Pain but no pain.

[scorekeeper]

While I’m scoring the game tonight, I’m listening to the dad of one of our P’s telling another dad about his son and what’s going on.

It seems his arm is having the same problem it had last year, so he’s shut it down again. Dad describes the problem as a pain, but not a pain because when he doesn't throw, it doesn't hurt. He says its like someone pinches the tricep. He insists there’s nothing wrong, because last year when it happened, they shot the boy full of dye and couldn’t see anything.

So, dad who owns a pest control business, has it all figgered out. He’s gonna train the kid to live with the pain. He makes the boy throw 50-75 pitches every night, and after only 2 weeks, he’s gone from only being able to throw maybe 40MPH, to prolly 60, and is positive in another 3-4 weeks, he’ll be back to 100%, and ready for fall ball. Along with the throwing, he’s lifting weights to strengthen his shoulder, and doing lots of arm exercises.

Comments?

[Jake Patterson]

While I’m scoring the game tonight, I’m listening to the dad of one of our P’s telling another dad about his son and what’s going on.

It seems his arm is having the same problem it had last year, so he’s shut it down again. Dad describes the problem as a pain, but not a pain because when he doesn't throw, it doesn't hurt. He says its like someone pinches the tricep. He insists there’s nothing wrong, because last year when it happened, they shot the boy full of dye and couldn’t see anything.

So, dad who owns a pest control business, has it all figgered out. He’s gonna train the kid to live with the pain. He makes the boy throw 50-75 pitches every night, and after only 2 weeks, he’s gone from only being able to throw maybe 40MPH, to prolly 60, and is positive in another 3-4 weeks, he’ll be back to 100%, and ready for fall ball. Along with the throwing, he’s lifting weights to strengthen his shoulder, and doing lots of arm exercises.

Comments?

Well the good news is he seems to have the appropriate background to be making that decision. Pain is the body's way of saying something's wrong.

[scorekeeper]

Well the good news is he seems to have the appropriate background to be making that decision. Pain is the body's way of saying something's wrong.

LOL!

Isn’t it funny how when the perception is that he activity is very important, so many people suddenly become deaf when the body tries to tell them something?

[hiddengem]

He's just paving the way to give another kid an opportunity.

[scorekeeper]

He's just paving the way to give another kid an opportunity.

Now that’s just flat out bizarre! One of our parents is a recently retired 14 year ML veteran. Not a week ago he was talking to this dad, and told him almost the exact same thing!

Great minds must think alike.
:rofl:

[Baseball gLove]

I heard the father of a competitive pitcher mirror the attitude of the pest control father. I figure it's one less player my son will have to compete against.

[scorekeeper]

I heard the father of a competitive pitcher mirror the attitude of the pest control father. I figure it's one less player my son will have to compete against.

Of course that’s the reality of the way things really are, but wouldn’t it be much more satisfying and better for the game, to be able to flat beat out the competition, rather than have them get DQ’d for something beyond their control?
:noidea

[Baseball gLove]

Of course that’s the reality of the way things really are, but wouldn’t it be much more satisfying and better for the game, to be able to flat beat out the competition, rather than have them get DQ’d for something beyond their control?
:noidea

I don't know why you are turning this back on me. They don't compete for the same position on the field. I can not interfere with the dad who seems to be willing to let his son pitch until his arm falls off. I was disappointed that the kid has thrown 18 innings in one week and the dad's was offering to let him throw some more in an inconsequential game. The kid is a nice kid.

If I was interested in making it easier for my son to make the varsity team, I could have transfered him to one of several schools where he'd easily make the squad.

[scorekeeper]

I don't know why you are turning this back on me. They don't compete for the same position on the field. I can not interfere with the dad who seems to be willing to let his son pitch until his arm falls off. I was disappointed that the kid has thrown 18 innings in one week and the dad's was offering to let him throw some more in an inconsequential game. The kid is a nice kid.

If I was interested in making it easier for my son to make the varsity team, I could have transfered him to one of several schools where he'd easily make the squad.

I wasn’t trying to “turn” anything on you at all. I guess I didn’t read what you thought you wrote. ;-)

When you said: I figure it's one less player my son will have to compete against I assumed you meant they were competing for a spot on the team, not necessarily for the same position. We’ll chalk it up to me only bein’ able to read reain’, not writin’. LOL.

