Krod cheating?

[Skin & Bones]

I came across this interesting piece based on a new book about cheating in Baseball...

http://www.zumsteg.net/cheatersguide/2007/04/03/francisco-rodriguez-doctoring-the-ball/

[Old Sweater]

How shocking. A pitcher doctoring a ball and a writer ratting him out to get pulblicity for his Jose Canseco like book.


Myself I hate the Rat more. Pitcher is just doing his job, just have to be more careful now days with all the rats trying to get a story.

[Westlake]

How shocking. A pitcher doctoring a ball and a writer ratting him out to get pulblicity for his Jose Canseco like book.


Myself I hate the Rat more. Pitcher is just doing his job, just have to be more careful now days with all the rats trying to get a story.

And the writer isn't?

[Old Sweater]

And the writer isn't?


Yeah he is if you wanna count being a rat writer a job.


No crap like this was in the papers when I was growing up. If you wanted gossip drama you sneaked a look at the National Enquier at the check out stand in the grocery store.

Of course some of the new breed of baseball fans seem to like the rat gossip drama more then the game itself. When someone go's to the extent of this writer and the cameras of FOX they are going beyond their duty and doing the umpires job, IMO

[Westlake]

Yeah he is if you wanna count being a rat writer a job.


A journalist is, in a way, a watchdog for the public he serves. He is doing his job.

You badly seem to want to let players get away with cheating, why is that?

[Old Sweater]

You badly seem to want to let players get away with cheating, why is that?

It is the job of the Umps and MLB only to catch the cheater's. IMO


It seems you think it is part of the medias job to catch the players cheating and tarnish the game we love. Why is that?

If you was a Umpire making a living for your family, how would you like it if some scandal rat writer was making you look bad at your job. Would you like them following you around and making headline stories if you got caught on your job taking 10 minutes to long on a coffee break or got caught doing some hanky panky?

Do you think it was right for SI to rat out on Pete Rose (whom I hate and admire for what he done on the field) just to sell more magazines?

What about the SI reporter that got John (Red Neck) Rocker drunk and let him shoot off his red neck month. Don't you think he went a bit to far to get a feather in his hat? I'm a hick and I lost more respect for that writer then the young kid shooting off his drunken mouth for saying those disgusting remarks.

Sports reporters should report sports and live up to their title.

Same thing for TV Sports Broadcasting. It's not their job to zoom in on Kenny Rogers hand and grabbing headlines from the greatest show on earth.

Any other part of the media should be tarred and feathered and rode out of town on a rail or get a job at a gossip rag.IMO

[ChrisLDuncan]

K-Rod is cheating by having stuff that filthy.

[MarinersFan51]

maybe hes cheating by throwing his vicous slider, like cheating the laws of physics for having it break that much

agreeeeed, get the rat editors out of baseball

that guy is a clown, with an im always right complex. someone needs to get rid of him, hes hurting the image of our great game

[Westlake]

It seems you think it is part of the medias job to catch the players cheating and tarnish the game we love. Why is that?

I think that if they find something they should report it. I believe journalists are society's watchdog. If the president is covering something very illegal up, do you believe it is ok for a journalist to find out and not
report it? I don't.

If you was a Umpire making a living for your family, how would you like it if some scandal rat writer was making you look bad at your job. Would you like them following you around and making headline stories if you got caught on your job taking 10 minutes to long on a coffee break or got caught doing some hanky panky?

I think cheating during a game is a little more newsworthy than a journalist taking 10 extra minutes during a coffee break. If the umpire is missing the call, then it's his fault, not the guy who figures it out.



Do you think it was right for SI to rat out on Pete Rose (whom I hate and admire for what he done on the field) just to sell more magazines?

Yes, I sure do. That is their job. I don't believe it letting everyone get away with wrongdoing. It's a journalists job to report this and help his mazagine's circulation. That's just fact.

What about the SI reporter that got John (Red Neck) Rocker drunk and let him shoot off his red neck month. Don't you think he went a bit to far to get a feather in his hat? I'm a hick and I lost more respect for that writer then the young kid shooting off his drunken mouth for saying those disgusting remarks.

Hm.. so you believe having drinks with a baseball player you are covering (who knows he's being covered) and reporting what he says is worse than all the racists slurs Rocker threw out there? Ok. That's your opinion and you're entitled to it.



