Delmon Young loses control

[Ichiro51]

During tonight's Minor League game of Durham @ Pawtucket, The game got off to a bizarre start as Durham rightfielder Delmon Young was ejected in the first inning for arguing a called third strike. Young, 20 years old #1 prospect for the Devil Rays, responded by throwing his bat at the home plate umpire, striking him in the chest. No word yet as to the length of a potential suspension.

How long should his suspension be? I know the umpire can be lousy at times during every game, but being a professional athlete losing his temper on the field is just unacceptable.

I say 20-25 games most likely.

[rockin500]

can it be any less than 30 games?

[Brian McKenna]

was he arrested?

[KCGHOST]

If he really threw the bat at the umpire then he has to be suspended for the season.

[KingJ]

Rays sure have a nag for drafting "When Top Prospects Go Bad."

[1doug]

Hitting the ump with the bat? He should and probably will be out the rest of the season.

[hiddengem]

There is absolutely no excuse for Young's behavior, and he should be prosecuted accordingly.

On a side note, did you guys know that every minor league umpire is on strike right now? We are dealing with high school and college level umpires right now that are absolutely overmatched at the very least. They have zero consistency, and just flat out shouldn't be out there.

The numbers this year for guys will no doubt be messed up. Might be in favor of some and hurt others. Very difficult to deal with at times, seeing as how this is how you make your living.

[RBi]

http://msn.foxsports.com/other/story/5544858

PAWTUCKET, R.I. (AP) - Durham Bulls outfielder Delmon Young threw a bat into the chest of the home plate umpire after being called out on strikes in the first inning of Wednesday night's game at Pawtucket.

Young took a third strike on a 1-and-2 pitch. When Young delayed leaving the batter's box, the umpire ejected him. Young then flipped his bat underhand. It sailed end over end and hit the umpire in the chest.
Pawtucket catcher Corky Miller said he didn't hear Young say anything to the umpire. "I heard the umpire say, 'You better get going,"' Miller said.

"It was hard to say what was going through his mind. Guys have emotions. But you try to learn how to control them. I'm sure as the bat left his hands he knew it was a bad decision," Miller said.

Young left during the game and wasn't available for comment afterward. The Tampa Bay Devil Rays, who selected Young with the first overall pick in the 2003 amateur draft, said they would have no comment until they review the situation.

Replacement umpires have been working all minor league games this season because the regular umpires are on strike. Bill Wanless, a spokesman for the Pawtucket Red Sox, said minor league teams are not releasing the names of umpires while the regulars are on strike.

"It's an unfortunate incident and there should be no place for actions like that in the game of baseball," the umpire said in a statement released by Pawtucket. "Any official should not be treated like that. He embarrassed himself and his teammates."

Young, 20, is the younger brother of Detroit Tigers outfielder Dmitri Young. He was voted the Tampa Bay Devil Rays' minor league player of the year last season and the 2005 minor league player of the year by Baseball America.

"It was unfortunate and until I speak with the organization and see what they have in mind, maybe I can comment on it later," Durham manager John Tamargo said. "It's a tough situation right now.

"I haven't spoken with (Young) and haven't gotten his side of it. We've had some problems with different umpires and it's tough. But I can't say any more."

According to International League policy, the umpire will file a report with president Randy Mobley on Thursday. Mobley will read it, interview parties involved in the incident and decide what penalty should be assessed.

[RBi]

the way that story reads, to me anyways...

it was not as if he "threw" it at him, but flipped his bat, and while doing so, it hit the ump in the chest.


Not that I am taking up for the younger Young... I simply want to tell the story how it reportedly happened.

:)

unreal...

HG, I did not know that the umps were on strike...

When does that mess plan to be over? I suspect it is over money... where do we stand on the negotiating?

[jwkfs]

Not to hijack this threa,d but this might be interesting to look at -- I found it on money.cnn.com:


The privilege of screaming "Yer out!"

It's a long and unprofitable road to the major leagues for umpires. They generally spend between eight and 12 years officiating minor league games before being invited to the Show.

The competition is stiff just to get into the profession, let alone the majors.

Aspiring umpires must first attend a recognized umpire school for a 5-week training program. Top graduates then go to an evaluation course run by the Professional Baseball Umpire Corp. (PBUC), which will hire some of them and put the rest on reserve.

Those hired are assigned to the lowest of four levels in the minor league system, where starting salaries range from $1,800 to $2,000 a month during the season. The most you can make in the minors, officiating AAA ball, is $3,400 a month.

