Draft Details and Discussion Thread

[Minstrel]

We ended up with 28 participants. I have broken these up into two leagues, with two separate drafts. One league will have the DH (I arbitrarily name this league the American League) and one will not have it (oddly enough, I came up with National League for this one).

Based on expressed DH preferences, I broke the leagues up thusly: I started by putting all those who firmly wanted the DH in the AL. That was 13 people. I then put someone who expressly said he didn't care (RuthMayBond) into the AL to fill it out. That left a 14 team NL made up of people who either firmly didn't want the DH, only wanted the DH under certain conditions or didn't care.

The league members (in draft order) will be posted in the individual draft threads. Incidentally, I used this (http://www.sharewareconnection.com/the-hat.htm) to determine draft order.

I'll run the AL draft, plask_stirlac has nobly agreed to run the NL draft. Mostly this means updating the first post in each draft thread to reflect all picks made so far and to officially remove participants from the draft (more on that below).

We'll start this on Monday, first window opening 10 AM EST. When I said Sunday, I had somehow forgotten to factor in the Super Bowl. That may not be the best time to get this going.

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Rules
* 25 man roster

* To be eligible for selection, a player:
==Must have played in 1884 or later
==Must have played in the NAPBBP, NL or MLB
==Must have played in at least 80% of team's scheduled games in at least three seasons (70% for catchers) for non-strike years (for non-pitchers)
==Major strike years (1981, 1994) count towards a player's top-two WARP1 seasons, but cannot be selected as the player's sim season
==Pitchers must have pitched in at least 160 IP in at least three seasons or made at least 40 appearances in at least three seasons

* Must have 1 starting C, 1B, 2B, 3B, SS, RF, CF, LF
* AL teams must have a DH
* Must have 4-5 starting pitchers
* Must have at least 4 relief pitchers

Procedure
* To be eligible at a fielding position, a player must have played at least 162 games at a position, over his career, to be eligible at it. The exceptions are that corner outfielders can be swapped between right and left field, center fielders can play any outfield position and shortstops can be played at second base. And, of course, anyone can be placed at DH.

* To be eligible as a starting pitcher, pitcher must have at least 3 seasons in which he pitched 160+ innings. You must, of course, choose one of their starting years if you are taking them as a starter and it can't be one of their two best seasons overall.

* To be eligible as a relief pitcher, pitcher must have at least 3 seasons in which he had 40+ non-start appearances. You must, of course, choose one of their relief years if you are taking them as a reliever and it can't be one of their two best seasons overall.

* Player's third-best full season (as judged by WARP1) will be used for simming purposes. I would use ERA+ / OPS+, since I'm sure most people know them better, but that would remove stolen bases from offensive contributions and innings pitched from pitching contribution, skewing actual value. Outside of the top two seasons, any season that counts as a "full season" (as defined in the eligibility rule above) can be selected.

* Each participant will have an 8-hour window to make a selection. This window can't close between 11 PM EST and 8 AM PST. Once the window has closed, the next participant's 8-hour window opens (therefore, keep track of the draft even if you're not the person currently up).

* If a participant goes 14 overall picks with an unmade pick outstanding, he/she will be dropped from the draft.

* Players selected by participants who end up being dropped do not re-enter the pool. There's no fair way to make them available again, it would just be luck of the draw as to who happened to be after the dropped participant.

* Each league will have the entire pool of major league players with at least 3 full seasons.

* Once both leagues have completed their drafts, there will be a poll thread to determine the best team, with discussion. This is the Popular Champion. ;) The poll will go 5 days.

* After the poll is completed, 100 simmed seasons (or as many as is fairly easy) will be played by each league. Within each season, each team will play each other team 13 times (169 game season). Any teams that were dropped during the draft will reduce that league's season by 13 games each, as those teams will not be available for everyone else to play. There will be no regular season inter-league games. The average team records over all the sims will be used. If the sim program can't provide results over multiple trials, one simmed season will be used per league.

* The four teams with the best records in each league (head-to-head records will break ties) will play division series, championship series and a World Series in the same manner as Major League Baseball does. In the World Series, the team with the best record will have the home field advantage. Home field, in each game, determines DH rules. The World Series winner will be the Simulation Champion!

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To avoid littering the forum with too many threads, use this thread for discussion on both drafts. We'll have an individual thread for each draft's actual selections, which shouldn't be used for discussion, to keep it clean and easily followed. I'll create one of them, plask_stirlac will create one (so that we have edit powers on the first post).

[Honus Wagner Rules]

I assume this will be a snake draft?

[Westlake]

Maybe this should be moved to the fantasy gaming forum?

[Minstrel]

I assume this will be a snake draft?

Yes.

Maybe this should be moved to the fantasy gaming forum?

I'd prefer not, since A. this is history-related and B. participation always drops when something is moved out of the bigger forum.

If the moderators of this site feel it really can't remain here, what must be, must be. But I'd prefer it remain here, among the community on this forum.

[Williamsburg2599]

Can you release the participants list so we can see who is in each league and to make sure we're in?

[Minstrel]

Can you release the participants list so we can see who is in each league and to make sure we're in?

Sure.

AL Members (in first-round draft order):
wee willie
AlexBoy006
Eric Bedard
Disgruntaledmarinerfan
Minstrel
yanks0714
ChrisLDuncan
RuthMayBond
Westlake
-Kyle-
BoSox Rule
Wade8813
538280
Huntington Avenue

NL members (in first-round draft order):
SamtheBravesFan
tearforamariner
Honus Wagner Rules
ElHalo
The Splendid Splinter
DTF955
Sockeye
AstrosFan
Williamsburg2599
mwiggins
plask_stirlac
TBT
Dudecar00
Windy City Fan

[538280]

Sounds good. The only suggestion I may have is that the team with the best record through the simmed season(s) will have home field advantage in the WS, rather than a coin toss. How would we do an on-line coin toss anyway? :crazy

[Minstrel]

Sounds good. The only suggestion I may have is that the team with the best record through the simmed season(s) will have home field advantage in the WS, rather than a coin toss. How would we do an on-line coin toss anyway? :crazy

Sure, that sounds good. I was just trying to keep it as close to the real Series, where it's essentially random, but let's go with best record.

[Williamsburg2599]

Sounds good. The only suggestion I may have is that the team with the best record through the simmed season(s) will have home field advantage in the WS, rather than a coin toss. How would we do an on-line coin toss anyway? :crazy
Or we could hold an All-star game and...... :D

[Minstrel]

Or we could hold an All-star game and...... :D

Wow. We could also run a mini-economy on the side, simulating who sells the most tickets, jerseys, etc, to give us a better idea of who the fans in our imaginary world would select to the All-Star game. ;)

[-Kyle-]

1. Is there a list of WARP1 seasons?

2.So the AL is only gonna draft AL players?

[Minstrel]

1. Is there a list of WARP1 seasons?

You can look up any player's WARP1 per season at baseballprospectus.com. Just type their name into the Find Player search engine and when you bring up their player card, it's in the Advanced Batting Statistics section.

2.So the AL is only gonna draft AL players?

No. Both leagues have the full array of players who played at least 3 full seasons in the majors.

[Wee Willie]

Is the WARP1 score based on the player's 3rd best total WARP1 score (example: Babe Ruth 1927) without taking Games played into account? Most on here would probably not consider 1927 in the top 3 seasons of Ruth's career, but if it makes things easier to manage, that's fine.

[-Kyle-]

No. Both leagues have the full array of players who played at least 3 full seasons in the majors.
So there will be two babe ruth's in both leagues because there are separate drafts?

[Minstrel]

Is the WARP1 score based on the player's 3rd best total WARP1 score (example: Babe Ruth 1927) without taking Games played into account? Most on here would probably not consider 1927 in the top 3 seasons of Ruth's career, but if it makes things easier to manage, that's fine.

Well, WARP is a counting stat, so playing more games does help accumulate more WARP. How about this: a team can choose to use any WARP1 score after the two top ones. So if you feel Ruth's 1920 was better than his 1927, you can use it. You just can't use one of the players top-two WARP1 seasons.

Of course, whichever season you use must be a "full" season (140+ games).

