Flying Fists

[Rookie1914]

Ok, I have wanted to see what you experts think on this:

Why is it ok to fist fight in baseball, basketball, football, nascar, and hockey, but in the real world we get shackled and locked up with an assault mark on our permanent records? As long as they are overpaid athletes, it's ok...? Don't worry kids, they are million-dollar athletes and are above the law. I understand UFC and boxing, fighting is what it is, but not these other sports I have mentioned. Shouldn't police officials remove them immediately and place them under arrest? I mean come on guys, it's on camera.

I really want your thoughts on this one!

Thank you!

[Astro]

Uhhh people get in fights all the time and people are never arrested... usually people are only arrested if someone is seriously hurt or putting many people's safety in danger...

If a player gets seriously injured in a brawl they have the right to be able to press charges... but it is up to them if they do

Some examples: In the NFL this year the guy spiked the Cowboys player in the head, he had the choice to press charges but choose not to

In the NHL Bertuzzi paralyzed the guy he checked from behind into the ice, he also had the right to press charges and most likely would have won millions, but I do not believe he did

[hubkittel]

my brother in law has that picture, signed by nolan ryan, hanging in his living room.

[ESPNFan]

The fighting in Hockey also serves a important role in keeping stick related infractions to a minimum. The classic case of it being the lesser of two evils.

[Rookie1914]

My point I am getting at is this...if you so much as "shove" someone, that is assault. If a Police Officer actually witnesses that "assault", then it's jailtime. Why not for athletes as it happens when they "throttle" someone?

Thank you for the responses so far.

[hubkittel]

The fighting in Hockey also serves a important role in keeping stick related infractions to a minimum. The classic case of it being the lesser of two evils.

:clapping :clapping :clapping and there have been several hockey players who have been arrested for on ice infractions. marty mcsorley and todd bertuzzi being the latest.

[Ubiquitous]

You are actually talking about "battery" not assault.

But for both in most cases a person needs to file charges for something to happen.

If you and me are standing in front of a cop and I punch you in the stomach, he can come up to us and say "hey now what is going on?" He may even take steps to secure the safety of the area, but if you say "it is alright man we are just playing around" He can't go and arrest me for assault and battery. There was no assault since you did not feel threatened, and it isn't battery since I wasn't intentionally trying to cause you harm or was done in a rude and insolent manner.


Now how does all that apply to players? Well players can and have filed charges on fellow players, but most of the time they do not. In real life most fights also do not result in charges, they can result in charges but it is up to the defendee to file for them.

[EvanAparra]

If you and me are standing in front of a cop and I punch you in the stomach, he can come up to us and say "hey now what is going on?" He may even take steps to secure the safety of the area, but if you say "it is alright man we are just playing around" He can't go and arrest me for assault and battery. There was no assault since you did not feel threatened, and it isn't battery since I wasn't intentionally trying to cause you harm or was done in a rude and insolent manner.



Not true. My "friend" was arrested for getting in a fight, even when the other guy did not wish to press charges. Its called disorderly conduct.

[Ubiquitous]

Yes and that isn't called assault and battery which is what I said you couldn't get arrested for. Nor was my example an example of a fight either. The cop couldn't arrest me for disorderly conduct, well he could but the charges probably wouldn't stick. I seriously doubt the DA would move forward with the case and actually take it to arraignment.

[Rookie1914]

Then what constitutes a "fight"? When a single punch is thrown, that is a fight, don't you think?

[EvanAparra]

Yes and that isn't called assault and battery which is what I said you couldn't get arrested for. Nor was my example an example of a fight either. The cop couldn't arrest me for disorderly conduct, well he could but the charges probably wouldn't stick. I seriously doubt the DA would move forward with the case and actually take it to arraignment.

I think he could most definately arrest you for disorderly conduct. But yeah, no way the DA takes it to arraignment. An arrest for the sake of an arrest.

[hudsonharden]

It's happened it my workplace a few time. I work in a restaurant and the pressure can get pretty high on a busy night and combined with the heat over the grill the stress can get to a point where blows are exchanged between chef and waiter. It's something that happens in the workplace and stays in the workplace. Usually the two involved can settle their differences and apologies are exchanged. Now, this isn't televised nor is it full of a stadium full of people. However, I think some fans like a little action and if the police arrested every player that got in a fight, that would diminish the quality of the game (if say, Nolan Ryan were arrested in the picture above). Sports provide important revenue for cities, so the cops are probably going to let a fight in a stadium slide. It may not be "justice", but it makes sense.

[Ubiquitous]

No he could not most definitely arrest me for disorderly conduct, not in the example I gave. Yes he could arrest me depending on the context and the mood he is in but it isn't a most definite. For the most part a cop can arrest you for doing almost anything. It isn't like you can say to a cop that what he is doing is wrong and then flee. You get arrested, either charges are filed or you are let go. The only thing (and sometimes this doesn't even stop them) that stops them from abusing this power is rules and the punishment for breaking the rules. Well that and their own morales. But again my scenario isn't one of those scenarios where it is automatic no-brainer leaving yourself open for arrest situation.

