Johan Santana?

[ElHalo]

This had honestly never occurred to me before there was an article mentioning it in passing on ESPN, but they brought up the idea of the Twins trading Johan Santana to the Yankees for a package of prospects.

Santana's a free agent in two years, and he should be getting, at a minimum, something in the range of 8 years, $200 mill. Probably more if salaries continue to inflate the way they did this year. That's a bit rich for the Twins' blood.

The Yankees would be able to offer Philip Hughes, who projects to be an ace #1 starter, Humberto Sanchez, who projects to be a number three starter, and Tyler Clippard, who projects as a decent back of the rotation guy, plus various other midlevel prospects. Nothing is going to replace Santana, the best pitcher in baseball, but the Twins won't be able to keep him anyway, and Hughes gives them a viable ace replacement to pair with Liriano if he ever comes back.

Does anybody else see this is a seriously sensible scenario?

[DoubleX]

I read the same article. I don't see this happening anytime soon because I believe Santana is under contract with the Twins through the 2009 season. So that's three more seasons before he'd be in line for the big payday, and a lot can happen between now and then that could alter his value. So being that he is under contract for three more seasons, I don't see the Twins, who have realistic pennant hopes, being eager to trade him, being the best pitcher in baseball, anytime soon (even if his trade value is very high right now).

[ElHalo]

And I agree that it wouldn't really be a realsitic possibility if Santana wasn't a free agent until after the 2009 season, but he's a free agent after the 2008 season. He only has two years left on his contract, so the Twins should be starting to think about it right about now.

Also hitting the free agent market that offseason: Jeremy Bonderman, Mark Prior, Brad Penny, Jake Peavy, and Ben Sheets. While ordinarily having a lot of quality arms on the market would tend to drive down prices, Santana's a special case, and it's equally possible that the contracts start to pile high on each other the way they did this offseason.

[Mattingly]

Let's also not forget that Phil Hughes may likely make his debut this September and be the #5 pitcher for the Yanks in 2008. If he's worthy of what's said about him, he increases his number of innings, then it may not be as urgent a need for the Yanks to get Santana. I'm not saying anyting's wrong with him, as I'd certainly love having him i pinstripes. However, I don't think that's the cure-all to everything, as he'd be one of 5 starters.

Having an additional starter, especially as the ace, puts less pressure on everyone else. It lets Wang be the #2 he most likely could be, just as many other teams' ace would be pushed to #2 status if he were signed.

I'd disagree with ElHalo's $200m/8 yr thing. I believe that this was merely a matter of players and agents (not all of whom are named $cott Bora$) taking advantage of a free agent pool that wasn't quite chock full of aces. In ordinary times, I could easily see Santana making Zito's $126m/7 yr deal, possibly $140m/7 yrs, but I wouldn't go as high as $25m, much less think that this could be paid easily.

Texas' Tom Hicks isn't going to get continually burned, as he's proven he can't afford Alex Rodriguez. He won't spend well beyond his means in the future. George Steinbrenner cannot afford to pay $25m/season, especially with all the inflated salaries, including an inflated luxury tax bill.

Now then, who else could possibly pay such an exorbitant fee? Most likely a team in a situation like the Giants, where they'd lost their ace , Jason Schmidt, and are looking for a suitable big-name replacement that the season ticket holders will likely warm up to very quickly.

Right now, I'm not seeing another $25m player. For that price, once you make that kind of exorbitant salary, I'm not sure how "hungry" you can still be to win. Anything over $20m/yr very much bothers me.

As a baseball fan, I often hope that Sanatana would stay in the Metrodome, just as many applauded the Brew Crew keeping Ben Sheets. However, if top aces became available, I could see a stampede going in their direction with huge pots of gold being flunt their way. That wouldn't be fool's gold, either. ;)

[Edgartohof]

If he can keep up his dominance, I could see a huge contract for him, though $200 million may be a bit much. Seeing as how he'll be 29 when he becomes a FA, a 7 year deal would bring him to age 36, which is as far as I would go, though if he's as good as many think he is, maybe in the long run it wouldn't be too bad to sign him for longer, but there is a lot of risk coming with that as well, so who knows.

