all-time team [Archive] - Baseball Fever

tripledup22

11-20-2006, 05:56 PM

any player from any era no salery any player now make a team im sure this has been done before but anyway

c. yogi berra
1. gerig
2. archie vaughn
3.brooks robinsan
ss. visquel (i would pick jeter but i dont want all yanks)
LF.Winfield
CF. joe-D
RF. ted williams

pitching

1.nolan ryan
2.cy young
3.roger clemans
4.tom sever
5.greg maddux

closer

MO(obvious)

now go make your own :coffee

RuthMayBond

11-20-2006, 06:20 PM

any player from any era no salery any player now make a team im sure this has been done before but anyway

c. yogi berra
1. gerig
2. archie vaughnI assume you mean Arky, and I guess he could have played 2B

<3.brooks robinsan>

How about some offense?

<ss. visquel (i would pick jeter but i dont want all yanks)>

See above

<LF.Winfield
CF. joe-D>

There are better

<RF. ted williams>

He had enough trouble playing LF

<pitching

1.nolan ryan>

Overrated

<2.cy young
3.roger clemans
4.tom sever
5.greg maddux

closer

MO(obvious)>

Otherwise, a fine bunch :clapping

Wade8813

11-20-2006, 09:17 PM

Is this based on their career numbers? Their best single season? Best three consecutive years? Five years? Are we trying to make a team that will play for 10 years? 20 years? If a player gives me 18 good years, and then is basically through, can I trade him for to get the last two years elsewhere?

Do we go by their numbers? Do we adjust for league quality? Are steroids an issue? Do we have to worry about team chemistry? How do we account for any years missed to war?

Can I use players from the Negro Leagues?

TheKingofKings

11-21-2006, 03:45 PM

This should go in the "History of the Game" Forum, anyways :

C Yogi Berra
1B Lou Gehrig
2B Joe Morgan
SS Ozzie Smith
3B Brooks Robinson

OF Willy Mays
OF Mickey Mantle
OF Ted Williams

SP Nolan Ryan
SP Cy Young
SP Roger Clemens

CL Trevor Hoffman

Erik Bedard

11-21-2006, 03:57 PM

OK, my all-time most underrated team:

C: King Kelly
1B: Stan Musial
2B: Nap Lajoie
SS: Arky Vaughan
3B: Pie Traynor
OF: Bill Lange
OF: Ed Delahanty
OF: Sam Crawford

SP: Greg Maddux
SP: Steve Carlton
SP: Kid Nichols
SP: Bert Blyleven
SP: Rube Waddell

CL: Joe Page

... and my "Most Overrated" team:

C: Josh Gibson
1B: Still need help...
2B: Frankie Frisch
SS: Derek Jeter
3B: George Brett
OF: Joe DiMaggio
OF: Mickey Mantle
OF: Ralph Kiner

SP: Nolan Ryan
SP: Christy Mathewson
SP: Cy Young
SP: Bob Gibson
SP: Dizzy Dean

CL: Dennis Eckersley

note: off the top of my head

and edited to include suggestions

Astro

11-21-2006, 04:03 PM

OK, my all-time most underrated team:

C: King Kelly
1B: Stan Musial
2B: Nap Lajoie
SS: Arky Vaughan
3B: Pie Traynor
OF: Bill Lange
Help me out!

SP: Greg Maddux
SP: Steve Carlton
SP: Kid Nichols
Help me out again!

CL: Joe Page

... and my "Most Overrated" team:

C: Josh Gibson
1B: Need some help...
2B: Help!
SS: Derek Jeter
3B: George Brett
OF: Joe DiMaggio
OF: Mickey Mantle
OF: Help!

SP: Nolan Ryan
SP: Christy Mathewson
SP: Cy Young
SP: Bob Gibson
SP: Dizzy Dean

CL: Help!

note: off the top of my head
Jeter, Mantle, Bob Gibson? wow

Wade8813

11-21-2006, 04:49 PM

... and my "Most Overrated" team:

C: Josh Gibson
1B: Need some help...
2B: Help!
SS: Derek Jeter
3B: George Brett
OF: Joe DiMaggio
OF: Mickey Mantle
OF: Help!

