Congrats Mariano Rivera [Archive]

AnaheimAngelsFan

10-24-2006, 04:42 PM

...but he doesn't deserve the award.

MARIANO RIVERA
Saves 34
ERA 1.80
Wins 5
SO 55
BB 11
Hits 61
IP 75
ER 15
R 16

FRANCISCO RODRIGUEZ
Saves 47
ERA 1.73
Wins 2
SO 98
BB 28
Hits 52
IP 73
ER 14
R 16

Frankie, YOU deserve the applause AND the award!

:clapping :clapping :clapping :clapping :clapping :clapping

Rookie1914

10-24-2006, 04:46 PM

Yankee Legend

10-24-2006, 04:51 PM

They were even. Mo helped the Yanks get to the playoffs. F-Rod is good but I'll give Mariano the award. but heres a :clapping to both of them for having good seasons.

EvanAparra

10-24-2006, 04:52 PM

They weren't even, didnt you look at the stats above?

Charger567

10-24-2006, 04:55 PM

Rivera can't even COMPARE to Frod.. What the hell is up with that?

(If Papelbon didn't get injured, would he have had a shot?)

Astro

10-24-2006, 04:59 PM

They were even. Mo helped the Yanks get to the playoffs. F-Rod is good but I'll give Mariano the award. but heres a :clapping to both of them for having good seasons.
Uhhh... Rivera helped the Yankees get to the playoffs? That has to be one of the dumbest statements I've heard

So K-Rod's 13 more saves didnt help the Angels at all? Please...

The Yankees made the playoffs because they have an all-star team, and they still lost

Charger567

10-24-2006, 05:04 PM

The numbers were not equal at all..

K Rod had:
13 More Saves
.07 ERA Lower
43 More Strikeouts
9 Less Hits Allowed

Astro

10-24-2006, 05:09 PM

And back on the Rivera helped the Yankees make the playoffs...

K-Rod's 2nd half #s:
2-1, 0.50 ERA, 26 saves, 35 1/3 IP, 21 H, 2 R, 18 BB, 51 K, .168 BAA

Yankee Legend

10-24-2006, 05:21 PM

Well for starters saves aren't everything. What about SV% compare that. Plus the ERA was almost equal. And Mariano did help Yankees to get to the playoffs. I mean look at the rest of the Yankees bullpen not to mention half our rotation. The Yankees wouldn't be the team they are without Mariano. And there's no Yankee-bias here just to let you know.

Charger567

10-24-2006, 05:39 PM

Mariano did not help the Yankees get into the playoffs, the redsox injuries did.

By the way, go ahead and post the SV%'s.

Astro

10-24-2006, 05:46 PM

Ok...

Rivera's Sv%: 91.8%
K-Rod's Sv%: 92.1%

And as for the bullpen debate, the Yankee's pen and the Angels pen are about even, if anything the Yankees have a better bullpen

And as for there is no bias there... haha riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight

Dasperp

10-24-2006, 05:47 PM

BJ Ryan was better than both of them, and maybe Joe Nathan was as well

Astro

10-24-2006, 05:50 PM

Nathan should have won it... Ryan, Papelbon and K-Rod also should have been in the running

Rivera has no business in the top 4 of it, but since hes a Yankee he won it

W_Marone

10-24-2006, 05:58 PM

Because only Yankees can win awards.....Duh!:rolleyes: :laugh

plask_stirlac

10-24-2006, 06:44 PM

And Joe Nathan was better than both, whether it's most reliable closer or best reliever. He was significantly better than K-Rod, especially if they were to inherit runners.

I could also take BJ Ryan or Papelbon above Mo and K-Rod based on this year. Saito basically matched them as well.

Rookie1914

10-24-2006, 06:52 PM

What in the world does the playoffs mean when it comes to choosing who had the better year? Nothing! If Pujols, Howard, or Arod were on the Royals and putting up those numbers, I would hope that would not be held against them. You can't help it you are on a bad team. Frod's numbers are better to me anyway.