[Astro]

It's happened it my workplace a few time. I work in a restaurant and the pressure can get pretty high on a busy night and combined with the heat over the grill the stress can get to a point where blows are exchanged between chef and waiter. It's something that happens in the workplace and stays in the workplace. Usually the two involved can settle their differences and apologies are exchanged. Now, this isn't televised nor is it full of a stadium full of people. However, I think some fans like a little action and if the police arrested every player that got in a fight, that would diminish the quality of the game (if say, Nolan Ryan were arrested in the picture above). Sports provide important revenue for cities, so the cops are probably going to let a fight in a stadium slide. It may not be "justice", but it makes sense.
Ah ha... I work in a restaurant aswell and I know what your talking about... when the waiters start complainin bout it takin too long and such

If you havent already, you should check out the movie "Waiting..." HILARIOUS

[EvanAparra]

No he could not most definitely arrest me for disorderly conduct, not in the example I gave

For the most part a cop can arrest you for doing almost anything.

Then? Whats your problem with what I said? I said he could most definately arrest you, I didnt say he has the right to.

[Ubiquitous]

It's happened it my workplace a few time. I work in a restaurant and the pressure can get pretty high on a busy night and combined with the heat over the grill the stress can get to a point where blows are exchanged between chef and waiter. It's something that happens in the workplace and stays in the workplace. Usually the two involved can settle their differences and apologies are exchanged. Now, this isn't televised nor is it full of a stadium full of people. However, I think some fans like a little action and if the police arrested every player that got in a fight, that would diminish the quality of the game (if say, Nolan Ryan were arrested in the picture above). Sports provide important revenue for cities, so the cops are probably going to let a fight in a stadium slide. It may not be "justice", but it makes sense.


One possible way to look at it is that sports is entertainment, and the fight is entertainment as well to the crowd. So the actions can be viewed as not disorderly conduct. Now granted that is looking at the event through rose-colored glasses but it is one way to defend the actions of cops who stand there and do nothing while 50 men beat on each other.

But there have been instances where the cops have wandered into team fights and have arrested or at least detained athletes for fights

[Ubiquitous]

Then? Whats your problem with what I said? I said he could most definately arrest you, I didnt say he has the right to.


A cop could most definitely arrest you for anything even for doing absolutely nothing.

But a cop cannot most definitely arrest you in my scenario and be most definitely in the right for doing so. What I am saying is that in terms of the actual law and the correct way a cop is supposed to follow it, my scenario is not a most definite arrestable offense.

Crack a bottle overy your buddies head for giggles in a crowded bar? Yes a most definite arrestable situation.

Wrestle around with your buddy in a mall cafeteria? Yes a most definite arrestable situation.

[Los Bravos]

:clapping :clapping :clapping and there have been several hockey players who have been arrested for on ice infractions. marty mcsorley and todd bertuzzi being the latest.They should both still be in jail.

In fact, McSorley should have still been in jail when he whacked Brashear in the head for the spear he put into Mike Bullard's gut in the '88 playoffs.

Apparently, being Gretzky's official butt wiper has it's privelliges.

[hubkittel]

They should both still be in jail.

In fact, McSorley should have still been in jail when he whacked Brashear in the head for the spear he put into Mike Bullard's gut in the '88 playoffs.

Apparently, being Gretzky's official butt wiper has it's privelliges.

i always thought dave semenko was gretzky's official butt wiper...er, body guard. but i guess there was a reason why the great one wanted him included in the la deal. and bertuzzi's just a punk.

there have actually been a lot more college hockey players arrested for the goonish stuff than nhl players. i guess being a union member has its privileges. it also doesn't hurt to be able to afford a lawyer.

the problem is that as they've eliminated the goon from the game, combined with the influx of european players, we've seen worse and worse stick infractions. the euro trash just can not keep their sticks down and there is no one left to enforce the rules (god knows the refs won't). the elimination of fighting (except in the kabuki form), along with manditory helmets and the use of visors, has actually led to more and worse violence in the game. ironic, isn't it?

[Captain Cold Nose]

They should both still be in jail.

In fact, McSorley should have still been in jail when he whacked Brashear in the head for the spear he put into Mike Bullard's gut in the '88 playoffs.

Apparently, being Gretzky's official butt wiper has it's privelliges.
Brashear's no prize. That may have had a lot to do with the lighter penalty. He also played on. Do you seriously think simple assault is worth 18 years in prison?

Anyway, let's try not to stray too far from the topic. As much as I love hockey, we do have those who hate it, and this is a baseball forum. In the context of fighting it's on topic, but stay off your soap boxes.

Waiting was a far better movie than I thought it would be.

[Brian McKenna]

Violence in sports needs to be dealt with harsher. The issue is that it is done in front of children and treated with minimal penalties.

Perhaps that is overlooked here as the arguers just banter back and forth about what a policeman can and can't do. Hello, the discussion was about sports not you. Step outside the ego.