SP: Nolan Ryan
SP: Christy Mathewson
SP: Cy Young
SP: Bob Gibson
SP: Dizzy Dean How can you say that Mantle and Mathewson are overrated? You could penalize The Mick somewhat for a lack of longevity, but despite his wild side, the injuries weren't all his fault. And even despite those injuries, he has some of the best numbers ever. And Mathewson is arguably the best ever (I have him second). He had a stellar career, and several of the best individual seasons. Even if you want to argue that everyone from that era should be penalized for playing pre-integration, he still ranks up with the best of the best.

W_Marone

11-21-2006, 05:07 PM

How can the all time leader in wins be overrated?

Here's my team.....not by who was the best, just who I would like on my team.

C: Berra
1st: Gehrig
2nd: Hornsby
3rd: Schmidt
SS: Honus Wagner
OF: Stan Musial
OF: Mickey Mantle
OF: Roberto Clemente

Reserves:
Ralph Kiner
Roger Maris
Hank Greenberg
Johnny Bench

Pitchers:

Walter Johnson
Steve Carlton
Cy Young
Juan Marichal
Bob Feller

Closer:
Rollie Fingers (just because I love that stache so much:D )

RuthMayBond

11-21-2006, 05:28 PM

OK, my all-time most underrated team:

OF: Bill Lange
Help me out!

SP: Greg Maddux
SP: Steve Carlton
SP: Kid Nichols
Help me out again!
OF EDelahanty, Raines
Hamilton, GVanHaltren
Crawford,
SP Bert Blyleven :D
Hubbell
Nichols
Waddell

<... and my "Most Overrated" team:

1B: Need some help...>

By some people, Sisler

<2B: Help!>

Joe Gordon :eek:

<OF: Help!>

Kiner,JRice
LWaner,HWilson
TMcCarthy,Maris,Oliva

<CL: Help!>

Eckersley

W_Marone

11-21-2006, 05:37 PM

glad my list could help you out Ruthmaybond....hahahaha.....:D My team is just some of my favorite guys over time, not exactly the best.....is this supposed to be who I think is the best at each position or just a team that I would love to put together??? Becuase that's what I did....

-Kyle-

11-21-2006, 06:35 PM

2B: Help!

Frankie Frisch?

milladrive

11-21-2006, 08:00 PM

...is this supposed to be who I think is the best at each position or just a team that I would love to put together???

I dunno the difference. I just wanna have more wins than the other team. heh

Anyhoo...

These are always so difficult, since we're always required to omit so many really super players. Off the top of my head, this would be my lineup and all-time 25-man roster.

2B: Rogers Hornsby
SS: Honus Wagner
1B: Lou Gehrig
CF: Willie Mays
LF: Stan Musial
RF: Hank Aaron
3B: Eddie Mathews
C: Yogi Berra

Depth:
C: Mickey Cochrane
1B: Jimmie Foxx
2B: Nap Lajoie
SS: Cal Ripkin
3B: Mike Schmidt
IF: Pete Rose
LF: Ted Williams
CF: Ty Cobb
RF: Babe Ruth

Pitchers:
SP: Walter Johnson
SP: Cy Young
SP: Christy Mathewson
SP: Babe Ruth
SP: Ed Walsh

RP: Hoyt Wilhelm
RP: Rollie Fingers
RP: Trevor Hoffman

P.S. Don't even ask me about Ruth. In my Utopian roster, Ruth pitches every fifth game and platoons the other four. ;)

Erik Bedard

11-22-2006, 04:06 AM

How can you say that Mantle and Mathewson are overrated? You could penalize The Mick somewhat for a lack of longevity, but despite his wild side, the injuries weren't all his fault. And even despite those injuries, he has some of the best numbers ever. And Mathewson is arguably the best ever (I have him second). He had a stellar career, and several of the best individual seasons. Even if you want to argue that everyone from that era should be penalized for playing pre-integration, he still ranks up with the best of the best.

He ranks up there with the best, certainly, but in no way #2 overall. Not even #2 pitching. That's why he's overrated.

Mantle: He's got great stats, certainly, but he's definitely not a Top 5 overall all-time (as I see some people putting him), which is why he makes this list.

Erik Bedard

11-22-2006, 04:10 AM

OF EDelahanty, Raines
Hamilton, GVanHaltren
Crawford,
SP Bert Blyleven :D
Hubbell
Nichols
Waddell

I believe I already had Nichols listed, but Blyleven would be a great addition. How did I forget Crawford? Hamilton and Raines might also make the team, but I'd still take Crawford and Delahanty. Hubbell... not really underrated. Waddell... maybe.