He IS the premier pitcher of today, has dominated the last 3 seasons, and has a good outlook towards the future. He has future HOFer written all over him (though one never knows). He did get a late start on things, not gettin ga full time starting position until 2004, at the age of 25, though Randy Johnson didn't fully get things under control until age 29, and look at what he has done!!!

[mwiggins]

I think they might be tempted to try to win it all in 2008, esp. if it seems like Liriano is going to be able to come back at full strength. If Garza lives up to his promise, that would give them a VERY strong top of the rotation. If Mauer and Morneau don't regress from their 2006 seasons, they could be a really strong contender.

[ElHalo]

Let's also not forget that Phil Hughes may likely make his debut this September and be the #5 pitcher for the Yanks in 2008. If he's worthy of what's said about him, he increases his number of innings, then it may not be as urgent a need for the Yanks to get Santana. I'm not saying anyting's wrong with him, as I'd certainly love having him i pinstripes. However, I don't think that's the cure-all to everything, as he'd be one of 5 starters.

Hughes certainly will be making his debut much sooner than September; he should be making his debut the second Pavano's ribs crack / thumbnail gets infected / hairlip splits / legs fall off.

I'd disagree with ElHalo's $200m/8 yr thing. I believe that this was merely a matter of players and agents (not all of whom are named $cott Bora$) taking advantage of a free agent pool that wasn't quite chock full of aces. In ordinary times, I could easily see Santana making Zito's $126m/7 yr deal, possibly $140m/7 yrs, but I wouldn't go as high as $25m, much less think that this could be paid easily.

Including his posting fee, Boston is paying $17 mill a year to Matsuzaka, sight unseen in the majors. The Giants are paying $18 mill a year to Zito, who's a good number three starter or a mediocre #2. You're telling me that teams won't be willing to pay Santana, unquestionably the best pitcher on the planet, more than twice as much as they're paying Gil Meche?

Take a look at Zito's numbers vs. Santana's numbers. The last three years, Zito's posted ERA+'s of 105, 116, and 116, with WHIP's of 1.394, 1.200, 1.403. In the same time, Santana's posted ERA+'s of 182, 153, 161, with WHIP's of 0.921, 0.971, 0.997. You're honestly telling me that Santana isn't worth $7 mill a year more than Zito? He's at least as much better than Zito as Zito is better than Gil Meche. And if you don't think Santana's agent isn't going to make this all very clear to the teams trying to sign him, I don't know what to tell you.

As for who'd be willing to pay that... well, the Mets need an ace, the Angels are trying strenuously to get one, the Yankees have money to spend with Johnson off the books, and the Red Sox are always in the running (especially with Schilling retiring soon). All of those teams can afford $20 mill +, albeit with some difficulty.

[ChrisLDuncan]

If that happens I will flip over my car and run around town naked in happiness, that would call for a celebration of celebrations.

[ChrisLDuncan]

I don't see the Twins, who have realistic pennant hopes, being eager to trade him, being the best pitcher in baseball, anytime soon (even if his trade value is very high right now).

I see him as the best PLAYER in baseball, I can't think of any hitter that is as good at his craft as Santana is at pitching.

[cubsfan1073]

I think it is a good idea for the Twins to trade him now, I had never thought of that either, but it will put them in a good position if they can trade him now. They don't wanna end up like the Nats and Soriano. The Yankees have so much money, they don't really rely on their farm much, so they Yankees can afford to trade some top prospects.

[EvanAparra]

Including his posting fee, Boston is paying $17 mill a year to Matsuzaka, sight unseen in the majors. The Giants are paying $18 mill a year to Zito, who's a good number three starter or a mediocre #2. You're telling me that teams won't be willing to pay Santana, unquestionably the best pitcher on the planet, more than twice as much as they're paying Gil Meche?
.

