Steroids?

[brewers96]

Who of these players do you think took steroids. This is multipule choice. Derek Jeter?:disbelief: I know that some of you have your own beliefs of this so express them here.

[SamtheBravesFan]

Some of the choices you have on this list are extremely bizzare. I am certain of some of the usual suspects:

Barry Bonds and Mark McGwire probably used them in the past, based on anecdotal evidence (which I hate using), but Bonds's case is stronger.

Even though Sosa acted like a clown in front of the Congress kangaroo court (what a waste of time) and had that corked bat thing, there is no concrete proof that he took steroids or corked his bat for an extended period of time.

I seriously doubt that any of the other people on the list used steroids. Quite frankly, I have no idea why you included them, especially Ripken, Jr., Rose and Jeter.

[brewers96]

I know that some of you have your own beliefs of this so express them here.
That is why I put it

[Erik Bedard]

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:



:disbelief:

[brewers96]

Ha ha very funny

[SamtheBravesFan]

That is why I put it

Yes, I know, but Babe Ruth? There was no such thing as weight training in Ruth's time, so he couldn't have taken steroids. In fact, the only routine I'm certain of that Ruth partaked in was of food, beer, and women.

[Erik Bedard]

Yes, I know, but Babe Ruth? There was no such thing as weight training in Ruth's time, so he couldn't have taken steroids. In fact, the only routine I'm certain of that Ruth partaked in was of food, beer, and women.
Plenty of people take steroids without lifting weights. And there probably was weight training in Ruth's day.

Hey, did you see Babe Ruth when he came up with the Red Sox? He was a freakin' toothpick!!!!!!!!!! Then he got a whole lot bigger, and started hitting way more HRs than anybody else ever had!!!!!!!!!!! It's SO OBVIOUS that he used PEDs!!!!!!!!!!!! And that thing he had in 1925, stopped him from playing as well as he did every other year? Was that just a normal injury? No way!!!!!!!!! It was OBVIOUSLY because of STEROIDS!!!!!!!! If you disagree then you're just blinding yourself to the obvious truth and you're WRONG!!!!!!!!!!!

[Captain Cold Nose]

There certainly was weight training in Ruth's day. It's not as widespread as it has been the last 30 or so years, but vigorous exercise has been around for thousands of years, and the lifting of some kind of weight has always been a part of it.

Nice rant at the end, btw, EB. Hopefully it will be seen as what it is by our resident Ruth scholars.

[SamtheBravesFan]

There certainly was weight training in Ruth's day. It's not as widespread as it has been the last 30 or so years, but vigorous exercise has been around for thousands of years, and the lifting of some kind of weight has always been a part of it.

Nice rant at the end, btw, EB. Hopefully it will be seen as what it is by our resident Ruth scholars.

That is true. I guess I can say for certainty it wasn't as sophisticated as it is now. And I get EB's rant. Pretty funny. :laugh

[Erik Bedard]

The strange part is that if you change a few specific details, you get this:

Hey, did you see Sammy Sosa when he came up with the Rangers? He was a freakin' toothpick!!!!!!!!!! Then he got a whole lot bigger, and started hitting way more HRs than he ever had!!!!!!!!!!! It's SO OBVIOUS that he used PEDs!!!!!!!!!!!! And that thing he had in 2005, stopped him from playing as well as he did every other year? Was that just a normal injury? No way!!!!!!!!! It was OBVIOUSLY because of STEROIDS!!!!!!!! If you disagree then you're just blinding yourself to the obvious truth and you're WRONG!!!!!!!!!!!

... which some people think is a convincing argument.

[brewers96]

Ok I don't mean to be starting anything here with Ruth fans but I agree he couldn't gain all that wait just from food and beer but it is totally true and nobody knows it

[Captain Cold Nose]

Ok I don't mean to be starting anything here with Ruth fans but I agree he couldn't gain all that wait just from food and beer but it is totally true and nobody knows it

I don't think you are at all. The point of no one being above suspicion is well made.

[slugger33]

I voted Bonds, McGwire, Sosa, and Ripken. All of them should be in the hall though.

[brewers96]

WOW Pujols got two votes so far and Aaron one. Those are two of the three that I thought wouldn't get any votes. ESPN was talking about how that if A-Rod passed Bonds:applaud: he would not get as hated as Aaron did when he passed Ruth which I think is true don't you? anyone?!

[Dogdaze]

I voted Bonds, McGwire, Sosa, and Ripken. All of them should be in the hall though.