[Minstrel]

So there will be two babe ruth's in both leagues because there are separate drafts?

Yes, there will be a Ruth in each league.

[plask_stirlac]

So we won't see any position players's seasons from major strike years?

[Minstrel]

So we won't see any position players's seasons from major strike years?

Nope, not unless the season went at least 140 games.

[plask_stirlac]

Nope, not unless the season went at least 140 games.

Laaaame...

[Minstrel]

Laaaame...

Why? It's not just about player health, it's also about proper sample sizes. Easier to fluke it up for 100 games than 140-160.

[Wee Willie]

Well, WARP is a counting stat, so playing more games does help accumulate more WARP. How about this: a team can choose to use any WARP1 score after the two top ones. So if you feel Ruth's 1920 was better than his 1927, you can use it. You just can't use one of the players top-two WARP1 seasons.

Of course, whichever season you use must be a "full" season (140+ games).
That's fine, but is the sim going to be based JUST on WARP1? In a nutshell, how does the sim work? Is a player with a 12.0 WARP1 in 145 games in his representative year more likely to perform better than a player with a 12.2 WARP in 160 games played? Does a pitcher with a 12.0 WARP1 in 350 innings pitched have a better likelihood of success than a pitcher with 11.5 WARP1 in 275 innings pitched? The answers to these questions could greatly influence draft strategy.

[BoSox Rule]

I think we should use WARP3 because it would account for shortened seasons.

[Minstrel]

That's fine, but is the sim going to be based JUST on WARP1? In a nutshell, how does the sim work? Is a player with a 12.0 WARP1 in 145 games in his representative year more likely to perform better than a player with a 12.2 WARP in 160 games played? Does a pitcher with a 12.0 WARP1 in 350 innings pitched have a better likelihood of success than a pitcher with 11.5 WARP1 in 275 innings pitched? The answers to these questions could greatly influence draft strategy.

I assume the sim works with either traditional stats (batting average, runs, RBI, etc) or the components (singles, doubles, triples, homers, walks, stolen bases, etc).

My understanding was that WARP1 wouldn't be used in the sim, it would just be the easy, quick way to rank seasons, so that we can determine which is the third-best to enter into the sim.

[plask_stirlac]

Why? It's not just about player health, it's also about proper sample sizes. Easier to fluke it up for 100 games than 140-160.

Since every team stops playing it isn't "easier to fluke" relative to others, and we're using WARP1.

OTOH I forgot WARP1 ranking is going to sink many strike seasons anyway.

[Minstrel]

I think we should use WARP3 because it would account for shortened seasons.

The reason to use WARP1 over WARP3 is because WARP3 includes LQ adjustments, whereas the sim won't.

Also, how do you mean WARP3 would account for shortened seasons?

[Minstrel]

Since ever team stops playing it isn't "easier to fluke" relative to others

It makes it easier to have a fluke season relative to other seasons. Yes, I agree...everyone who plays the strike season has "equal" fluke chance. That wasn't my point.

OTOH I forgot WARP1 ranking is going to sink many strike seasons anyway.

Yeah...using WARP actually does sort of make playing time considerations a bit moot.

[SamtheBravesFan]

I can't wait to get started. :D

[Wee Willie]

I can't wait to get started. :D
As your 1st pick counterpart in the AL, I can't, either.:)

[Mariano_Rivera]

Just as a little bit of a hint, Jimmie Foxx could play catcher, 3rd base, and 1st base so

Honus Wagner could play any position at all except catcher

Stan Musial could play several positions

A-Rod could play 3rd base and SS

That could be useful in saving roster spots for pitchers

[TBT]

If Babe Ruth is already selected as a RFer, can you select him as a Pitcher?

[Mariano_Rivera]

If Babe Ruth is already selected as a RFer, can you select him as a Pitcher?

You are picking a 25 man roster. So on days he isn`t pitching you could have him play DH or the OF.

[TBT]

You are picking a 25 man roster. So on days he isn`t pitching you could have him play DH or the OF.
Just realized that you actually can't have him as a pitcher because his third highest WARP1 season does not have enough IP.

[plask_stirlac]

Just as a little bit of a hint, Jimmie Foxx could play catcher, 3rd base, and 1st base so

Honus Wagner could play any position at all except catcher

Stan Musial could play several positions

A-Rod could play 3rd base and SS

That could be useful in saving roster spots for pitchers

How eligible are players, Minstrel? Restrictions? I know sometimes moving players to where they dabbled sometimes works in sim, sometimes fails.

And Foxx's season with the most catching value, 1935, is ineligible as it is his 2nd best WARP1.

[ElHalo]

Interesting format. Should be a good time.

[Windy City Fan]

Using multi-position players is going to be tricky. Can we use Robin Yount's 1989 season and still call him a SS? (Disregarding the WARP req) I think we should only be able to use a player at his most demanding position in seasons he actually played there. However, if we draft Yount or Ripken or Banks and want to shift them to CF, 3B, or 1B respectively, we should be able to use any of their seasons. If they had the skill set to play a less demanding position as older players, they certainly could've done it earlier if asked.

Another thing is we should pick homeparks before the draft begins. That will have a considerable impact on draft strategy and such.

[-Kyle-]

Is VORP the same as WARP1?

[Wee Willie]

Just as a little bit of a hint, Jimmie Foxx could play catcher, 3rd base, and 1st base so

Honus Wagner could play any position at all except catcher

Stan Musial could play several positions

A-Rod could play 3rd base and SS

That could be useful in saving roster spots for pitchers
Actually, Jimmie Foxx can't play catcher...he didn't catch in 162 games, only 108. Wagner would not be able to play 2B, either. I hope that's clear to everyone.

[plask_stirlac]

Nope, VORP is just offense, WARP includes defense. BP has both but in different places, with VORP not going back as far.

Here's a VORP leader listing up until 1995.
http://www.stathead.com/bbeng/woolner/mvpvorpd.htm

[digglahhh]

If one league's draft moves faster than the other, participants in the slower moving draft can look over at the other draft to "cheat."

I'm not involved, but I was hoping you guys would use one player pool for all the teams.

[Minstrel]

How eligible are players, Minstrel? Restrictions? I know sometimes moving players to where they dabbled sometimes works in sim, sometimes fails.

Yeah, I actually mentioned this in the previous thread, but forgot to add it to the rules here. Wee Willie got it right though:

A player must have played at least 162 games at a position, over his career, to be eligible at it.

The exceptions are that corner outfielders can be swapped between right and left field, center fielders can play any outfield position and shortstops can be played at second base. And, of course, anyone can be placed at DH.

All of these exceptions involve a player moving to a position that involves the same general skill set but is either similar in difficulty or easier.

I'll add this to the first page rules.

[Williamsburg2599]

Is there a cut-off year?(such as 1900, 1890, etc.., where players before that date are inelgiable) and if so, what is it?

[Minstrel]

Is there a cut-off year?(such as 1900, 1890, etc.., where players before that date are inelgiable) and if so, what is it?

The cut-off is 1871, which is the inception of the National Association of Professional Baseball Players, the league which gave way to the National League, which later became Major League Baseball.

[-Kyle-]

If one league's draft moves faster than the other, participants in the slower moving draft can look over at the other draft to "cheat."

I'm not involved, but I was hoping you guys would use one player pool for all the teams.
I thought it would be good to have AL only draft AL players, and NL to only draft NL players.

[Minstrel]

If one league's draft moves faster than the other, participants in the slower moving draft can look over at the other draft to "cheat."

I'm not involved, but I was hoping you guys would use one player pool for all the teams.

That would have been ideal, but with 28 teams, it would have been unwieldy (potentially long periods of time between selections, especially if you have end point picks and have to wait two rounds between picks essentially) and "great players" would have run out quickly.

As for "cheating," I suppose one could view it that way. Of course, with the Internet, one doesn't really need a concurrent draft to find likely players after the obvious ones.

[digglahhh]

That would have been ideal, but with 28 teams, it would have been unwieldy (potentially long periods of time between selections, especially if you have end point picks and have to wait two rounds between picks essentially) and "great players" would have run out quickly.

Isn't that part of the fun, the separating the men from the boys, so to speak. Having to dig a little deeper, maybe even engaging your creativity...

