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Hexed
10-04-2006, 09:14 PM
Opps forgot Randy Johnson. Can a Mod add him in?
STLCards2
10-04-2006, 09:27 PM
I only voted for players who I felt would make it if they retired immediatley. Therefore, i didn't vote for players who are not eligable (10 years)
EvanAparra
10-04-2006, 09:29 PM
Yup same here, but if this is for projecting their entire careers, i might vote yes on all of them
candy curveball cummings
10-04-2006, 09:33 PM
Yup same here, but if this is for projecting their entire careers, i might vote yes on all of them

Agreed. I just voted for those who'd get in if they retired this year.
EvanAparra
10-04-2006, 09:36 PM
Whats your beef with Hoffman, CCC?
Skin & Bones
10-04-2006, 09:39 PM
Nomar seems to get very little love. The guy is already a Hofer, IMO.

Edit: Somehow missed arod, is there a way to go back and edit my vote ?
candy curveball cummings
10-04-2006, 09:55 PM
Whats your beef with Hoffman, CCC?

I don't have one. I must've missed that box. If a moderator would oblige, I do support Trevor for the Hall.
candy curveball cummings
10-04-2006, 09:57 PM
I'd love to hear Dalkowski's argument against Rivera and Jeter.
EvanAparra
10-04-2006, 10:29 PM
S&B, i might be one of the biggest Nomar fans out there, but I still think he needs a couple more good years to make it. He has the peak, now just a little longevity gets him in.
ChrisLDuncan
10-04-2006, 11:07 PM
The only players I forsee having problems (barring injury for Pujols), are Nomar and Papi.
KCGHOST
10-05-2006, 07:28 AM
I ignored the players with less than 10 years playing time. Too much can happen to kill careers. Those guys didn't get my vote, nor did Papi, Nomar, and relievers.
Seattle1
10-05-2006, 07:36 AM
More people should probably be voting for Ichiro Suzuki. It makes sense that Ken Griffey, Jr. has the most votes so far.
Captain Cold Nose
10-05-2006, 08:14 AM
Randy Johnson added. Votes added for Arod and Hoffman. Please post if you want to add a vote for Johnson.
Seattle1
10-05-2006, 08:52 AM
Randy Johnson added. ... Please post if you want to add a vote for Johnson.

Yes, please. I would like to cast a vote for Randy Johnson.
Brad Harris
10-05-2006, 11:43 AM
As much as I'm tempted, I won't call the four morons who left Clemens off their ballot, out on the carpet for that glaring ommission.

I'd just like to hear what possible explanation any of them could have.
Brooklyn
10-05-2006, 01:26 PM
I'd love to hear Dalkowski's argument against Rivera and Jeter.

I voted for Rivera, but not Jeter. While you didn't ask me specifically, I'll give my Jeter reasoning.

I went with the category of "if they retired right now". So like many others, I didn't click anyone with less than 10 years. To be consistent, I only looked at Jeter's stats through today. There is no doubt in my mind he'll wind up accumulating enough to get there. There is also no doubt in my mind that if he retired today he would in fact get voted in - but I don't believe he's done enough yet.

He is short on ink, which I value highly for HOF voting - not a perfect measure (and certainly biased towards earlier players) by any means, but I view it as a good way to see how dominant a player was. Jeter is barely top 200 all time in grey, and only has a 6 in black ink.

His accumulation stats are not impressive, either. He is not in the top 100 all-time in any significant counting stat. If her retired today, 2,150 hits and 183 home runs are just too low for the era.

His list of most similar batter starts with Arky Vaughn but declines sharply to a bunch of good but not great players.

Generally I'd give positional adjustments to short stops (and catchers) for not needing as much pop, but any metric I've seen on Jeter shows he is between sub-average and lousy defensively, despite the voters giving him gold gloves.

I also can't give him credit for the 4 rings, without giving the same credit to Tino, Bernie, O'Neill, Jorge, Rivera, Pettite, Cone, Nelson, Sojo, none of which I'd support for the Hall (except Rivera). the same way I won't hold it against a player for not having ring, he can't get extra credit for being ont he right team at the right time.

To repeat, if we have this conversation in 3-5 years, I'm sure I'd support him. But under the category of "do I think he deserves it if he retired right now", I'd say no.
Seattle1
10-05-2006, 02:58 PM
I have some reservations about Clemens.
west coast orange and black
10-05-2006, 03:12 PM
^^ reservations about anyone else?
Krylon
10-05-2006, 03:28 PM
How could these two not be unanimous?
538280
10-05-2006, 07:22 PM
As much as I'm tempted, I won't call the four morons who left Clemens off their ballot, out on the carpet for that glaring ommission.