I can certainly understand how you can be “bothered” by a situation like that. You “COULD” interfere, but it sure would very likely at a minimum, get the guy to tell you to mind your own business! Picture what I feel like in my situation. At least you’re kid is on the same team and have that connection. I don’t even have that, so I’m even more helpless than you are.

Not that it makes it any better, were all 18 innings on 1 team and under 1 coach? Good googy moogy! The most my son ever threw in a week was 14 innings, and that was with 4 days rest.

The dads that I worry about aren’t the ones who let the kid go a little overboard once in a while. It’s the one’s who do that kind of thing on a regular basis. And what’s bad is, these aren’t stupid people! they will often recognize abuse/overuse in someone else, but never in themselves!

My comment about beating out the competition was only meant from the standpoint of self satisfaction for the player for a job well done.

[Drill]

So, dad who owns a pest control business, has it all figgered out. He’s gonna train the kid to live with the pain. He makes the boy throw 50-75 pitches every night, and after only 2 weeks, he’s gone from only being able to throw maybe 40MPH, to prolly 60, and is positive in another 3-4 weeks, he’ll be back to 100%, and ready for fall ball. Along with the throwing, he’s lifting weights to strengthen his shoulder, and doing lots of arm exercises.

Comments?


So what is the 800 number to the Orkin pest control baseball training hot line? Maybe we can get Jakes fungo knee taken care of.


drill

[hiddengem]

Now that’s just flat out bizarre! One of our parents is a recently retired 14 year ML veteran. Not a week ago he was talking to this dad, and told him almost the exact same thing!

Great minds must think alike.
:rofl:

Its the truth..Parents in general need to know their limitaions, just like I do as a player. This dad has zero clue about sports medicine and is killing his sons chances. Its just the natural process of elimination.

[Jake Patterson]

So what is the 800 number to the Orkin pest control baseball training hot line? Maybe we can get Jakes fungo knee taken care of.


drill

LOL :eek: .

[scorekeeper]

So what is the 800 number to the Orkin pest control baseball training hot line? Maybe we can get Jakes fungo knee taken care of.

S’all cool! I already sent the guy Jake’s e-mail address, and he’s gonna contact him and take care of that bad knee.

The way I understand it, he’s planning a rehab program of hitting 200 fungos a day, followed by 100 deep knee bends with a 20 pound weight on his back, and finishing with a brisk little 3 mile jaunt to work up a good sweat. That’ll continue until Jake learns to live with the pain. :rofl:

[Baseball gLove]

I wasn’t trying to “turn” anything on you at all. I guess I didn’t read what you thought you wrote. ;-)

I don't see where I wrote that I have the power or control to get anyone DQ'd.


...I can certainly understand how you can be “bothered” by a situation like that. You “COULD” interfere, but it sure would very likely at a minimum, get the guy to tell you to mind your own business! Picture what I feel like in my situation. At least you’re kid is on the same team and have that connection. I don’t even have that, so I’m even more helpless than you are.

Not that it makes it any better, were all 18 innings on 1 team and under 1 coach? Good googy moogy! The most my son ever threw in a week was 14 innings, and that was with 4 days rest.



I can't interfere. The father has his own ideas of arm maintenance. It's high school ball, so I don't talk to the coaches except to say, "It's a nice day for a baseball game."

[scorekeeper]

I don't see where I wrote that I have the power or control to get anyone DQ'd.

You didn’t. Where did I say that you did?

Them getting DQ’d could happen in a myriad of ways, but they would still be DQ’d. All I said was: wouldn’t it be much more satisfying and better for the game, to be able to flat beat out the competition, rather than have them get DQ’d for something beyond their control? There was no implication intended on my part that you would either be the direct or indirect cause of them being disqualified.

A player might be DQ’d because s/he happened to forget to wear the school colors at last Wednesday’s rally, was stopped from competing because they’d farted at the family dinner table with out excusing themselves, was 5 minutes late because of a train wreck, but broke a team rule by being late, or a million other things that had nothing at all to do with displaying baseball skills.

