned; "mentalpause." I can remember 30 years ago, but not 30 days ago. But I recall my one and only day in OYS vividly, and it was exactly the way Mike described it. Being born and raised in South Philly I was used to Connie Mack Stadium, and I remember thinking that CMS would easily fit inside OYS, and the roof would be no higher than the top row of the second deck. What I still have a clear vision of in my mind, however, is when I came through the tunnel in the left field bleachers and followed the foul pole up until I saw the 42 foot end section of the frieze hovering over me. I had only seen it on a cheap B&W TV set, but now it was in color and it was a monster.

I was 15 years old then in 1964, and I shined shoes in a barber shop. The owner took me to Yankee Stadium for game 5 of the World Series for my birthday. Yankees vs Cardinals. Stottlemyre vs Gibson. The rookie Stottlemyre beat Gibson in game 2, but Gibson struck out 13 Yankees this day in 10 innings. It was also the day that my hate for Tim McCarver took root.

With two outs in the bottom of the 9th and down 2-0, Tom Tresh hit a 2 run homer that brought the place down. but McCarver ruined my birthday AND my one and only trip to OYS with a 3-run shot in the 10th. I didn't realize it until a couple of years ago, but that game was the last WS game played in OYS.

[Lpeters199]

Terrific post, Voo! Did you ever make it across the Harlem to the Polo Grounds?

I loved the terraces, porches, or whatever they were called that were attached to the front of the second deck and added on over the years. The renovation took away all of the middle deck's character and sadly turned it from a unique treasure into just another sterile, generic slab.

[ChineseDemocracy]

Well, my suspicions in regards to the older generation (the baby boomers) favoring the OYS appears to pan out. Mike Wagner (54), Lpeters199 (63) and myself (60) voted for OYS along with a surprise by locke40 who is 25.

locke 40 reminds me of myself. I recall telling my Father many years ago that I thought that I was born too late, and would've been better off had I been born when he was. He responded by saying that he told his Father the exact same thing. I based my thoughts on not having the opportunity to see players like Ruth and Gehrig play. If selling my soul to the devil for a favor wasn't an eternal agreement, I would do just that to watch Ruth hit one of his towering home runs.

Gary Dunaier feels that OYS has run its course, and praises NYS, but this was from a response to another post, not a response to mine, and I don't know his age. But I believe that he may be old enough to off-set locke 40's answer. So basically, the old folks favor the old stadium, and there were two others who seemed to like OYS just from mentioning their adoration of the seafoam green paint.

I seem to have the disease that hits you at the half century mark that Mike Wagner mentioned; "mentalpause." I can remember 30 years ago, but not 30 days ago. But I recall my one and only day in OYS vividly, and it was exactly the way Mike described it. Being born and raised in South Philly I was used to Connie Mack Stadium, and I remember thinking that CMS would easily fit inside OYS, and the roof would be no higher than the top row of the second deck. What I still have a clear vision of in my mind, however, is when I came through the tunnel in the left field bleachers and followed the foul pole up until I saw the 42 foot end section of the frieze hovering over me. I had only seen it on a cheap B&W TV set, but now it was in color and it was a monster.

I was 15 years old then in 1964, and I shined shoes in a barber shop. The owner took me to Yankee Stadium for game 5 of the World Series for my birthday. Yankees vs Cardinals. Stottlemyre vs Gibson. The rookie Stottlemyre beat Gibson in game 2, but Gibson struck out 13 Yankees this day in 10 innings. It was also the day that my hate for Tim McCarver took root.

With two outs in the bottom of the 9th and down 2-0, Tom Tresh hit a 2 run homer that brought the place down. but McCarver ruined my birthday AND my one and only trip to OYS with a 3-run shot in the 10th. I didn't realize it until a couple of years ago, but that game was the last WS game played in OYS.

I think Gary was being sarcastic.

Even people who never had the pleasure of going to OYS would take it over RYS and NYS. You can't go wrong with the frieze hanging over the field, the original Gate 4, open concourses (except for the upper deck), monuments in play, and cheap concessions.

[voodoochile]

Terrific post, Voo! Did you ever make it across the Harlem to the Polo Grounds?

I loved the terraces, porches, or whatever they were called that were attached to the front of the second deck and added on over the years. The renovation took away all of the middle deck's character and sadly turned it from a unique treasure into just another sterile, generic slab.

No, never made it to the Polo Grounds, and I kick myself it the butt everytime I see a picture of it. But I'm not alone because I know a lot of native New Yorkers who had the opportunity to see a game in OYS, but didn't. You just know there's some serious butt kickin' going on there.

I was in New York the third week of July this year (2 weeks ago) and got off the bus at Cogan's Bluff just to check it out. I had heard, and even seen some photos of a set of stairs that were constructed so fans going to the game wouldn't have to "roll" down the hill. Someone claims that it is the only thing that remains that links the Polo Grounds being there. I walked along Edgecombe Ave looking for it, and didn't really expect to find anything, especially since there was chain link fence all over the place. I walked as far as I thought it should be, and then some, and turned around and headed back. A couple of minutes later I heard some rustling in the bushes and looked down the hill to see some guy trying to climb up the hill to the sidewalk where I was. Just behind him were a set of cement stairs. It wasn't the Lost Arc, but it was what I was looking for.

They weren't as delapidated as I heard they were. There were chains across them to keep people off, but they appeared to be stable enough to hold a few people, no more. It was difficult to get good pictures with the chain link fence, until the guy climbing up the hill came through a small opening in it. It didn't say Exit Only, so I went through. As claimed, there is a plaque commemorating something on the bottom landing which was too steep to get to. I'll post some photos in a few minutes.

[voodoochile]

Ten photos of the stairway at Coogan's Bluff that led to the Polo Grounds. (Part I) They are in chronological order from ascending to descending. The first section has one landing in the middle, while the second landing makes a 90 degree turn to the right. It is also where the plague is. The second section, beginning from the 90 degree turn where the plaque is, ends abruplty, but it almost reaches the bottom. The terrain was far too steep to safely proceed any further. Maybe this is the reason for the stairs, ya' think?

[voodoochile]

Coogan's Bluff Stairs (Part II)

[Gary Dunaier]

Gary Dunaier feels that OYS has run its course, and praises NYS

I think Gary was being sarcastic.

I was indeed. I thought the way I had typed it, with each word beginning with a capital letter, along with the :crazy and the "admission" that I was drinking the Steinbrenners' "Kool Aid" - since the phrase "drinking ______'s Kool Aid" is generally used to imply that the person on the receiving end of that remark is being brainwashed - were giveaways.

I think the new building doesn't have any soul. Don't know if it's because I've only been there four times (three games and, ironically, the Joel Osteen event) and I'm not really a Yankee fan, whereas I am a Met fan and I've been to Citi Field 17 times already (including pre-season games, the plan holders' workout which wasn't actually a game, and all three McCartney concerts), or how much of it is intrinsic to the architecture and setup of the place.

The old place wasn't just Yankee Stadium, it was Y*A*N*K*E*E S*T*A*D*I*U*M, where so many of the great names in baseball history have played. Even though I'm not a Yankee fan I respected its history and embraced it as best as I could.

This past July 4, Major League Baseball honored the 70th anniversary of Lou Gehrig's famous "luckiest man" speech. Video footage of the speech was shown...

http://www.sportsvideodaily.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/11/gehrig_goodbye500.jpg

...and for the first time, those attending the ceremonies in the home ballpark of the club for which Lou Gehrig played could not look beyond the wall and see the same buildings in the distance that they were seeing in the background of the footage.