Same thing for TV Sports Broadcasting. It's not their job to zoom in on Kenny Rogers hand and grabbing headlines from the greatest show on earth.

I, for one, am glad when a cheater is busted. Whether or not it was by an umpire.

Any other part of the media should be tarred and feathered and rode out of town on a rail or get a job at a gossip rag.IMO

Some answers above.

[Old Sweater]

I think cheating during a game is a little more newsworthy than a journalist taking 10 extra minutes during a coffee break. If the umpire is missing the call, then it's his fault, not the guy who figures it out.

You a journalist?

[Westlake]

You a journalist?

I'm double majoring, and one of the majors is Journalism. Write for the school paper.

[Old Sweater]

I'm double majoring, and one of the majors is Journalism. Write for the school paper.



Well I can certainly see your point of view on the matter then.

It's like asking a convict on death row if he believes in capital punishment.


I just like when I use to pick up the sports page and read about sports instead of the scandal sheet it has become. Even on this board look at all the scandal threads instead of threads just about baseball just because it's as close as you can get to talking politics on Baseball Fever. The myth about players are being destroyed and the game is being hurt.

What you said about the President is true, reporters are doing their job investigating what is really going on. The President is the leader of the country but baseball is just a entertainment and doesn't effect me like a Presidents activities. Shame that players are being treated like movie stars just to make a profit for the media. Scandal gives a boost to the careers of movie stars though, part of the Hollywood Scene forever. Just hurts or ends the career of a baseball player.


A baseball team is just like a family. What happens on the field and in the clubhouse should remain there without a outsider of the game being a rat. If you find your friend kissing your little sister do you beat him up? Maybe. Now if your friend go's around the neighborhood telling all your other friends that your sister is easy, do you beat him up? Absolutely or at least try. Now your friend has became a famous writer and your sister becomes a famous soccer player and the writer puts in the paper that he use to kiss your sister just to sell more papers. What do you do or think of your old friend now? Myself I wouldn't care for this one bit. Same go's for baseball players, I don't want to know anything bad about them just for the sake of selling scandal.

[Old Sweater]

Hm.. so you believe having drinks with a baseball player you are covering (who knows he's being covered) and reporting what he says is worse than all the racists slurs Rocker threw out there? Ok. That's your opinion and you're entitled to it.


And your entitled to yours. I think it was a bait job by the reporter to get the racial slurs so he could sell his big scandal. If Rocker was sober the reporter never gets his scandal. Only the writer knows this for 100% sure. I'm sitting at 99% sure with my experience with young drunks and their 10 beer statements.

Getting scandal on a player is bad enough, creating it is just not right.

Few drinks? Quite a few drinks is more like it I bet.

[digglahhh]

So, Sweater, do you believe it was the authors of "Game of Shadows" that disgraced the game or Bonds himself?

I don't want to make this about Bonds, I'm just testing your expressed beliefs.

I, too, could do without the sports pages being indistinguishable from the gossip section. I, too, think there is very little "real journalism" going on in sports. However, something like a reporter breaking a cheating story is not "out of bounds." Something like, interviewing the 19 year-old girl Paul Lo Duca cheated on his wife with and printing her myspace page is...

This is yellow journalism, granted, on a less important scale. When the media discovers, say, the mistreatment of animals by a Pet Food company should it keep it quiet as to not undermine or insult the ASPCA?

Ratting is one thing, investigative journalism is another.

[The Great Nom]

KRod was cheating. Look at the crap under the bill of his cap.

http://web.mit.edu/baxamusa/Public/does_krod_cheat.JPG

More like K-Y Rod.

[plask_stirlac]

I just like when I use to pick up the sports page and read about sports instead of the scandal sheet it has become. Even on this board look at all the scandal threads instead of threads just about baseball just because it's as close as you can get to talking politics on Baseball Fever. The myth about players are being destroyed and the game is being hurt.

Nobody is forcing you to read these things, game recaps and previews from the AP are written in an informative, if plain, way and you can read them in full online or in shorter bursts in baseball sections of newspapers.

Baseball is entertainment but it's most entertaining and best played on an even playing field and with all proven cheating or advantage-taking available to the fans to judge.