Doesnt have anything to do with it. It's all about the market at the time. I dont think he will get close to 200 mil, much lest 200 at the very least.

[cincyredfan1972]

I can see them eventually trading him, but not with 2 years left on his contract. And not before they at least try to reup him. The twins have a couple of years here where they have a very dominant pitcher, and some of the games best young hitters. Plus they have a new park coming online in the next couple of years.

[DodgerBlue8188]

If the Twins get rid of him I have a feeling they will regret it. If he has 3 years left I think it would be a horrible decision. If he only had 1 year it may be a smart move but I just think 2-3 years left on the team can make a lot happen.

[Old Sweater]

If that happens I will flip over my car and run around town naked in happiness, that would call for a celebration of celebrations.

LOL


I think that the Twins should keep Santana, they made the playoffs last year and if Liriano had stayed healthy, who knows what could have happened.

[Mattingly]

Hughes certainly will be making his debut much sooner than September; he should be making his debut the second Pavano's ribs crack / thumbnail gets infected / hairlip splits / legs fall off.
I'm not too sure the Yanks would be willing to put their AA ace up into the South Bronx anytime soon, especially with his limited number of innings (5-6/game, I understand). I just don't see this. I think that we'll see Karsten or Rasner filling the chores. Don't want to hurt young talent.

What's the wine slogan, about we'll serve no wine before its time? The Yanks will debut no pitcher before his time. We need a few years out of him, not a few months.

For Pavano, I'm willing to accept sig & av bets with any Yankee fan that he won't make it past each of February (pitchers & catchers reporting), March and April before he spends at least a combined week unable to play, practice, etc. He got traded from Boston to Montreal for Pedro, and all we get in return from him is an automatic deduction every Thursday into his Swiss bank account. I would say "plus a handshake", but wouldn't want to risk any further injuries. :D
Including his posting fee, Boston is paying $17 mill a year to Matsuzaka, sight unseen in the majors. The Giants are paying $18 mill a year to Zito, who's a good number three starter or a mediocre #2. You're telling me that teams won't be willing to pay Santana, unquestionably the best pitcher on the planet, more than twice as much as they're paying Gil Meche?

Take a look at Zito's numbers vs. Santana's numbers. The last three years, Zito's posted ERA+'s of 105, 116, and 116, with WHIP's of 1.394, 1.200, 1.403. In the same time, Santana's posted ERA+'s of 182, 153, 161, with WHIP's of 0.921, 0.971, 0.997. You're honestly telling me that Santana isn't worth $7 mill a year more than Zito? He's at least as much better than Zito as Zito is better than Gil Meche. And if you don't think Santana's agent isn't going to make this all very clear to the teams trying to sign him, I don't know what to tell you.

As for who'd be willing to pay that... well, the Mets need an ace, the Angels are trying strenuously to get one, the Yankees have money to spend with Johnson off the books, and the Red Sox are always in the running (especially with Schilling retiring soon). All of those teams can afford $20 mill +, albeit with some difficulty.
Matsuzaka's posting fee doesn't count towards luxury taxes, nor can it be used in future negotiations for a greater salary. Only his performance in Fenway and other parks as a Red Sox player will help this. While they may be strapped to his historic posting fee, if there's an extention, it could be cheaper down the road.

I wouldn't agree with the $25m/yr thing. I think that once you hit $20m/yr, that's my imaginary "glass ceiling". You're not going above this, to me, unless someone is beyond superstar. In fact, I don't think that A-Rod ($25.2m/yr), Manny ($20m/yr) or Jeter ($18.9m/yr) should make their salary, but that's a different issue.

As I'd tried saying in my last reply to you, I think that part of the exorbitant salaries are due to the team's pretty much fearing that one of the other 29 teams will sign the much-desired player, even if some have pretty much been financially eliminated from the chase. Once the Yanks don't bite (but they surely would with Santana, then you're talking about teams willing to overspend on one player. This would be unlike the Yanks, who obviously have overspent on quite a few players (too many to list, though said list is quite interesting).