In time, the new Yankee Stadium will surely acquire its own legends, its own history, its own great moments. But how many home runs did Babe Ruth hit there? None. How many consecutive games did Lou Gehrig play there? None. Joe DiMaggio, Mickey Mantle, Reggie Jackson, even Horace Clarke... they never played there... and, okay, Thurman Munson's locker is there, but he never set foot in that locker in its present location at the Yankee Museum on the 200 level of the new building.

The new building is Derek Jeter and Alex "A-Rod" Rodriguez and Mark Teixeira and Mariano Rivera and everyone else who's been on the 2009 roster... yes, even Cody Ransom... :ooo:

But the new building is also the "moat" and the so-upscale-even-Donald-Trump-can't-afford-them amenities and the obstructed views in the bleachers and the "security" at each and every aisle and door and portal whose only job is to tell you to go away.

The new building may be called "Yankee Stadium." But it will never be Y*A*N*K*E*E S*T*A*D*I*U*M.

[cgcoyne2]

Great shots Voodoochile. Is the "plaque" that is there actually the lettering in the stairs themselves. I always assumed there was a plaque mounted on the stairs somewhere not lettering in the stairs.

Great shots, really sweet!!!!:nod:

[voodoochile]

Great shots Voodoochile. Is the "plaque" that is there actually the lettering in the stairs themselves. I always assumed there was a plaque mounted on the stairs somewhere not lettering in the stairs.

Great shots, really sweet!!!!:nod:

First, let me take care of Gary Dunaier. I've never been that naive in my life, and I am as sarcastic as they come so I'm surprised that I didn't pick up on it. As for the little faces and the Kool Aid, it's foreign to me. I have no clue what those things mean. So now, if you fall in the age range of at least 45 years old, then it's unanimous.

Now to the plaque. The pictures that I took of the area near the plaque were with the zoom since I just couldn't get down there. It is an extremely steep hill, more like a cliff in some areas. I'm certain that it is a sheet of steel the size of the landing and was bolted to possibly the steel structure surrounding it.

That Brush guy who the plaque was commemorating was either the builder and/or owner of the Polo Grounds, and/or the owner of the first baseball team that played there. I don't remember, I'd have to look it up. The point being, however, is that Yankee Stadium is credited as being the first venue to be called a stadium when in fact Brush Stadium was, I believe in the late 1800's, even though the public continued to refer to it as the Polo Grounds.

[voodoochile]

My mistake on the plaque. It appears that the metal letters were set up and cement poured around them. I zoomed in further and it is indeed cement. Another telltale sign is that a portion of one of the corners has been broken off.

[RationalNYYfan]

NYS is kind of boring.

[Yankee4life]

Coogan's Bluff Stairs (Part II)

All of this stuff should be in the Polo Grounds/Brush Staircase thread.

[Lpeters199]

Great group of Brush Stairs shots, Voodochile! Thanks!

These pictures are from Google Earth.

#1 shows the bend in the stairs, below the words "New York, N.Y."

#2 was taken from in front of 515 Edgecombe, showing what should be the entrance to Brush Stairs.

#3 is what you would see driving by that spot, heading toward the Harlem River.

#4 is 515 Edgecombe at the corner of 158th St., across the street from the stairs.

#5 is a Daily News picture taken from the roof of 515, from where the shot was fired that killed Barney Doyle in the stands. The kid had a priceless view of the Polo Grounds, so what did he do? He shot at it, of course. That still ticks me off 60 years later.

[Lpeters199]

All of this stuff should be in the Polo Grounds/Brush Staircase thread.

Don't like it? Then don't read it. Good work, Voo.

[Mike Wagner]

Dear voodoochile,

These are great photos. I've never seen the staircase before. It's also great to see New York apartment buildings again. There's nothing like New York!!!

-Mike Wagner

[Lpeters199]

Once during a rain delay in the 50s, the Tigers' announcers went on and on about how K.C. Municipal Stadium was modeled after Yankee Stadium. I couldn't see it then, and I still can't see it now. Am I missing something?

[voodoochile]

All of this stuff should be in the Polo Grounds/Brush Staircase thread.

My mistake. Didn't know that there was a Brush Staircase thread. Be it from me to make any waves. A friend of mine was suspended for life from this site for engaging in a heated discussion with another member, while the other person was not.

Actually, after I exited the bus and photographed the stairs, I walked the length of 155th street and the Macombs Dam Bridge to River Avenue to Billy's Bar and Restaurant to see Bald Vinny before the game at the stadium. It was something that I hadn't done before, and I wanted to see the area where the Polo Grounds once stood, and get a few shots of the sight line from there to where OYS stood. I've seen pictures of it before, but never had the pleasure of experiencing it firsthand, so technically I was posting my experience with the pre-renovated Yankee Stadium in mind. Sounds good to me.

[voodoochile]

Once during a rain delay in the 50s, the Tigers' announcers went on and on about how K.C. Municipal Stadium was modeled after Yankee Stadium. I couldn't see it then, and I still can't see it now. Am I missing something?

Yeah, I believe you are. If I'm not mistaken, I'd say that he was making referrence to the structural design, and not the finished product. Originally built, the Yankee Stadium grandstands did not curve around the foul poles, and the ends were left entirely open. You could see the massive amounts of
I beams, H columns and angle iron used to support the place. The structure deos resemble K.C. Find out if K.C. was designed by Osborn Engineering.

[voodoochile]

Forgot to tell you to check out the guy in the second photo, upper left corner. Also, that K.C. stadium looks as though it's ready tio collapse.

[Lpeters199]

A couple teasers from the New York Times:

[Mike Wagner]

Dear Friends,

The new Yankee Stadium has been described as having no soul. I find that to be terrible. Yes, it's a beautiful building from the photos I've seen. I guess you can liken it to a beautiful woman with no soul. Superficial beauty on the outside, but not within.

A lot of money has been spent on the Stadium. It's easy to criticize things.
I believe solutions can easliy be found as long as people have reasonable ideas. The new Yankee Stadium should have soul, as the original Yankee Stadium has. After all, you want to love to go to the Stadium and feel a true bond with it. That's a part of our national pastime.

Again, I've never been there. All I can do is go by the posts and photos I've seen.

I think it would be great if the outfield wall had a close resemblance to the pre-renovated Yankee Stadium. The long black wall - or black padding for the new Stadium. Also, perhaps a monument in centerfield to the old Yankee Stadium. And, a lot less ads that make the new Stadium look so commercial.
And, lower prices of numerous seats and concessions.

That's my take from the posts I've read.

It seems the Yankees want nothing to do with the old Stadium. That's wrong!!! It's a past that will NEVER escape them. There's far too many memories, photos, videos, ghosts, etc. I firmly believe that to embrace and incorporate some of the characteristics that have made Yankee Stadium so unique and beloved, would give soul to the new Yankee Stadium. And, would in all likelihood, make the new Stadium beloved as well.

-Mike Wagner

[The Monument]

A few comments on recent posts. Mantle's OT Day HR was definitely in '73. I like to think of it as #537. I was there, lower RF stands. Not sure when Mel Allen returned again after Mantle Day in '69. Thats a very good question. I can tell you this--I was there on Mantle Day too, and I knew who Mel Allen was. It was a thrill when Frank Messer introduced him to the crowd, " Only one man can make this next presentation. The man who officiated at the three previous retirement ceremonies,the long-time voice of the Yankees, Mel Allen!" I still get chills when I listen to the Yankee Stadium 50th anniversary record and I hear Mel say "Hello there everybody!" his signature phrase when coming on the air. Mel then introduced Mickey. "It gives me great pleasure to once again call from the dugout, one of the all-time Yankee greats, the Magnificent Yankee, the great #7, Mickey Mantle!!" Mantle's 10 minute standing ovation followed. That day is my greatest Yankee Stadium memory. It helps that the Yanks swept the Chisox in a doubleheader, but the ceremony was top notch all the way. The Yanks organization had real class back then,despite the losing seasons.It made quite an impression on an 8 yr old kid.
Obviously, I grew up with the blue-seat, white-frieze Stadium and thats the one I prefer. Not that the old green looked bad, but I'm glad they went with the white frieze in both RYS and NYS.
The lower and mezzanine decks had open concourses, and you could watch the game from behind the last row of seats. Thats one feature that I wish was retained in RYS but of course it couldn't be due to structural reasons.