Umpires who aren't promoted to the next level every two years are usually expected to leave. If they make it to the AAA level, they have three years to impress the major league clubs. If they don't, they're out.

But even for great umps, the chances of making the majors is "slim," said Tom Lepperd, director of umpire administration for Major League Baseball.

There are 229 umpires in the minor leagues, but only 68 in the majors, and they can enjoy careers of 20 years or more. You do the math.

If you do snag a job in the big leagues, your salary would range from $90,000 to over $350,000, plus benefits and a pension.

The schedule during baseball season is grueling – constant traveling, and games nearly every day with maybe a free day twice a month.

Between spring training and baseball season, umpires technically are on duty for 31 weeks. But they do have four 1-week vacations built into their schedules during the season, Lepperd said. Plus, they have the off-season free.

That, plus a love of the game, probably helps make up for all the times that burly men second-guess your decisions, scream in your face, and prompt entire stadiums to boo you.

[hiddengem]

HG, I did not know that the umps were on strike...

When does that mess plan to be over? I suspect it is over money... where do we stand on the negotiating?


Its my understanding that they are so far off on a solution that there are no talks going on. The above story tells it all. The amount of money these guys are payed is absolutely rediculous. They, unlike us cannot reach a point where they are a "free agent" so to speak and can make more money.

Minor league players have to attend 6 spring trainings before they are a free agent and can demand a much higher salary. These guys don't have that option, the most they can make for a minor league season (5 months) is around 17k. There are some minor league players making 17k+ a month.

[Dravecky43]

I think this whole issue with Young might just give the D-Rays another excuse to keep him down in the minors and not start his service clock when he comes off the suspension.

On another note, here is a link to an article a few days ago in the Fresno Bee about the minor league umpire strike.

http://www.fresnobee.com/sports/grizzlies/story/12090494p-12842305c.html

[hiddengem]

I think this whole issue with Young might just give the D-Rays another excuse to keep him down in the minors and not start his service clock when he comes off the suspension.

On another note, here is a link to an article a few days ago in the Fresno Bee about the minor league umpire strike.

http://www.fresnobee.com/sports/grizzlies/story/12090494p-12842305c.html



This about sums up my experience so far.

"It's terrible," Fresno Grizzlies catcher Eliezer Alfonzo said. "I have to laugh sometimes how bad it is."

[KCGHOST]

Linking this incident to the MiL umpires strikes is a typical obfuscation of the issue. The guy hit the umpire with a bat. And you want to mitigate that with the side issue that the umpire is not a formal member of the MiL Umpires Union?? The only thing that matters is whether there was real intent to hit the umpire with the bat. If he really meant to hit the guy then that's a full-season suspension. If he just sort of flipped the bat in the direction of the umpire and it took an odd bounce and hit then it's just 20 or so games.


As for the coaches and players whining about the replacement umpires they might want to consider pulling there heads out of their butt. This is a labor issue in which they happen to be a third party. As Marvin Miller so frequently said about the fans, they just have to understand these things happen and they just have to accept it. Instead of hiding behind the replacement umpires they should simply focus on their jobs. If they really think it is so bad they don't have to be out there. Go on a sympathy strike and wait for the regular umps to return.

Of course, the MiL Umpires have real issues here. Their pay schedule is awful and their travel schedule is brutal.

[digglahhh]

Being a scab worker is dangerous...

[digglahhh]

HG,

I work for MLB, scoring the MILB games and putting the data up on the web site. From what the teams have told me the umpiring hasn't been all that bad. Some are better than others, but overall I think the sentiment is that they are doing a better job than many expected.

One guy was telling me, during a game the other night, that the particular homeplate ump did have a strike zone that was roughly the size of New Hampshire...:laugh

[ESPNFan]

I think they should throw the book at Young first off. There is no place for touching umpires, even if the intentions of the bat "flip" are in question. But that being said, am I the only one that thinks that with all the talk of 30 game suspensions, that the 5 game suspension that Roberto Alomar got for spitting in umpire John Hirschbeck's face was inconceivably light?

[KingNothing13]

Wasn't his brother Dmitry the one that smacked the girl in the sausage costume a couple of years back in Milwaukee?

If so, I guess smacking people with bats runs in the family. Maybe they should audition for "The Sopranos"

[BoSox Rule]

Wasn't his brother Dmitry the one that smacked the girl in the sausage costume a couple of years back in Milwaukee?

If so, I guess smacking people with bats runs in the family. Maybe they should audition for "The Sopranos"
That was Randall Simon.