As for "cheating," I suppose one could view it that way. Of course, with the Internet, one doesn't really need a concurrent draft to find likely players after the obvious ones.

Point taken.

[Minstrel]

Isn't that part of the fun, the separating the men from the boys, so to speak. Having to dig a little deeper, maybe even engaging your creativity...

Perhaps. On the other hand, I'm not sure there's a great deal of creativity or excitement in deciding between Dante Bichette and Ezra Sutton. ;) You're still going to run out of obvious all-time greats in a 14 person draft of 25 rounds. Just not all within the first 10 rounds or so, like in a 28 person draft.

[Wade8813]

1. How does the draft order go after the first round? I assume I don't have nearly the last pick every round.

2. We need to decide what sim we'll be using, so we can know what to look at when evaluating players. I don't want to be looking at Warp, if the sim is just looking at BA, RBI, and HR.

[Minstrel]

1. How does the draft order go after the first round? I assume I don't have nearly the last pick every round.

It's a snake draft. Draft order reverses each round.

2. We need to decide what sim we'll be using, so we can know what to look at when evaluating players. I don't want to be looking at Warp, if the sim is just looking at BA, RBI, and HR.

Fair enough. Eric Bedard seems to be the guy who'll do the simming, so maybe he can enlighten us as to what metrics it uses.

[538280]

The cut-off is 1871, which is the inception of the National Association of Professional Baseball Players, the league which gave way to the National League, which later became Major League Baseball.

The cut-off can't be 1871 if you're not allowing a season with less than 140 games be a part of the sim. Teams didn't play 140 or more games until the the mid 1890s or somewhere around there.

[Williamsburg2599]

The cut-off can't be 1871 if you're not allowing a season with less than 140 games be a part of the sim. Teams didn't play 140 or more games until the the mid 1890s or somewhere around there.
We'll have to come up with a precentage of games played compared to total possible games, maybe 75% or 80%?:
NL
1876 - 70 games
1877 - 60 games
1879 - 84 games
1883 - 98 games
1884 - 112 games
1886 - 126 games
1888 - 140 games
1892 - 154 games
1893 - 132 games
1898 - 154 games
1900 - 140 games
1904 - 154 games
1919 - 140 games
1920 - 154 games
1962 - 162 games
1969 - 162 games
1993 - 162 games
1994 - 162 games
1997 - 162 games
1998 - 162 games

AL
1901 - 140 games
1904 - 154 games
1919 - 140 games
1920 - 154 games
1961 - 162 games
1969 - 162 games
1977 - 162 games
1994 - 162 games
1997 - 162 games
1998 - 162 games

Are AA players eligable??? If so,:
1882 - 80 games
1883 - 98 games
1884 - 112 games
1886 - 126 games
1888 - 140 games
1889 - 112 games
1890 - 140 games
League disbanded after 1891, 4 teams joined NL

[Wee Willie]

The cut-off can't be 1871 if you're not allowing a season with less than 140 games be a part of the sim. Teams didn't play 140 or more games until the the mid 1890s or somewhere around there.
I'd say a good cut-off point can be 1884, when seasons were finally over 100 games (112), and overhand pitching was allowed for the first time. This would also allow the great 1880's stars (Anson, Brouthers, Connor, Kelly, etc.) to still have a solid WARP1 season for the sim during their era while using a high enough sample-size of games.

The minimum games played rule could then be simplified to:

Non-catchers: must have played in 80% of team's scheduled games for the representative sim year
Catchers: must have played in 70% of team's scheduled games for the representative sim year
Pitchers: The previous minimums already decided upon can still apply.

It would be the drafter's responsibility to make sure they are picking an eligible year. Major strike years can still be excluded from the sim.

[Minstrel]

I'd say a good cut-off point can be 1884, when seasons were finally over 100 games (112), and overhand pitching was allowed for the first time. This would also allow the great 1880's stars (Anson, Brouthers, Connor, Kelly, etc.) to still have a solid WARP1 season for the sim during their era while using a high enough sample-size of games.

The minimum games played rule could then be simplified to:

Non-catchers: must have played in 80% of team's scheduled games for the representative sim year
Catchers: must have played in 70% of team's scheduled games for the representative sim year
Pitchers: The previous minimums already decided upon can still apply.

It would be the drafter's responsibility to make sure they are picking an eligible year. Major strike years can still be excluded from the sim.

This is quite reasonable.

Rules post updated to reflect this change.

[Erik Bedard]

Fair enough. Eric Bedard seems to be the guy who'll do the simming, so maybe he can enlighten us as to what metrics it uses.

Basically, everything you can think of is kept track of by OOTP2006, which is what I have. VORP, WARP1, whatever. What goes into rating the players is their actual stats. That's about it.

On another note, after, say, the tenth round, the "miss a round, get kicked out" rule should be dropped.

This looks like a lot of fun. And I love having an early pick.

[Erik Bedard]

On another note, I found a DB that uses Japanese League HoFers. So they could be used in the sim.

BTW, what time does the clock start?

[Minstrel]

BTW, what time does the clock start?

Tomorrow, 10 AM EST for both leagues.

[Erik Bedard]

Cool with me.

[Wade8813]

Can we get a list of which seasons were strike shortened? I know about '94, but not any of the others.

[Minstrel]

Can we get a list of which seasons were strike shortened? I know about '94, but not any of the others.

The main three I know of are 1981, 1972 and 1994. If anyone else has a more comprehensive list, that would be great.

[Wee Willie]

The main three I know of are 1981, 1972 and 1994. If anyone else has a more comprehensive list, that would be great.
1972 had a short strike at the beginning of the season, but I'd put it in the category of "minor strike year", as probably 1995 should be as well. So I think both of those years should be eligible. 1981 and 1994 are the only ones I know of where a good chunk of the season was missed.

[Minstrel]

1972 had a short strike at the beginning of the season, but I'd put it in the category of "minor strike year", as probably 1995 should be as well. So I think both of those years should be eligible. 1981 and 1994 are the only ones I know of where a good chunk of the season was missed.

Sure. I don't know much about the history of strikes in baseball...and 1994 was the only one that happened while I was old enough to be following baseball.

[plask_stirlac]

How does the sim treat shortened seasons since we can pick anything lower than the players' third-best WARP?

[Wee Willie]

Also, what if two seasons are tied for the 2nd-best WARP1 for a player? Should either one of those seasons be eligible, since one of them could actually be the third best? Or would we need to pick that player's 4th best WARP1 year?

[ChrisLDuncan]

Can we trade players?

[The Splendid Splinter]

what stat are we using to determine the pitcher's seasons? is it still WARP1?

[Minstrel]

Also, what if two seasons are tied for the 2nd-best WARP1 for a player? Should either one of those seasons be eligible, since one of them could actually be the third best? Or would we need to pick that player's 4th best WARP1 year?

Either can be selected, since one of them is third-best. The "third-best season" thing is mostly to prevent Brady Anderson-esque hijinks. ;) Or, more generally, one or two year flukes. Plus, one's two best seasons are probably not one's general ability, but one's highest-variance ability.

[Minstrel]

Can we trade players?

Yes.

what stat are we using to determine the pitcher's seasons? is it still WARP1?

For the purposes of determining third-best season, yes.

[Erik Bedard]

How does the sim treat shortened seasons since we can pick anything lower than the players' third-best WARP?

OOTP adjusts everything to a 162-game schedule.

[Honus Wagner Rules]

I'm confused. Managers from both drafts can draft the same player? So Ruth will be picked twice? :confused:

[Erik Bedard]

It's not a problem as far as the sim's concerned.

[Wee Willie]

I'm confused. Managers from both drafts can draft the same player? So Ruth will be picked twice? :confused:
That's correct. The AL - NL designation for each draft just means the AL draft will allow the use of a DH.

[Wade8813]

It was mentioned before, but I don't see it in the official rules, so I wanted to clarify - we take all suspected steroid users by their actual numbers, correct?

I can pick Honus Wagner in a year he played SS, and stick him at 3B, since he had enough games played there?