[SparkyL]

Yeah, I believe you are. If I'm not mistaken, I'd say that he was making referrence to the structural design, and not the finished product. Originally built, the Yankee Stadium grandstands did not curve around the foul poles, and the ends were left entirely open. You could see the massive amounts of
I beams, H columns and angle iron used to support the place. The structure deos resemble K.C. Find out if K.C. was designed by Osborn Engineering.

That's a rather "interesting" screen behind home plate. Can you imagine what the HP camera view would look like with the net obstruction, if they had TV back then?

[voodoochile]

I recall seeing photos of other ballparks from the same era with similar netting behind the plate. Obviously it covers the same area as what they use now.

Another interesting item is the foul pole. Compared to what they use today, the older ballparks used sticks. They had no screen on them, were skinny and were usually no higher than the first row of the second deck. The photo is Yankee Stadium 1928. They were setting up the ring for a Gene Tunney fight. You can clearly see the RF foul pole on the left.

[Mike Wagner]

Dear Friends,

Regarding Mickey's home run in the 1973 Old Timers Day game at Yankee Stadium, I found my clipping from the New York Daily News. The bottom of the front page features 2 photos of Mickey. The first one shows Mickey's beautiful swing. The photo to the right shows Mickey rounding third base, with a wide smile.

I sent it to Mickey's home in Dallas. He signed it beautifully with a blue Sharpie. Mickey always had the most beautiful signature. Buck Leonard's reminds me very much of Mickey's signature. I laminated the paper, as I'd rather laminate it than have it fall apart.

At a Virginia Beach, Virginia show featuring ex-Yankee pitcher Jim Coates in the mid-1980s, I traded for a bat Mickey used in an Old Timers Day game. It's currently in storage, as we've moved a few times. I think it is the same bat Mickey clubbed his home run off of Whitey. I'd have to look. The bat is autographed.

By the way, I did use it for a few swings at a baseball batting cage shortly after I got it. I hit 2 or 3 baseballs with it. No homers. I can see you guys fainting!!! No, the bat didn't break. You know you would have done the same thing. I choked up on it, as it weighed a little too much for me. But, how many people have been able to swing their hero's bat?

-Mike Wagner

[brooklyndodger14]

Dear Friends,

Regarding Mickey's home run in the 1973 Old Timers Day game at Yankee Stadium, I found my clipping from the New York Daily News. The bottom of the front page features 2 photos of Mickey. The first one shows Mickey's beautiful swing. The photo to the right shows Mickey rounding third base, with a wide smile.

I sent it to Mickey's home in Dallas. He signed it beautifully with a blue Sharpie. Mickey always had the most beautiful signature. Buck Leonard's reminds me very much of Mickey's signature. I laminated the paper, as I'd rather laminate it than have it fall apart.

At a Virginia Beach, Virginia show featuring ex-Yankee pitcher Jim Coates in the mid-1980s, I traded for a bat Mickey used in an Old Timers Day game. It's currently in storage, as we've moved a few times. I think it is the same bat Mickey clubbed his home run off of Whitey. I'd have to look. The bat is autographed.

By the way, I did use it for a few swings at a baseball batting cage shortly after I got it. I hit 2 or 3 baseballs with it. No homers. I can see you guys fainting!!! No, the bat didn't break. You know you would have done the same thing. I choked up on it, as it weighed a little too much for me. But, how many people have been able to swing their hero's bat?

-Mike Wagner

Fantastic story, Mike! Made even more so personal having your clipping signed by The Mick.

I was a vendor that day working the 1B Field Level out of the portal between Sections 11 & 13. That was the portal from which guests would emerge from the Yankee offices, go down the aisle and directly to the field.

I mention this because I remember walking by Casey Stengel as he was preparing to be introduced by Frank Messer to the crowd. He was wearing a special Yankee pinstripe jersey which was also emblazoned with the other ML team logos he played or managed in his career: the Dodgers, Giants, Mets, Boston Braves, Phillies & Pirates. You can see that jersey on display at Cooperstown (see below, image from the Uniwatch Blog, May 2007).

What I recall most vividly was him leaning on an assistant as he waited for his turn to be called looking very frail, and as Frank read off Casey's credentials to increasingly loud cheers, both Stengel and assistant proceeded to emerge from the portal and down the aisle.

By the time he reached the field gate, he was fully on his own power: sometimes skipping like a kid, sometimes moving like a ballet dancer with broad sweeps of his arms to bow in all directions.

It was a great experience to be able to see close-up some living baseball history.

Dennis
BrooklynDodger14

(image link: http://www.uniwatchblog.com/2007/05/)

[Mygirljess]

Was that the same day they gave away the free "Yankee Stadium 50th Anniversary" Records? It was the same size as a '45 but it played at 33 1/3. I still have two copies, my brother gave me his.

[voodoochile]

Speaking of Stengel, this is a nice piece of trivia that I like to tell, and not many people that I know have knowledge of it.
1923 was Yankee Stadium's first year, and they were playing the Giants for the third consecutive time. Having lost the previous two to the Giants in '21 & '22, they entered the 9th tied 4-4. A home run by a Giants outfielder won game one 5-4, and it was the first World Series home run ever hit at Yankee Stadium. However, it was of the inside the park variety. But no problem since the second World Series home run at the stadium was hit over the fence by the same outfielder for a 1-0 win, and both were hit by Casey Stengel.

The photo is of Casey sliding safely in game one.

[Mike Wagner]

Dear Dennis,
Thank you for the story about Casey and Frank Messer. Everyone loves Casey!! Frank Messer was a true, kind gentleman. On September 30, 1973, the last game before the renovation, I was near 3b, taking photos of the Stadium. Frank was walking from LF towards Home Plate. He saw me point my camera at him. He was kind enough to pose and smile. I later sent him the photo, which he was kind enough to autograph. Such a sweet man!!!

During the 1973 Yankee Old Timers Day game, I saw an Old Timer sit behind Home Plate. I ended up getting autographs of Monte Irvin and Johnny Stevens (umpire) autographs. I had a baseball book. Monte liked it and said he'd like to get a copy. I later wrote him the particulars about the book and publisher.

Earlier that day, there was an entrance/exit near the street where the Yankee locker room was. I got autographs of Bobby Thomson, Rico Petrocelli,
Mel Allen, Terry Moore (Cardinals), Elston Howard, and others.

I also remember when Mickey got up to hit his home run off of Whitey, I was standing in the lower level well behind the Home Plate area. When Mickey got up to bat, I remember seeing a black man put his arms above his head and bowing towards Mickey. One of many people worshipping a baseball God.

Since you were a vendor, I do remember a tall, white male, I think he had a mustache, long hair, and glasses, and was in his 20s or 30s. I may be off a little on this. I do know he sold yearbooks along the 3b side. I don't remember if it was Upper or Lower Deck. Anyway, I remember he had the most unique way of saying "Yearbooooooooooooks."

Thanks for jogging my memory, Dennis. I took a photo of Concessions.
Hot Dog .50 Hero Sandwich .95 soda .30 candy .25
Popconn Peanuts Cracker Jacks Potato Chips .27

-Mike

[Mike Wagner]

Dear Mygirljess,

The record was given away of September 30, 1973. I still also have a couple of copies.

