BBF Mock HoF Election: 2010

[DoubleX]

Welcome to Baseball Fever's Mock HoF Election for 2010. The goal of this project is to conduct Hall of Fame elections from 1979-2011, as if we were the BBWAA, and then compare our results to the actual BBWAA results (obviously, there will be no comparisons to the BBWAA for elections after 2007). For the most part, we will proceed just like BBWAA does. 1979 was selected as the start year because that is when the BBWAA elections first implemented the 5% rule (though it was not always adhered to).

This post will provide three things:

1) The Format and Rules

2) A Guide for the 2010 Election


Format and Rules
- The BBF ballot will consist of the same players that were on the BBWAA ballot, except for in instances where we have elected, dropped, or sustained on the ballot different players than the BBWAA (which will likely be quite a few).

- Voters may vote for between 0-10 candidates. A "None of the Above" option is available if you believe no one is worthy and you wish to submit a blank ballot.

- Adjusting Ballots: Anyone who votes for more than 10 candidates will have all their votes discounted unless they inform me within 48 hours of submitting their vote (or the close of the election, whichever comes first) of the mistake and which players they wish to discount. In such a situation, if I am not informed of the players to be dropped, I will discount that voter's entire ballot. If a voter habitually submits a ballot with more than 10 players, they risk having their votes discounted in all present and future elections. Otherwise, there will be no adjusting ballots after submitted, even if you forgot to vote for someone you meant to vote for or clicked on the wrong player. So please think carefully about your ballot before voting and make sure you have selected everyone you intend to vote for (up to 10).

- 75% support or greater will elect a player. Players receiving less than 5% will be dropped from all future elections (even if in reality, that player was included in future BBWAA elections). Players receiving 5% or more but less than 75% will stay on the ballot for the next election, unless that player's 15-year eligibility is over.

- The election will close exactly a week after it started. The next election might not commence for another day or two.

- IMPORTANT: There is some concern about voters defrauding this process by voting with multiple screen names. First, please don't as there is really no point and it takes the fun out of this which is to see how we come out, more than it being a heated competition to get your player elected. Nevertheless, to take precaution against the possibility of a voter abusing the process, votes will be made public, so if we see unfamiliar screen names casting similar ballots, we'll see cause for concern, and if the concern proves to be founded, some form of punitive action could follow. So basically, ONE PERSON = ONE BALLOT. Anything else is really just moronic and defeats the purpose.

- Also, in the interest of making this process as genuine as possible, I strongly urge voters to not view the results before they vote, as viewing results before voting could influence a person's votes (perhaps subconsciously).

- This thread is also meant to be a discussion thread, so please feel free to stump for and/or against players, including players that will come up for election in the following year.


2010 Guide
There are 38 candidates on the 2010 BBF ballot. Here's some information regarding the candidates:

First Timers (23)
Roberto Alomar
Kevin Appier
Andy Ashby
Rod Beck
Dave Burba
Ellis Burks
Mike Fetters
Andres Galarraga
Pat Hentgen
Sterling Hitchcock
Mike Jackson
Eric Karros
Ray Lankford
Barry Larkin
Edgar Martinez
Fred McGriff
Mark McLemore
Shane Reynolds
David Segui
Robin Ventura
Fernando Vina
Turk Wendell
Todd Zeile

Holdovers (15)
Player Year of Eligibility High BBF Support Previous Year’s BBF Support
Albert Belle 5th 46.51% (2008) 35.56%
Will Clark 5th 30.23% (2008) 28.89%
Dave Cone 2nd 6.67% (2009) 6.67%
Andre Dawson 9th 58.33% (2004) 55.56%
Dwight Evans 14th 31.11% (2009) 31.11%
Keith Hernandez 15th 47.06% (1998) 33.33%
Fred Lynn 15th 18.92% (1997) 6.67%
Mark McGwire 4th 53.49% (2008) 42.22%
Jack Morris 11th 25.00% (2000) 11.11%
Dale Murphy 12th 58.33% (2000/2004) 44.44%
Dave Parker 14th 40.54% (1997) 37.78%
Dan Quisenberry 15th 37.78% (2009) 37.78%
Lee Smith 8th 21.21% (2003) 15.56%
Mo Vaughn 2nd 6.67% (2009) 6.67%
Lou Whitaker 10th 69.77% (2008) 60.00%