[Bluesteve32]

I just saw the tape on Jim Rome is Burning. This is one of the most appalling scenes I have ever seen in baseball.

First of all, if that state has a statute for batter of a sport official (there are quite a few states that actually do), the player needs to be procecuted to the full extent of the law. I would have pressed charges as soon as the game was over. I would also investigate into civil case to stick it up his pervibial rear end.

Secondly, the league needs to give a proper suspension. Then MLB needs to hammer some more punitive penalties and the Devil Rays must deal with the situation even more, including a contact clause that would include these types of behavior.

I thought when Roberto Alomar spit on John Hirchbeck was about as bad as you could get, but I guess I was wrong.

[Yankees]

The IL imposed an indefinate suspension right now, while they decide what the set punishment will be.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2006/baseball/mlb/04/27/bc.bbm.bulls.youngsuspe.ap/index.html

[rockin500]

the way that story reads, to me anyways...

it was not as if he "threw" it at him, but flipped his bat, and while doing so, it hit the ump in the chest.


Not that I am taking up for the younger Young... I simply want to tell the story how it reportedly happened.

:)

unreal...

HG, I did not know that the umps were on strike...

When does that mess plan to be over? I suspect it is over money... where do we stand on the negotiating?
Seeing that video for the first time, that classifies as a throw to me. He cant be allowed back for at least 50 games. at the very least.

[JohnnysGhost]

This idiot needs to be suspended for a minimum 1 yr,forfiet a few million,and work for 10 bucks an hour

[starkeeper]

I saw a video of this. That was no flip of the bat. That umpire, as well as Young, are very fortunate that he wasn't seriously injured. A significant ban is definitley in order here.

[Empty_One]

You can see the video on their website:

http://www.minorleaguebaseball.com/app/index.jsp

It's currently in the top left corner of the page under Multimedia.

It looks like more than just a little "flip"

You can also watch it here:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wQk0w2E0kf8

[efin98]

If anyone is familiar with the layout of McCoy stadium, you know instantly that it was intentional. The visitor's dugout is on the firstbase side and he threw the bat directly back towards home plate- in the opposite direction!

There is no way in heck that bat could "get away from him" while heading towards the dugout- it's way too far away from the dugout and in the other direction for him to have "missed" the batboy or whoever he was intending to "flip the bat to"...

It's about as blatantly clear he intended to hit the umpire as Roberto Alomar was spitting in the face of the umpire a decade ago!

[Yankees]

I voted for 11-19 at first, after reading and hearing it as a flip (thinking it was more frustration directed at the vicinity of the ump than intending to actually hit him), but after seeing the video, I'm thinking 20+---that wasn't a flip, he flung it backwards directly at him.

[Dravecky43]

Any word on the health of the umpire? Good thing home plate umps wear those chest protectors. Otherwise, we might be guessing time of prison term, not suspension. That was so blatantly blatant that it is amazing. Just absurd.

[rockin500]

Any word on the health of the umpire? Good thing home plate umps wear those chest protectors. Otherwise, we might be guessing time of prison term, not suspension. That was so blatantly blatant that it is amazing. Just absurd.
i think hes fine. if you saw the reaction of him, he took it well. and yep, the protector indeed works well if he took it without much of a flinch.

[Gee Walker]

Other than the lifetime bans given to gambling-related incidents, what is the longest suspension on record in baseball? I've read that there were several "lifetime" suspensions handed out in the late 1940's to the players that jumped to the Mexican league, but several of them made it back after a couple of years, including Sal Maglie.

I remember Steve Howe having seven suspensions for drug abuse, but his career ended like most pitchers - when he couldn't get guys out.

For criminal assault, the NHL effectively gave goon Todd Bertuzzi about a month's suspension for breaking the neck (and ending the career) of Steve Moore. The next year the NHL was on strike, so Bertuzzi actually missed about 20 games in all. That's the longest suspension for in-game violence that I know of.

[BoofBonser26]

I just watched the video, and that is blatant blatant. I'm guessing he's supsended for the season.

[Go Bravos!!!#1]

The D'rays always have a way of getting the finer young men to play for their club.

[Go Bravos!!!#1]

Delmon Young needs to be suspended, and suspended for a while. I think the big part of this outburst was an inflated ego by Young. He's the Devil Rays big hope and his head must be as big as Jupiter. A long suspension should greatly humble him and this should never happen again.