ChrisLDuncan

10-24-2006, 08:16 PM

It's the delivery award, Rivera delivered...who ever said that the Red Sox's injuries got the Yankees to the playoffs is an idiot too...the Yankees led the majors in wins...so if the Red Sox were healthy they would win 98 games??? Yeah right the Yankees clinched the playoffs regardless of what Boston did. Do you guys even pay attention to recent baseball???? When A-Rod was in Texas he had about two or three more MVP seasons that times he won the award, WHY??? because the award isn't player of the year it's MOST VALUABLE!!!! Rivera should have won it because the Yankees bull pen sucked, Rivera had to fight some injuries this season as well. Pretty soon the award will be named the Mariano Rivera Memorial Trophy. He had an amazing season this year, he delivered the Yankees to the playoffs. Ask any Yankee fan that knows anything about the Yankees the most important Yankee is MARIANO RIVERA. Yankee stadium will be the only ball park where 42 isn't retired for Jackie Robinson.

Rapmaster

10-24-2006, 08:46 PM

I couldn't agree more with you. I should have put FROD on my list of underrated players.

I did :dance

plask_stirlac

10-24-2006, 09:53 PM

Rapmaster

10-24-2006, 10:32 PM

Nathan
Saves 36/38
ERA 1.58
Wins 7
SO 95
BB 16
Hits 38
IP 68.3
ER 12
R 12
HR 3

Yes, 38 H in 68.3 IP, 0.79 WHIP and 12.5 K/9. And he only gave up 3 HR, putting him with the others at the top of controlling that. His newly polished curve was outstanding. He was filthy in April and May but only got 6 saves; he had 30 saves after June 1 when the Twins were much better. And these are just basic measures.

Okay, that's all.

I like his walk total. Reminds me of Smoltz's 2003 season. Similar amount of innings pitched, similar results if you remove Smoltz's injured finish to the season (both lost in the DS with minimal impact), similar walk total, similar runs total, similar homerun total, etc...

Everytime I think nathan, I think of that trade. Bonser, Liriano, and a little throw-in of Joe Nathan. All for 1 year's worth (frankly too much) of A.J.

BigStellyPADRES4LIFE

10-24-2006, 11:29 PM

Obviously Huge Yankee bias amongst voters and members of this forum there is no way Rivera deserved that award over FRod.

EvanAparra

10-24-2006, 11:33 PM

Obviously Huge Yankee bias amongst voters and members of this forum there is no way Rivera deserved that award over FRod.
Or Nathan.

Astro

10-25-2006, 12:07 AM

Or Nathan.
Or Ryan...

EvanAparra

10-25-2006, 12:12 AM

Ryan??? His ERA+ was only 343 this season!!! :laugh

Hammerin Hank

10-25-2006, 12:44 AM

Let me guess...another award voted on by the fans.

Well, I guess he wouldn't have won it no matter who voted considered all the bias...

jeterMVP

10-25-2006, 03:48 AM

so many yankee haters...

can't wait until jeter is announced as the mvp and the hating continues :dance

Charger567

10-25-2006, 05:16 AM

I would rank Rivera 5th in the league, maybe fourth because of Papelbon's injuries.

plask_stirlac

10-25-2006, 07:01 AM

so many yankee haters...

can't wait until jeter is announced as the mvp and the hating continues :dance

I don't think this is the thread for Yankee hate... it's just that giving Rivera an award is about as bold of a choice as putting MJ on the Sports Illustrated cover, or picking a repeat champion before the season. Fine, but we like picks that make us think more. Last year the voters have basically been forced not to just pick the best AL West player, which some could have been doing for all we know.

ChrisLDuncan

10-25-2006, 08:36 AM

Well Rivera was robbed of the Cy Young last season so why not give him a questionable award.

AnaheimAngelsFan

10-25-2006, 10:50 AM

Nathan
Saves 36/38

That stat alone takes Nathan out of contention, in my humble opinion.

insanefishpossay

10-25-2006, 01:32 PM

so many yankee haters...

Sorry. When an undeserving player wins an award simply because he plays for a team that has more bandwagon fans than any other team, it tends to generate hate.

Well Rivera was robbed of the Cy Young last season so why not give him a questionable award.