For the Mets, I don't think they'd get Santana. You remember what happened with A-Rod? Couldn't afford him. They loved the meal, but just couldn't pay for such quality dining.

Are the Angels willing to spend $25m on one player? After paying for Zito, could the Giants pay that much? I seriously doubt that they could have the two priciest pitchers in baseball on a single roster. I just don't see them doing that.

If there is an absolute price war, I could see Santana giong as high as $21m/yr. However, I don't see it going much beyond that unless it's for few years (5-6 @ $22m/yr). Otherwise, if he wants 7 years, I think that there should be a limit on how much he makes.

If he's the best MLB pitcher on the planet, and thus the best baseball pitcher on the planet, I believe that $20m/yr does well to compensate him for his highly desirable services.

[cubsfan1073]

I think that the Twins should keep Santana, they made the playoffs last year and if Liriano had stayed healthy, who knows what could have happened.
That will be good for the Twins the next couple of years, but what happens two years from now when Santana is asking for 150M? The Twins don't have that kind of cash, and even if they do manage to pay Santana the big bucks, they won't have money to spend on anyone else.

[FatAngel]

For Pavano, I'm willing to accept sig & av bets with any Yankee fan that he won't make it past each of February (pitchers & catchers reporting), March and April before he spends at least a combined week unable to play, practice, etc.

I think this year he´s due for skipping at least one start because he slept on the wrong side;)

[Mattingly]

I think this year he´s due for skipping at least one start because he slept on the wrong side;)
Carl Pavano is the only pitcher I know of who's pencilled in to miss a start when it's not even his turn to pitch.

Anyone can have bad luck, such as the Red Sox' Matt Clement being the frequent victim of comebackers hitting him. However, Pavano has shown me absolutely nothing. It's one thing to have little talent, frequent DL stints, but not even showing up is absolutely unacceptable. I feel that he's got very little left in the desire to play professionally.

If he retired rich, I wouldn't mind one bit. Makes me wish his contract weren't guaranteed.

[wu-tang clan]

Carl Pohlad does have enough money to sign him to a new contract, but he chooses not to spend more per year. since he is 91, i am hoping the twins get a new owner who is more willing to spend.

[ChrisLDuncan]

Wow Wu, that would be a horrible off-season...seriously.

[plask_stirlac]

As unsavory as it would be to trade Santana as a Twins fan, if they can't re-sign him they won't once he's on the market. They don't really sign anyone who's getting big offers from other teams, ever.

I'm not sure if they're pennant-chasing, though they did "make up" for Liriano getting injured pretty well in August and September. A lot of guys had career years, Kubel needs to emulate Cuddyer's level or better.

They've done it before with Viola, trading a guy who was among the best in his prime and stocking the rotation. I think Ryan would need Hughes and Sanchez, plus even more arms but not at that level. Well Hughes would have to show some good progress in the majors, probably.

But they payed Radke $46.25 million over his last five, I could see them upping Johan to $18-20 M per year, two times Radke and with Zito (and the Giants had to go longer than others at a very high annual, losing recently), for about 4 years again. If he has preference for the Twins again he might sign.

But a lot could happen. If Johan has some injury problems, the Twins would be the first that could offer long-term money. 2008 could see the Twins too hot to trade, especially if there isn't a team sure they have enough to trade and then bid to re-sign him. Hughes and Sanchez might go elsewhere.

[Honus Wagner Rules]

I said it here first. The Twins will keep Santana and pay him big money. The Twins paid Puckett big money (the highest salary in baseball at that time) when he was to become a FA. And I don't want to hear "But the ecomonics were different back then".