[rockin500]

Other than the lifetime bans given to gambling-related incidents, what is the longest suspension on record in baseball? I've read that there were several "lifetime" suspensions handed out in the late 1940's to the players that jumped to the Mexican league, but several of them made it back after a couple of years, including Sal Maglie.

I remember Steve Howe having seven suspensions for drug abuse, but his career ended like most pitchers - when he couldn't get guys out.

For criminal assault, the NHL effectively gave goon Todd Bertuzzi about a month's suspension for breaking the neck (and ending the career) of Steve Moore. The next year the NHL was on strike, so Bertuzzi actually missed about 20 games in all. That's the longest suspension for in-game violence that I know of.
there were a couple longer than that in the NHL. I forget the name of one, but i do know McSorley's career was ended because of his take out of brashear.

[DodgerBlue8188]

I think the league needs to set an example that any type of action like this will not be tolerated. The way the video shows it. It clearely looks like he was intending to throw the bat at him. What if he had hit him in the face and broke his jaw, knocked a few teeth out, broke the nose etc..? These guys get paid some good money and they can't even keep there attitude under control.

[Astro]

I havent seen it, but my guess is it will be about 30 games... since Kenny Rogers doesnt even get that many for going ape-**** on a cameraman

[Ursa Major]

Empty_One, thanks for posting the link to the clip. I'm sorry -- that is not "flipping the bat". It's out and out throwing. I'd go for a 75-day suspension, mandatory counseling, and referral to the local district attorney's office. Whether the DA does anything about it or not is beside the issue for baseball; Young just has to realize that it's a criminal act.

And, yes, it was an incorrect call, but not THAT bad. It looks like Young did one of those knee lock, bail out things that many little leaguers (including my son, dagnabbit) sometimes do, and all of a sudden that outside corner is as unreachable to the batter as the moon. And the ump may have engaged Young, but he didn't go after him to prolong the argument.

Astro, go back to Empty One's post and click on the links. You've got to see the throw to realize that 30 days ain't gonna be enough. Rogers may have gone ape-poop with a cameraman, but (a) he didn't use a deadly weapon to do it, and (b) a cameraman is not a game official, who is entitled to greater protection from physical abuse for challenges to his calls.

[Bluesteve32]

Looking at the clip, the umpire had no choice but to engage him since his was still in the box for several seconds. I'll give the ump credit for not jacking him right there, but after he said something while he was walking away.

Like I said before, thowing a bat at any official cannot be tolerated at any level of baseball. I bet within the next month you'll see a youth player do something similar because they saw it on ESPN. This player needs to be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law, in criminal and civil courts.

[Gashouse6]

I just saw the clip on Sportscenter. He should be suspended for a long time.

[grizzly451]

This throwing the bat at the umpire incident, on top of him bumping chests with another umpire last year makes me wonder what kind of angry issues this guy must have.

For bumping chests with that umpire last year he was suspended 3 games, for this one he should be suspended at least for a month or more and probably should get some counseling on his anger before he plays anymore.

At this rate he'll turn into Milton Bradley...

[grizzly451]

I havent seen it, but my guess is it will be about 30 games... since Kenny Rogers doesnt even get that many for going ape-**** on a cameraman


Kenny Rogers was a major leaguer though, I'm certainly not excusing it, but he did have Bud Selig on his side. And Bud is almost always quick to protect the interests of the owners (in this case a player). And the whole "I'm famous so I can get away with it" thing that normally seems to happen.

[Astro]

Kenny Rogers was a major leaguer though, I'm certainly not excusing it, but he did have Bud Selig on his side. And Bud is almost always quick to protect the interests of the owners (in this case a player). And the whole "I'm famous so I can get away with it" thing that normally seems to happen.
Being a major leaguer has nothing to do with it

Corky Miller said he did not hear Young say anything, so there goes the he got ejected after he said something excuse

After seeing it I would expect a 90 day suspension, which will be lowered to around 60 after appeals

[grizzly451]

Being a major leaguer has nothing to do with it

Corky Miller said he did not hear Young say anything, so there goes the he got ejected after he said something excuse

After seeing it I would expect a 90 day suspension, which will be lowered to around 60 after appeals


I disagree that being a major leaguer had nothing to do with it. It wasn't all important, but do you really think if a minor leaguer had done that to a cameraman that all he would have gotten was a 20 game suspension? Come on, no way it would have been that light.

