Tommy McCarthy?

[Chickazoola]

Who out there can defend his selection? And why was he elected so early on(1946)?

My understanding is that he allegedly invented the hit & run, and he formed the famed 'Heavenly Twins' outfield with Hugh Duffy. His best offensive years aren't particularly good and were infrequent, and he had a very short career.

My theory is that Hugh Duffy might have had something to do with it, as he was elected in 1945, and was still living at the time, and he was still involved in baseball too, I believe he was working for the Red Sox. He was a popular figure in Boston, and could have helped draw attention to his former teammate. But this is pure speculation.

Let's discuss Tommy McCarthy.

[jalbright]

I'm not going to defend the selection, because based on what I know, I don't buy the argument for him. However from the baseballlibrary.com entry on him:


McCarthy is credited with perfecting, if not inventing, the hit-and-run; runner-to-batter signals; and an outfield trap, designed to freeze forced baserunners, where if the runner stayed on base McCarthy would trap the ball and get at least a forceout and possibly a double play.


Even if this is so, IMO he could only earn induction as an innovator, rather than as a player, which is how he is credited. Seems to me he was a very heady player in the early days of the game, when many strategies were being discovered and adopted. That's to his credit, but I can't see it as HOF material unless there's a heck of a lot more.

Jim Albright

[Fuzzy Bear]

Even if this is so, IMO he could only earn induction as an innovator, rather than as a player, which is how he is credited. Seems to me he was a very heady player in the early days of the game, when many strategies were being discovered and adopted. That's to his credit, but I can't see it as HOF material unless there's a heck of a lot more.

Jim Albright

McCarthy actually gives George Kelly competition as the worst HOFer there is.

McCarthy's selection, from various sources I have read, was a result of the Old-Timers Committee of the 1940s making large numbers of inductions, in part because the writers of that period didn't seem to want to induct ANYBODY. This is how the gray area of the HOF started. McCarthy was elected by guys who were his pals and peers who were still alive. I guarantee you that if the writers were inducting worthy candidates at that time, the Old-Timers Committee would have made fewer inductions, and McCarthy would NOT be a HOFer.

McCarthy is a guy who MIGHT have a case if he (A) played CENTER field, (B) won MULTIPLE GOLD GLOVES, (C) had a longer career, and (D) posted the same numbers in a tighter offensive context. McCarthy was a good player, but nothing more.

I understand that McCarthy had some "fame" in his day. This may have played a role in his selection, but I'm not sure as to the extent of his "fame" while active.

[Dodgerfan1]

McCarthy actually gives George Kelly competition as the worst HOFer there is.

McCarthy's selection, from various sources I have read, was a result of the Old-Timers Committee of the 1940s making large numbers of inductions, in part because the writers of that period didn't seem to want to induct ANYBODY. This is how the gray area of the HOF started. McCarthy was elected by guys who were his pals and peers who were still alive. I guarantee you that if the writers were inducting worthy candidates at that time, the Old-Timers Committee would have made fewer inductions, and McCarthy would NOT be a HOFer.

McCarthy is a guy who MIGHT have a case if he (A) played CENTER field, (B) won MULTIPLE GOLD GLOVES, (C) had a longer career, and (D) posted the same numbers in a tighter offensive context. McCarthy was a good player, but nothing more.

I understand that McCarthy had some "fame" in his day. This may have played a role in his selection, but I'm not sure as to the extent of his "fame" while active.

IMO, Rick Ferrell is in the top ten of the worst HOFers (PLAYERS ONLY). Here is my list of players who have no business in the Hall. I may or may not slide them up or down a couple notches depending on my mood, but this is pretty much my list. I also may have overlooked someone who deserves to be here.

People who know my opinion, know that I am a purist who believes the Hall of Fame should be reserved for all-time great players, not very good players. IMHO, nobody on this list was an all-time great player. After the first seven or eight, the rest are pretty much interchangeable. You can throw all the sabermetrics at me you want and break down their stats comparable to their era. I don't care about that. None of these guys are HOFers.

I also don't know enough about the Negro Leagues to offer an opinion at this time.

All Relief pitchers (Too one-dimensional. Don't play often enough to be an all-time great, IMO)
Tommy McCarthy
Candy Cummings
Eppa Rixey
Joe Tinker
Bobby Wallace
Fred Lindstrom
Johnny Evers
Jesse Haines
Rabbit Maranville
Rick Ferrell
Bill Mazeroski
Red Ruffing
Ray Schalk
George Kelly
Red Schoendienst
Early Wynn
Phil Rizzuto
George Kell
Luis Aparicio
Travis Jackson
Dave Bancroft
Bobby Doerr
Nellie Fox
Don Sutton
Harry Hooper
Tony Lazzeri
Lloyd Waner
Vic Willis
Elmer Flick