<... and my "Most Overrated" team:

1B: Need some help...>

By some people, Sisler

Damn sabermetricians! I don't even know what WARP+ stands for, nor why it has any significant meaning.

<2B: Help!>

Joe Gordon :eek:

Maybe...

<OF: Help!>

Kiner,JRice
LWaner,HWilson
TMcCarthy,Maris,Oliva

Yes, Yes, No, Yes, No, Yes, No

<CL: Help!>

Eckersley

Possibly...

Erik Bedard

11-22-2006, 04:12 AM

Jeter, Mantle, Bob Gibson? wow

How can you not call Jeter overrated? Rings ? Good player. Gibson pitched in a completely pitching-dominated era. Mantle... see my comments two posts above.

RuthMayBond

11-22-2006, 05:21 AM

glad my list could help you out Ruthmaybond....hahahaha.....:D Where would I be without you? ;)

yankillaz

11-22-2006, 05:29 AM

I would've made a team based on the cheapest players that i can get, but them being good players. I like the Underrated list that Bedard has, so i think i'll get the players from this list. You know, for instance, Brooks Robinson, due to his popularity could've been worth 12 million a year nowadays, while Ron Santo will be 8 million dollars worth. That's what my team will be based on. Therefore, here i go with it.

Catcher: Ray Schalk (Deffensive specialist, just what i need from this position)

First Base: Hank Greenberg (Short Career, buy outstanding power)

Second Base: Craig Biggio (Never has been considered the best in his position, but is a top 10 all-time 2b)

Third Base: Ron Santo (Sure Fire Hall Of Famer, or should have been)

Shortstop: Bill Dahlen (Glue Player, Deffensive Liability, dunno why isn't in the Hall)

Left Fielder: Tim Raines (Underrated Leadoff man)

Center Fielder: Kirby Puckett (Glue Guy, popular in Minny)

Right Fielder: Harry Heilmann (Nobody speaks bout this guy)

Designated Hitter: Tony Oliva (The best Hitter in the AL in his prime)

Manager: Dick Williams (Made the Oakland franchise in the 70's and the Montreal franchise in the 80's)

Starting Rotation: Walter Johnson (I need an Ace), Bert Blyleven, Don Sutton, Luis Tiant, Mike Mussina

Bullpen: John Hollinger, Dave Smith, Tom Henke, Randy Myers, Trevor Hoffman

RuthMayBond

11-22-2006, 05:44 AM

I would've made a team based on the cheapest players that i can get, but them being good players. I like the Underrated list that Bedard has, so i think i'll get the players from this list. You know, for instance, Brooks Robinson, due to his popularity could've been worth 12 million a year nowadays, while Ron Santo will be 8 million dollars worth.Not sure where you're getting these salary estimates, and Santo was wildly popular in Chicago

<Catcher: Ray Schalk (Deffensive specialist, just what i need from this position)>

How about Hartnett?

<First Base: Hank Greenberg (Short Career, buy outstanding power)>

Or Mize?

<Second Base: Craig Biggio (Never has been considered the best in his position, but is a top 10 all-time 2b)>

Or Gehringer

<Third Base: Ron Santo (Sure Fire Hall Of Famer, or should have been)>

Similar to DEvans

<Shortstop: Bill Dahlen (Glue Player, Deffensive Liability, dunno why isn't in the Hall)>

About the tenth best defensive SS ever is a defensive liability? :confused: :ughh

<Center Fielder: Kirby Puckett (Glue Guy, popular in Minny)>

Van Haltren if not Hamilton?

<Bullpen: John Hollinger>

Hollinger is definitely underrated, but maybe for a reason ;)

yankillaz

11-22-2006, 05:57 AM

RMB, love the fact that you can scrutinize each and every comment here posted. Just curious which would've been the picks.:D

As for mine...

-Schalk is least heard off than Hartnett.
-Greenberg ranks in value to his team, when he peaked, to both Gehrig and Foxx, Mize didn't.
-Thought of Gehringer, but Biggio brings other things to the table.
-Santo was so popular in Chicago, that he's in the HOF.
-Dahlen wasn't known only for his glove, but he had a very underrated one.
-Couldn't pick Hamilton, since i had Raines. But i battled between Puckett and Van Haltren.