I'm glad to know Ken Caminiti took steroids when he played extremely well, not to stew over it and be angry at him as a person but just for the most knowledge.

[Old Sweater]

Nobody is forcing you to read these things, game recaps and previews from the AP are written in an informative, if plain, way and you can read them in full online or in shorter bursts in baseball sections of newspapers.

Baseball is entertainment but it's most entertaining and best played on an even playing field and with all proven cheating or advantage-taking available to the fans to judge.

I'm glad to know Ken Caminiti took steroids when he played extremely well, not to stew over it and be angry at him as a person but just for the most knowledge.

And on the other hand no one is forcing members to post them. There is the worn out thread I don't read but what about the title of this thread. Bad for K-rod, just doing something to help his team win. I just don't understand the fans that don't know cheating is just part of the game, accept it, players on your very own team do the same thing. Players accept it, why don't the fans?

Baseball is entertainment but it's most entertaining and best played on an even playing field and with all proven cheating or advantage-taking available to the fans to judge.

I see your point but I think the playing field is pretty even(except for payroll) since players on both teams cheat. Like I said before, it is up to MLB and Umps to catch the cheaters, everyone else is just a rat getting rich off the scandal. IMO

I hated it when I read about Ken Caminiti. After years of reading about him playing through injurys and even the stomach virus in Mexico when it benched his teammates, I thought he was the toughest SOB in baseball. Then I read he was just a druggie, man what a let down.

[Edgartohof]

. I just don't understand the fans that don't know cheating is just part of the game, accept it, players on your very own team do the same thing. Players accept it, why don't the fans?

People steal from their companies - lot's of people do it. So why don't we just accept it?

What you are saying is that they are doing something wrong....and you don't care - you think it's alright to cheat.

Is that right? Because that's sure what it sounds like when it comes down to it.

[Old Sweater]

So, Sweater, do you believe it was the authors of "Game of Shadows" that disgraced the game or Bonds himself?

I don't want to make this about Bonds, I'm just testing your expressed beliefs.

I, too, could do without the sports pages being indistinguishable from the gossip section. I, too, think there is very little "real journalism" going on in sports. However, something like a reporter breaking a cheating story is not "out of bounds." Something like, interviewing the 19 year-old girl Paul Lo Duca cheated on his wife with and printing her myspace page is...

This is yellow journalism, granted, on a less important scale. When the media discovers, say, the mistreatment of animals by a Pet Food company should it keep it quiet as to not undermine or insult the ASPCA?

Ratting is one thing, investigative journalism is another.

I always blame the "stick" that stirs the crap more then the "crap" itself. the player that takes PED's pays the ultimate price in the end.

This is yellow journalism, granted, on a less important scale. When the media discovers, say, the mistreatment of animals by a Pet Food company should it keep it quiet as to not undermine or insult the ASPCA?

No this is good journalism and real news and has a affect on a citizens life. Just like when Westy used the President as a comparison, the President is our leader and affects our life's. What is what you call yellow journalism is the Monica story's. Catch the President breaking the law, write about it. Catch him with Monica, put your pen away. His love affairs is none of our business.

Ratting is one thing, investigative journalism is another.[/

Not when it comes to baseball. IMO

If they want to get scandal on someone in the entertainment let them stick to the Hollywood Stars and get a job at a scandal rag like the National Enquire.

[Old Sweater]

People steal from their companies - lot's of people do it. So why don't we just accept it?

What you are saying is that they are doing something wrong....and you don't care - you think it's alright to cheat.

Is that right? Because that's sure what it sounds like when it comes down to it.

1/ Stealing from your company hurts the company. You steal from the hand that feeds you, you are scum in my book. Players cheating is helping his team win and his company gains a profit. Totally different. Everyone keeps using something that affects one's personal life. For the last time, baseball is a entertainment and doesn't affect a fans personal life. Now if you find a player stealing from your house, call the cops.

2/ Of course it's alright for players to cheat. Name one player that hasn't cheated. Pitchers cheat every time they pick off a runner at a base. You are not suppose to decieve the runner, that is what a good move is, decieveing the runner. stealing signs is cheating, every team has someone stealing signs.
Walt Weiss is barred from the Rockies dugout this year because a couple ex Rockie players with the D backs ratted him out for stealing signs. Now name me one player with a better image then Walt Weiss besides Cal Ripken. I don't believe in the PED's that the players are cheating with but if I was in a players shoes trying to keep my job, I probably would be taking them.