Last Year of Eligibility (3)
Keith Hernandez
Fred Lynn
Dan Quisenberry

Penultimate Year of Eligibility (2)
Dwight Evans
Dave Parker

Players on BBF Ballot that Will Not be on BBWAA Ballot (7)
Albert Belle – Dropped by BBWAA (2007)
Will Clark – Dropped by BBWAA (2006)
Dwight Evans – Dropped by BBWAA (1999)
Keith Hernandez – Dropped by BBWAA (2004)
Fred Lynn – Dropped by BBWAA (1997)
Dan Quisenberry – Dropped by BBWAA (1996)
Lou Whitaker – Dropped by BBWAA (2001)

Players that Might Be On BBWAA Ballot but Not On BBF Ballot (5)
Harold Baines – Dropped by BBF (2007)
Bert Blyleven - Elected by BBF (1998)
Goose Gossage – Elected by BBF (2000)
Rickey Henderson – Elected by BBF (2009)
Don Mattingly – Dropped by BBF (2002)
Tim Raines – Elected by BBF (2009)
Alan Trammell – Elected by BBF (2008)

Players Elected by BBF between 1979-2009 (56)
Player BBF Election Year BBF Election Percentage Year on Ballot
Hank Aaron 1982 100.00% 1st
Dick Allen 1985 75.00% 3rd
Luis Aparicio 1990 76.47% 12th
Richie Ashburn 1979 75.41% 12th (1st for BBF)
Johnny Bench 1989 95.12% 1st
Bert Blyleven 1998 82.35% 1st
Wade Boggs 2005 83.78% 1st
George Brett 1999 96.97% 1st
Lou Brock 1988 76.19% 4th
Rod Carew 1991 86.05% 1st
Gary Carter 1998 82.35% 1st
Steve Carlton 1994 94.12% 1st
Orlando Cepeda 1984 79.03% 5th
Don Drysdale 1983 79.03% 9th (5th for BBF)
Dennis Eckersley 2005 78.38% 2nd
Rollie Fingers 1991 76.47% 4th
Carlton Fisk 1999 93.94% 1st
Bob Gibson 1981 89.83% 1st
Goose Gossage 2000 80.56% 1st
Tony Gwynn 2007 95.00% 1st
Rickey Henderson 2009 91.11% 2st
Reggie Jackson 1993 97.62% 1st
Fergie Jenkins 1989 82.93% 1st
Al Kaline 1980 90.32% 1st
Harmon Killebrew 1981 93.22% 1st
Juan Marichal 1981 79.66% 1st
Willie Mays 1979 98.36% 1st
Willie McCovey 1986 100.00% 1st
Minnie Minoso 1990 76.47% 5th
Paul Molitor 2004 83.33% 1st
Joe Morgan 1990 88.24% 1st
Eddie Murray 2003 87.88% 1st
Phil Niekro 1993 80.85% 1st
Jim Palmer 1990 80.39% 1st
Gaylord Perry 1989 80.49% 1st
Kirby Puckett 2006 76.19% 6th
Tim Raines 2009 80.00% 2nd
Cal Ripken Jr 2007 90.00% 1st
Brooks Robinson 1983 88.71% 1st
Frank Robinson 1982 100.00% 1st
Nolan Ryan 1999 93.94% 1st
Ryne Sandberg 2003 87.88% 1st
Ron Santo 1980 82.26% 1st
Mike Schmidt 1995 95.35% 1st
Tom Seaver 1992 97.62% 1st
Ted Simmons 2006 77.50% 14th
Ozzie Smith 2002 81.58% 1st
Duke Snider 1979 83.61% 10th (1st for BBF)
Willie Stargell 1988 88.10% 1st
Don Sutton 1996 78.95% 3rd
Alan Trammell 2008 76.74% 7th
Hoyt Wilhelm 1979 77.05% 2nd (1st for BBF)
Billy Williams 1982 80.00% 1st
Dave Winfield 2002 92.59% 2nd
Carl Yastrzemski 1989 92.68% 1st
Robin Yount 1999 93.94% 1st