RIVERA was robbed last year?

Rookie1914

10-25-2006, 03:16 PM

Sorry. When an undeserving player wins an award simply because he plays for a team that has more bandwagon fans than any other team, it tends to generate hate.

RIVERA was robbed last year?

I had to deal with the same thing being a Cubs fan. Pujols got MVP over Lee in 2005 while Lee won the gold glove and silver slugger awards, makes absolutely no sense to me. They say Pujols got it, because Bonds took it the years before over Pujols. I don't like "makeup" calls.

SamtheBravesFan

10-25-2006, 03:23 PM

I had to deal with the same thing being a Cubs fan. Pujols got MVP over Lee in 2005 while Lee won the gold glove and silver slugger awards, makes absolutely no sense to me. They say Pujols got it, because Bonds took it the years before over Pujols. I don't like "makeup" calls.

Me neither. Lee was better than Albert. MVP voters must be insane because they pull crap like this. But that's what you get with a group voting for something: there will always be people who disagree.

jeterMVP

10-25-2006, 03:25 PM

I had to deal with the same thing being a Cubs fan. Pujols got MVP over Lee in 2005 while Lee won the gold glove and silver slugger awards, makes absolutely no sense to me. They say Pujols got it, because Bonds took it the years before over Pujols. I don't like "makeup" calls.
you don't think that it had anything to do with the cardinals making the playoffs?

Astro

10-25-2006, 03:28 PM

I had to deal with the same thing being a Cubs fan. Pujols got MVP over Lee in 2005 while Lee won the gold glove and silver slugger awards, makes absolutely no sense to me. They say Pujols got it, because Bonds took it the years before over Pujols. I don't like "makeup" calls.
Maybe it had something to do with the Most VALUABLE Player, not the Best Statistical Player...

SamtheBravesFan

10-25-2006, 03:35 PM

Maybe it had something to do with the Most VALUABLE Player, not the Best Statistical Player...

Well, then why in the stinking world did Andre Dawson (1987) and Alex Rodriguez (2003) win those MVPs? They weren't exactly valuable to their last-place teams, now were they?

W_Marone

10-25-2006, 03:39 PM

Now now gentleman, lets get back to the subject, now, This is the DHL delivery award, there's still the Rolaids Releif Award, Correct? That's a bigger award that's been around much longer than this DHL made up award. Rolaids Releif is more of a "prestegious" relief award than this DHL one. I must say though, Mariano did have a good season, was it as good as K-Rod or Nathan? No, but he had a good season none the less.

And yes, it was a FAN VOTE, hence why he won this award.

Rookie1914

10-25-2006, 03:41 PM

you don't think that it had anything to do with the cardinals making the playoffs?

If a TEAM does not make the playoffs, why PENALIZE a PLAYER for putting up the best numbers...? Why not make that MANAGER NOT ELIGIBLE for MANAGER OF THE YEAR...? Make sense doesn't it...This year, Albert made the playoffs and Howard didn't, BUT the Phillies had a BETTER RECORD! Not making the playoffs is on the Managers head and the Administration, not a guy winning a gold glove and silver slugger award!!!

SamtheBravesFan

10-25-2006, 03:43 PM

And yes, it was a FAN VOTE, hence why he won this award.

Well, there we go. Name recognition rules the day.

jeterMVP

10-25-2006, 03:45 PM

Well, then why in the stinking world did Andre Dawson (1987) and Alex Rodriguez (2003) win those MVPs? They weren't exactly valuable to their last-place teams, now were they?
A Rod should have never won the award...even though he put up monster numbers

If a TEAM does not make the playoffs, why PENALIZE a PLAYER for putting up the best numbers...? Why not make that MANAGER NOT ELIGIBLE for MANAGER OF THE YEAR...? Make sense doesn't it...This year, Albert made the playoffs and Howard didn't, BUT the Phillies had a BETTER RECORD! Not making the playoffs is on the Managers head and the Administration, not a guy winning a gold glove and silver slugger award!!!
the phillies were in contention until the end of the season...so if ryan howard won the award i would have no problem with it. i think that he is more deserving that albert pujols to be honest with you

W_Marone

10-25-2006, 03:47 PM

Perhaps those two cases were because their stats were outstadingly better than any other in the league? I'm asking a question.... I'll check the stats of some othe guys during that season.