[trosmok]

Young was flat wrong, but I do understand his frustration. Physical contact with an umpire is inexcusable, and is greatly compounded by using a bat toss that could have been a lot worse. At least he didn't club the guy ala Marichal.:eek:
It is not mere obfuscation to link this to the lousy amateurs trying to fill in for the striking professional umpires. Twenty one games into the AAA season and the difference between the real umpires and these clowns is like night and day. This is not the first case of frustrations boiling over, and many more ejections, incidents, and violence are sure to come if they Minor League execs and umps don't get their differences worked out posthaste. Federal arbitrators sat down with the reps yesterday and have more talks scheduled for Monday, and the main sticking point is that the minor league umpires have not received a nickel in raises for over eight years.
Officially I am supposed to remain neutral, but there have been several games I've seen that the HP ump called everything, and I mean everything that didn't bounce in front of the plate a strike. The managers on both sides were understandibly furious, and are powerless to do anything about it. It hurts the fans, the franchises, and particularly the players trying to make it to the show. If this job action isn't resolved very soon, I'm certain what Young did is bound to be repeated, if not worse.

[Astro]

Twenty one games into the AAA season and the difference between the real umpires and these clowns is like night and day.

So... because they are not as good as someone else at their job, they are clowns?

I wont even continue to tell you how idiotic of a statement you just made is

[wamby]

After seeing the clip of this incident, I think he should be suspended for the rest of the season.

I don't think the fact that a replacement umpire was involved should have any bearing on this matter. I don't how many minor leaguers are members of the Players Association, but maybe anyone who is should refuse to cross the umpires' picket line.

[trosmok]

Have you been to any of your local team's, the Louisville Bats, games yet this season? :crazy I'm not saying all the replacements are bad, but the incompetent little league guys out there make them all look foolish. Umpires work their way up through the ranks with little thanks, less compensation, and only a few acheive the level of proficiency to work at the AAA level. In fact, several of the real umpires I've met at the yard fill in for vacationing MLB umpires on a regular basis. As hard as I have been on umpires in the past, I have found a new appreciation for the job they do, now that they are on strike. Several MLB umpires have joined their minor league brethren in blue on the picket lines when they have a day off, and they all wish MiLB management would have bargained in good faith and come to some agreement with the professional umpires very, very soon. I'm not advocating open season on scabs by any stretch, it is only a matter of time before somebody else snaps and takes it out by breaking one of the replacement umps white canes and shooting their guide dog.:eek:

[Brian McKenna]

Other than the lifetime bans given to gambling-related incidents, what is the longest suspension on record in baseball? I've read that there were several "lifetime" suspensions handed out in the late 1940's to the players that jumped to the Mexican league, but several of them made it back after a couple of years, including Sal Maglie.
.

significant bans have been instituted for a host of reasons - many during the 19th century for drunkenness or otherwise running foul of the owner

ray fisher was banned for decades
many have been banned for years for playing outlaw baseball
durocher for a year
mexican league players

for an on the field incident in modern times i can think of 30 days for pete rose in the dave pallone incident

[Chelle]

I thought I heard last night that this is the second time he threw a bat. Didn't he throw a bat at a pitcher last year? And, he bumped an ump last year (what does "bump" mean). This guy is should be out at least 50 games. I saw the video, he didn't throw it hard, but he threw the bat.

[KingNothing13]

Wow...nice clip.

suspend him for a good long time.

[wamby]

Other than the lifetime bans given to gambling-related incidents, what is the longest suspension on record in baseball? I've read that there were several "lifetime" suspensions handed out in the late 1940's to the players that jumped to the Mexican league, but several of them made it back after a couple of years, including Sal Maglie.

I remember Steve Howe having seven suspensions for drug abuse, but his career ended like most pitchers - when he couldn't get guys out.

For criminal assault, the NHL effectively gave goon Todd Bertuzzi about a month's suspension for breaking the neck (and ending the career) of Steve Moore. The next year the NHL was on strike, so Bertuzzi actually missed about 20 games in all. That's the longest suspension for in-game violence that I know of.

The Mexican League suspensions were anounced as five year suspensions. These suspensions led to Danny Gardella's suit against MLB. The suspensions were ended by Happy Chandler in 1949.

[ESPNFan]

there were a couple longer than that in the NHL. I forget the name of one, but i do know McSorley's career was ended because of his take out of brashear.

Marty McSorley IMO wasn't trying to hit Bashir in the head. I thought it was an attempt to goad Martin into a second fight (they fought earlier and Bashir gave McSorley a beatdown) by hitting him in the shoulder with the heel of his stick. (If done correctly you can basicly make a guys arm go numb so you would have a considerable advantage in the ensuing fight.) Instead he hit him in the head and was suspended for basicly a season. By the time he was up for reinstatement he was not even a marginal NHL caliber player anymore. How Todd Bertuzzi got less of a penalty than Marty for basicly a premeditated on ice Crippling is beyond me.


