Right timing for a first-ballot election

[Appling]

By my count, the BBWAA has so far inducted 105 ballplayers into the Hall of Fame. This does not include players who were elected primarily for contributions in another area -- as a baseball pioneer or manager or executive or umpire. It also does not include the 123 players elected by the Veteran's Committee or by the Negro Leagues Committee.

For purpose of this thread, I included as "First-Ballot Honorees" anyone elected within six or fewer years of his last active-playing season. I also include players elected in the FIRST TWO HOF elections (1936 and 1937) -- since the initial backlog of qualified candidates was huge.

Of the 105 elected by the BBWAA, 51 players (nearly half) were elected on the first ballot (as I defined it). To my surprise, JOHNNY BENCH is the only catcher selected on his first HOF ballot, even though the BBWAA seems to think highly of catchers on their MVP ballots.

So what about the 54 players passed over by the BBWAA on their first ballot? Are those players clearly inferior to the First-Ballot Honorees? IMO, some of these players were major stars in their own right and might well have been voted in on the first ballot, had the vote been taken at a different time. In fact, it seems to me that some First-Ballot Honorees elected recently (Willie Stargel? Kirby Puckett? Nolan Ryan?) might not have made it on first ballot in years gone by.

Please review the list on the poll question, and check off any you think might have been First Ballot Honorees if the timing were different. You might choose "None" -- or you might select up to ten names on this list.

Every player listed on the poll response was voted in by the BBWAA seven or more years after his last active-playing season -- clearly not chosen on "First HOF Ballot".

[futurehalloffamer]

I believe Warren Spahn was a first ballot hall of famer...

[cbenson5]

I believe Warren Spahn was a first ballot hall of famer...

You are right. Spahn earned 316 votes for an 83.16 percentage on his first try in 1973.

[Appling]

You are right. Spahn earned 316 votes for an 83.16 percentage on his first try in 1973.
By my information, Spahn's last MLB season was 1965. (ESPN BASEBALL ENCYCLOPEDIA; also Baseball-Reference.com). After the required five years of retirement, he should have been eligible in 1971. He was elected in 1973. How was that his first year on the ballot?

I confess, however, I don't understand why Warren didn't get even 100 votes in the 1971 or 1972 elections -- when he should have been eligible.

Sandy Koufax, whose last MLB season was 1966, was elected to Cooperstown in 1972 -- along with Yogi Berra (1946-1965) and Early Wynn (1939-1963). Why wasn't Spahn (1942-1965) on that 1972 ballot?

[Captain Cold Nose]

By my information, Spahn's last MLB season was 1965. (ESPN BASEBALL ENCYCLOPEDIA; also Baseball-Reference.com). After the required five years of retirement, he should have been eligible in 1971. He was elected in 1973. How was that his first year on the ballot?

I confess, however, I don't understand why Warren didn't get even 100 votes in the 1971 or 1972 elections -- when he should have been eligible.

Sandy Koufax, whose last MLB season was 1966, was elected to Cooperstown in 1972 -- along with Yogi Berra (1946-1965) and Early Wynn (1939-1963). Why wasn't Spahn (1942-1965) on that 1972 ballot?
I could have sworn Spahn was not a first ballot, either, but I'm looking at the HOF's website right now and they don't have him listed for 1971 or 1972. It looks like a little digging will have to be done.

[KCGHOST]

A whole bunch of these guys would be first ballot guys if their timing had been better. Grover, Yogi, Collins, Cochrane, Whitey, Charlie, Hank, Mathews, Sisler, Spahn (assuming he wasn't), and Vaughn. And several others might have done it (Dickey, etc.)

[cbenson5]

I could have sworn Spahn was not a first ballot, either, but I'm looking at the HOF's website right now and they don't have him listed for 1971 or 1972. It looks like a little digging will have to be done.

Mr. Spahn pitched in the Mexican League and the Pacific League for a couple of years after he left MLB. He was still considered an active pitcher by the Hall of Fame. Therefore, his first year of eligibilty was not until 1973.

[Captain Cold Nose]

Mr. Spahn pitched in the Mexican League and the Pacific League for a couple of years after he left MLB. He was still considered an active pitcher by the Hall of Fame. Therefore, his first year of eligibilty was not until 1973.
Excellent information. Thanks. :clapping

[Appling]

Excellent information. Thanks. :clapping
Ditto. Thanks a lot. I was thinking only of last MLB season played.

Might minor league play delay the ballot appearance of Rickey Henderson?

[Brooklyn]

Ditto. Thanks a lot. I was thinking only of last MLB season played.

Might minor league play delay the ballot appearance of Rickey Henderson?