-Mike Wagner

[stadiumbuilder]

I've got three copies of that record I guess because the people I was with didn't want theirs. I brought home from that game those records, 3/4 of a seat, a boxplate (315e), and a small piece of the right field wall. I don't have the slightest recollection of carrying all that stuff home, but somehow I did. I also have my ticket stub, but if I was smart, I'd have three ticket stubs from that game because if people didn't want their records, they certainly would have given me those too. Nuts.

[brooklyndodger14]

Dear Dennis,
Thank you for the story about Casey and Frank Messer. Everyone loves Casey!! Frank Messer was a true, kind gentleman. On September 30, 1973, the last game before the renovation, I was near 3b, taking photos of the Stadium. Frank was walking from LF towards Home Plate. He saw me point my camera at him. He was kind enough to pose and smile. I later sent him the photo, which he was kind enough to autograph. Such a sweet man!!!

During the 1973 Yankee Old Timers Day game, I saw an Old Timer sit behind Home Plate. I ended up getting autographs of Monte Irvin and Johnny Stevens (umpire) autographs. I had a baseball book. Monte liked it and said he'd like to get a copy. I later wrote him the particulars about the book and publisher.

Earlier that day, there was an entrance/exit near the street where the Yankee locker room was. I got autographs of Bobby Thomson, Rico Petrocelli,
Mel Allen, Terry Moore (Cardinals), Elston Howard, and others.

I also remember when Mickey got up to hit his home run off of Whitey, I was standing in the lower level well behind the Home Plate area. When Mickey got up to bat, I remember seeing a black man put his arms above his head and bowing towards Mickey. One of many people worshipping a baseball God.

Since you were a vendor, I do remember a tall, white male, I think he had a mustache, long hair, and glasses, and was in his 20s or 30s. I may be off a little on this. I do know he sold yearbooks along the 3b side. I don't remember if it was Upper or Lower Deck. Anyway, I remember he had the most unique way of saying "Yearbooooooooooooks."

Thanks for jogging my memory, Dennis. I took a photo of Concessions.
Hot Dog .50 Hero Sandwich .95 soda .30 candy .25
Popconn Peanuts Cracker Jacks Potato Chips .27

-Mike


I remember him too! Unfortunately, I forgot his name, but yup, he would always make that unique call for yearbooks. I'll bet you'll remember an elderly beer vendor named Nick Gerardi. He was a short Italian gentleman who must have been selling since the late 40's or early 50's, but he was one of those who sold beer from dugout to dugout (NYS2009 equivalent: The Trost Trench) with a distinctive call always heard in the background on radio and TV: "Getcher beeeeeeer, hey beeeeeeeeer!" He certainly had seen and worked many memorable games during the Yankees' glory days of the 50's.

If you have any photos of the concessions (whether vendors or stands), would you please possibly post some here? It would be a great resource for Kaplanski's 3DYS, as I'm working on the signage for inside and outside the model. Some of the earlier pictures posted here of OYS during the 1966 football season showed the stands with the same interior food signage that lasted until 1973, but still had the archival Yankee history photos outside and above the stands. In 1967, they were replaced with large color transparencies of Canteen Corporation foods. Thanks in advance!

Dennis
BrooklynDodger14

[stadiumbuilder]

I remember that guy! I heard that beer call so many times on TV I thought they trained all the beer vendors to talk that way, but it was all him. I also remember an incredibly cute female vendor from the late 70's, long dark hair, dark eyes. I think she was selling peanuts the first day I saw her. I called for some so I could talk to her and she throws them to me! No! I pass the money along and never got within 10 feet. She probably learned early on how to keep idiot teenagers from hitting on her.

[brooklyndodger14]

I remember that guy! I heard that beer call so many times on TV I thought they trained all the beer vendors to talk that way, but it was all him. I also remember an incredibly cute female vendor from the late 70's, long dark hair, dark eyes. I think she was selling peanuts the first day I saw her. I called for some so I could talk to her and she throws them to me! No! I pass the money along and never got within 10 feet. She probably learned early on how to keep idiot teenagers from hitting on her.

I think I know whom you're thinking of, her name was Liz and I do have some pictures of her. In the first year of RYS was the first season they hired female vendors to work the stands (Women's Lib literally at work, LOL!).

I started a baseball vendors thread here a couple of years ago where I will post some of the pre-game Stadium pics I found from 1976-78 over there sometime this weekend, so I won't stray off-topic here.

Dennis
BrooklynDodger14

[Gary Dunaier]

I started a baseball vendors thread here a couple of years ago where I will post some of the pre-game Stadium pics I found from 1976-78 over there sometime this weekend, so I won't stray off-topic here.

Dennis
BrooklynDodger14

There are four threads here at the Baseball Fever that reference vendors. In searching for the thread Dennis started, I learned that when you do searches you have to be specific - a search for "vendors" only pulls up those threads with "vendors" in the title, if you want the singular you have to type "vendor" without the "s."

Anyway, here are the threads, beginning with the one Dennis started...

The Ballpark Vendor (http://baseball-fever.com/showthread.php?t=43775&highlight=vendor). Most recent post - 6/11/06.

Photos of vendor uniforms (past and present) throughout the major leagues. (http://baseball-fever.com/showthread.php?t=79362&highlight=vendor) Most recent post - 7/16/08.

Standout Vendors. (http://baseball-fever.com/showthread.php?t=32277&highlight=vendors) Most recent post - 10/25/07.

Where are the Vendors & Service People? (http://baseball-fever.com/showthread.php?t=62066&highlight=vendors) Most recent post - 6/24/07.

[SparkyL]

Dear Friends,

Regarding Mickey's home run in the 1973 Old Timers Day game at Yankee Stadium, I found my clipping from the New York Daily News. The bottom of the front page features 2 photos of Mickey. The first one shows Mickey's beautiful swing. The photo to the right shows Mickey rounding third base, with a wide smile.

I sent it to Mickey's home in Dallas. He signed it beautifully with a blue Sharpie. Mickey always had the most beautiful signature. Buck Leonard's reminds me very much of Mickey's signature. I laminated the paper, as I'd rather laminate it than have it fall apart.

At a Virginia Beach, Virginia show featuring ex-Yankee pitcher Jim Coates in the mid-1980s, I traded for a bat Mickey used in an Old Timers Day game. It's currently in storage, as we've moved a few times. I think it is the same bat Mickey clubbed his home run off of Whitey. I'd have to look. The bat is autographed.

By the way, I did use it for a few swings at a baseball batting cage shortly after I got it. I hit 2 or 3 baseballs with it. No homers. I can see you guys fainting!!! No, the bat didn't break. You know you would have done the same thing. I choked up on it, as it weighed a little too much for me. But, how many people have been able to swing their hero's bat?

-Mike Wagner

Posting the picture on behalf of Mike.

[brooklyndodger14]

A comparison with the Daily News photo of Mantle's 1973 OTD homerun swing and the cover photo from Joseph Durso's Yankee Stadium: Fifty Years of Drama which was published the year before showing his swing from OTD 1970.

The Yankee uniform numbers on their home jerseys had 3 distinct phases: the 1929 thru 1945 era in the Red Sox-style number font (think Babe Ruth & Lou Gehrig), the 1946-1973 era with the Navy-style block font (think late-career DiMaggio, Mantle, Maris, Ford & Howard), and finally, the current 1973-present doubleknit era (Reggie, Munson, Goose, Mattingly, thru Jeter) with the serif-style numerals.

To fans growing up within each of these eras, the uniforms and the player numbers provided a unique identity to both the players and their time as Yankees.

I bring this up because in the back of my mind I find it slightly out-of-place to see Mantle in his '73 double-knits with a serif "7" when during his whole playing career he is remembered in his flannels and classic "7" as in the Durso book cover.