[Mattingly]

I said it here first. The Twins will keep Santana and pay him big money. The Twins paid Puckett big money (the highest salary in baseball at that time) when he was to become a FA. And I don't want to hear "But the ecomonics were different back then".
Doesn't mean that people can't talk about economics. Was he considered the best player at his position at the time? A position that was very much in demand in a relatively thin pool of available people at that spot? To me, that's what Santana represents.

http://www.baseball-reference.com/p/puckeki01.shtml

In which year are you referring to where he'd made the highest salary in baseball at the time? The most he'd ever made was $7m in 1995. He'd averaged $3m from 1991-92, jumped to $5.3m in 1993.

[Richmond Hill Phoenix]

That will be good for the Twins the next couple of years, but what happens two years from now when Santana is asking for 150M? The Twins don't have that kind of cash, and even if they do manage to pay Santana the big bucks, they won't have money to spend on anyone else.The Twins owner's net worth is $2.8 billion. Don't tell me that they don't have the money. Maybe he will decide to open the purse strings when such a special player becomes available. But time will tell. It's all going to depend on the market at the time.

And for the record, trading him now would be a terrible idea. They have the best pitcher in baseball for two more years at a marvelous, unheard of price: 07:$12M, 08:$13.25M.

[bigtrain]

I said it here first. The Twins will keep Santana and pay him big money. The Twins paid Puckett big money (the highest salary in baseball at that time) when he was to become a FA. And I don't want to hear "But the ecomonics were different back then".

I hope you are right but the difference between Santana and Puckett is Puckett had ties in MN. His home and family was in MN. Not the case with Santana. Puckett was offered more money from other teams but he turned it down to stay in MN. I doubt Santana has that strong of ties to the state.

Puckett was also the lone superstar on his team and the overall fan favorite by far. Santana has to compete with Mauer and to an extent Morneau for the fan favorite crown. If it came down to either Mauer or Santana I believe the Twins would sign Mauer.

I have read that Santana is not looking forward to pitching outside in April in MN because of the cold. How serious he was about it is unknown. With the new outdoor stadium coming in 2010 that may affect his decision.

[digglahhh]

If the Twins were crazy enough to trade Santana, don't you think they could do better than some Yankee prospects?...

You don't think that just about any team wouldn't be willing to give up a top young, established, star plus a top level prospect?...

Utley plus...
Sizemore plus...
Texeira plus...
Wright/Reyes plus...

[Colorado Express]

I highly doubt that the Twins would trade Santana before the deadline of his Free Agent year. The Twins have a lot riding on their success (i.e., the hype of the new stadium), but I would fully expect them to be priced out of Santana's salary range and have to make a trade. By then, Hughes should be ready to step in and be a contributor to the Twins staff of Liriano, Garza, Bonser and Perkins/Durbin.

[plask_stirlac]

If the Twins were crazy enough to trade Santana, don't you think they could do better than some Yankee prospects?...

You don't think that just about any team wouldn't be willing to give up a top young, established, star plus a top level prospect?...

Utley plus...
Sizemore plus...
Texeira plus...
Wright/Reyes plus...

It would probably be deadline '08, so two months and then he'll file for FA probably.

[insanefishpossay]

...but I would fully expect them to be priced out of Santana's salary range and have to make a trade.

I find it unbelieveable that we're having to talk about Santana's contract like this, when in reality our owner has enough money to pay for an entire pitching staff full of Johan Santana's. If the richest owner in baseball is not willing to open up his wallet to keep the best player in the MLB wearing a Minnesota Twins uniform, it is time for him to give the team to someone who cares.

[Honus Wagner Rules]

Doesn't mean that people can't talk about economics. Was he considered the best player at his position at the time? A position that was very much in demand in a relatively thin pool of available people at that spot? To me, that's what Santana represents.

http://www.baseball-reference.com/p/puckeki01.shtml

In which year are you referring to where he'd made the highest salary in baseball at the time? The most he'd ever made was $7m in 1995. He'd averaged $3m from 1991-92, jumped to $5.3m in 1993.
I believe after the early 1990s when the 3 million dollar per season mark was broken. I forget the details. Either Rickey Henderson or Kirby were the first to break it. But then the conracts started going up fast. They didn't have the highest salary very long, perhpas a few weeks? I'll check up on it.