3/ This has nothing to so with baseball. I watch a whole lot of pool and foosball and is why I go by the name Old Sweater, I am 54 and sweat pool and foosball. My favorite fooser just got inducted in the HOF for foosball last weekend in Las Vegas when they were holding the $50,000 HOF Classic, now don't laugh, this man had made enough on the foosball tour when pays were high to buy 2 arcades and drive around in a corvette. He is my favorite because even at 47 he knows the game better, shots are almost always on goal and hands down is known as the best cheater in the game, with or without a ref for a match. He is even known for the best mental game in the business by the legends of the game. If he don't cheat he don't win as much, he is so good at cheating he can cheat the ref that is reffing the match without the ref seeing his cheat. Learning to cheat that good is a skill to me and the other Pro Masters accept this as part of his game. Rookies and Semi Pro players cry like little girls when this man cheats them. My advise is you better learn how to cheat to win or accept the fact you are never going to get to the Pro Master level if you don't unless you have the pure skills to get there, which my favorite fooser don't and wouldn't have been inducted in the Foosball HOF.

[bluezebra]

If it weren't for the media "ratting-out" crooked politicians, heads of corporations, athletes, et al, who would do it?

You don't want to be "ratted" on, DON'T CHEAT.

Bob

[rockin500]

who cares if he cheats or not? if you aint cheatin, you aint tryin.

[bluezebra]

"Catch him with Monica, put your pen away. His love affairs is none of our business."

It is when it's done in the White House, which in case you don't know, is owned by the Citizens of the USA.

Bob

[Westlake]

It is the job of the Umps and MLB only to catch the cheater's. IMO


If it weren't for the media "ratting-out" crooked politicians, heads of corporations, athletes, et al, who would do it?

You don't want to be "ratted" on, DON'T CHEAT.

Bob

Says the career umpire.

[bluezebra]

Says the career umpire.

Whose philosophy has always been, "If you cheat, you're admitting your opponent is better than you are".

Bob

[Westlake]

Whose philosophy has always been, "If you cheat, you're admitting your opponent is better than you are".

Bob

Should be above the door in every clubhouse.

[natsnsoxfan]

we don't even know what the substance IS or if its actually having an affect on the ball. maybe its just resin from the resin bag and he puts it on his hat cause he doesn't like the bag?

[Old Sweater]

If it weren't for the media "ratting-out" crooked politicians, heads of corporations, athletes, et al, who would do it?

You don't want to be "ratted" on, DON'T CHEAT.

Bob

Once again someone is using something that affects a persons personal life compared to a entertainment. I don't care if my players cheat to win. Didn't you know that baseball plyers cheat Bob? Never caught one cheating Bob, that was your job? The higher the level the more they cheat.

You don't want to be "ratted" on, DON'T CHEAT.

Easy to say since you are not a major leage player getting ratted on by a rat fink reporter. It's only the job of the Umps and MLB to report the cheating for the sake of the game. The other scandal, is just to sell their rag for money and not for the best interest of the game of baseball.

You were a marine Bob, what would happen to a marine that ratted off a fellow marine? Now just think what would happen to a outside source turning rat on a marine. Think that outside source would like to meet any marine that knew about it?

[Old Sweater]

"Catch him with Monica, put your pen away. His love affairs is none of our business."

It is when it's done in the White House, which in case you don't know, is owned by the Citizens of the USA.

Bob


Yes I know the White House is owned by the citizens of the USA.

Did you know that it cost the citizens not a penny more? Monica worked there. Now how much do you think the scandal caused by Monica cost the citizens? Been a lot cheaper for Monica to keep her mouth shut or from the rat reporters keeping it out of the papers, right?

[Ubiquitous]

It has nothing to do with the White House. What it has to do with is lying under oath. Now it is a valid point on whether or not his relationship with Monica is something that one is allowed to ask officially. But what any of this has to do with baseball, well I don't know.