Players Elected by BBF by Position
Catcher (4): Johnny Bench, Gary Carter, Carlton Fisk, Ted Simmons
First Base (5): Dick Allen, Orlando Cepeda, Harmon Killebrew, Willie McCovey, Eddie Murray
Second Base (3): Rod Carew, Joe Morgan, Ryne Sandberg
Shortstop (5): Luis Aparicio, Cal Ripken Jr, Ozzie Smith, Alan Trammell, Robin Yount
Third Base (5): Wade Boggs, George Brett, Brooks Robinson, Ron Santo, Mike Schmidt
Left Field (7): Lou Brock, Rickey Henderson, Minnie Minoso, Tim Raines, Willie Stargell, Billy Williams, Carl Yastrzemski
Center Field (4): Richie Ashburn, Willie Mays, Kirby Puckett, Duke Snider
Right Field (6): Hank Aaron, Tony Gwynn, Reggie Jackson, Al Kaline, Frank Robinson, Dave Winfield
Designated Hitter (1): Paul Molitor

Starting Pitcher (12): Bert Blyleven, Steve Carlton, Don Drysdale, Bob Gibson, Fergie Jenkins, Juan Marichal, Phil Niekro, Jim Palmer, Gaylord Perry, Nolan Ryan, Tom Seaver, Don Sutton
Relief Pitcher (4): Dennis Eckersley, Rollie Fingers, Goose Gossage, Hoyt Wilhelm

Players Elected by BBWAA between 1979-2007 (48)
Player BBWAA Election Year BBWAA Election Percentage Year on Ballot
Hank Aaron 1982 97.83% 1st
Luis Aparicio 1984 84.62% 6th
Johnny Bench 1989 96.42% 1st
Wade Boggs 2005 91.90% 1st
George Brett 1999 98.19% 1st
Lou Brock 1985 79.75% 1st
Rod Carew 1991 90.52% 1st
Steve Carlton 1994 95.61% 1st
Gary Carter 2003 78.00% 6th
Don Drysdale 1984 78.41% 10th
Rollie Fingers 1992 81.16% 2nd
Dennis Eckersley 2004 83.20% 1st
Carlton Fisk 2000 79.56% 1st
Bob Gibson 1981 84.04% 1st
Tony Gwynn 2007 97.60% 1st
Catfish Hunter 1987 76.27% 3rd
Reggie Jackson 1993 93.62% 1st
Fergie Jenkins 1991 75.40% 3rd
Al Kaline 1980 88.31% 1st
Harmon Killebrew 1984 83.13% 4th
Juan Marichal 1983 83.69% 3rd
Willie Mays 1979 94.68% 1st
Willie McCovey 1986 81.41% 1st
Paul Molitor 2004 85.20% 1st
Joe Morgan 1990 81.76% 1st
Eddie Murray 2003 85.30% 1st
Phil Niekro 1997 80.34% 5th
Jim Palmer 1990 92.57% 1st
Tony Perez 2000 77.15% 1st
Gaylord Perry 1991 77.20% 3rd
Kirby Puckett 2001 82.10% 1st
Cal Ripken Jr 2007 98.50% 1st
Brooks Robinson 1983 91.98% 1st
Frank Robinson 1982 89.10% 1st
Nolan Ryan 1999 98.79% 1st
Ryne Sandberg 2005 76.20% 3rd
Mike Schmidt 1995 96.52% 1st
Tom Seaver 1992 98.84% 1st
Ozzie Smith 2002 91.70% 1st
Duke Snider 1980 86.49% 11th
Willie Stargell 1988 82.44% 1st
Bruce Sutter 2006 76.90% 13th
Don Sutton 1998 81.61% 5th
Hoyt Wilhelm 1985 83.80% 8th
Billy Williams 1987 85.71% 6th
Dave Winfield 2001 84.50% 1st
Carl Yastrzemski 1989 94.63% 1st
Robin Yount 1999 77.46% 1st