I think it would be nice (and therefore, highly unlikely) if the Yankees were to acknowledge their retired numbers in MP in the appropriate number style of each player's era. It would provide a subtle but meaningful statement of the long and legendary historical heritage of the Yankees.


Dennis
BrooklynDodger14


http://baseball-fever.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=74691&stc=1&d=1249661177

[SparkyL]

A comparison with the Daily News photo of Mantle's 1973 OTD homerun swing and the cover photo from Joseph Durso's Yankee Stadium: Fifty Years of Drama which was published the year before showing his swing from OTD 1970.

The Yankee uniform numbers on their home jerseys had 3 distinct phases: the 1929 thru 1945 era in the Red Sox-style number font (think Babe Ruth & Lou Gehrig), the 1946-1973 era with the Navy-style block font (think late-carrer DiMaggio, Mantle, Maris, Ford & Howard), and finally, the current 1973-present doubleknit era (Reggie, Munson, Goose, Mattingly, thru Jeter) with the serif-style numerals.

To fans growing up within each of these eras, the uniforms and the player numbers provided a unique identity to both the players and their time as Yankees.

I bring this up because in the back of my mind I find it slightly out-of-place to see Mantle in his '73 double-knits with a serif "7" when during his whole playing career he is remembered in his flannels and classic "7" as in the Durso book cover.

I think it would be nice (and therefore, highly unlikely) if the Yankees were to acknowledge their retired numbers in MP in the appropriate number style of each players era. It would provide a subtle but meaningful statement of the long and legendary historical heritage of the Yankees.


Dennis
BrooklynDodger14


Very observant and I totally agree with you about MP. Of course making such a change assumes that the Yankee organization is equally observant and based on some of Trost's comments (and even Morante's) I'm not convinced that is the case.

[RationalNYYfan]

A comparison with the Daily News photo of Mantle's 1973 OTD homerun swing and the cover photo from Joseph Durso's Yankee Stadium: Fifty Years of Drama which was published the year before showing his swing from OTD 1970.

The Yankee uniform numbers on their home jerseys had 3 distinct phases: the 1929 thru 1945 era in the Red Sox-style number font (think Babe Ruth & Lou Gehrig), the 1946-1973 era with the Navy-style block font (think late-carrer DiMaggio, Mantle, Maris, Ford & Howard), and finally, the current 1973-present doubleknit era (Reggie, Munson, Goose, Mattingly, thru Jeter) with the serif-style numerals.

To fans growing up within each of these eras, the uniforms and the player numbers provided a unique identity to both the players and their time as Yankees.

I bring this up because in the back of my mind I find it slightly out-of-place to see Mantle in his '73 double-knits with a serif "7" when during his whole playing career he is remembered in his flannels and classic "7" as in the Durso book cover.

I think it would be nice (and therefore, highly unlikely) if the Yankees were to acknowledge their retired numbers in MP in the appropriate number style of each players era. It would provide a subtle but meaningful statement of the long and legendary historical heritage of the Yankees.


Dennis
BrooklynDodger14


http://baseball-fever.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=74691&stc=1&d=1249661177

Wow that's really interesting! And I'd like to see that in MP as well.

[voodoochile]

Regarding the uniform/fonts of different era's, you might be surprised to find that the Yankees may listen to your suggestion. If you recall the most recent ceremonies that included veteran players, they were attired accordingly, so someone is on the ball in the front office.

[Bobby_Ayala]

Actually Munhak does have obstructing support columns.
http://static.panoramio.com/photos/original/22946695.jpgIt appears so, but not nearly to the extent that OYS had, what Locke endorses, or what USCF has.

[voodoochile]

I understand that this is off thread, but if your're not watching the Yanks/Sox game, you're missing out big time. Top of 14. Yanks no runs, 5 hits, Sox no runs, 3 hits.

[Mike Wagner]

Dear Dennis,

Nick sounds vaguely familiar. But, I'll never forget the yearbook man. I can still hear him now. I sent you a personal message.

-Mike Wagner


I remember him too! Unfortunately, I forgot his name, but yup, he would always make that unique call for yearbooks. I'll bet you'll remember an elderly beer vendor named Nick Gerardi. He was a short Italian gentleman who must have been selling since the late 40's or early 50's, but he was one of those who sold beer from dugout to dugout (NYS2009 equivalent: The Trost Trench) with a distinctive call always heard in the background on radio and TV: "Getcher beeeeeeer, hey beeeeeeeeer!" He certainly had seen and worked many memorable games during the Yankees' glory days of the 50's.

If you have any photos of the concessions (whether vendors or stands), would you please possibly post some here? It would be a great resource for Kaplanski's 3DYS, as I'm working on the signage for inside and outside the model. Some of the earlier pictures posted here of OYS during the 1966 football season showed the stands with the same interior food signage that lasted until 1973, but still had the archival Yankee history photos outside and above the stands. In 1967, they were replaced with large color transparencies of Canteen Corporation foods. Thanks in advance!

Dennis
BrooklynDodger14

[Yankees73]

Was that the same day they gave away the free "Yankee Stadium 50th Anniversary" Records? It was the same size as a '45 but it played at 33 1/3. I still have two copies, my brother gave me his.

That was handed out at the final game of the season 30 Sept 1973..

[locke40]

A comparison with the Daily News photo of Mantle's 1973 OTD homerun swing and the cover photo from Joseph Durso's Yankee Stadium: Fifty Years of Drama which was published the year before showing his swing from OTD 1970.

The Yankee uniform numbers on their home jerseys had 3 distinct phases: the 1929 thru 1945 era in the Red Sox-style number font (think Babe Ruth & Lou Gehrig), the 1946-1973 era with the Navy-style block font (think late-carrer DiMaggio, Mantle, Maris, Ford & Howard), and finally, the current 1973-present doubleknit era (Reggie, Munson, Goose, Mattingly, thru Jeter) with the serif-style numerals.

To fans growing up within each of these eras, the uniforms and the player numbers provided a unique identity to both the players and their time as Yankees.

I bring this up because in the back of my mind I find it slightly out-of-place to see Mantle in his '73 double-knits with a serif "7" when during his whole playing career he is remembered in his flannels and classic "7" as in the Durso book cover.

I think it would be nice (and therefore, highly unlikely) if the Yankees were to acknowledge their retired numbers in MP in the appropriate number style of each players era. It would provide a subtle but meaningful statement of the long and legendary historical heritage of the Yankees.


Dennis
BrooklynDodger14

Nice research, BrooklynDodger14! Very well written, informative, and observant! :atthepc

I really hope that someone within the Yankee organization, or someone with connections to the Yankee organization would sit down and consider this improvement to our Monument Park.

[Yankees73]

Posting the picture on behalf of Mike.

I remember watching that as an 11 yr old. I remember before the homer, the Mick hit a huge foul in the upperdeck in left field and Mel Allen yelling foul ball! foul ball! He then hit the home run and the place went nuts... I also liked the way the paper was layed out with the seperate pictures and the center fold. Back then itwas called the Sunday News!!

[Mattingly85MVP]

as requested by locke40

[Mygirljess]

That was handed out at the final game of the season 30 Sept 1973..

Not sure if that was the only day they gave away that record. Only reason I say that is that 9/30 was the last actual game at Old Yankee and I don't think I was there that day, and I'm sure I got the record as a give away at the Stadium. I wonder if they might have given it away the last few games? Or maybe I was at that last actual game, I just thought I would have remembered that.

Funny story about Stengel was when the Yankees were playing the Dodgers at Ebbets Field in the '50's and during pregame practice he walked out to the outfield and started telling young Mantle about how to play the caroms off the oddly angled outfield walls. He knew every nook and cranny, from his playing days. Mantle looked at him incredulously and said, "you mean you played here?" He had no idea that Stengel actually had been a major league player!