I'd just like to hear what possible explanation any of them could have.

One of the people who left off Clemens voted for David Ortiz. :hp
Seattle1
10-05-2006, 07:32 PM
^^ reservations about anyone else?

I only voted for a handful of guys in this poll. I come from the school of thought that not everybody and his brother, so to speak, should make it to the HoF, even with impressive statistics. Not that I'd do much complaining, probably, if some of the guys I didn't vote for here eventually made it in.
ChrisLDuncan
10-05-2006, 07:43 PM
I have some reservations about Clemens.

Elucidate...PLEASE
538280
10-05-2006, 07:45 PM
I only voted for a handful of guys in this poll. I come from the school of thought that not everybody and his brother, so to speak, should make it to the HoF, even with impressive statistics. Not that I'd do much complaining, probably, if some of the guys I didn't vote for here eventually made it in.

Even if you are a very small Hall advocate...how does this justifty leaving out Roger Clemens? How many people would be in your HOF? Five?
ElHalo
10-05-2006, 08:24 PM
Even if you are a very small Hall advocate...how does this justifty leaving out Roger Clemens? How many people would be in your HOF? Five?

I voted for Clemens in this one, but I'm beginning to be on the fence about him... for the same reasons I didn't vote for Barry Bonds. I'm very, very anti-steroid, and at this point I'd give the probability of Clemens' post-Boston resurgance having been entirely attributable to 'roids at about 50%. If that gets up in the 75% range, he wouldn't get my vote.
mac195
10-05-2006, 08:26 PM
Who are the 13 maroons who didn't vote for Randy Johnson?
ElHalo
10-05-2006, 08:30 PM
Who are the 13 maroons who didn't vote for Randy Johnson?

I believe he was added mid-poll. I can't see another excuse for Glavine having more votes than him.
Seattle1
10-05-2006, 08:30 PM
Who are the 13 maroons who didn't vote for Randy Johnson?

The problem is Johnson didn't get added to the poll until late by a moderator. So all of the other players got a big head start on him.
Seattle1
10-05-2006, 08:33 PM
I voted for Clemens in this one, but I'm beginning to be on the fence about him... for the same reasons I didn't vote for Barry Bonds. I'm very, very anti-steroid, and at this point I'd give the probability of Clemens' post-Boston resurgance having been entirely attributable to 'roids at about 50%. If that gets up in the 75% range, he wouldn't get my vote.

Thanks El Halo, you have put it into words a lot better than I could have done.

Plus that beaning of Piazza (and later throwing a broken bat at him in the World Series) has never ceased to bug the crap out of me, even after six years.
MyDogSparty
10-05-2006, 09:42 PM
I can't believe the lack of support for Randy Johnson. He's a lock in my book. What would keep him out (besides roids)? He's been in the league 19 years now, he's 20 wins away from 300, won 20+ games 3x, 19 games 3x, won 5 Cy Young awards and is number 3 All-Time on the career strikeout list behind Ryan and Clemens.
Seattle1
10-05-2006, 09:51 PM
I can't believe the lack of support for Randy Johnson. He's a lock in my book. What would keep him out (besides roids)? He's been in the league 19 years now, he's 20 wins away from 300, won 20+ games 3x, 19 games 3x, won 5 Cy Young awards and is number 3 All-Time on the career strikeout list behind Ryan and Clemens.


The problem is Johnson didn't get added to the poll until late by a moderator. So all of the other players got an unfair head start on him.
cbenson5
10-05-2006, 10:18 PM
It's interesting to me that if Fever members were the voting bloc Trevor Hoffman would fall short of the Hall. That is the only vote percentage that surprised me on this poll.
EvanAparra
10-05-2006, 10:27 PM
Lets hope they never are.
ChrisLDuncan
10-05-2006, 10:45 PM
Lets hope they never are.
Right on man...right on
Captain Cold Nose
10-06-2006, 10:54 AM
As I stated before, please contact me if you voted before Johnson was added and would like to add a vote, or if you missed somebody's name on the list.
john1972
10-11-2006, 03:39 PM
An excellent indication as to the intelligence and perspective of many on this board is noticing that Craig Biggio has recieved one more vote than
Barry Bonds!:clapping
-Kyle-
10-11-2006, 04:11 PM
53280...did you vote on Pujols projection? Or solely based on his career at the moment?
EvanAparra
10-11-2006, 04:17 PM
An excellent indication as to the intelligence and perspective of many on this board is noticing that Craig Biggio has recieved one more vote than
Barry Bonds!:clapping

Its called Steroids, i'm sorry theres no Almomar to vote up as the best player ever for you. :clapping