But shockingly, to me these events, were incredbly less troubling than the Young incident because both NHL incidents had other violent encounters that instigated them. The NHL is (or was) a league were sometimes frontier justice is required, and ugly incidents result in player vs. Player disputes. The fact the the attack was unprovoked aginst an umpire is unprecidented in American professional sports. Umpire did nothing to Young that warrented a violent attack with a weapon. His suspension should be half a season at the least.

[trosmok]

Negotiations were successful, and the bump in salaries as well as per diem will be ratified on Monday May 1, with the minor league umps returning on or before May 8, according to the latest news:

http://www.minorleaguebaseball.com/app/news/article.jsp?ymd=20060428&content_id=63156&vkey=news_milb&fext

On the Young suspension, it is looking like the remainder of the season, at least. My source cited Burleigh Grimes being suspended for the balance of a season around 1940 for spitting a full juicy wad of tobacco in the face of an umpire while managing Grand Rapids in the Michigan State League.

[Taco De Muerte]

I havent seen it, but my guess is it will be about 30 games... since Kenny Rogers doesnt even get that many for going ape-**** on a cameraman

I agree with this - Though rogers did get sent to jail - But his suspension should of been way longer. He's MUCH older than young and showed the same lack of class as young did.

[Elvis]

The bat could just as easily have hit the umpire square in the face/nose/eyeball. Just because it didn't doesn't make the act any less reprehensible and punishable.

Remainder of season and criminal prosicution if the D.A. thinks it warranted.

[tigers527]

When the draft that included Delmon Young was about to happen the Tigers were as per norm SUCKING. Dimitri Young (Delmons brother) was really pimping his bro to be drafted by the Tigers. I am so glad the D-rays got to him first. Between how Dimitri behaved last year, and now this incident with Delmon, thank goodness.

I think he should be suspended at least the rest of this season. But I would have a tiny bit of respect restored in our judicial system if he actually faced some crimnal charges. I am not saying he should be in jail, but how about some community service (like UMPing lil league games for the city). Although, he is guilty by the video taped evidence alone of assult and battery with a deadly weapon. Time for some counceling Delmon.

[TheKingofKings]

He's probably that frustrated cause he's still not in the MLB and he wants to be in TB's Starting Lineup or , as i read in a news article , he wants his way out of TB so that he can get his chance to play in the MLB , a team who could be interested in him is Florida .

[Bluesteve32]

I agree with this - Though rogers did get sent to jail - But his suspension should of been way longer. He's MUCH older than young and showed the same lack of class as young did.

The Kenny Rogers incident has one major point difference, Kenny did not use a bat. Using a weapon make this a much more severe crime, and really cannot be compared to Hockey's Marty McSorely's bashing of Brian Brashear since that was done in the heat of a game by two competitors. That does not condone McSorely either; but it must be taken in context.

Young, on the other hand, very seriously could have injured by his deliberate throw of the bat. Jail time ought not be necessary, but community service and anger management is quite appropriate. I do like the idea of having Mr Young umpire youth games, and perhaps he will learn something about more about the game and even give something bask to it by this type of service.

[soxfan04]

I don't know if I like the idea of having him umpire youth games as a punishment. It seems to me that a more appropriate punishment would be to combine community service, anger management counseling, and some jail time. I know that any charges that may be filed will undoubtedly be plea bargained away, but something along those lines would better serve the interests of the parties involved. As for the community service, let it be a combination of speaking to youth sports groups about violence, and picking up litter or sweeping streets. By having him working with youth players, it would seem to me to be sending a message to the kids that the person is only there because he has to be there, and doesn't have any real interest in them or their game.

Unfortunately, Bluesteve32 is right, we probably will see this sort of thing show up in a youth game sooner or later because of the exposure. Young people tend to emulate what they see, not just in sports, but everywhere. A negative incident like this will just cause more problems down the road.

[tigers527]

I don't know if I like the idea of having him umpire youth games as a punishment. It seems to me that a more appropriate punishment would be to combine community service, anger management counseling, and some jail time. I know that any charges that may be filed will undoubtedly be plea bargained away, but something along those lines would better serve the interests of the parties involved. As for the community service, let it be a combination of speaking to youth sports groups about violence, and picking up litter or sweeping streets. By having him working with youth players, it would seem to me to be sending a message to the kids that the person is only there because he has to be there,


I can see your point. I was just thinking that maybe Umping little league games might give him some perspective. After hearing his lame apology though I dont know if he'd see the point?