[voodoochile]

I remember a clip from an interview with Mantle that I saw on TV when Mantle was talking about Stegel. Mantle said that he had asked Casey if he ever played ball, and Casey said, "What do you think, I was born old?"

[Yankees73]

Not sure if that was the only day they gave away that record. Only reason I say that is that 9/30 was the last actual game at Old Yankee and I don't think I was there that day, and I'm sure I got the record as a give away at the Stadium. I wonder if they might have given it away the last few games? Or maybe I was at that last actual game, I just thought I would have remembered that.

Funny story about Stengel was when the Yankees were playing the Dodgers at Ebbets Field in the '50's and during pregame practice he walked out to the outfield and started telling young Mantle about how to play the caroms off the oddly angled outfield walls. He knew every nook and cranny, from his playing days. Mantle looked at him incredulously and said, "you mean you played here?" He had no idea that Stengel actually had been a major league player!

Good story! Mickey thought Casey was born at 60. I remember listening to the "45" given out when I got home from the game. Poor quality to say the least but I didn't care. finally, since I'm the king of useless information,here is some more.. They had those records as a special insert in the 74 yearbook.

[voodoochile]

as requested by locke40

This shot reminded me of one that I have from 1923 just after Yankee Stadium was completed, and before a game had yet to be played in it. I wish that the photographer had been farther back to capture the grandstands as in the top photo. You can, however, see just a a little of the frieze on the left side.

[YankeeFanBx]

As an old Yankee fan who saw my first game in 1965 at OYS, I like the NYS.
I'm 58 and have fond memories of OYS and the bad teams that followed the 1964 team.
I remember the green field and the green stadium and the vastness of the field.
I miss OYS not RYS and welcome NYS.
Just my thoughts.

[NYFan1stYankFan2nd]

This shot reminded me of one that I have from 1923 just after Yankee Stadium was completed, and before a game had yet to be played in it. I wish that the photographer had been farther back to capture the grandstands as in the top photo. You can, however, see just a a little of the frieze on the left side.

Don't forget it wasn't until 1937 that both grandstands curved 'round behind the foul poles to fill in that empty area; LF extension was completed ten years prior.

As an aside - I'm personally glad they didn't wrap the granstand completely around that field - it would literally SCREAM "college football arena"! :laugh

[voodoochile]

Don't forget it wasn't until 1937 that both grandstands curved 'round behind the foul poles to fill in that empty area; LF extension was completed ten years prior.

As an aside - I'm personally glad they didn't wrap the granstand completely around that field - it would literally SCREAM "college football arena"! :laugh



I understand that completely, but my point is that had the photo been taken from a location similar to the where the top photo was taken, the grandstands would've been entirely visible, and made for a better photograph.

When I first saw this photo it appeared to be just a baseball field and not a stadium until I realized what was missing.

[locke40]

It must have been strange as a player to be sitting in the dugout, looking straight ahead, and seeing the other team looking straight at you from across the field. Also, I definitely prefer the smaller dugouts from the old stadiums. Coupled with smaller clubhouses, a tighter unity among the players was probably more pronounced.

74755

[SparkyL]

I understand that completely, but my point is that had the photo been taken from a location similar to the where the top photo was taken, the grandstands would've been entirely visible, and made for a better photograph.

When I first saw this photo it appeared to be just a baseball field and not a stadium until I realized what was missing.

And doesn't the infield in the '23 picture look like something out of a Bugs Bunny cartoon?

[Gary Dunaier]

It must have been strange as a player to be sitting in the dugout, looking straight ahead, and seeing the other team looking straight at you from across the field.

I think that's a fish-eye view, that photo. The dugouts were not angled to face each other in real life.

[NYFan1stYankFan2nd]

I think that's a fish-eye view, that photo. The dugouts were not angled to face each other in real life.

I know. I think what one could do is print out some of Andrew Clem's diagrams as big as possible(on 11x17 paper if one's printer has that size) and experiment with wide-angle and tele-photo photographing of the same, and different heights simulating upper grandstand or field level perspectives.

I've seen telephotos of pre-RYS that foreshorten that field to make it look "shallower" than RYS(or NYS's relative bandbox). It doesn't help newbies or young fans appreciate just how deep a field everyone from Ruth to Mantle had to contend with.

[voodoochile]

I've seen telephotos of pre-RYS that foreshorten that field to make it look "shallower" than RYS(or NYS's relative bandbox). It doesn't help newbies or young fans appreciate just how deep a field everyone from Ruth to Mantle had to contend with.


This should take care of that. This is also a 1923 shot of YS just after completion, and before a game had been played in it. This particular picture is deceptive in regards to where a ball would have to be hit to be a home run. It appears that the track that emcompasses the field is the end of the outfield, but it is actually the front wall of the bleachers where the red line is. The area behind the flagpole where the two walls meet, (aka; Death Valley) is 500 feet from home plate.

To further give you an idea of how big and deep the outfield is, the dirt track that surrounds the field is one-quarter of a mile long.

[ChineseDemocracy]

There's no Gate 2, at least the Gate 2 we have come to know and love (and try to save).

[voodoochile]

You'll need to talk to Osborn Engineering in Cleveland. Want their address?

[Mygirljess]

Wow, no Kinney parking garage, no buildings on Jerome Avenue. But the 4 train tunnel entrance still looks exactly the same today.

[RichardLillard1]

There's no Gate 2, at least the Gate 2 we have come to know and love (and try to save).

Gate 2 is there, however incomplete.

We've discussed this at great length throughout our efforts to see its preservation. The lower most section of the Gate was built in 1923, it was then completed to match Gate 4 in 1928 and during the renovation it was shortened slightly and given the current form it has today.

Rest assured, those entrances are the same ones that have been there since 1922 when the concrete was poured in place. This is even confirmed on the 1927 Osborn Engineering plans for the "Part D Extension" of the grandstand as the 1923 section is illustrated as a dashed line, indicating it was already built.

Attached are a couple of pictures, the first of which was taken after the one posted just above. You can tell this because the box seats are starting to be installed into the upper deck. As you can see, the lower section of the Gate and even the stairs leading up to it, are the same ones there today.

Second is a shot from opening day, April 18, 1923. This picture is great for illustrating even the windows of the lower section, which you can see in the third picture from the 1961-62 off-season.

I don't mean to attack anyone with this post and I apologize if it is in any way hostile. However, this information needs to become a type of common knowledge if we are to see Gate 2 saved and turned into a monument. The simple fact is that Gate 2 has been there from the beginning and is a representative piece of all of the work done over Yankee Stadium's evolution.


Richard

[RichardLillard1]

Attached below is a great shot for illustrating just how big the field was in 1923. Note the short foul lines, 258ft each way. By the 1924 season, the plate had been moved forward ten feet and angled slightly to the right to eliminate the angle between the right field bleachers and grandstand.

This shot is sometimes mislabeled as being taken on opening say in 1923. I will say that it is probably just before opening day, but definitely not the 18th of April. Note the lack of bunting of any kind. This is more than likely either just prior and the Yankees are having some sort of press event/spring training at the Stadium, or just after.

Also, you can see the very same windows again, at Gate 2.


Richard

[Gylmar]

Wonderful shots of Gate 2...in the 1961-1962 off-season photo I like the Yankee logos on the outside of the stadium! :D

[locke40]

Wonderful shots of Gate 2...in the 1961-1962 off-season photo I like the Yankee logos on the outside of the stadium! :D

I also [like the Yankee logos on the outside of the stadium]. I like the fact that they are the original design with the light blue under-bill. Very classy organization back then!

