Craig Biggio- which hat?

[AlecBoy006]

It's quite obvious Craig Biggio will go into the hall of fame, and as an Astro, but he has had several different hats over the years playing there. Which one?


http://www.astrosdaily.com/files/gallery/Biggio_Craig_04.jpg




http://imagesource.allposters.com/images/pic/PHO/AAGW217_8x10-2006StudioPlus~Craig-Biggio-Posters.jpg

http://www.astrosdaily.com/cards/1989D_Biggio_Craig.jpg

[Mad Guru]

If he goes in wearing anything that isn't slathered in pine tar, he shouldn't be allowed in at all.

[Biggtone23]

well considering the bronze/gold color of the plaque there would be no difference between one and two. And I'm pretty sure they wont give him a backwards batting helmet, so I'll go with 1 and 2.

[AlecBoy006]

I couldn't find a pic with the H and star. Sorry.

[Erik Bedard]

I always associate Biggio with #2.

[Fuzzy Bear]

I think number 2 reflects Biggio in his prime years better.

[MadHatter]

Perhaps this will be unpopular - but I'm not convinced that Biggio is a Hall-of-Famer.

[dgarza]

Where's the honor of being an Astro and not wearing the 70s/80s design?

[KCGHOST]

I like #2 best.

[brewcrew82]

If he were to make it to the Hall I don't think the cap design will really matter...The difference between the '95-99 cap and the 2000-current design is minimal (even more so when the statue is bronze).

That being said, the current logo would be the one that would be put on Biggio/Bagwell etc should they make it to Cooperstown (they (Biggio etc) have worn that design longer than any of the other Astros designs).

[Captain Cold Nose]

Perhaps this will be unpopular - but I'm not convinced that Biggio is a Hall-of-Famer.
He's on the verge of reaching 3000 career hits. The writers have yet to dismiss such glossy career totals.

[MadHatter]

He's on the verge of reaching 3000 career hits. The writers have yet to dismiss such glossy career totals.

Agreed and understood... but the same used to be said about the 400 homer plateau... and yet Dave Kingman isn't in. I know it's a totally different case, but Craig Biggio (not unlike Bert Blyleven) has some great career totals due to longevity. But he was never a dominant player, the way Jim Rice was. That being said, if Tony Perez can get in then I suppose Biggio will too... but I think it's a flawed system.

[holyroman]

Agreed and understood... but the same used to be said about the 400 homer plateau... and yet Dave Kingman isn't in. I know it's a totally different case, but Craig Biggio (not unlike Bert Blyleven) has some great career totals due to longevity. But he was never a dominant player, the way Jim Rice was. That being said, if Tony Perez can get in then I suppose Biggio will too... but I think it's a flawed system.


Me thinks you have spent too much time collecting autographs and cardboard with pictures on it then watching baseball.
Biggio is a hall of famer without 3000 hits. i think you should be comparing 500 homers with 3000 hits rather than 400 homers as this is a better comparison.
take a look at the people he has passed on the all time doubles list. he is ninth all time and will likely be 6th after this seasons over. and how many of them are in the hall
he may well reach 300 homeruns this year.
he will reach 3000 hits this year
Your perception of his dominance withstanding, there is no denying he is past his prime, but in his prime he was the best leadoff hitter of the nineties and in his current form still hitting for plenty of extra base power.
In the last 4 years since 2003 he has hit 164 doubles. 86 homeruns. and hit for a .264 average. his average has dropped .20 points in these years from his career average.
If Craig were playing in St. Louis or Chicago or New York or Boston. I think you might have heard a little more about how good this guy has been. I can not explain this phenomenun as I know Houstonn is the 4th largest city in the country

[dgarza]

That being said, if Tony Perez can get in then I suppose Biggio will too... but I think it's a flawed system.
What's your take on Robin Yount. I think Yount's a better comparison to Biggio. I think I have Yount and Biggio ranked about the same. They're certainly very similar players.