Surely you wouldn't revel in beating out someone who was eliminated from the competition because of silly things like that.

I can't interfere. The father has his own ideas of arm maintenance. It's high school ball, so I don't talk to the coaches except to say, "It's a nice day for a baseball game."

You’re missing what I’m saying. The reality is, if you so chose, you “COULD”, as in “have the ability to” interfere. What you’re saying seems to be that no matter what you said or did, the outcome would be the same, and that would be pointless. In that I wholeheartedly agree.

[Baseball gLove]

I posted this:


I heard the father of a competitive pitcher mirror the attitude of the pest control father. I figure it's one less player my son will have to compete against.

from which you came up with this:

Of course that’s the reality of the way things really are, but wouldn’t it be much more satisfying and better for the game, to be able to flat beat out the competition, rather than have them get DQ’d for something beyond their control?
:noidea

Looks to me that you are blaming me for allowing someone to get DQ'd.

I'd like to know how different is my post from this:

He's (meaning the dad) just paving the way to give another kid an opportunity. It was posted by Hidden Gem.

Because of the reputation of my older son, I can and do influence the dads of my younger son's teammates. I advise those dads to not let their 7 & 8 year olds pitch too much and that their kids shouldn't be throwing curves or split finger pitches until they are in high school. I do tell those dads that it is more important that the kids have fun playing the game rather than stressing out if they make errors. I know I turned one dad from yelling at his kid for not being a pro at 8 years of age. After 10 weeks of positive prodding he truly recognizes that positive coaching gets more out of a kid than negative coaching ever will.

[scorekeeper]

Looks to me that you are blaming me for allowing someone to get DQ'd.

I can’t control how you interpret anything I write. All I can say is, I don’t BLAME you for anything! All I was trying to say is, its seems to me that a truly competitive person would get more satisfaction out of beating everyone by displaying superior skills, than by backing in because the opposition didn’t get to compete.

I'd like to know how different is my post from this:

It was posted by Hidden Gem.

Its different because he wasn’t referring to his son, or any other individual. Perhaps you don’t see that there’s a difference, but I do. One was a very general statement, the other was a very personal one.

Like I said, I can’t control how you interpret what I write. All I can do is say I honestly didn’t mean anything derisive about neither you nor your son, and didn’t meant to insult you or praise HG.

Because of the reputation of my older son, I can and do influence the dads of my younger son's teammates. I advise those dads to not let their 7 & 8 year olds pitch too much and that their kids shouldn't be throwing curves or split finger pitches until they are in high school. I do tell those dads that it is more important that the kids have fun playing the game rather than stressing out if they make errors. I know I turned one dad from yelling at his kid for not being a pro at 8 years of age. After 10 weeks of positive prodding he truly recognizes that positive coaching gets more out of a kid than negative coaching ever will.

The “older” guys having influence is part of the way knowledge is transferred. Since I have no younger son and my son is 10 years removed from 12U ball, very few at that level remember my boy, and thus have no reason to take what I have to say as being any more valid than what anyone else might say.

However, at the HS level around here, it’s a totally different story. I have a reputation, and my son is still known or remembered by may people, and in that venue, I too have some influence. Trouble is, reputation or not, this one particular dad is completely out there in la la land.

But no matter what, at the HSV level, things are far different than at all levels before it. A jerk dad or coach can cause some problems for an 8YO, but there’s still 8-10 years to recover. But when the kid’s a Jr or a Sr, the ability to be able to recover from some kind of BS is pretty much gone, and in that sense its much more serious.

The arm “problem” I mentioned is one of those things that may well not be able to be recovered from. There may well be lots of guys out there who have seen kids not be harmed at all from something like that, because after all, we’re talking about millions of kids. But I strongly suspect that the percentage of kids who “melt down” is a lot higher than those who have unbridled success.

I can’t tell you how many kids I’ve seen at this stage and just beyond who will not risk completely shutting down and getting some true professional medical help because they figure there’s only this one shot, then there is no more. While that’s true to some degree, a 16-18YO can shut down for a whole year, get himself sound again, work his way back into the game and go on from there. But trying to play through pain now, usually means the pain and the condition is gonna get worse, not better.