* To be eligible as a relief pitcher, pitcher must have at least 5 seasons in which he had 40+ non-start appearances. If pitcher has fewer than 5 full seasons in his career, all 3 or 4 of his seasons must meet the 40+ non-start appearances qualification. This needs to be modified, IMO. John Smoltz should definitely qualify as a reliever, but he only has four seasons from the pen (and only three with 40+ non-start appearances). Since we only need three years worth of stats, I think we should only require three years with 40+ non-start appearances.

This raises another question - if Smoltz's two best years are from when he was a starter, does that mean we can take his best year as a reliever for the sim?

Lastly, the Baseball Prospectus site lists Warp1 for pitchers under advanced batting statistics. Is that still what I'm supposed to be looking at?

[Erik Bedard]

It would be great if we had a Rosters thread as well.

[Minstrel]

It was mentioned before, but I don't see it in the official rules, so I wanted to clarify - we take all suspected steroid users by their actual numbers, correct?

For the sim, we're going to have to. We have no way to come up with "real" numbers.

In the poll, people will vote based on what they think. While that's fine, I'd urge people to vote based on their appraisal of true talent and not punitively.

I can pick Honus Wagner in a year he played SS, and stick him at 3B, since he had enough games played there?

Right.

This needs to be modified, IMO. John Smoltz should definitely qualify as a reliever, but he only has four seasons from the pen (and only three with 40+ non-start appearances). Since we only need three years worth of stats, I think we should only require three years with 40+ non-start appearances.

Okay, that's fair. I'll drop the five year requirements to three.

This raises another question - if Smoltz's two best years are from when he was a starter, does that mean we can take his best year as a reliever for the sim?

That's a good question that should be resolved. Yes, it would work that way...WARP is comparable between starters and relievers, since BP adds value for the leverage of the innings pitched.

Lastly, the Baseball Prospectus site lists Warp1 for pitchers under advanced batting statistics. Is that still what I'm supposed to be looking at?

Yes. BP seems to classify WARP an offensive number, but it combines batting, fielding and pitching, so it's valid for pitchers as well as hitters.

[Minstrel]

It would be great if we had a Rosters thread as well.

We don't want to create too many threads for this. Posters can occasionally post their to-date rosters in the discussion thread, just to show how it's shaping up.

[Wee Willie]

I assume the NL in the rules stands for "Negro Leagues", right? Are essentially all Negro Leaguers eligible? How are their stats going to be simmed, since the actual Negro League season was quite short each year?

[Erik Bedard]

The DBs I use conatain every MLB player from 1871-2005, 50 NgL players, and 55 Japanese HoFers. That's not really an answer, but if you give me a player and a year, I'll add it in.

BTW, if I could get a city and a team name for everybody, that'd be great. Otherwise, I'd have to have random ones.

[Westlake]

My name in the CPFD can work for this one too, EB.

[BoSox Rule]

Boston Red Sox

[Erik Bedard]

My name in the CPFD can work for this one too, EB.

Whoa. Are you HW in disguise?

[plask_stirlac]

Portland Eagles

[Westlake]

Whoa. Are you HW in disguise?
EvanAparra in disguise.

[AstrosFan]

I hope I don't fall into the trap of trying to draft the best team. I'm just here to have fun. If I start trying to work out which player is the best value, I'm going to let a bunch of spreadsheets distract me. Can't have that.

[Westlake]

Same here AF. I'm not even going to look at WARP or BURP or whatever we are going to use, just here to have some fun.

[SamtheBravesFan]

Same here AF. I'm not even going to look at WARP or BURP or whatever we are going to use, just here to have some fun.

I'll have fun too. :) I'll look at WARP, but I'll end up going on instinct myself, looking at particular people and I'll probably overlook others. :crazy I'll have fun regardless. :D

[AstrosFan]

Same here AF. I'm not even going to look at WARP or BURP or whatever we are going to use, just here to have some fun.

When is the next poll for the BBF Top 25 coming up (Sorry for going off topic here)?

[Windy City Fan]

EB, shouldn't we have to call what stadiums we'll be using? Afterall, the type of park a team plays in can be an important factor.

I'll be the Chicago Cubs for city and name.

[Westlake]

When is the next poll for the BBF Top 25 coming up (Sorry for going off topic here)?

Oops. Forgot about that. I'll get on that tonight.

[Minstrel]

I assume the NL in the rules stands for "Negro Leagues", right? Are essentially all Negro Leaguers eligible? How are their stats going to be simmed, since the actual Negro League season was quite short each year?

No, NL stands for National League. My impression was that the general history of organized professional baseball went National Association of Professional Baseball Players, which was then succeeded by the National League, which was finally succeeded by Major League Baseball with the addition of the American League.

[The Dude]

I'll be playing under the moniker of "Midwest Gale"

[TBT]

I'll be the New York Yankees, if I'm allowed.

[Wee Willie]

No, NL stands for National League. My impression was that the general history of organized professional baseball went National Association of Professional Baseball Players, which was then succeeded by the National League, which was finally succeeded by Major League Baseball with the addition of the American League.
Okay, gotcha. That makes things simpler, anyway.

I live in Knoxville, TN, so I'll name my club after the local minor league affiliate - The Tennessee Smokies.

[Williamsburg2599]

I'll be the New York Yankees, if I'm allowed.
It's a draft, were you select your own players. And sign-ups are over for now.

[Williamsburg2599]

If were choosing Stadiums, I'll take Polo Grounds. My team name will be the Worcester Ruby Legs.

EDIT: did the window for tearforamariner just close in the NL League?

[Minstrel]

EDIT: did the window for tearforamariner just close in the NL League?

Looks like it.

[TBT]

If were choosing Stadiums, I'll take Polo Grounds. My team name will be the Worcester Ruby Legs.

EDIT: did the window for tearforamariner just close in the NL League?
Yes, either just now or one hour ago (I am unsure of time zones). I did sign up, I was just asking if the Yankees could be my team name. As for stadiums I'll pick Coors Field.

[Minstrel]

I'll be the La Jolla Minstrels. I don't live in La Jolla anymore, but I did when I went to UCSD, and I like the sound of it. I'll take Dodger Stadium in Chavez Ravine as my home stadium.

[The Dude]

I will take County Stadium as my stadium.

[Westlake]

Hm, if we can take historical parks than I will choose Ebbets Field.

EB, I've decided that I dont want the name from CPFD. I'll be located in Brooklyn, and my name will be the Robins.

[Williamsburg2599]

Yes, either just now or one hour ago (I am unsure of time zones). I did sign up, I was just asking if the Yankees could be my team name. As for stadiums I'll pick Coors Field.
Oh, ok, gotcha. New York Yankees? ehh, I don't like the sound of it.:D

[BoSox Rule]

If we're picking stadiums I'll take Fenway

[TBT]

Oh, ok, gotcha. New York Yankees? ehh, I don't like the sound of it.:D
Well, sorry if it sounds made up, but it's the best thing that I could think of. You have got to believe that it sounds better than what that other guy said, the Boston Red Sox or something. What a joke. Sounds like the name of a team that wouldn't be able to win the World Series for 86 years or something. ;)

[Windy City Fan]

I'll take Griffith Stadium.

[Erik Bedard]

When choosing a park, please list the dimensions, so that I can create it.

[Westlake]

Just to put everything in one post, EB.

Evan -- Westlake -- Brooklyn Robins -- Ebbets Field --

Dimensions...

Right field foul line - 297
Right center - 352
Center - 400
Left center - 365
left field - 343
backstop (in case you need it) - 70

Fences: LF to LCF was 9.87 ft.

CF: 20 ft.

RCF to RF: 38 ft

Elevation: 55 feet

[Williamsburg2599]

LF:279'
CF:483'
RF:259'
Back Stop:74 feet
Elevation:55 feet
Fences: LF-CF: 16.8 ft to 8.5 ft
CF background: 30.5 ft.
RCF: 12 ft.
RF: 10.64 ft.

[Minstrel]

For my stadium, Dodger Stadium:

Left Field - 330 ft
Medium Left-Center - 360 ft
True Left-Center - 375 ft
Center Field - 395 ft
True Right-Center - 375 ft
Medium Right-Center - 360 ft
Right Field - 330 ft
Backstop - 55 ft
Height of fences - 8 ft.