BBF/BBWAA Election Ratio (1979-2007)
53:48

Players Elected by Year between 1979-2009 (BBF and BBWAA)
Year BBF (54) BBWAA (48)
1979 Richie Ashburn Willie Mays
Duke Snider
Hoyt Wilhelm
Willie Mays
1980 Al Kaline Al Kaline
Ron Santo Duke Snider
1981 Bob Gibson Bob Gibson
Harmon Killebrew
Juan Marichal
1982 Hank Aaron Hank Aaron
Frank Robinson Frank Robinson
Billy Williams
1983 Don Drysdale Juan Marichal
Brooks Robinson Brooks Robinson
1984 Orlando Cepeda Luis Aparicio
Don Drysdale
Harmon Killebrew
1985 Dick Allen Lou Brock
Hoyt Wilhelm
1986 Willie McCovey Willie McCovey
1987 None Caftish Hunter
Billy Williams
1988 Lou Brock Willie Stargell
Willie Stargell
1989 Johnny Bench Johnny Bench
Fergie Jenkins Carl Yastrzemski
Gaylord Perry
Carl Yastrzemski
1990 Luis Aparicio Joe Morgan
Minnie Minoso Jim Palmer
Joe Morgan
Jim Palmer
1991 Rod Carew Rod Carew
Fergie Jenkins
Gaylord Perry
1992 Tom Seaver Rollie Fingers
Tom Seaver
1993 Reggie Jackson Reggie Jackson
Phil Niekro
1994 Steve Carlton Steve Carlton
Rollie Fingers
1995 Mike Schmidt Mike Schmidt
1996 Don Sutton None
1997 None Phil Niekro
1998 Bert Blyeven Don Sutton
Gary Carter
1999 George Brett George Brett
Carlton Fisk Nolan Ryan
Nolan Ryan Robin Yount
Robin Yount
2000 Goose Gossage Carlton Fisk
Tony Perez
2001 None Kirby Puckett
Dave Winfield
2002 Ozzie Smith Ozzie Smith
Dave Winfield
2003 Eddie Murray Eddie Murray
Ryne Sandberg Gary Carter
2004 Paul Molitor Dennis Eckersley
Paul Molitor
2005 Wade Boggs Wade Boggs
Dennis Eckersley Ryne Sandberg
2006 Kirby Puckett Bruce Sutter
2007 Tony Gwynn Ton Gwynn
Cal Ripken Jr Cal Ripken Jr
Ted Simmons
2008 Alan Trammell n/a
2009 Rickey Henderson n/a
Tim Raines

Players Elected by BBF but not BBWAA between 1979-2007 (8)
Dick Allen (1985)
Richie Ashburn (1979) - Elected by VC (1995)
Bert Blyleven (1998)
Orlando Cepeda (1984) - Elected by VC (1999)
Goose Gossage (2000)
Minnie Minoso (1990)
Ron Santo (1980)
Ted Simmons (2007)

Players Elected by BBWAA but not BBF between 1979-2007 (3)
Catfish Hunter (1987)
Tony Perez (2000)
Bruce Sutter (2006)

Players Dropped by BBF After 15 Years on Ballot (29)
Player Year Dropped High BBF Support
Sal Bando 2001 19.57% (1987)
Bobby Bonds 2001 28.26% (1987)
Ken Boyer 1989 33.33% (1986)
Jim Bunning 1991 69.57% (1987)
Norm Cash 1994 20.95% (1994)
Darrell Evans 2009 35.14% (1997)
Curt Flood 1991 16.28% (1991)
Nellie Fox 1985 67.31% (1985)
Bill Freehan 1996 50.00 (1996)
Steve Garvey 1997 27.32% (1997)
Bobby Grich 2006 55.88% (1998)
Gil Hodges 1983 27.42% (1980/1983)
Frank Howard 1993 30.95% (1993)
Catfish Hunter 1999 39.53% (1991)
Tommy John 2009 30.23% (1995)
Jim Kaat 2003 34.88% (1995)
Ted Kluszewski 1981 9.68% (1980)
Bill Mazeroski 1992 50.00% (1992)
Don Newcombe 1980 12.90% (1980)
Tony Oliva 1996 36.96% (1987)
Tony Perez 2006 48.15% (2002)
Jim Rice 2009 50.00% (1998)
Red Schoendienst 1983 25.81% (1983)
Enos Slaughter 1979 45.90% (1979)
Reggie Smith 2002 27.91% (1991)
Bruce Sutter 2008 46.51% (2008)
Luis Tiant 2002 40.48% (1988)
Joe Torre 1997 62.16% (1997)
Jimmy Wynn 1997 34.62% (1985)