No, the current rules tart the 5 year period from the last major league experience

[Brooklyn]

I know for purposes of this trhead you are counting "first ballot" as those inducted within 6 years of their last season, so this is a little off topicm but I always thought it odd that it took Dimaggio three years to be elected. I'd guess voters were not voting for him because they felt there should be a wait, but that is only speculation

[Appling]

I know for purposes of this trhead you are counting "first ballot" as those inducted within 6 years of their last season, so this is a little off topicm but I always thought it odd that it took Dimaggio three years to be elected. I'd guess voters were not voting for him because they felt there should be a wait, but that is only speculation
Joe D is one of the chief reasons I defined "first ballot" the way I did.

Joe had been retired only 3 full seasons when he was elected. I see no shame in his not being elected sooner. Ott, Hornsby and Foxx also received votes during or shortly after their playing years. Foxx was elected after a 5-year wait, while Ott and Hornsby were elected before the full 5-year wait. Like DiMaggio, none of these players was elected on a true "First Ballot".

Joe actually received his first HOF vote in the 1945 election -- when he was on active military duty but not yet "retired" from baseball (and still lacked the ten playing years now needed for the HOF). I'm sure he also received some votes on the 1952 ballot (first ballot after his retirement from MLB) before the received 117 in 1953, 175 in 1954, and finally the 223 votes (89%) in 1955 that got him in. This shows the confusion that existed before the 5-year wait rule.
Before then, each voter had his own idea of a reasonable wait period.

(Without a wait rule, Pete Rose would be in the HOF today!)

[SportsDoc]

Pete Rose came clean. He says that he only bet on his team to win and he bet every game. That is the attitude of a Manager who believes in his team. The old sports cliche, "put your money where your mouth is", he lived it. Despite all the coruption, dishonesty and lies, He believed his guys were winners every night. While you can't condone gambling, you gotta love his cocky approach. Heck, let him in the HOF. Uphold his ban in baseball. 18 years is enough and he still is the all-time hits leader. Put an * or 2 next to it. Let's just get it behind us. Respectfully, SportsDoc

[Appling]

Pete Rose came clean. He says that he only bet on his team to win and he bet every game. That is the attitude of a Manager who believes in his team. The old sports cliche, "put your money where your mouth is", he lived it. Despite all the coruption, dishonesty and lies, He believed his guys were winners every night. While you can't condone gambling, you gotta love his cocky approach. Heck, let him in the HOF. Uphold his ban in baseball. 18 years is enough and he still is the all-time hits leader. Put an * or 2 next to it. Let's just get it behind us. Respectfully, SportsDoc
(1) If only: he had said this the first time, instead of denials
(2) If only: I could trust him to tell the truth - THIS TIME.

[Mike D.]

(1) If only: he had said this the first time, instead of denials
(2) If only: I could trust him to tell the truth - THIS TIME.

And it's already been proven that he was lying again. He didn't bet on the Reds to win games that Mario Soto and on other pitcher on his staff started (the name escapes me).

[DTF955]

Joe actually received his first HOF vote in the 1945 election -- when he was on active military duty but not yet "retired" from baseball (and still lacked the ten playing years now needed for the HOF). I'm sure he also received some votes on the 1952 ballot (first ballot after his retirement from MLB) before the received 117 in 1953, 175 in 1954, and finally the 223 votes (89%) in 1955 that got him in. This shows the confusion that existed before the 5-year wait rule.

Was it just confusion, or was there concern that some players might not make it home? With the war as tough as it was, I'm thinking that might have gone through some voters' minds.

Imagine the shock if there had been an attack on one of the bases that some were stationed at that was supposed to be "safe" - I know some, like Feller, served active duty, and Ted Williams might have, too (he did in Korea, IIRC.) but, not all did. Still, it's possible.

[Appling]

Was it just confusion, or was there concern that some players might not make it home? With the war as tough as it was, I'm thinking that might have gone through some voters' minds.

Who knows what was in the voter minds? Feller (playing years 1936-1956) got his first HOF votes in 1962, the year he was elected. Williams (1939-1960) got his first HOF vote in 1966, the year he was elected. Both Feller and Williams were in Military Service 1943-1945, but received no HOF votes during their wartime absense.

However, Hank Greenberg (1930-1947) got his first HOF votes in 1945 (the year in which he returned from WWII service) but he wasn't elected until 1956, 9 years after his 1947 retirement.

I think Joe DiMaggio was destined for the HOF ever since he had that 56-game hitting streak. Until the 5-year wait became mandatory, voters could pretty much do as they chose regarding eligibility.