[Wee Willie]

Since I've taken Ruth, I might as well pick a stadium in which he's comfortable. We'll go with Yankee Stadium and its current dimensions:

Left field - 318
Left center - 399
Center field - 408
Right center - 385
Right field - 314

[SamtheBravesFan]

Turner Field - Atlanta, Georgia.

Left field - 335 ft.
Left-center - 380 ft.
Center field - 401 ft.
Right-center - 390 ft.
Right field - 330 ft.
Backstop - 58 ft.
Fence height - 8 ft.
Elevation: 1,025 ft. (?)

[The Dude]

Team Name: Midwest Gale
Stadium: County Stadium, Milwaukee, Wisconsin
LF: 320
LC: 397
CF: 410
RC: 395
RF: 320

Fences: 10 feet

[The Splendid Splinter]

Team Name: Cleveland Spiders
I'm going with Shibe Park... in 1956

LF: 334 ft.
CF: 447 ft.
RC (left of scoreboard): 400 ft.
RC: 393 ft.
RF: 329 ft.

backstop: 78 ft.

fence height-

LF: 12 ft.
CF: 8 ft.
RC scoreboard: 60 ft.
RF: 32 ft.

[Disgruntaledmarinerfan]

for a team name I'll go with..... Seattle Rainiers.
Fore staduim I'll go with the kingdome.

[-Kyle-]

I cannot find a list of WARP1 years/players on Baseball prospectus. All it tells me is what the stat is. Does anyone have a link?

[plask_stirlac]

It's under "Advanced Batting Statistics", the second section usually. It's the last stat under "Adjusted For Season", right where the <----><----> meet.

[SamtheBravesFan]

Let's see... for a team name I'll take...

Atlanta Braves (*shrug*)

I couldn't think of anything else. :crazy

[Erik Bedard]

Guess I picked the wrong draft to go with Willie Mays over Nap Lajoie. :crazy

[SamtheBravesFan]

Guess I picked the wrong draft to go with Willie Mays over Nap Lajoie. :crazy

*Bender voice* Eh, they're both fine choices, whatever floats your boat. *puffs on a cigar*

[Wee Willie]

I cannot find a list of WARP1 years/players on Baseball prospectus. All it tells me is what the stat is. Does anyone have a link?
There isn't an actual list on that site. You'll need to look up an individual player's WARP1 seasons.

[SamtheBravesFan]

There isn't an actual list on that site. You'll need to look up an individual player's WARP1 seasons.

Which is what I do. :)

[Wade8813]

Are we picking home fields that will actually be where our team plays? So, I should pick a field that gives an advantage to whatever team I come up with? If so, what are the restrictions for the dimensions? Do we need the elevation?

Do I have to worry about my players getting tired/injured?

Will relief pitchers be made by the computer, or after a certain number of innings, or what?

[Minstrel]

Are we picking home fields that will actually be where our team plays? So, I should pick a field that gives an advantage to whatever team I come up with? If so, what are the restrictions for the dimensions? Do we need the elevation?

Do I have to worry about my players getting tired/injured?

Will relief pitchers be made by the computer, or after a certain number of innings, or what?

Paging Eric Bedard...

[Erik Bedard]

Yes, yes, it has to be a real MLB park, past or current, if possible.

Yes/no. I will turn off injuries, but fatigue will be a factor.

By the computer, based on the era I choose to have it in.

BTW, what year would be considered "neutral"?

[tearforamariner]

I would like my team to be known as the Tacoma Giants, as an homage to the great minor league franchise that was once here.

For my stadium, I'm going with the kingdome in 1977:

LF: 315
LC: 375
CF: 405
RC: 375
RF: 315

http://www.oldtimerbaseball.com/images/NoHit-JerryThomas.jpg

[Wee Willie]

BTW, what year would be considered "neutral"?For our league, I would think the most neutral AL season in which the DH was used would probably work best. In a neutral offensive context, teams normally average 9.0 hits per game.

Looking at the AL each year going back to 1973, it looks like 1985 seems to be the most neutral. In that year, you can't get any more even than 20181 innings pitched and 20182 hits. It's a modern year, where steriods and juiced balls weren't really an issue. That would be my suggestion.

[Wade8813]

So, you do need the altitude?

I think I'll wait to pick my stadium until after I see how my team turns out to pick a stadium (assuming that if someone takes the one I want, I can also take it? If not, maybe we should have it that you have to use a pick on your stadium...).

[Erik Bedard]

If you can find it, great, if not, I'll just give you a generic one.

[-Kyle-]

McCoy Stadium, Pawtucket, RI

Left Field - 325 ft
Center Field - 400 ft
Right Field - 325 ft
Alleys - 375 ft
Outfield fence - 8 ft except 5 ft at bullpens

[Wee Willie]

For our league, I would think the most neutral AL season in which the DH was used would probably work best. In a neutral offensive context, teams normally average 9.0 hits per game.

Looking at the AL each year going back to 1973, it looks like 1985 seems to be the most neutral. In that year, you can't get any more even than 20181 innings pitched and 20182 hits. It's a modern year, where steriods and juiced balls weren't really an issue. That would be my suggestion.
On second thought, I realize that the AL in the DH era has more often than not had a higher offensive context. After all, that's what the DH does - it tilts the balance of power slightly toward the offense.

I did a quick average of Hits per Game over all 34 years of the DH era, and it turns out the AL has average just under 9.2 hits per game. So, the most representative year of the AL should probably be one that comes closest to that average. The years 1977, 1983, 1987, 1993, and 2002 all had 9.2 H/G. To narrow that down further:
1977 and 1993 were expansion years - toss them out.
1987 saw an explosion in home runs - toss it out.
2002 had too much of a steriod factor - toss it out.

That leaves 1983, a pretty "average" AL season from the DH era.

So, I'd actually go with 1983 over 1985 for the sim - all things considered.

[Wade8813]

If you can find it, great, if not, I'll just give you a generic one. I'm pretty sure I can find it - I'm just wondering if it'll affect my team a lot *cough*Coorsfield*cough*

[TBT]

I'm pretty sure I can find it - I'm just wondering if it'll affect my team a lot *cough*Coorsfield*cough*
Sorry man, Coors Field is already taken. See post #95.

[Westlake]

Sorry man, Coors Field is already taken. See post #98.
Post 98 was me saying I would take Ebbets.

[tearforamariner]

Sorry man, Coors Field is already taken. See post #95.

You and Wade are in different leagues. It shouldn't matter. If there are two Babe Ruths, I assume there are two Coors Fields, right?

[TBT]

You and Wade are in different leagues. It shouldn't matter. If there are two Babe Ruths, I assume there are two Coors Fields, right?
So, hypothetically, if me and him both get to play the WS against each other, all the games will be played at Coors?

[Erik Bedard]

. Yep.

[Wade8813]

If the home field can have a large impact on the game (as I imagine Coors could), I don't think it's fair if you can just name a stadium, and have exclusive rights to it.

[Westlake]

If the home field can have a large impact on the game (as I imagine Coors could), I don't think it's fair if you can just name a stadium, and have exclusive rights to it.

The other team plays in your park as well, I dont see how it is an advantage.

[Wade8813]

Because I play half my games there, if I build a team that does well in that sort of park, it should be advantageous.

[Erik Bedard]

Well, if you draft a team that plays well in your park, then it can be an advantage. If you draft a team that will play poorly in your park, then it can be a detractor. It all depends on how well you draft.

[Westlake]

Had to pick the Kid in front of the 2 Sox fans. :)

[Minstrel]

Teddy Ballgame was a pretty sweet value at pick 8.

[-Kyle-]

Had to pick the Kid in front of the 2 Sox fans. :)
:cool: He and Honus were my picks I was eyeing.

[Westlake]

:cool: He and Honus were my picks I was eyeing.

I struggled with Bonds or Williams. But I decided to take the player that people dont throw syringes at. Bonds '02 season is perfect, Kyle.

[-Kyle-]

I struggled with Bonds or Williams. But I decided to take the player that people dont throw syringes at. Bonds '02 season is perfect, Kyle.
I'm gonna go with that or in 92, when he could play defense well.