Players Heldover by BBF but Dropped Before Eligibility Ended (27)
Player (Year Dropped) Years on Ballot High BBF Support
Vida Blue (1993) 2 11.90% (1992)
Jay Buhner (2008) 2 5.00% (2007)
Jose Canseco (2008) 2 5.00% (2007)
Joe Carter (2007) 4 10.81% (2005)
Dave Concepcion (1999) 6 17.65% (1994)
Rick Dempsey (1999) 2 5.88% (1998)
George Foster (2003) 12 14.29% (1992)
Ron Guidry (2000) 7 18.92% (1997)
Orel Hershiser (2007) 2 9.52% (2006)
Willie Horton (1988) 3 6.52% (1987)
Elston Howard (1981) 8 (3 for BBF) 11.29% (1980)
Don Larsen (1980) 7 (2 for BBF) 6.56% (1979)
Sparky Lyle (1989) 2 7.14% (1988)
Roger Maris (1982) 9 (4 for BBF) 16.13% (1979)
Don Mattingly (2002) 2 13.51% (2001)
Thurman Munson (1989) 9 17.39% (1987)
Graig Nettles (2002) 9 27.78% (2000)
Al Oliver (1993) 3 11.63% (1991)
Amos Otis (1991) 2 5.88% (1990)
Lance Parrish (2002) 2 8.11% (2001)
Vada Pinson (1983) 3 13.56% (1981)
Boog Powell (1992) 10 17.74% (1984)
Bret Saberhagen (2008) 2 5.00% (2007)
Rusty Staub (1992) 2 6.98% (1991)
Dave Stieb (2005) 2 5.56% (2004)
Gene Tenace (1992) 4 7.32% (1989)
Maury Wills (1990) 12 (11 for BBF) 16.13% (1984)

Number of Ballots Submitted in Past BBF Elections
1979: 61
1980: 62
1981: 59
1982: 55
1983: 62
1984: 62
1985: 52
1986: 51
1987: 46
1988: 42
1989: 41
1990: 51
1991: 43
1992: 42
1993: 42
1994: 34
1995: 42
1996: 38
1997: 37
1998: 34
1999: 33
2000: 36
2001: 37
2002: 27
2003: 33
2004: 36
2005: 37
2006: 42
2007: 40
2008: 44
2009: 45

Links to Past BBF Elections
1979 (http://www.baseball-fever.com/showthread.php?t=56114&highlight=Mock+Election)
1980 (http://www.baseball-fever.com/showthread.php?t=56470&highlight=Mock+Election)
1981 (http://www.baseball-fever.com/showthread.php?t=56809&highlight=Mock+Election)
1982 (http://www.baseball-fever.com/showthread.php?t=57089&highlight=Mock+Election)
1983 (http://www.baseball-fever.com/showthread.php?t=57376)
1984 (http://www.baseball-fever.com/showthread.php?t=57694)
1985 (http://baseball-fever.com/showthread.php?t=58020)
1986 (http://baseball-fever.com/showthread.php?t=58308)
1987 (http://baseball-fever.com/showthread.php?t=58590)
1988 (http://baseball-fever.com/showthread.php?t=58882)
1989 (http://baseball-fever.com/showthread.php?t=59147)
1990 (http://baseball-fever.com/showthread.php?t=59516)
1991 (http://baseball-fever.com/showthread.php?t=59900)
1992 (http://baseball-fever.com/showthread.php?t=60287)
1993 (http://baseball-fever.com/showthread.php?t=60589)
1994 (http://baseball-fever.com/showthread.php?t=60982)
1995 (http://www.baseball-fever.com/showthread.php?t=61296)
1996 (http://baseball-fever.com/showthread.php?t=61617)
1997 (http://www.baseball-fever.com/showthread.php?t=62106)
1998 (http://www.baseball-fever.com/showthread.php?t=62481)
1999 (http://www.baseball-fever.com/showthread.php?t=63012)
2000 (http://www.baseball-fever.com/showthread.php?t=63473)
2001 (http://www.baseball-fever.com/showthread.php?t=64011)
2002 (http://www.baseball-fever.com/showthread.php?p=952844#post952844)
2003 (http://www.baseball-fever.com/showthread.php?t=64872)
2004 (http://baseball-fever.com/showthread.php?t=65361)
2005 (http://www.baseball-fever.com/showthread.php?t=65822)
2006 (http://http://www.baseball-fever.com/showthread.php?p=985274#post985274)
2007 (http://www.baseball-fever.com/showthread.php?t=66756)
2008 (http://www.baseball-fever.com/showthread.php?t=67132)
2009 (http://www.baseball-fever.com/showthread.php?t=67448)