[4evertribe]

My first post, and I have a question to which I have long sought an answer... or sought a picture. Did Yankee Stadium have a rotunda? If so, do pictures exist? I've read where Babe Ruth's body was laid in state in the Yankee Stadium rotunda.

Please inform.

(By the way, this is a great thread, on a great website).

[brooklyndodger14]

I also remember an incredibly cute female vendor from the late 70's, long dark hair, dark eyes. I think she was selling peanuts the first day I saw her. I called for some so I could talk to her and she throws them to me! No! I pass the money along and never got within 10 feet. She probably learned early on how to keep idiot teenagers from hitting on her.

I think I know whom you're thinking of, her name was Liz and I do have some pictures of her. In the first year of RYS was the first season they hired female vendors to work the stands (Women's Lib literally at work, LOL!).

Dennis
BrooklynDodger14

Here she is....

[jimmyjimjimz]

And doesn't the infield in the '23 picture look like something out of a Bug Bunny cartoon?

who's Bug Bunny?

[voodoochile]

My first post, and I have a question to which I have long sought an answer... or sought a picture. Did Yankee Stadium have a rotunda? If so, do pictures exist? I've read where Babe Ruth's body was laid in state in the Yankee Stadium rotunda.

Please inform.

(By the way, this is a great thread, on a great website).

I won't pretend to be an expert on Yankee Stadium, but I'll telll you what I know, which isn't much. Besides, I wasn't born until a year after he died.

I've also read where Ruth was laid out in the rotunda at Yankee Stadium. From what I understand, a rotunda is a room of a circular design with a domed roof or cileing, exactly like the Capital in Washington DC.

I believe that word must have been used during that time to also describe possibly a vestibule or a foyer. I've been in old Yankee Stadium when I was a kid, and I don't recall it being much different inside than after the renovation. No rotunda, no vestibule, no foyer. However, that entrance at gate 4 where his body is being taken in the photo may be a larger area, but it's by no means a rotunda. Of course, I may be wrong.

C'mon guys, help me out here. Somebody has to know more than this.

[SparkyL]

I won't pretend to be an expert on Yankee Stadium, but I'll telll you what I know, which isn't much. Besides, I wasn't born until a year after he died.

I've also read where Ruth was laid out in the rotunda at Yankee Stadium. From what I understand, a rotunda is a room of a circular design with a domed roof or cileing, exactly like the Capital in Washington DC.

I believe that word must have been used during that time to also describe possibly a vestibule or a foyer. I've been in old Yankee Stadium when I was a kid, and I don't recall it being much different inside than after the renovation. No rotunda, no vestibule, no foyer. However, that entrance at gate 4 where his body is being taken in the photo may be a larger area, but it's by no means a rotunda. Of course, I may be wrong.

C'mon guys, help me out here. Somebody has to know more than this.


Yeah, they were streatching the definition of "rotunda." Sort of like calling the Frieze the Facade.

I guess it sounded better than "entranceway."

[4evertribe]

Thank you Sparkyl and voodoochile for the rotunda answers. That one has been bugging me for some time.

I was never in Yankee Stadium, old or renovated.

[The Monument]

It's funny how that keed is crying because Babe won't sign his ball.

[voodoochile]

It's funny how that keed is crying because Babe won't sign his ball.

And I'll bet after 61 years he still hasn't signed it.

[voodoochile]

I wonder if that kid is Johnny Sylvester, the one that Ruth signed a ball for in the hospital.

[Mygirljess]

Wonder where she is now? Maybe becoming a grandma. :sigh:

[locke40]

Wonder where she is now? Maybe becoming a grandma. :sigh:

I was thinking the same thing. Maybe someone can track her down; she might have some interesting stories for us, or some nice photos of the pre-renovated Stadium.

[The Monument]

If '76 was the first year for female vendors, it's unlikely she would have any OYS photos unless she was a big fan 3 years before she started working there.

[voodoochile]

Wonder where she is now? Maybe becoming a grandma. :sigh:

Maybe this is her.

[The Monument]

That's "Cotton Candy"! She had her own chant from the boys as soon as she appeared. Saw her on Opening Day this year. A guy said to her "What happened to you?" and she yelled back " I gained 17 lbs!" I like how Hideki Irabu is in that pic.

[NYFan1stYankFan2nd]

who's Bug Bunny?

JJJ - remember our PMs??

I'm tryina help you here and thought I was doing a good deed. I looked at posts of yours that are over a year old and going back into 2007, and they seem from a different person altogether. They read just like a thousand other posts/threads put up on these boards.

Are you sure this isn't just an act?

[voodoochile]

JJJ - remember our PMs??

I'm tryina help you here and thought I was doing a good deed. I looked at posts of yours that are over a year old and going back into 2007, and they seem from a different person altogether. They read just like a thousand other posts/threads put up on these boards.

Are you sure this isn't just an act?



You can put me down for a vote of "YES", it is an act. I posted this about 2 weeks ago in regards to him . . .

I've read your posts on many threads over the past few months, and I personally believe that you're sitting back laughing like hell at us all. But I'm a nice guy and will give you the benefit of the doubt simply because I admire your approach, and enjoy a good laugh myself, even at the expense of others.

"Who is Bugs Bunny?" C'mon, Triple J, you're getting sloppy now.

[elmer]

making some waves.

A Monument for all to the greatest sports venue in history.

[jimmyjimjimz]

You can put me down for a vote of "YES", it is an act. I posted this about 2 weeks ago in regards to him . . .

I've read your posts on many threads over the past few months, and I personally believe that you're sitting back laughing like hell at us all. But I'm a nice guy and will give you the benefit of the doubt simply because I admire your approach, and enjoy a good laugh myself, even at the expense of others.

"Who is Bugs Bunny?" C'mon, Triple J, you're getting sloppy now.




who's Bug Bunny?

What does that say?

See, I was trying to help the guy out and point out to him that he spelled something wrong. What's wrong with that?

And seriously, how do I change my name on here? I don't like to be called triple j. Will you people stop calling me that?

[voodoochile]

making some waves.

A Monument for all to the greatest sports venue in history.

I don't believe anything unless I see it. However, I did notice a couple of things that appear to be questionable. First is the condition of Gate Two. It was my understanding that this particular section was chosen because it was passed over during the renovation, and still retains its original charisma. Now critics have "noted" that it was "significantly changed" during the renovation. Who are these critics, where do they get their information from, and why are their opinions always quoted in the paper? And who came up with the $10 million restoration cost?

Second, It was also mentioned that the "famous" bat would remain, as well as sections of Yankee Stadium's "historic frieze." Is this in lieu of Gate Two?

Man, who are they trying to BS with that historic crap? That frieze isn't historic, it's a cheap imitation of the REAL historic frieze that hasn't been seen since 1973. I suppose that bat/vent pipe combo is also historic. If they're thinking of whitewashing the Gate Two deal with a giant fiberglass bat and a few chunks of imitation cement frieze, they must be high. I want those clowns drug tested.

[SparkyL]

I don't believe anything unless I see it. However, I did notice a couple of things that appear to be questionable. First is the condition of Gate Two. It was my understanding that this particular section was chosen because it was passed over during the renovation, and still retains its original charisma. Now critics have "noted" that it was "significantly changed" during the renovation. Who are these critics, where do they get their information from, and why are their opinions always quoted in the paper? And who came up with the $10 million restoration cost?

Second, It was also mentioned that the "famous" bat would remain, as well as sections of Yankee Stadium's "historic frieze." Is this in lieu of Gate Two?

Man, who are they trying to BS with that historic crap? That frieze isn't historic, it's a cheap imitation of the REAL historic frieze that hasn't been seen since 1973. I suppose that bat/vent pipe combo is also historic. If they're thinking of whitewashing the Gate Two deal with a giant fiberglass bat and a few chunks of imitation cement frieze, they must be high. I want those clowns drug tested.