Perhaps we could make special teams of youths for just this sort of occaision. We can bring together throughout the country all the over amped psycho parents who get WAY TO INTO THEIR CHILDRENS GAMES. Then we would have a place for Marty Mcsorely (spelling???) and Delmon Young. I dont think I would feel all that bad for Delmon being shouted down by a living too vicariously dad at a little league game...hell, I'd buy a DVD of that game. Every pitch being questioned by either the pitchers dad or the batters dad....it'd be better then bum fights.

[Bluesteve32]

I don't know if I like the idea of having him umpire youth games as a punishment. It seems to me that a more appropriate punishment would be to combine community service, anger management counseling, and some jail time. I know that any charges that may be filed will undoubtedly be plea bargained away, but something along those lines would better serve the interests of the parties involved. As for the community service, let it be a combination of speaking to youth sports groups about violence, and picking up litter or sweeping streets. By having him working with youth players, it would seem to me to be sending a message to the kids that the person is only there because he has to be there, and doesn't have any real interest in them or their game.

Unfortunately, Bluesteve32 is right, we probably will see this sort of thing show up in a youth game sooner or later because of the exposure. Young people tend to emulate what they see, not just in sports, but everywhere. A negative incident like this will just cause more problems down the road.

Truthfully, I don't think jail time would really help or be necessary. Community service would drive the point home, in my opinion, much better. Having him go behind the plate and hear mommies complain to him and yell about calling their little angel out, argue with coaches who think they are Tommy Lasorda, and some snot-nosed 10 year old who thinks they know baseball batter than them would do a world of more good than spening some time in jail or prison.

Secondly, punish him civilly and get him in the pocketbook. That'll hurt a lot, especially for someone who has not made the big money yet, but his lifestyle and potential lifestyle could be effected everytime he write a check to that umpire for a while.

[Astro]

He's probably that frustrated cause he's still not in the MLB and he wants to be in TB's Starting Lineup or , as i read in a news article , he wants his way out of TB so that he can get his chance to play in the MLB , a team who could be interested in him is Florida .
...riiiiiiight

Tampa wont trade him because he could turn into a superstar, he would have been called up this season if he had not of done this... now it is unlikely he will be, even if he is not suspended for the season

[Brian McKenna]

has this been ruled on yet or did i miss it?

[Ursa Major]

... that I am, Bluesteve, but you don't "... punish him civilly and get him in the pocketbook. That'll hurt a lot, especially for someone who has not made the big money yet, but his lifestyle and potential lifestyle could be effected everytime he write a check to that umpire for a while."

Civil damage awards are to compensate an injured party for his injuries (not to punish), and it doesn't look like the umpire was injured, thankfully. Conceivably the umpire could sue for nominal damages and seek punitive damages on top of that, but I suspect that it's not worth it to the umpire to chase down what might b a $100,000 verdict at best and set a questionable precedent of umpires suing players.

Suspending him without pay for three months certainly would do more to "punish" -- you gotta wonder whether he has any marketable skills to earn money during the suspension. And, certainly, baseball can fine him a substantial amount.

[hiddengem]

As for the coaches and players whining about the replacement umpires they might want to consider pulling there heads out of their butt. This is a labor issue in which they happen to be a third party. As Marvin Miller so frequently said about the fans, they just have to understand these things happen and they just have to accept it. Instead of hiding behind the replacement umpires they should simply focus on their jobs. If they really think it is so bad they don't have to be out there. Go on a sympathy strike and wait for the regular umps to return.



I'm not sure why I'm even responding to this ignorant post but you struck a nerve.

This is how I would compare our sitution to "your" world, albeit a little extreme.

You have been indicted on an account that you robbed a store and you are completely innocent. You have prepared your case for hrs and hrs with your attorney(Ursa Major) and are set to do battle in the court to prove you are innocent. A few days before your trial something happens to Ursa and he can no longer represent you. The Court says tough crap, the trial must go on, here is a college student that is studying law that will represent you. Good luck.

That is what we are dealing with you chump. This is our livelyhood, this is how we feed our families and pay our bills. We work our tails off all offseason to prepare for a game that is cutthroat and will spit you at the drop of a hat. When I go up to the plate I expect that the person calling balls and strikes has at least the same understaning of the strike zone that I have, and I expect that the people calling the game on the bases aren't so over matched that they don't even know the rules of the game.