[Minstrel]

I've added one new person, a friend of Westlake's, on his request, to take the place of RMB. I decided to allow it since the first round hasn't completed, so RMB could be dropped and a new player added with no disruption. I added the new participant, ronnie5, to the end of the first round.

Hope this doesn't bother anyone.

[The Dude]

Then we're still down one in the nL.

[TBT]

Then we're still down one in the nL.
I know someone you can add who will join.

[Wade8813]

Erik - how is defense rated in your sim? Do you have any idea?

Does the game differentiate between the fielding of an Ozzie Smith vs. an Omar Vizquel? How much will it hurt to have a mediocre fielding SS? A horrible one?

And, to answer the question once and for all, is Jeter a good fielder or a bad fielder? (lol)

[Minstrel]

I know someone you can add who will join.

Ask plasc_stirlac about it, as he's running the NL draft.

[Erik Bedard]

Erik - how is defense rated in your sim? Do you have any idea?

Does the game differentiate between the fielding of an Ozzie Smith vs. an Omar Vizquel? How much will it hurt to have a mediocre fielding SS? A horrible one?

And, to answer the question once and for all, is Jeter a good fielder or a bad fielder? (lol)

I'm not sure how the makers decided to rate defense, but it is a factor.

I believe Vizquel and Smith both have the highest possible rating defensively. If you put a mediocre SS at SS, he would make the basic plays, and a few extra ones. Nothing spectacular, like a Vizquel or Smith. If you play someone out of position at SS, he probably will botch a few of the easy ones. For example, I once made a team in 2004, as the Red Sox. It got to be 2008, and I had no SS on my roster, but I had six OFs. I decided to try putting Craig Monroe at SS, and.... well, let's just say it seemed like if it wasn't hit directly at him, he wouldn't make the play. And sometimes, even if it was hit directly at him, he would throw it away.

Jeter is generally a middle-of-the-road defensive SS in this DB. Again, I'm not sure how they rate defense.

[Wade8813]

I figured as much. Thanks for the info.

[Erik Bedard]

No problem. :cool:

[The Dude]

What stat are we using for the pitcher bar? I know we're using Warp 1 for batters (can't be top 2), but is there any stat for the pitchers?

[plask_stirlac]

Regarding the NL Draft, I assume Chris Duncan is the person we could add.

Post if you are in favor of letting him be added to the end of the first and beginning of the second. I might add him anyway, but support would be nice to see. The deadline is Dudecar's pick so Windy City Fan will be able to plan accordingly.

[tearforamariner]

Regarding the NL Draft, I assume Chris Duncan is the person we could add.

Post if you are in favor of letting him be added to the end of the first and beginning of the second. I might add him anyway, but support would be nice to see. The deadline is Dudecar's pick so Windy City Fan will be able to plan accordingly.

So he'd have teams in both Leagues?

[ChrisLDuncan]

Well, yeah I'd have two teams. If people are against that I'm okay with that, but I'd like to know why. If there are some restrictions on my choices that the mods or each of the leagues would like to impose that's cool too.

[tearforamariner]

I don't know. I have to think about it a little while longer. I'm not sure I'm too keen on the idea of two teams Chris.

[Westlake]

Same here.

[The Splendid Splinter]

i kinda like how it's not even. the real mlb league has 14 AL teams and 16 NL teams. so 14 AL and 13 NL is fine with me. also i dont think one person should have 2 teams, but if the majority of the NL want him in then i would welcome him in our league. i would much rather have someone else who doesnt have a team join before chris.

[cashwrapper]

If there's a spot open, I'd like to join.

[plask_stirlac]

Oh I didn't know ChrisLDuncan was in the AL, haven't been following it. Now I'm against it unless there's a swell of support.

But how about cashwrapper? Hmm.

[Wade8813]

Another Q for you Erik - does your game count Saves for relievers/closers?

[Erik Bedard]

Going into the ratings, no. I believe it only counts rate stats and non-team-influenced individual stats.

[Minstrel]

What stat are we using for the pitcher bar? I know we're using Warp 1 for batters (can't be top 2), but is there any stat for the pitchers?

We're using WARP1 for pitchers as well as position players. WARP1 tallies up value from hitting, pitching and fielding, so it works for all players.

[The Dude]

I'm against having someone have two teams. I'm up for cashwrapper coming in though.

[The Dude]

If Warp 1 is tied, are we able to use WARP 2/3 as a tiebreaker?

[Wee Willie]

If Warp 1 is tied, are we able to use WARP 2/3 as a tiebreaker?
You can use either WARP1 season if two seasons are tied for the 2nd or 3rd best season.

[ChrisLDuncan]

I withdraw my NL team request.

[The Splendid Splinter]

mwiggins got till 10:53 tonight to make his pick... man the NL draft is taking forever...

[The Dude]

I agree. This is taking way too long.

[Williamsburg2599]

I was thinking since the LBA is dead in the water, maybe a mod could re-name it and give that sub-forum to the Fantasy Draft and league?

[Windy City Fan]

Guys, we are moving waaaay too slow. We should be shooting for a round a day, and in the NL, we're only half way through the first round after 3 days! If you see your pick coming up and you know you won't be on for a while, perhaps you could PM it to a member of the opposite league who you know checks in regularly. Also, I think we should change the times the window cannot expire. With the current 8 AM PST and 10 PM EST, there is 14 hours in the day when the window cannot close. I much rather have be say 8 to 10 Central time (yes that is my time zone, but we're in the middle).

Oh, and cashwrapper joining the NL is fine with me.

[tearforamariner]

I'm on throughout the day and am a very honest person (and a Moderator to boot). If you guys know you can't make your picks when it's your turn, you can PM me your pick. Either league, doesn't matter.

[Westlake]

I'm on throughout the day and am a very honest person (and a Moderator to boot). If you guys know you can't make your picks when it's your turn, you can PM me your pick. Either league, doesn't matter.

Honest? No one that thinks Johjima is going to hit 30 jacks this year is honest, not even to themselves. :rolleyes:

[tearforamariner]

Honest? No one that thinks Johjima is going to hit 30 jacks this year is honest, not even to themselves. :rolleyes:

Oh it will happen my friend, it WILL happen. Come September, you'll be crying in disbelief. :laugh.

[plask_stirlac]

TFAM you should be a professional editor, hehe.

GL with a round a day unless we whittle down to about 6-8 hardcores.

[tearforamariner]

TFAM you should be a professional editor, hehe.

GL with a round a day unless we whittle down to about 6-8 hardcores.


I shouldn't have even been here to edit the most recent update.

I was on my way home (on campus right now). I got to my car and it turns out I locked my keys in it. Sitting right in the ignition. I'm waiting for someone to come save me.

[Westlake]

I shouldn't have even been here to edit the most recent update.

I was on my way home (on campus right now). I got to my car and it turns out I locked my keys in it. Sitting right in the ignition. I'm waiting for someone to come save me.

I don.... I jus... ah sorry Russel, I can't help it.... :laugh

[plask_stirlac]

The draft draws you to it irreisistibly... just when you think you're out it pulls you back in!

So two for cashwrapper and no spoken opposition?

[tearforamariner]

The draft draws you to it irreisistibly... just when you think you're out it pulls you back in!

So two for cashwrapper and no spoken opposition?

cashwrapper is fine I guess.

[Westlake]

Yeah, but there should be a precaution like -- if he misses a pick and a certain amount of turns....

[Minstrel]

cashwrapper is fine by me.

We do have a "miss a pick" precaution...if a poster goes 14 selections (overall, not his/her own) with an unmade pick outstanding, he/she will be dropped.

So, basically, if someone doesn't make a pick and a whole round goes by without them making it...fin.

[Minstrel]

Hrm, we have a run on pitchers going in the AL. There may not be any left by round 3...

[ronnie5]

Hey guys. I'm new here and I had a quick question and I apologize if someone's already asked this... I know it was mentioned that strike years don't count, but does that mean that year doesn't count toward a player's WARP1? I guess basically, are we to ignore that season completely? If someone knows the answer to this, can you let me know? Thanks.

[plask_stirlac]

These are the reasons I chose Mantle.