[MadHatter]

Me thinks you have spent too much time collecting autographs and cardboard with pictures on it then watching baseball.
Biggio is a hall of famer without 3000 hits. i think you should be comparing 500 homers with 3000 hits rather than 400 homers as this is a better comparison.
take a look at the people he has passed on the all time doubles list. he is ninth all time and will likely be 6th after this seasons over. and how many of them are in the hall
he may well reach 300 homeruns this year.
he will reach 3000 hits this year
Your perception of his dominance withstanding, there is no denying he is past his prime, but in his prime he was the best leadoff hitter of the nineties and in his current form still hitting for plenty of extra base power.
In the last 4 years since 2003 he has hit 164 doubles. 86 homeruns. and hit for a .264 average. his average has dropped .20 points in these years from his career average.
If Craig were playing in St. Louis or Chicago or New York or Boston. I think you might have heard a little more about how good this guy has been. I can not explain this phenomenun as I know Houstonn is the 4th largest city in the country

I watch plenty of baseball, and have been watching for close to 30 years now. I would say overall, you have some strong points... and maybe I'm a bit unrealistic... but I always thought of the Hall as a place for the best of the best. A place where only those who truely dominated deserved to be enshrined. Granted, there are some milestones that "trigger" induction in many cases... but guys like Blyleven can hit those numbers and still not get in. So there's a gray area there.

I guess, looking back on it for me, Biggio has been a very good player. Yes, his stats are comparable to Hall-of-Famers Yount, Joe Morgan, Molitor, Sandberg... but those guys always seemed more dominant during the times that they played.

just looking at stats... if a guy plays for 25 years as a good player, he can reach many milestones. Can anyone really ever say Biggio DOMINATED the time that he played? Does everyone else REALLY think he's a lock? More so than Lou Whitaker or Vada Oinson (two other guys his stats compare to)?

[dgarza]

just looking at stats... if a guy plays for 25 years as a good player, he can reach many milestones. Can anyone really ever say Biggio DOMINATED the time that he played? Does everyone else REALLY think he's a lock? More so than Lou Whitaker or Vada Oinson (two other guys his stats compare to)?
But remember, the whole "dominated" criteria is yours and may not hold sway for others. Even Yogi Berra never really dominated.

[MadHatter]

But remember, the whole "dominated" criteria is yours and may not hold sway for others. Even Yogi Berra never really dominated.

Agreed - and that's what this is all about - opinion, right?

The Berra case is interesting because it's true he never really dominated the way Bench did... but he had a LOT of exposure playing on some pretty powerful Yankees teams. And this goes to your point earlier about Biggio playing in a smaller market team (and one that did not have much post-season exposure.)

I'm not a Biggio hater, far from it... I, personally, just question his Hall worthiness.

[Westlake]

Me thinks you have spent too much time collecting autographs and cardboard with pictures on it then watching baseball.



Absolutely unnecessary, buddy.

[dgarza]

Agreed - and that's what this is all about - opinion, right?


Right, but it seemed as if you were asking people to draw a conclusion by taking them down your path only, without giving them a chance to use their own criteria. That's the only reason I pointed it out, that is came across as such.

[jalbright]

Me thinks you have spent too much time collecting autographs and cardboard with pictures on it then watching baseball.



Absolutely unnecessary, buddy.

We will have no more exchanges like this--it's veering far too much into the personal attack area to be allowed to go any further. Hopefully this will serve as a word to the wise. The unwise will find out how I use my powers as a moderator in such situations.

Jim Albright

[The Kid]

Pic number two. It's the one he will be wearing the inning after he gets his 3000th hit.

[milladrive]

If he were to make it to the Hall I don't think the cap design will really matter...

I second that.

[holyroman]

Absolutely unnecessary, buddy.
you're right I don't know who pissed in my cornflakes yesterday.
I apologize for the snide remark MadHatter.
I took offense and shouldn't have. My opinion is just on the oposite end of the spectrum on this matter. We should agree to disagree.