[mwiggins]

I find it unbelieveable that we're having to talk about Santana's contract like this, when in reality our owner has enough money to pay for an entire pitching staff full of Johan Santana's. If the richest owner in baseball is not willing to open up his wallet to keep the best player in the MLB wearing a Minnesota Twins uniform, it is time for him to give the team to someone who cares.


Agreed. It's not going to help season tickets for the new park if they get rid of him. For the whole time they've been trying to get the new park it's been "if we only had a new park, we could be competitive in terms of spending". And then right before you move in you deal away your best player because you don't want to spend the money.

They've been talking about the new park resulting in an extra $20 million in payroll spending, but knowing Pollad he won't be raising the budget by that much anytime soon. I know they'll give Mauer whatever he wants, but I'd much rather pay Santana $20 million a year and let Morneau walk, rather than lock Mauer and Morneau up this offseason and hope the young pitchers like Garza and Liriano can come through when you have to deal Santana.

[Colorado Express]

I find it unbelieveable that we're having to talk about Santana's contract like this, when in reality our owner has enough money to pay for an entire pitching staff full of Johan Santana's. If the richest owner in baseball is not willing to open up his wallet to keep the best player in the MLB wearing a Minnesota Twins uniform, it is time for him to give the team to someone who cares.

With Mauer, Morneau, Liriano, Nathan, Cuddyer, Bonser, etc. all coming due for a BIG payday, there will not be enough money spread around. Although the mighty billionaire, Pohlad, can afford to hold onto all these players, it's quite obvious that he won't. If the Twins plan on hanging onto all their top players, they would end up with a payroll in the $150 million range in 3 years. Let's face it, that's not going to happen!!!

I support the way the Twins handle their payroll. Despite the fact that the Twins have been one of the better teams in baseball over the past 4 years, people still don't go to the games (hopefully the new stadium will change this). I like the fact that the Twins rarely overpay for players and instead look for the bargains. Having said that, if the Twins are on the verge of winning a championship and the missing ingredient is Johan Santana, then I would expect him to go all out and spend every penny to keep him.

[Colorado Express]

Agreed. It's not going to help season tickets for the new park if they get rid of him. For the whole time they've been trying to get the new park it's been "if we only had a new park, we could be competitive in terms of spending". And then right before you move in you deal away your best player because you don't want to spend the money.

They've been talking about the new park resulting in an extra $20 million in payroll spending, but knowing Pollad he won't be raising the budget by that much anytime soon. I know they'll give Mauer whatever he wants, but I'd much rather pay Santana $20 million a year and let Morneau walk, rather than lock Mauer and Morneau up this offseason and hope the young pitchers like Garza and Liriano can come through when you have to deal Santana.

Everything comes down to depth. The Twins have a pitching-rich minor league system. It may make more sense to keep Morneau than Santana.

I agree that Mauer will get whatever he wants...he's the "new" Kirby Puckett for the Twins organization. I still believe that the Twins will build on their version of the M&M boys and we'll see Morneau get his payday from the Twins, too.

[ElHalo]

If the Twins were crazy enough to trade Santana, don't you think they could do better than some Yankee prospects?...

You don't think that just about any team wouldn't be willing to give up a top young, established, star plus a top level prospect?...

Utley plus...
Sizemore plus...
Texeira plus...
Wright/Reyes plus...

It's quite obvious that the Mets would be foolish to give up both Wright and Reyes; that's two potential perennial MVP candidates, and that's way too much to give up for any one player. As to Utley, Sizemore, and Texiera, it's probable (especially with the scarcity of ace pitchers) that Philip Hughes has more trade value than any of them. You also have to factor in that a team trading for him would want to be in a position to afford him once he becomes a free agent, which Philly and Cleveland clearly can't, and which Texas probably won't.