-When he had epic offensive years, he really went off. Okay some were short but not his incredible 56-57, which opens the door for 1961. It was an up offensive year with expansion and all, but other than Norm Cash and his fairly unique year, he was definitely the Alpha Dog in baseball. Maris had zero IBBs, no manager caved even once or a handful of times... mind-boggling.
-He presents something different as a CF in general, and none have been drafted. He's the only non-corner man with an AB/HR under 10 with at least 30 HR. It was only done by Mark and Sammy in the 90s, at any position. I rarely see an EqA like .379 (or .372) other than three lefties I'm sure you can name.
-He's modern, could still chip in for 10/11 SB (I love when sluggers or catchers do that), and I like his appeal for any vote as the 10th pick, not many weaknesses other than doubles (but 76 XBHs still). And it's nice to fill in CF, set it and forget it.

And I have a general idea of what Bonds '02 or '04 would do in a simulation, it's very nice, uber-efficient and all, but owners have complained about even more excessive walking. I just said in my sig, yes, but he's also not a CF and more deficient among LFs those years. There will be LFs. 1992 was tempting, he played and plays pretty much perfect ball when I've tried him, and he could play CF probably, but RL time helps.

[plask_stirlac]

Hey guys. I'm new here and I had a quick question and I apologize if someone's already asked this... I know it was mentioned that strike years don't count, but does that mean that year doesn't count toward a player's WARP1? I guess basically, are we to ignore that season completely? If someone knows the answer to this, can you let me know? Thanks.

They were made available if the player played ___% of team games, 80 I think. It was at the top of a previous page.

[Wade8813]

He presents something different as a CF in general, and none have been drafted. The NL draft is so different than the AL already. We had 4 CFers go in the first 10 picks. I need to keep track, and make sure I can get a good enough CF, before they're all gone.

[plask_stirlac]

Oh, Cobb is a CF. I often forget that.

[Westlake]

Oh, Cobb is a CF. I often forget that.

Same here. I was about to say I only saw 3. There's actually a good amount of CF left. Its not as bare as 2nd base and SS.

[Wade8813]

Oh, Cobb is a CF. I often forget that. I did too, until I started listening to William Burgess so much... :rolleyes:

[Minstrel]

They were made available if the player played ___% of team games, 80 I think. It was at the top of a previous page.

The major strike years were disqualified. Playing 80% (or even 100%) of a significantly shortened season lends itself to small sample size effects.

I think 1994 and 1981 were identified as the two major strikes, so those years are as if they never happened. They can't be used.

[plask_stirlac]

Well, cashwrapper will be added to the NL draft.

[Wade8813]

Same here. I was about to say I only saw 3. There's actually a good amount of CF left. Its not as bare as 2nd base and SS.I've found about the same number at CF, SS, and 2B (which is not a lot). There are more top end CFers IMO, but more have been taken. Also, a CF is more likely to be taken as a DH, so the list could shrink faster than expected.

[Westlake]

I have my eye on one CFer and one Pitcher. And whichever one I take, i'm sure the other will be taken by the next time I choose, especially with the run of pitchers lately. :o

[tearforamariner]

Hrm, we have a run on pitchers going in the AL. There may not be any left by round 3...

We're having a run on second basemen in the NL. Top 4 are already gone and it's still the first round!

[Erik Bedard]

I'm probably going to have to take an infielder or catcher next. I've got my eye on a few.

[Wade8813]

It will be interesting - if the AL continues picking pitchers (or CFers) and the NL continues picking 2nd basemen, people might start picking them much higher than they were going to, just to make sure they don't get the short end of the stick.

[plask_stirlac]

This might be tricky, guys with two picks in a row are very important to draft pace, of course.

It's up to you, cashwrapper.

[Wade8813]

Hey, the NL is finally picking up the pace!

[ronnie5]

I think 1994 and 1981 were identified as the two major strikes, so those years are as if they never happened. They can't be used.

Thanks for clearing that up.

[digglahhh]

You guys should try to shoot for organizing a "lightning round." The weekends would be a good time. Try to see if you can get everybody from the league on for, say, a two hour period on Saturday or Sunday. If you can do that, and everybody has some sort of ranking list, you could bang out of a whole bunch of picks in a short amount of time.

I think they tried to do this in some of the other All-Time Drafts that have been done here in the past.

[Westlake]

Thats a good idea digglahhh... ronnie and I were talking about that as well. If everyone is game, i am.

[Minstrel]

You guys should try to shoot for organizing a "lightning round." The weekends would be a good time. Try to see if you can get everybody from the league on for, say, a two hour period on Saturday or Sunday. If you can do that, and everybody has some sort of ranking list, you could bang out of a whole bunch of picks in a short amount of time.

I think they tried to do this in some of the other All-Time Drafts that have been done here in the past.

That would be great, but it seems like organizing such a thing around 14 people's schedules would be quite a nightmare. We can try it at some point and see.

[Erik Bedard]

In the CPFD, with thirteen people, we found it virtually impossible. Same with the last all-time draft. The first managed a few, but they only had eight people.

[Wade8813]

I'm up for it. Even if it was just for a 1/2 hour, we could probably do an entire round or two, if people were all here and all ready.

[tearforamariner]

I'm there. Just let me know when.

[Erik Bedard]

People who know they can't make it can PM a draft board to someone who will be there.

I think a good time to do it would be around 8:30 EST (5:30 PST), so that it's convenient to both people on the East Coast and the West Coast, and in between.

[Erik Bedard]

Augh, Kyle took my guy!

[Minstrel]

Okay, let's try this: I'll propose a time and day with a decently long window. If most people can hit it, great. If not, we'll try to close the window to the point that most/all people can be there.

This Sunday (2/11) from 3 PM EST until 9 PM EST. That's noon until 6 PM on the west coast.

I picked Sunday since my experience is that Saturday is the more active day. If you can make the entire window, indicate that. If you can make only a portion of the window, indicate the widest window you're available for. Then we'll see what we see.

Also, as a related aside, now that we've been moved to this forum, I'm going to create a separate discussion thread for AL and NL. That will also help better organize responses to this idea. So don't respond here, respond in the discussion thread for your league.

[Westlake]

Augh, Kyle took my guy!
You were going to take another 2nd baseman?

[Erik Bedard]

What? I have Willie Mays. That's it. I wish I had Nap Lajoie, though.

[Westlake]

What? I have Willie Mays. That's it. I wish I had Nap Lajoie, though.

My bad Danny, I was just looking at the old all-time draft where you took Lajoie.

[Wade8813]

I wish I had Nap Lajoie, though. :waving :dance :clapping :gt

[Erik Bedard]

My bad Danny, I was just looking at the old all-time draft where you took Lajoie.

It's cool. Just don't call me Danny. ;)

[Windy City Fan]

I was schocked to see Willie Mays available with the 13th pick. I was equally shocked to see Collins, Lajoie, and Morgan all gone before my first pick. Frankly, I think I got a steal in Mays and there are several other intriguing players left on the board for me to debate with my next pick once cashwrapper does his thing. Very different drafts so far. But I do see CF and 2B as similar positions. Both have a pretty strong group at the top, but then there's a sharp dropoff.

I will say the biggest reach thus far has been Bench with the second pick overall in the AL draft. I had him pegged going no sooner than late second round.

[Westlake]

It's cool. Just don't call me Danny. ;)


LOL. Ok, EriC Bedard! ;)

[Erik Bedard]

Don't call me that either. EB is fine, Erik is fine, heck, Dan's fine too. I'd prefer you didn't call me anything else. And don't mispell my name. ;)

[Wade8813]

I wouldn't have picked a C in the first round, but I totally understand wanting to snag one of the best before they all disappear. I almost took a SS (who will remain unnamed) over Mathewson for my second pick, just because I don't want to get stuck with some mediocre SS. There's no way in heck this SS is good enough to be in the top 20 players, but you need to make sure you fill all the positions in a draft...

[plask_stirlac]

So we're narrowing it down from 6 hrs or is it a 6 hr thing? If it's lightning, make it an hour like was said.

I'll be here... Godspeed to everyone else for such an endeavor. I mean in online fantasy leagues, everybody specifically picks the same time for a live draft, but still half as no-shows (though with skipping now it's harder to tell if they're silent) is like the norm. I missed a freebie draft completely just last year.