[Ubiquitous]

To bring it back to KRod and baseball. This isn't the "reporters" fault. If their is fault it lies with Felix who cheated thus causing the possibility of a rat. KRod doesn't cheat then there is no story. The journalist isn't a rat because in order to be a "rat" one must either be employed or have the confidence of the one who you are snitching on. A reporter is neither. The reporter is not employed by the Angels or Rodriguez nor are they sworn to the Angels or Rodriguez. You cannot be a "rat" if you are not an insider or taking part in the deed.

Secondly the person who is bringing discredit to the game with this story is not the reporter but Rodriguez who is cheating. Again if KRod doesn't cheat then there is no black mark. It is all on him.

[Old Sweater]

Whose philosophy has always been, "If you cheat, you're admitting your opponent is better than you are".

Bob


This I agree with. You or your team don't have chace to win without cheating you had better cheat if you want to win. No one loves a loser that don't at least try to win.

Name one sport where they don't cheat. Everytime a ref blows a whistle on a foul or time violation in basketball he is catching someone cheating. Same go's for football, and hockey or any sport that has a ref with a whistle.

The only whistle blower in baseball is the rat reporter that the fans don't need to know about. At least not this fan, other then by the Ump or MLB.

[Old Sweater]

Should be above the door in every clubhouse.

This would look good above the door of the Investigative Reporters Clubhouse that rats on baseball players.

[rockin500]

i dont like journalists for the most part. while i dont call think they are rats, really, i dont really respect them either.

most of these reporters who try to unearth big stories are in it for the money or fame, really. Is that a bad thing? Absolutely not. I respect that, just dont give me a line of bullpatootie about trying to do it merely for the greater good. the greater good is in the list of things, it just isnt the highest part.

[Ubiquitous]

most of these reporters who try to unearth big stories are in it for the money or fame, really. Is that a bad thing? Absolutely not. I respect that, just dont give me a line of bullpatootie about trying to do it merely for the greater good. the greater good is in the list of things, it just isnt the highest part.

I would say "so what" to the view that the "greater good" isn't the highest part on the list. There are thousands of people right now working on a cure for AIDS, there are millions of people around the world that are doctors very few of any of them are doing for the "greater good" of anything.

[sturg1dj]

i would actually be for allowing spit balls again.......batters are now more protected, and baseballs are more plentiful in the league


correct me if I am wrong here, but wasn't getting rid of the spitballs one of the measures to eliminate the change of another Chapman experience? (never mind making players wear masks)

its true that it seems the media is trying hard to find 'cheaters' which I would attribute to the lucrative world of 'catching' steroid users. I think things like corking bats or scuffing balls are fine being dealt with the way they are....if you are caught you are tossed (and maybe a short suspension) because a proactive ump can make sure it does not effect a game. The only way to do that with steroids would be to suspend the person for life really.

[Skin & Bones]

i would actually be for allowing spit balls again.......batters are now more protected, and baseballs are more plentiful in the league


correct me if I am wrong here, but wasn't getting rid of the spitballs one of the measures to eliminate the change of another Chapman experience? (never mind making players wear masks)

its true that it seems the media is trying hard to find 'cheaters' which I would attribute to the lucrative world of 'catching' steroid users. I think things like corking bats or scuffing balls are fine being dealt with the way they are....if you are caught you are tossed (and maybe a short suspension) because a proactive ump can make sure it does not effect a game. The only way to do that with steroids would be to suspend the person for life really.

Cheating by altering equipment may not be caught as much as you think - Check out this interesting statement made by Wendell: That being the case, Major League Baseball might want to do some research and find out who has cornered the Florida market on cork.

According to the former Cubs reliever, Wrigley Field is not the only stadium that has seen its share of corked bats in the last decade.


“That’s the big scandal nobody’s talking about,’’ Wendell said. “It’s getting pretty prevalent. There’s a guy in Tampa that players are sending their bats to and getting them filled there.

“It’s a huge problem, and everyone’s closing their eyes to that, too. I can’t believe nobody’s looked into it because the players sure know about it.’’

That might explain, in part, why there’s been such an increase in the number of pitchers getting drilled — some in the head — by batted balls.

http://www.dailyherald.com/sports/rozner.asp?id=168644

And allow the spitball? Why not just allow pitchers to roid up too? Let's just condone all types of cheating so the pitchers could " keep up ".