[mwiggins]

Everything comes down to depth. The Twins have a pitching-rich minor league system. It may make more sense to keep Morneau than Santana.

I agree that Mauer will get whatever he wants...he's the "new" Kirby Puckett for the Twins organization. I still believe that the Twins will build on their version of the M&M boys and we'll see Morneau get his payday from the Twins, too.

I'm still not sold on Morneau long term. I'd like to see him put together another very good year before they lock him up. But he'll be cheaper than Santana, so that's where they'll go.

Maybe Santana and Hunter for Hughes and A-Rod?:eek:

[ShortStop]

Maybe Santana and Hunter for Hughes and A-Rod?:eek:


If the twins trade Santana it would be because they woun't be able to pay his salaries demands, whon in the blue hell makes you believe they will be willing to pay 25 mil to A-Rob?:grouchy

[plask_stirlac]

The Yankees (and Rangers) if they could have Santana!

[SwissRedSoxFan]

The Twins will never let go Santana until he hits the trade deadline for FA. Forget it.

[ChrisLDuncan]

The Twins will never let go Santana until he hits the trade deadline for FA. Forget it.

That's just the Red Sox fan in you talking, the Twins won't pay to keep Santana and they can't just let him walk.

[ElHalo]

If the twins trade Santana it would be because they woun't be able to pay his salaries demands, whon in the blue hell makes you believe they will be willing to pay 25 mil to A-Rob?:grouchy

Nobody is paying $25 mill to ARod. The Yankees are currently paying him around $15 mill, and the Rangers around $10. $15 mill for a player of that caliber is an absolute bargain in today's market.

[mwiggins]

If the twins trade Santana it would be because they woun't be able to pay his salaries demands, whon in the blue hell makes you believe they will be willing to pay 25 mil to A-Rob?:grouchy


As a Twins fan I'd pick up the Yankees portion of A-Rod's contract. He could play SS if he wanted. I'm guessing if he got out of NY, he'd be well worth $15 million.

[Colorado Express]

I'm still not sold on Morneau long term. I'd like to see him put together another very good year before they lock him up. But he'll be cheaper than Santana, so that's where they'll go.

Maybe Santana and Hunter for Hughes and A-Rod?:eek:

That's what's nice...the Twins have 2 more years to see which of these players develop and to determine their needs. The Twins have a lot of good young players/prospects and it's really just time that will tell which ones pan out.

I suspect that Morneau will be a good player for years to come and at 25, his best years should be ahead of him. I'm not sure I expect him to hit .321 every year (although he could, he was a career .310 hitter in the minors), I do expect to see better power numbers in the future. I think Morneau dropped off the radar after 2005 and everyone forgot that he was one of baseballs top hitting prospects and labeled as a "can't miss" by most magazines.

Provided that they perform as I expect them to, I think the Twins will build around the two of them (and market them as the "new" M&M boys) and will plug other gaps just as they have always done, with prospects.

[mwiggins]

That's what's nice...the Twins have 2 more years to see which of these players develop and to determine their needs. The Twins have a lot of good young players/prospects and it's really just time that will tell which ones pan out.

I suspect that Morneau will be a good player for years to come and at 25, his best years should be ahead of him. I'm not sure I expect him to hit .321 every year (although he could, he was a career .310 hitter in the minors), I do expect to see better power numbers in the future. I think Morneau dropped off the radar after 2005 and everyone forgot that he was one of baseballs top hitting prospects and labeled as a "can't miss" by most magazines.

Provided that they perform as I expect them to, I think the Twins will build around the two of them (and market them as the "new" M&M boys) and will plug other gaps just as they have always done, with prospects.

Hopefully Bartlett is the real deal as well. Those three - along with Liriano, Garza, and Bonser - gives them potentially a very nice young core to build around, with or without Santana.

