Unassisted Triple plays?

[brett]

Two questions that I came across today.

1) I heard it stated that a triple play could be recorded even if there was already one out to start the play. The scenario was:

Runners on second and third and one out, the hitter pops it up to the catcher. The runner from third breaks for home and leaves early. The ball is caught. The runner scores and the catcher tags the runner going from second to third after the score and then steps on third to eliminate the run. Is that scored as a triple play ie are their 3 putouts on a play like that? If so, in theory a TP could even occur on a play that begins with 2 outs.

2) I also heard that their have been 13 unassisted triple plays, most of which were completed by the shortstop, with some by second base and 1 by first base and that no one has recorded a triple play from any other position. I though I read that Tris Speaker got one from center field.

Does anyone have the breakdown of unassisted triple plays by position, or possibly a complete list?


Thanks.

[Macker]

A list of triple plays can be found here:

http://www.baseball-almanac.com/feats/feats8.shtml

Two have been made by first basemen. Tris Speaker made several unassisted double plays, but never an unassisted triple play. Some accounts will say center fielder Paul Hines of Providence made one in 1878, but that was not unassisted. Hines caught a sinking liner, ran in to touch third, and threw to second for the third out.

As for making a triple play after one out is already made, the only way it can happen is to recognize the 'fourth out rule.' However, that's just a case when the defense uses the fourth out to replace the third out. There isn't an additonal putout credited; the defense just chooses to accept one putout over an other, which negates the third putout. With one out before the play happens, it's just an unassisted double play.

[Rockhound]

Earlier this season, rookie Troy Tulowitzki turned an awsome unassisted triple play. I voted that play as 'Best Play of the Year' on MLB.com

[Utter Chaos]

Here's an excellent site for triple play information: http://tripleplays.sabr.org/

[Brooklyn]

How about this situation: Second and third, one out. Batter strikes out, runs to first. Runner from third is tagged out trying to score. Catcher then throws to third, to tag out runner from second. Inning over. Three outs are recorded, but I wouldn't consider this a triple play, either

[Macker]

Three outs are recorded, but I wouldn't consider this a triple play, either

But three outs aren't recorded. The batter is charged with a strikeout, but nobody is credited with a putout. The batter would count as being left on base.

[brett]

But three outs aren't recorded. The batter is charged with a strikeout, but nobody is credited with a putout. The batter would count as being left on base.

What if he never made it to first base?

[brett]

As for making a triple play after one out is already made, the only way it can happen is to recognize the 'fourth out rule.' However, that's just a case when the defense uses the fourth out to replace the third out. There isn't an additonal putout credited; the defense just chooses to accept one putout over an other, which negates the third putout. With one out before the play happens, it's just an unassisted double play.

I've got one:

One out and the bases loaded.

Pop up to the catcher.

ALL 3 runners leave early and all of them score.

Since the tag plays are not forceouts, all three runners have to be put out to prevent their runs from counting.

The pop up caught gets superceded by the other outs also (right?)

Interestingly the pop up out has to exist for the players to be in jeopardy of the tag play.

[Macker]

What if he never made it to first base?

It doesn't matter. To balance the box score, he counts as left on base. If there are two outs and a runner on first, and the batter grounds to the shortstop for a force at second, the batter might stop halfway to first, but he's counted as left on base.