[TBT]

Okay, let's try this: I'll propose a time and day with a decently long window. If most people can hit it, great. If not, we'll try to close the window to the point that most/all people can be there.

This Sunday (2/11) from 3 PM EST until 9 PM EST. That's noon until 6 PM on the west coast.

I picked Sunday since my experience is that Saturday is the more active day. If you can make the entire window, indicate that. If you can make only a portion of the window, indicate the widest window you're available for. Then we'll see what we see.

Also, as a related aside, now that we've been moved to this forum, I'm going to create a separate discussion thread for AL and NL. That will also help better organize responses to this idea. So don't respond here, respond in the discussion thread for your league.
Aww man, I guess I have to be the guy who messes this up because I will probably not be able to be on this forum over the weekend. I'm able to do it on any weekday besides Friday. If it must be done over the weekend, I guess that I could PM someone a draft board, but it might influence their decisions.

[Wade8813]

Aww man, I guess I have to be the guy who messes this up because I will probably not be able to be on this forum over the weekend. I'm able to do it on any weekday besides Friday. If it must be done over the weekend, I guess that I could PM someone a draft board, but it might influence their decisions. PM anyone from the other league. You'll probably have to do that whether we do a lightning round or not, because missing 3 days is probably too much.

[-Kyle-]

Augh, Kyle took my guy!
Sorry :o
My stratigy was to pick a heavy hitter and a good middle infielder. Hans was taken, and Barry was there so I picked him, hoping one of the three 2ndasemen I had in mind came back around.

[Williamsburg2599]

Don't call me that either. EB is fine, Erik is fine, heck, Dan's fine too. I'd prefer you didn't call me anything else. And don't mispell my name. ;)
Mispell? more like spell correctly.

-Eric C. ;)

[Erik Bedard]

... stupid people named Eric.... always telling me my name is spelled wrong....

(said in Homer Simpson's "stupid Flanders" voice)

[-Kyle-]

I was schocked to see Willie Mays available with the 13th pick. I was equally shocked to see Collins, Lajoie, and Morgan all gone before my first pick. Frankly, I think I got a steal in Mays and there are several other intriguing players left on the board for me to debate with my next pick once cashwrapper does his thing. Very different drafts so far. But I do see CF and 2B as similar positions. Both have a pretty strong group at the top, but then there's a sharp dropoff.

I will say the biggest reach thus far has been Bench with the second pick overall in the AL draft. I had him pegged going no sooner than late second round.
I got Collins in the second round of the AL, I'm pretty pleased.

[Wade8813]

Ironically enough, you guys misspelled misspell. :crazy

Anyway, back on topic - Minstrel. How many Games/IP do pitchers need? I assume they don't need to be in 80% of the scheduled games...

[Minstrel]

Ironically enough, you guys misspelled misspell. :crazy

Anyway, back on topic - Minstrel. How many Games/IP do pitchers need? I assume they don't need to be in 80% of the scheduled games...

160+ IP for a starter or 40+ appearances for a relief pitcher.

[Minstrel]

So we're narrowing it down from 6 hrs or is it a 6 hr thing? If it's lightning, make it an hour like was said.

The idea is a cut-down from six hours, since I doubt 14 people will all be able to be around for six hours. I'm just trying to constrain when it might happen and then find out people's availability within that window.

Goes without saying, you handle this for the NL (assuming you want a lightning round for the NL). ;)

[Wade8813]

160+ IP for a starter or 40+ appearances for a relief pitcher. I thought so, but wasn't sure because of the way you worded it.

[Erik Bedard]

Problem: There are no WARP1 stats for NeL players.

[Westlake]

Problem: There are no WARP1 stats for NeL players.

We arent using Negro League players.

[Erik Bedard]

In the first post, it says we can. Or maybe NL doesn't mean Negro Leagues. Or maybe something changed.

[Wade8813]

NL means National League - we have an AL and an NL team.

[Westlake]

I believe MLB was called the NL before it was completely established.

[Westlake]

What about a rule change -- 400 ABs or 200 IP. for strike years

[538280]

From past experience with these type leagues I think it would be very useful if we had a rosters thread.

[Wade8813]

I was going to suggest the same thing, but figured it doesn't matter this early in the draft.

[plask_stirlac]

ADDING INSTANT BASEBALL PROSPECTUS SEARCH (WARP speed ;) )
I have Baseball Prospectus DT search in my Firefox search bar. Searching definitely isn't hard this way so try it if you like or aren't used to the site.

If you go to the website and you're running Firefox, the little dropdown box should have a blue outline and be willing to take BP just like Google or Yahoo.

[Minstrel]

From past experience with these type leagues I think it would be very useful if we had a rosters thread.

Sure. I didn't want to make a whole collection of threads when this was in the History forum, but here I guess we can go hog-wild...we seem to mostly have the run of the place. ;)

[Disgruntaledmarinerfan]

[QUOTE=Minstrel]Okay, let's try this: I'll propose a time and day with a decently long window. If most people can hit it, great. If not, we'll try to close the window to the point that most/all people can be there.

This Sunday (2/11) from 3 PM EST until 9 PM EST. That's noon until 6 PM on the west coast.

I picked Sunday since my experience is that Saturday is the more active day. If you can make the entire window, indicate that. If you can make only a portion of the window, indicate the widest window you're available for. Then we'll see what we see.
[quote/]
I hate to be a"party pooper" but under the proposed lightning round time frame, I cannot participate.:( :(

[Minstrel]

I hate to be a"party pooper" but under the proposed lightning round time frame, I cannot participate.:( :(

Okay, let's try this. In your league discussion thread, give the times during the weekend that you'd be free for an hour or two. We'll see if there's any major crossover.

[Wade8813]

I talked to Disgruntaledmarinerfan, and it looks like he might be able to do some of the lightning round after all.

[The Splendid Splinter]

I should be able to make it this sunday for the whole time or most of it anyway... if not, i already gave my list to one of my buddies... his name is wolverineman on here so if you see his name in the draft, hes picking for me... letting you guys know

cuz i know i wont be on for a week from like march 9th til the 17th... spring break and im going to cali.

[tearforamariner]

On the NL Roster thread, Windy City Fan has Willie Mays playing RF. If I remember the rule correctly, Mays can't play RF.

[The Splendid Splinter]

On the NL Roster thread, Windy City Fan has Willie Mays playing RF. If I remember the rule correctly, Mays can't play RF.


remember he said if you were a CF, you are capable to play all 3 OFs spots... then corner OF can play either LF/RF and a SS can also play 2B... i believe those are the only exceptions

[tearforamariner]

remember he said if you were a CF, you are capable to play all 3 OFs spots... then corner OF can play either LF/RF and a SS can also play 2B... i believe those are the only exceptions

Okay, I guess that makes sense.

[Windy City Fan]

SS has it right. CF can play any outfield slot, corner outfielders can switch, and SS can plat 2B.

[The Dude]

I can make whatever time on sunday

[Williamsburg2599]

I want to put this out there again, now that we have 7 threads, and since the LBA is now pretty much dead, could a mod possibly change the name of the LBA sub-forum and give it to the all-time draft?

[Minstrel]

Okay...I don't think we're going to get an organized sense for who can be here when among all our participants, so let's just say that between 12 PM and 6 PM PST (3 PM and 9 PM EST) on Sunday, we're trying to do a lightning round.

All of you do your best to check in as much as possible during that period, but if you can't, you can't. You don't have to be sitting in front of the draft thread all the time, just be somewhat aware of when you might have another pick and check in. Also, try to have someone else draft for you if you can't be here. Mention on one of these discussion threads (preferably your league thread, for better readability) who you're authorizing to make picks on your behalf.

We'll see how that goes.

[Erik Bedard]

Minstrel: Have we decided whether I can use Maddux's 1994 season or not? He had 202 IP, which, IMO, is a big enough sample size.

[Minstrel]

Minstrel: Have we decided whether I can use Maddux's 1994 season or not? He had 202 IP, which, IMO, is a big enough sample size.

Okay, I guess if the sample size is big enough, the strike doesn't matter. The sample size has to be as much as the specifications for a "full season" in the rules.

I'll adjust the rules.