And after checking....Delgado and A-Rod werent all that far apart in any category in the stats baseballreference.com showed....I shall do furhter investigating......

And Delgado's Blue Jays won 86 some games....the rangers won....71 games.

jeterMVP

10-25-2006, 03:56 PM

manny ramirez-.325/37/104

W_Marone

10-25-2006, 03:59 PM

There ya go, another guy who should have won it over A-Rod.

Astro

10-25-2006, 04:00 PM

If a TEAM does not make the playoffs, why PENALIZE a PLAYER for putting up the best numbers...? Why not make that MANAGER NOT ELIGIBLE for MANAGER OF THE YEAR...? Make sense doesn't it...This year, Albert made the playoffs and Howard didn't, BUT the Phillies had a BETTER RECORD! Not making the playoffs is on the Managers head and the Administration, not a guy winning a gold glove and silver slugger award!!!
Its not penalizing a player if they dont win an AWARD

Go look up the definition of award, slick

W_Marone

10-25-2006, 04:31 PM

Now, Now Astro, everything is going to be alright.

Rookie, Astro, along with most of us, see the MVP award as a player who helps their team succeed and make either the playoffs, if not that a winning record and in the playoff hunt, not guys who put up guady stats,and thier team doesnt even have a winning record, how can a player have value if his team, especially to his team if they lose almost 100 games? And even in the year A-rod won it when his team stunk his stats werent outstandingly better than the next two guys closes to him, Manny and Delgado.

Oh yeah the Definition of Award as said by dictionary.com: Something awarded or granted, as for merit

Rookie1914

10-25-2006, 05:02 PM

Its not penalizing a player if they dont win an AWARD

Go look up the definition of award, slick

My name isn't SLICK! Please show some respect in these forums.

So you are saying if Pujols had been on the Royals team last year, he shouldn't have won MVP, because the Royals stunk?

- Royals mustered up 56 wins

W_Marone

10-25-2006, 05:07 PM

I'd say he wouldnt have won it, Lee would have won it in the NL, and A-rod or Papi in the AL.

EvanAparra

10-25-2006, 05:12 PM

I think the player that is most valuable to his team should win it. If Babe Ruth played for the D-Rays this year, and had his '21 season, then I think he should win.

Rookie1914

10-25-2006, 05:14 PM

I think the player that is most valuable to his team should win it. If Babe Ruth played for the D-Rays this year, and had his '21 season, then I think he should win.

Amen Evan!

If I have a Van Gogh painting hanging in a "shack" is it worth nothing?

Is it only worth something in a mansion or museum?

Sweet Lou

10-25-2006, 09:52 PM

Amen Evan!

If I have a Van Gogh painting hanging in a "shack" is it worth nothing?

Is it only worth something in a mansion or museum?
But the award isn't titled "Best Player". It's titled "Most Valuable Player". I know Wikipedia doesn't give the end all definition, but what I found there said: "In the game of baseball, both amateur and professional, it is tradition to annually recognize the one player in the league who has contributed the most to the success of the player's team."
So I suppose a successful team is a precursor to receiving the award...

EvanAparra

10-25-2006, 09:54 PM

"In the game of baseball, both amateur and professional, it is tradition to annually recognize the one player in the league who has contributed the most to the success of the player's team."

How does that... Equal this... ???

So I suppose a successful team is a precursor to receiving the award...

Just because the rest of the team isn't very good, doesn't mean that one player isn't contributing the most to the success of his team.

Rookie1914

10-25-2006, 10:11 PM

How can you produce more than in the field by yourself and at the plate by yourself? You can't twist the owner's arm to spend more like the Yankees and be surrounded by great players. It sounds like you want to give a "Good Character Player" award. GCP is different from MVP.

Howard just got the Hank Aaron award, will he get "hammered" and not get MVP?

Definition:
The Hank Aaron Award, which is presented annually to the top offensive performer in each league.