Ripken? I highly doubt he was a juicer.

But I'm inclined to agree with you in that even if Bonds, McGwire and Sosa cheated, they were all awsome ball players irregardless and are HOF worthy.

As for if they did or not, I suspect they did, but am not 100% sure, therefore I decided not to vote.

[Dogdaze]

WOW Pujols got two votes so far and Aaron one. Those are two of the three that I thought wouldn't get any votes. ESPN was talking about how that if A-Rod passed Bonds:applaud: he would not get as hated as Aaron did when he passed Ruth which I think is true don't you? anyone?!

Yes I agree. Racial predujice was much more prevelant in Aarons day then today, plus I think many don't want Bonds as the all time HR leader, and therefore will cheer A-Rod on!

And providing A-Rod stays healthy, I believe he will eventually surpass Bonds, whom I believe will break Aarons record in the next few months.

[Skin & Bones]

I still don't understand why Pujols keeps getting lumped in with alleged steroid users. The allegations that his trainer dealed steroids were false, and deadspin apologized for them. The guy who allegedly sold steroids to Grimsley and Segui was Clemens and Pettitte's personal strength coach. Infact, Segui has said on that record that he got steroids from the strength coach. So, why not list them, or other guy's who have actually been linked to the scandal? Why list Pujols for no other reason than him being good? The same could be said for Arod, Aaron, Ruth, Ripken, etc.

[SamtheBravesFan]

I still don't understand why Pujols keeps getting lumped in with alleged steroid users. The allegations that his trainer dealed steroids were false, and deadspin apologized for them. The guy who allegedly sold steroids to Grimsley and Segui was Clemens and Pettitte's personal strength coach. Infact, Segui has said on that record that he got steroids from the strength coach. So, why not list them, or other guy's who have actually been linked to the scandal? Why list Pujols for no other reason than him being good? The same could be said for Arod, Aaron, Ruth, Ripken, etc.

To list someone just because they accumulated lots of power statistics is extremely cynical.

[Skin & Bones]

To list someone just because they accumulated lots of power statistics is extremely cynical.

I agree...

[ReignInBlood]

Roger Clemens

[Seattle1]

In fact, the only routine I'm certain of that Ruth partaked in was of food, beer, and women.

Don't forget about hot dogs. Those were known as P.E.H.D.s (Performance Enhancing Hot Dogs). LOL!



:laugh

[SamtheBravesFan]

Don't forget about hot dogs. Those were known as P.E.H.D.s (Performance Enhancing Hot Dogs). LOL!



:laugh

That goes under the all-encompassing "food". :) Babe ate a LOT. :D

[SamtheBravesFan]

Why is Ripken getting votes? Because he was durable? Well, we may as throw Lou Gehrig in the list too, he couldn't have played 2,130 straight games without "help". XP

[slimfire66]

Every single pro player...tiger's even shooting up now
http://deadspin.com/sports/seriously%2C-golfers-aren.t-supposed-to-look-like-that/golfers-getting-huge-270954.php

[Senior skittles]

luis gonzalez he had 57 hr that one year.......and then his power vanished...seemed kinda fishy

[nerfan]

Ivan Rodriguez

just a hunch

[cosmo34]

I only say Pujols as a possibility of using A.S because he went to Maple Woods. There are many a rumors of Maple Woods players using A.S., even to this day

[hudsonharden]

Looks like a small percentage of us played modern-day Nostradamus on A-Rod.

[Seattle1]

Looks like a small percentage of us played modern-day Nostradamus on A-Rod.

I voted for A-Rod. Must have been the same day in 2007 I posted that joke about Babe Ruth eating hot dogs. Also voted for Pujols on a hunch, we'll see.

[plask_stirlac]

Pujols skyrocketed in 2000-01 so he probably just skipped to HGH and stayed on.

And I don't care if I don't know.

[SamtheBravesFan]

Well, it's certainly interesting to see what I wrote nearly a year and a half ago come back to bite me in the butt. :laugh

I guess the lesson to take here is that we don't really know who used until we get positive tests. Eyeballing only leads to suspicion, and not the actual truth.

[Seattle1]

On 6/22/07, I voted for Bonds, A-Rod, Sosa, McGwire, and Pujols in this poll. I would stand by those votes today although it's yet to be seen on Pujols. I am suspicious though.

[White Knight]

I PRAY it comes out that Ripken used PED's. Please let it happen.

[Brooklyn]

I PRAY it comes out that Ripken used PED's. Please let it happen.

What reason could you possibly have to want that? Did he do something to you or your family?