[DoubleX]

I think this is a pretty interesting year as we have a number of intriguing newcomers. Headlining the class is Roberto Alomar and Barry Larkin, after that, I imagine guys like Fred McGriff and Edgar Martinez will stir plenty of debate, then even after that, we have a number of solid candidates led by Andres Galarraga and Robin Ventura.

As for holdovers, we lost three to eligiblity in Darrell Evans, Tommy John and Jim Rice, and we have three more who are in their last year this year - Keith Hernandez, Fred Lynn, and Dan Quisenberry. All three need a good deal of support to get over the hump. Next year will be the last year for Dwight Evans and Dave Parker. Lou Whitaker seems to be in the best position among holdovers to get elected, but after receiving just under 70% in 2008, he fell back to 60% last yeaer. Andre Dawson was the only other holdover to receive over 50% last year.

[KCGHOST]

Alomar
Larkin
Martinez
Quiz
Whitaker

[Brad Harris]

Alomar
Belle
Clark
Larkin
Martinez
McGriff
McGwire
Murphy
Parker
Whitaker

[dgarza]

1. Mark McGwire
2. Roberto Alomar
3. Albert Belle
4. Edgar Martinez
5. Dale Murphy
6. Dave Parker
7. Andre Dawson
8. Lee Smith
9. Dan Quisenberry
10. Keith Hernandez

[MadHatter]

Wow... I'm in awe and shock that Tim Raines made it in last season.

[PVNICK]

Dawson
Dwight Evans
Hernandez
Larkin
Morris
Parker
Whitaker

[Brad Harris]

Wow... I'm in awe and shock that Tim Raines made it in last season.

Says a guy who once voted for Everett Scott. :laugh

[DoubleX]

Bump..........

[Captain Cold Nose]

Wow... I'm in awe and shock that Tim Raines made it in last season.

I kind of am, too. We have plenty of pontificators on this site, but there always seem to be enough dissension to do away with people who so many see as well-ahead of the HOF curve.

[DoubleX]

Apparently, baseball-reference does not have a page listing players that retired in 2005. I guess it's too recent. So sadly, this might be the last election.

EDIT: This is a list of some eligible players at the Baseball Hall of Fame website. However, it's likely that this an incomplete list, so does anyone have suggestions on players that should be added?

Wilson Alvarez
Carlos Baerga
Jeff Bagwell
Bret Boone
Kevin Brown
John Franco
Juan Gonzalez
Marquis Grissom
Mike Hampton
Al Leiter
Tino Martinez
Raul Mondesi
Hideo Nomo
John Olerud
Rafael Palmeiro
Benito Santiago
Ugueth Urbina
Larry Walker

I also wouldn't be surprised if a couple of these players play again, notably Mike Hampton and Juan Gonzalez.

[leecemark]

Jeff Bagwell
Kevin Brown
John Franco
John Olerud
Rafael Palmeiro
Benito Santiago
Larry Walker

---The above are definately retired and ballot worthy. We should be able to squeeze out at least 1 more year of voting.

[Freakshow]

does anyone have suggestions on players that should be added?

Wilson Alvarez
Carlos Baerga
Jeff Bagwell
Bret Boone
Kevin Brown
John Franco
Juan Gonzalez
Marquis Grissom
Mike Hampton
Al Leiter
Tino Martinez
Raul Mondesi
Hideo Nomo
John Olerud
Rafael Palmeiro
Benito Santiago
Ugueth Urbina
Larry Walker

I also wouldn't be surprised if a couple of these players play again, notably Mike Hampton and Juan Gonzalez.
I had previously researched this for the Hall of Merit. Like you, I welcome any additions/deletions that others may discover. That is, I don't guarantee it's a complete list, and it's subject to change if players return. (Don't worry about returnees; we all understand that this is just where the new eligible list stands now, at the end of the 2007 season.)