RuthMayBond

11-22-2006, 06:00 AM

RMB, love the fact that you can scrutinize each and every comment here posted.Just giving suggestions, you can discard as you see fit

<-Santo was so popular in Chicago, that he's in the HOF.>

I hope we're not going by HOF vote

<-Dahlen wasn't known only for his glove, but he had a very underrated one.>

I just don't understand how that means liability :confused:

yankillaz

11-22-2006, 06:38 AM

D'accord. Got you with the liability part. He wasn't.

Wade8813

11-22-2006, 10:50 AM

He ranks up there with the best, certainly, but in no way #2 overall. Not even #2 pitching. That's why he's overrated.

Mantle: He's got great stats, certainly, but he's definitely not a Top 5 overall all-time (as I see some people putting him), which is why he makes this list. (I meant #2 pitcher, not #2 overrall.)

You don't really cite reasons, just make statements. Why do you feel that way?

tearforamariner

11-22-2006, 11:03 AM

Erik Bedard

11-22-2006, 11:26 AM

Because I couldn't think of anyone else. :D Anyone want to help?

Oh, and Wade, too many people rate Mathewson higher than where I think he should be (no higher than #5 pitcher, and not quite top 20 overall (I have him 22nd)). So, in that way, he is overrated.

tearforamariner

11-22-2006, 11:45 AM

RuthMayBond

11-22-2006, 11:49 AM

Because I couldn't think of anyone else. :D Anyone want to help?I've seen people here overrate Charles Johnson. Maybe one of the Lopez "brothers" or JKendall would be better.

<Oh, and Wade, too many people rate Mathewson higher than where I think he should be (no higher than #5 pitcher, and not quite top 20 overall (I have him 22nd)). So, in that way, he is overrated.>

People do tend to overrate Christy here, but 22nd is underrating. I can't see him any higher than 7th nor any lower than 11th.

Erik Bedard

11-22-2006, 12:03 PM

I've got him, among all pitchers, behind Johnson, Clemens, Maddux, Pedro, and Paige, if you count Negro Leaguers. I can't remember my rankings from 1-21 off the top of my head, but at a ratio of 2-1 position players to pitchers, Mathewson would be 21st or 22nd.

RuthMayBond

11-22-2006, 12:04 PM

Erik Bedard

11-22-2006, 12:04 PM

Though someone named him as a guy they want, Ray Shalk is overrated as is Rick Ferrell.

They're only overrated by HoF voters.

The Kid

11-22-2006, 12:16 PM

My lineup:

C Yogi Berra
1B Lou Gherig
2B Nap Lajioe
3B Brooks Robinson
SS Honus Wagner
LF Ted Williams
CF Ty Cobb
RF Babe Ruth

Bench:

C Johny Bench
1B Jimmie Foxx
2B Rogers Hornsby
3B Mike Schmidt
SS Derek Jeter
OF Mickey Mantle
OF Willie Mays
OF Stan Musial

Rotation:

RHP Cy Young
RHP Walter Johnson
LHP Warren Spahn
RHP Roger Clemens
LHP Sandy Koufax

Closer:

RHP Trevor Hoffman

Erik Bedard

11-22-2006, 05:49 PM

My lineup:

C Yogi Berra
1B Lou Gherig
2B Nap Lajioe
3B Brooks Robinson
SS Honus Wagner
LF Ted Williams
CF Ty Cobb
RF Babe Ruth

Finally, someone else who agrees with me! Oh, and its Lajoie, not Lajioe, BTW. ;)

Wade8813

11-23-2006, 02:28 PM

Unless there's a large gap between certain spots, the difference between #2 and #5 isn't that big. When you're talking about someone being "Most Overrated", you usually talk about someone who gets rated way above where they should be (for example, my friend used to have Hank Aaron #1, and my brother used to have Nolan Ryan as his #1 pitcher. Of course, part of that was because my friend's name is Aaron, and my brother's name is Ryan... :laugh ). But whatever. If you have Mathewson #5, it's not a big enough difference in my opinion to argue about it.

Erik Bedard

11-24-2006, 01:18 AM

Well, if you can find anybody more overrated, tell me, and I'll put them on.

plask_stirlac

11-28-2006, 11:25 PM

Can Foxx catch? Is this a snapshot, like Gooden recaptured in 1985 form, or a sampling from ~3 peak seasons preferably in a row to avoid outliers like Brett's 1980?