[SamtheBravesFan]

What reason could you possibly have to want that? Did he do something to you or your family?

I know exactly why he wants it. It would do two things: it would make many sportswriters' heads explode because a beloved player who could do no wrong did what many consider cheating, and it would cement the notion that it's impossible to determine who used just by eyeballing them and/or go by gut feelings.

[Brooklyn]

I know exactly why he wants it. It would do two things: it would make many sportswriters' heads explode because a beloved player who could do no wrong did what many consider cheating, and it would cement the notion that it's impossible to determine who used just by eyeballing them and/or go by gut feelings.

That is a very direct attack on an individual player. I can understand wanting to know exactly who is on the list - I certainly do - but to wish people on the list is over the line.

[SamtheBravesFan]

That is a very direct attack on an individual player. I can understand wanting to know exactly who is on the list - I certainly do - but to wish people on the list is over the line.

In a sense, you're right. I interpreted it as he was attempting to attack a preconvinced notion instead of attacking Ripken.

[sturg1dj]

That is a very direct attack on an individual player. I can understand wanting to know exactly who is on the list - I certainly do - but to wish people on the list is over the line.

depends on how you see steroid use. To be honest, I am one who doesn't care and just wants it to go away. So if that were possible I would have no problem never seeing any of the same. On the other hand for those who think user are just getting what they deserve then I would say it is not a personal attack, it is a call for a player who used to get what is coming to him.


And on a third hand (is that possible?) there are the people, and the above who brought up Ripken would be included, who want people like Ripken (or someone like Ichiro or Jeter or Maddux or Glavine or what about Nolan Ryan) who are still being defended and shoved in our faces as what is good about baseball by people who also say those who used as what is wrong and what is evil, to be shown as users just to move the discussion away from good vs. evil to a more mature discussion where we actually look at why.

[Defense Counts!]

Why isn't Cap Anson on the list?

[White Knight]

I know exactly why he wants it. It would do two things: it would make many sportswriters' heads explode because a beloved player who could do no wrong did what many consider cheating, and it would cement the notion that it's impossible to determine who used just by eyeballing them and/or go by gut feelings.

100% correct, you are good. :) But there is a third reason: If a super-popular player like Ripken used, and since he's already in the HOF, they may be forced to now put Big Mac in where he deserves to go.

[White Knight]

In a sense, you're right. I interpreted it as he was attempting to attack a preconvinced notion instead of attacking Ripken.

Your senses are weak, Jedi. :) No attack on Cal, he's a great role model. That's why I hope he used. PED users can be role models too.

I only named Cal because he's probably the most popular player of the last 20-30 years. I hope Nolan Ryan comes out too.

It would also piss off the elite sportwriters (and people on here) who hate steroids users, but love Cal and Ryan. And I want them pissed off.

Edit: Please let Maddux be a user too.

[SamtheBravesFan]

100% correct, you are good. :) But there is a third reason: If a super-popular player like Ripken used, and since he's already in the HOF, they may be forced to now put Big Mac in where he deserves to go.

That is very plausible.

[SamtheBravesFan]

Your senses are weak, Jedi. :) No attack on Cal, he's a great role model. That's why I hope he used. PED users can be role models too.

I only named Cal because he's probably the most popular player of the last 20-30 years. I hope Nolan Ryan comes out too.

It would also piss off the elite sportwriters (and people on here) who hate steroids users, but love Cal and Ryan. And I want them pissed off.

Edit: Please let Maddux be a user too.

Hall of Famers or sure-fire Hall of Famers on that list would force people's hands on the issue. The voters can't let their self-righteousness keep out a whole generation of players.

[Defense Counts!]

How far do we want to take this speculation?

In 1996 Brady Anderson hit 50 homers and slugged .637

In nine other complete seasons he never hit more than 24 homers or slugged more than .477

So did he take steroids for one year, but stop when he realized they were ruining his love life?

[Seattle1]

So did he take steroids for one year, but stop when he realized they were ruining his love life?

Yeah his balls started shriveling up, and he was like WTF?? F this, it's not worth it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mi-w4EnnJhM

[cardsfanatic]

That is a very direct attack on an individual player. I can understand wanting to know exactly who is on the list - I certainly do - but to wish people on the list is over the line.

How is it any different than the rubes that constantly point fingers at players without any proof whatsoever? I guess it's ok to accuse every player you don't like of being on steroids but it's over the line to hope one of the "OMG, STEROIDZ!" guys have one of their icons fall.