Having said that, there are four players I found that seem worthy to add:

BJ Surhoff
Jose Offerman
Ismael Valdez
Paul Quantrill

Others of lesser quality include Steve Reed, Kirk Rueter, Buddy Groom and Greg Myers.

[leecemark]

--If you are of lesser quality than Jose Offerman and Ishmeal Valdez I don't think you can really complain about not being discussued in regards to the Hall of Fame. That discussion can't possibly be falttering to you. Not that it matters, but I think that should be Paul Quantrill.

[DoubleX]

I guess we'll go ahead and I'll use the Hall of Fame's list plus the four players Freakshow mentioned. Though I don't think I'll include Mike Hampton as I believe there is a pretty decent chance he'll come back. Juan Gonzalez is really the only other player that I can see returning, but I think it's doubtful at this point.

[Freakshow]

Yes, Paul Quantrill, not Phil.

As for excluding Hampton, or anyone else, I think we should treat him based on his current status; his major league career ended on August 19, 2005.

Most players don't retire. They're forced out due to injury or poor play. Little by little, they accept the fact that the phone's never going to ring, that they need to get on with their lives. So, it's hardly shocking that Hampton would be aiming to make another go of it, at age 35.

Rather than speculate on whether he'll make it or not, just treat him based on his current status. There's no harm in placing him on our prospective 2011 BBWAA ballot. Indeed, we're probably including guys who won't pass the ballot screeners; we may be omitting some that they put on. It's understood that when the actual ballot comes out in three years that it may look a bit different than ours.

[DoubleX]

Yes, Paul Quantrill, not Phil.

As for excluding Hampton, or anyone else, I think we should treat him based on his current status; his major league career ended on August 19, 2005.

Most players don't retire. They're forced out due to injury or poor play. Little by little, they accept the fact that the phone's never going to ring, that they need to get on with their lives. So, it's hardly shocking that Hampton would be aiming to make another go of it, at age 35.

Rather than speculate on whether he'll make it or not, just treat him based on his current status. There's no harm in placing him on our prospective 2011 BBWAA ballot. Indeed, we're probably including guys who won't pass the ballot screeners; we may be omitting some that they put on. It's understood that when the actual ballot comes out in three years that it may look a bit different than ours.

Too late - I started it without Hampton.

[Freakshow]

Too late - I started it without Hampton.
I believe you can edit the poll.

[leecemark]

Yes, Paul Quantrill, not Phil.

As for excluding Hampton, or anyone else, I think we should treat him based on his current status; his major league career ended on August 19, 2005.

Most players don't retire. They're forced out due to injury or poor play. Little by little, they accept the fact that the phone's never going to ring, that they need to get on with their lives. So, it's hardly shocking that Hampton would be aiming to make another go of it, at age 35.

Rather than speculate on whether he'll make it or not, just treat him based on his current status. There's no harm in placing him on our prospective 2011 BBWAA ballot. Indeed, we're probably including guys who won't pass the ballot screeners; we may be omitting some that they put on. It's understood that when the actual ballot comes out in three years that it may look a bit different than ours.

--With Hampton it isn't just speculation that he intends to pitch next year. Both he and the Braves expect (or hope is probably the better word) that he will be back in the rotation next year.

[DoubleX]

I believe you can edit the poll.

I could, but Hampton would have to go in at the end as to not upset the results that have already been posted. I think I'm just going to leave it. I'd actually be surprised to not see Hampton make at least one more appearance in the big leagues. He came pretty close to pitching earlier this year before he was finally shut down. He had Tommy John surgery, so it's not that big of a surprise that he's been out for the past two seasons, and it's certainly not out of the realm of possibility that he can come back from it. I also believe that he's under contract for next year, so I'm sure if at some point he's healthy enough to go, the Braves will try to get him out there.

[Freakshow]

I could, but Hampton would have to go in at the end as to not upset the results that have already been posted. I think I'm just going to leave it. I'd actually be surprised to not see Hampton make at least one more appearance in the big leagues. He came pretty close to pitching earlier this year before he was finally shut down. He had Tommy John surgery, so it's not that big of a surprise that he's been out for the past two seasons, and it's certainly not out of the realm of possibility that he can come back from it. I also believe that he's under contract for next year, so I'm sure if at some point he's healthy enough to go, the Braves will try to get him out there.
No problem; that's a pretty good case for excluding him.