[rockin500]

all should be relieved, orel herschieser thinks it wasnt cheating. :cool:

[EdmondsFan#1]

"The Angels had a two-word response to Internet posted allegations of doctoring baseballs by closer Francisco Rodriguez in two games this week against the Texas Rangers.
"It's resin," Angels manager Mike Scioscia said.
"It's the same stuff I've had since I was called up [in 2002]," Rodriguez said, showing his cap to a pair of reporters at his locker to show the resin residue on its bill. "A lot of pitchers use it. They rub it on their pants and use it when they need it. I have it on my cap. You can see it in all the pictures; it's there.
"I don't see why they're making a big deal out of this. We can't worry about things we can't control. They haven't made it illegal, so it's something I do."
Resin, Rodriguez said, helps with his grip on the baseball -- just as it helps hitters grip a bat.
"It doesn't help me throw any harder," he said.
Rodriguez was firing fastballs in the mid-90s along with his signature slider on Monday night and Wednesday afternoon against the Rangers. A Web site, The Cheater's Guide to Baseball Blog, accused him of having a substance under the bill of his cap and using it.
It was reported by the Dallas Morning News on Thursday that Major League Baseball was conducting an investigation into the matter, headed by Bob Watson.
Rangers general manager Jon Daniels said the team did not contact MLB with a complaint about Rodriguez.
Pat Courtney, a spokesman for Major League Baseball, told the newspaper his office found out about the allegation Thursday and Watson, in charge of discipline, was looking into it. Watson, the report continued, will review video of the games and might talk to umpires and players.
Doctoring baseballs is a violation of rule 8.02b and could carry a maximum 10-game suspension.
Resin is not an illegal substance, Scioscia submitted, claiming it was much ado about nothing.
"I don't think there's a pitcher in the league who doesn't have [resin] show up somewhere on his uniform," Scioscia said. "It's legal. [This is] nothing."
Rodriguez, fighting sinus congestion, struggled with his control on Wednesday, giving up a run in the ninth before claiming his second save. He threw a perfect ninth inning in saving the opener"

from mlb.com

[Ursa Major]

Okay, it comes down to this:

1. Bonds taking steroids violated no existing baseball rules.

2. KRod doctoring the ball does violate a long-established baseball rule.

Therefore, Bonds' 756th homer should be greeted joyously as honorably breaking baseball's greatest record.

The 2002 World Series is declared a forfeit to KRod's team's opponent, which was ... oh, let me look it up .... THE GIANTS!

Yessssss!

[bluezebra]

Once again someone is using something that affects a persons personal life compared to a entertainment. I don't care if my players cheat to win. Didn't you know that baseball plyers cheat Bob? Never caught one cheating Bob, that was your job? The higher the level the more they cheat.



Easy to say since you are not a major leage player getting ratted on by a rat fink reporter. It's only the job of the Umps and MLB to report the cheating for the sake of the game. The other scandal, is just to sell their rag for money and not for the best interest of the game of baseball.

You were a marine Bob, what would happen to a marine that ratted off a fellow marine? Now just think what would happen to a outside source turning rat on a marine. Think that outside source would like to meet any marine that knew about it?

If a Marine committed such an act that brought disgrace to the Corps, you bet you a** that I'd turn him in. That's not "ratting", it's doing my duty. In fact, when I was stationed at Camp Pendelton, a friend of mine and I went into Oceanside to have dinner at a restaurant, rather a meatless meal (it was a Friday, and the Catholic Church was coddled in this respect) at the mess hall. When we approached the restaurant, there was a car parked with the trunk open. We noticed an M-1 rifle in it. Rather than overlook this, and go in and eat, we immediately drove back onto the base, and reported the incident to the Provost Marshall, with a description of the car, and the license number. We were thanked for our diligence, because there had been weapons stolen and smuggled into Mexico, and sold down there. A few days later, we were called into our Company Office, and informed of the result of the investigation into the matter. It turned out, that the car belonged to a Marine who was assigned to the Rifle Range that week, and had kept his weapon in his car, and forgot to remove it. We were commended by our C.O. and First Sergeant for reporting it.

I don't consider that "ratting". Frankly, I feel sorry for you and your ilk, who condone cheating in sports, politics, business, and anywhere else.

Bob