Either
LF - Bonds
CF - Mantle
RF - Ruth
2B - Hornsby
1B - Gehrig
C - Piazza
3B - Mathews
SS - Rodriguez

Although I could get Williams in there. Wagner and A-Rod are very close. Or, defensively tuned

2B - Morgan
SS - Rodriguez
LF - Bonds
CF - Mantle
1B - Musial
RF - Aaron
3B - Boggs (lefty)
C - Bench

Actually I dig #2, looking at it. Best of 7 with Wagner and Mays on #2, Williams on #1? I preferred Bonds even without 01-04 for D in #1 but if they're going all-out, take Williams.

Wade8813

11-30-2006, 12:17 AM

Well, since the creator of this thread doesn't seem to be coming up with any rules, I guess I'll use my own for now... :rolleyes:

This team will be based off single season stats, I don't adjust very much for LQ (since I don't know enough about it to do so), I ignore steroids, team chemistry isn't a factor, only using 1900 to the present, and I don't think there's enough info on players from the Negro Leagues, so I won't use them. (Oh, and LF/RF are interchangable)

1B Lou Gehrig - 1927
2B Rogers Hornsby - 1925
SS Arky Vaughan - 1935
3B George Brett - 1980
CA Mike Piazza - 1997
LF Babe Ruth - 1920
RF Ted Williams - 1941
CF Mickey Mantle - 1956
DH Barry Bonds - 2004

1. Ted Williams
2. Rogers Hornsby
3. Barry Bonds
4. Babe Ruth
5. Mickey Mantle
6. Lou Gehrig
7. George Brett
8. Arky Vaughan
9. Mike Piazza

SP Walter Johnson - 1913
SP Christy Mathewson - 1909
SP Dutch Leonard - 1914
SP Bob Gibson - 1968
SP 3 Finger Brown - 1906

RP Dennis Eckersly - 1990
RP Billy Wagner - 1999
RP Mariano Rivera - 2005
RP Eric Gagne - 2003
RP Rollie Fingers - 1981

My lineup basically has the most ridiculous hitting ever. My fielding is a little shakier than you'd expect from an all-time team, but is still very good.

My baserunning is pathetic, but why get thrown out stealing when you're probably going to be driven in if you wait?

EvanAparra

11-30-2006, 12:39 AM

Though someone named him as a guy they want, Ray Shalk is overrated as is Rick Ferrell.
I've come to think Schalk goes underrated by everyone here -- except for maybe Randy and ElHalo.

Dalkowski110

11-30-2006, 12:42 AM

"RP Billy Wagner"

I dare you to come over to the Mets forum and say that Billy Wagner is one of the best relief pitchers of all time. I won't criticize you, but I know of at least five people who will... ;)

Anyway, here's my all-time team WITH a 25-man roster. Negro Leaguers ARE allowed.

C Biz Mackey (The most underrated catcher of all time.)
C/DH Josh Gibson (Incredible slugger, but not too impressive defensively)
1B Lou Gehrig
1B Oscar Charleston
2B Nap Lajoie
2B Rogers Hornsby
SS Honus Wagner
SS/General Purpose IF John Henry Lloyd
3B Brooks Robinson
LF Ted Williams
CF Willie Mays
RF Babe Ruth
OF Spottswood Poles
OF Jud Wilson

SP Walter Johnson
SP Smokey Joe Williams
SP Cy Young
SP Satchel Paige
SP Lefty Grove

LRP Grover Cleveland Alexander
MRP Goose Gossage
MRP Dizzy Dean (sparing him the arm problems...)
MRP Sandy Koufax (sparing him the arm problems...)
SU/General Purpose Relief Hoyt Wilhelm
CP Trevor Hoffman

EvanAparra

11-30-2006, 12:49 AM

C Biz Mackey
1B Lou Gehrig
2B Rogers Hornsby
SS Honus Wagner
3B Mike Schmidt
LF Ted Williams
CF Ty Cobb
RF Babe Ruth
OF Willie Mays
OF Richie Ashburn
IF Rabbit Maranville
IF Nap Lajoie
C Ray Schalk

SP Pedro Martinez
SP Walter Johnson
SP Satchel Paige
SP Sandy Koufax
SP Lefty Grove

CP Mariano Rivera