My guess as to "who are the critics" are the same Parks Department types who are trying to "preserve" items from the 70's renovation while saying the gate is not original. That's why they are not specifically named. And they think that we're all fools . . .

. . . BTW, here's a link to the article; and there a yes/no vote . . . . http://www.nydailynews.com/ny_local/bronx/2009/08/17/2009-08-17_the_gate_debate_boosters_push_to_save_and_resto re_historic_entrance_at_old_stadi.html

[Mattingly85MVP]

I wish a rep from the Yankees would comment on the movement and throw their support towards the effort. This is a GREAT IDEA and it needs to come to fruition

[Gehrig27]

I just noticed this book on Amazon; there's only one left in stock. Does anyone have it? If so, how is it, are there any rarely seen pictures?
http://www.amazon.com/Yankee-Stadium-1923-2008-Images-Baseball/dp/0738565962/ref=pd_ys_qtk_rnr_img?pf_rd_p=236216201&pf_rd_s=center-3&pf_rd_t=1501&pf_rd_i=home&pf_rd_m=ATVPDKIKX0DER&pf_rd_r=1MT8GA5K6WW52M9HX43V#

[4evertribe]

Does anyone have any up close photos of the two circular friezes (if you will) opposite the words "Yankee Stadium" as seen in the picture of Gate Two (the ones with the eagles and the bats)... although I think these were above other gates too.

Thank you, much.

[tugger]

Does anyone have any up close photos of the two circular friezes (if you will) opposite the words "Yankee Stadium" as seen in the picture of Gate Two (the ones with the eagles and the bats)... although I think these were above other gates too.

Thank you, much.

Here ya go . . . .
http://diand.files.wordpress.com/2008/01/ramones_logo.jpg

[voodoochile]

Does anyone have any up close photos of the two circular friezes (if you will) opposite the words "Yankee Stadium" as seen in the picture of Gate Two (the ones with the eagles and the bats)... although I think these were above other gates too.

Thank you, much.

Yeah, I might have something. Give me a few minutes.

[voodoochile]

I think this is what you wanted.

[voodoochile]

Or maybe this . . . It has a very low resolution, so it's pretty grainy, and there's not much I can do to sharpen it up.

[4evertribe]

Thanks... Is that someone's head above the eagle?

[RationalNYYfan]

I always thought it was a catcher's mask

[4evertribe]

Yankee Stadium, pre-renovation, gets the award for seamless additions to a stadium. The left field and right field additions appeared to be (both inside and out) seamless. Unlike any other old-time ball park, where either the roof was higher in left or right (Old Comiskey, Forbes Field), or the outside facade was different (Wrigley), etc, etc., you really couldn't tell there were later additions to Yankee Stadium. Having never been to Yankee Stadium, I am basing this solely on the pictures provided.

[NYFan1stYankFan2nd]

Here ya go . . . .
http://diand.files.wordpress.com/2008/01/ramones_logo.jpg

LOL!!

That's stickin' it to the new-school YS crowd.

[Mike Wagner]

Yes, it IS a catcher's mask.

Also, the powers that be - Parks Dept. - or whoever it is, are hell bent against saving Gate 2. I would like to know what they're afraid of. Are they afraid that any remnant of the old Yankee Stadium would detract from the new Yankee Stadium.

Quite the contrary, they would complement each other. They each serve their respectable place in the history of the New York Yankees and New York City.

Why can't these damn morons cut out the politics, &/or corruption, and give Gate 2 the respect and life it deserves???!!!!!! Old Yankee Stadium is every inch an icon of NYC as the Statue of Liberty and the Empire State Building!!!!!!!!!!

-Mike Wagner

[voodoochile]

Thanks... Is that someone's head above the eagle?

There's a lot of stuff in there, and I'll probably miss a few. Besides the catchers mask there's also a chest protector. The eagle is clutching a bunch of baseball bats similar to the the olive branches in the Official USA Seal. Below the bats are two baseball gloves, one I believe being a catchers mitt. Behind the mask is a scroll with NY on it, I think some baseballs above that, and an infield framing it all. You can see homeplate and the bottom, and the foul lines, and/or dirt path leading to the respective bases.

I believe they were hand carved for the original stadium in 1923. In fact, the reproductions for the new place are hand carved, also . . . I think.

OK guys, did I miss anything? I know you can't WAIT to get at this.

[Gehrig27]

Granted, not the originals so the design is a little off - but still some good detail.

[Gehrig27]

...And for good measure:

[voodoochile]

Granted, not the originals so the design is a little off - but still some good detail.

I read or heard somewhere that those things were hand carved for NYS also, but the one that has 1923 at the top and 2009 at the bottom appears to be brass, or was it meant to look like that?

I also was under the impression that everything in it represents one thing or another. Anyone have any insight on that?

[stadiumbuilder]

I don't believe anything unless I see it. However, I did notice a couple of things that appear to be questionable. First is the condition of Gate Two. It was my understanding that this particular section was chosen because it was passed over during the renovation, and still retains its original charisma. Now critics have "noted" that it was "significantly changed" during the renovation. Who are these critics, where do they get their information from, and why are their opinions always quoted in the paper? And who came up with the $10 million restoration cost?

Second, It was also mentioned that the "famous" bat would remain, as well as sections of Yankee Stadium's "historic frieze." Is this in lieu of Gate Two?

Man, who are they trying to BS with that historic crap? That frieze isn't historic, it's a cheap imitation of the REAL historic frieze that hasn't been seen since 1973. I suppose that bat/vent pipe combo is also historic. If they're thinking of whitewashing the Gate Two deal with a giant fiberglass bat and a few chunks of imitation cement frieze, they must be high. I want those clowns drug tested.That cement frieze is light years ahead of the new stuff. I remember being slightly disappointed with the '76 version. The 1923 frieze is major league, the 1976 is AA quality and the new obahmanation is high school. But in the Yankees defense, many fans don't care much about the frieze, they just want to win. Our problem is we love baseball and architecture. Also, most everybody going to games never saw the old stuff in person, will never know what they didn't see and therefore can't miss it. The naysayers in that gate 2 story are just plain good old fashioned lying. No matter how hard people try to make the old stadium go away, it's legend is going to keep growing and will be more prominent in it's demise than it is now. OYS has a life of it's own and cannot be destroyed.

[Gylmar]

That cement frieze is light years ahead of the new stuff. I remember being slightly disappointed with the '76 version. The 1923 frieze is major league, the 1976 is AA quality and the new obahmanation is high school. But in the Yankees defense, many fans don't care much about the frieze, they just want to win. Our problem is we love baseball and architecture. Also, most everybody going to games never saw the old stuff in person, will never know what they didn't see and therefore can't miss it. The naysayers in that gate 2 story are just plain good old fashioned lying. No matter how hard people try to make the old stadium go away, it's legend is going to keep growing and will be more prominent in it's demise than it is now. OYS has a life of it's own and cannot be destroyed.

Very well said, builder! :thumbsup:

[locke40]

That cement frieze is light years ahead of the new stuff. I remember being slightly disappointed with the '76 version. The 1923 frieze is major league, the 1976 is AA quality and the new obahmanation is high school. But in the Yankees defense, many fans don't care much about the frieze, they just want to win. Our problem is we love baseball and architecture. Also, most everybody going to games never saw the old stuff in person, will never know what they didn't see and therefore can't miss it. The naysayers in that gate 2 story are just plain good old fashioned lying. No matter how hard people try to make the old stadium go away, it's legend is going to keep growing and will be more prominent in it's demise than it is now. OYS has a life of it's own and cannot be destroyed.

And this Pre-Renovation thread (and all the other Yankee Stadium threads) is a very good testament to what you just said.