[digglahhh]

It's quite obvious that the Mets would be foolish to give up both Wright and Reyes; that's two potential perennial MVP candidates, and that's way too much to give up for any one player. As to Utley, Sizemore, and Texiera, it's probable (especially with the scarcity of ace pitchers) that Philip Hughes has more trade value than any of them. You also have to factor in that a team trading for him would want to be in a position to afford him once he becomes a free agent, which Philly and Cleveland clearly can't, and which Texas probably won't.

I certainly didn't mean Wright and Reyes, I meant Wright or Reyes.

And I did try to consider teams that could afford him. Texas and the Mets surely could. The Phils could too, when they have to re-up on Utley and Howard, they'll have to pay big time, and they have the money. Cleveland is not swimming in riches, but any team that is not destitute will find the money for Johan if he entered the market. Only the bare-bottom teams wouldn't be able to at least compete; that's why I didn't throw Miguel Cabrera's name out there.

The point is; I doubt the Yanks could put the best deal on the table if this unlikely scenario were to come to fruition.

[Richmond Hill Phoenix]

...The Twins won't pay to keep Santana...
How do you know? I have a feeling that they will. And hopefully (for the twins) he has some loyalty to his franchise.

Who's his agent, anyways?

[ChrisLDuncan]

How do you know? I have a feeling that they will. And hopefully (for the twins) he has some loyalty to his franchise.

Who's his agent, anyways?

I hope so too...the Twin Cities have some people so they can fill a ball park, it doesn't make any sense to build a new franchise without that marquee player. Johan Santana is a marquee player. As much as I would like to have Santana as a Yankee fan, he should stay with the Twins...I'm not sure that he would be able to handle New York.

[Richmond Hill Phoenix]

His agent is Peter Greenberg. At least its not you know who...

17492
I know he's just doing his job... But still.

[cardsfanatic]

If the Twins were crazy enough to trade Santana, don't you think they could do better than some Yankee prospects?...

You don't think that just about any team wouldn't be willing to give up a top young, established, star plus a top level prospect?...

Utley plus...
Sizemore plus...
Texeira plus...
Wright/Reyes plus...

I wouldnt trade any of those guys plus, for Santana with his contract status the way it is. But some team might. Most likely the Rangers who need pitching like crops need rain. Then again, Tex plus is steep for anyone. Santana included. The question I'd have to ask myself is "is my team just Johan Santana away from making the playoffs?" If I answer yes, I might bite the bullet. If the answer is no then there's no way I do any of those trades.

[Colorado Express]

Hopefully Bartlett is the real deal as well. Those three - along with Liriano, Garza, and Bonser - gives them potentially a very nice young core to build around, with or without Santana.

I couldn't agree more. Not to mention, they still have great prospects in Durbin, Perkins and Span.

[NYMets523]

Santana has a limited no-trade clause: He can block trades to 10 teams this year and 12 next year. However, he has a full NTC now since he won this year's Cy Young. I believe the Twins will try to trade him at the 2008 trade deadline; especially if they are not in playoff contention. If they are competitve throughout 2007 and 2008, they will keep him.

If the Twins want to trade him, I would imagine they would trade with an NL team for a good amount of top-level prospects or some already established players. I don't think they would want to trade Santana to an AL team or even any Central team (both AL and NL).

If he hits the market, I could definitely see the Yankees and Mets going after him. The Yankees have tons of money to sign him regardless of his price. However, they have been more cautious with their money. I think if their young guys are doing very well and they have more dire needs (such as bullpen or position players), they may not go after him.

The Mets will have lost Pedro, Delgado, Green, Lo Duca, El Duque, and Glavine. This is going to leave them with a LOT of money to play around with. They will probably still need a #1 pitcher unless either Maine or Perez become an ace over the next 2 years. Plus being in the NL and a team that wants to win could help their case (Minaya is GM until 2009 and he wants to win).

Again, all of this is speculation. If the Twins are in playoff contention and Santana has another Cy Young Award season the rest of his tenure with the Twins, they will keep him. If they fall out of contention early or Santana is not delivering, I could see them trading him next year. He will certainly be a player to watch whether on the trading block or in the FA market.