[digglahhh]

When I go up to the plate I expect that the person calling balls and strikes has at least the same understaning of the strike zone that I have, and I expect that the people calling the game on the bases aren't so over matched that they don't even know the rules of the game.

Have you ever talked to the official scorers? Some of them are unable to determine even simple things, like which runs are earned and which are unearned.

[wamby]

I'm not sure why I'm even responding to this ignorant post but you struck a nerve.

This is how I would compare our sitution to "your" world, albeit a little extreme.

You have been indicted on an account that you robbed a store and you are completely innocent. You have prepared your case for hrs and hrs with your attorney(Ursa Major) and are set to do battle in the court to prove you are innocent. A few days before your trial something happens to Ursa and he can no longer represent you. The Court says tough crap, the trial must go on, here is a college student that is studying law that will represent you. Good luck.

That is what we are dealing with you chump. This is our livelyhood, this is how we feed our families and pay our bills. We work our tails off all offseason to prepare for a game that is cutthroat and will spit you at the drop of a hat. When I go up to the plate I expect that the person calling balls and strikes has at least the same understaning of the strike zone that I have, and I expect that the people calling the game on the bases aren't so over matched that they don't even know the rules of the game.

It might surprise you to know that people outside of professional athletics have had their livelihoods affected in negative ways by work stoppages and strikes. I was even able to say that without name-calling. I wish I could relate to having a livelihood and providing for my family and paying the bills.

That was also an excellent, very realistic example that you provided.

[hiddengem]

Have you ever talked to the official scorers? Some of them are unable to determine even simple things, like which runs are earned and which are unearned.


Those guys are often brutal as well. They need to have somebody in that booth that has played the game at a high level and many of them have never worn a jock in their life. They are often times making decisions on plays that they have never had to make in their life.

[digglahhh]

Those guys are often brutal as well. They need to have somebody in that booth that has played the game at a high level and many of them have never worn a jock in their life. They are often times making decisions on plays that they have never had to make in their life.

Perspective is one thing, but not knowing the rules is even worse.

The PR guys are even worse. Their job is to figure out any possible way to lobby for the best possible stats for their guys, even if they know that the player doesn't deserve them. It's a whole perverse dynamic.

Many times I hear OSes say that the managers pressure them to make scoring changes.

The OSes and managers shouldn't be allowed to speak- conflict of interest!

[Yankees]

Concerning suspending him without pay:
Didn't he get several M as a signing bonus, so would it really do anything?

Umpires suing:
Perhaps naive, but would a replacement want his name out, with probably less than a 50/50 change of winning a suit, and not all that much $$ to follow, if he did win?

Hiddengem:
Definately naive: Is there not some skill in adapting to the strikezone of an umpire? This is not to say that I disagree with your post--I don't, and I would assume that adaption is more suited to AAA umps, where they vary, but not as much as the current--I am mainly just curious.

[hiddengem]

Hiddengem:
Definately naive: Is there not some skill in adapting to the strikezone of an umpire?

Sure, you have to adapt to a speicific strike zone a guy is calling. But maybe you could tell me the secret to adapting to a strike zone that changes every pitch?

[The Big C]

It comes from the Vlad Guerrero school of hitting. The technique is called "crush everything". Apparently, minor league hitters are now supposed to be adept at that, rendering competent umpiring obsolete.

[Yankees]

Sure, you have to adapt to a speicific strike zone a guy is calling. But maybe you could tell me the secret to adapting to a strike zone that changes every pitch?

Bribing the umpire, perhaps? Seriously, though, much deserved--thanks for the reply, however.

I wonder what your take on the actual bat flinging incident is, apart from simply the umpires?

[trosmok]

has this been ruled on yet or did i miss it?

No word yet from the IL president Randy Mobely or the league office. It is not unusual for a week or two to pass while a violent offender is on "indefinite suspension" before a ruling is made. Since he has no chance of playing or appealing until it is announced, it may be another week or more before they decide what all to do. Certainly they will conduct as thorough an investigation as possible, even though we all saw the replay numerous times. For more see:

http://bradenton.com/mld/bradenton/sports/14494938.htm?source=rss&channel=bradenton_sports


Minor League Umpires are still on strike, having rejected the insult, er, latest offer from the management side of the squabble. No further talks are scheduled, much to my disappointment. Seems like more violent episodes are bound to occur; three bench clearing incidents occurred during Saturday's game between the Jacksonville Suns and Birmingham Barons. One manager pulled his team off the field in the seventh, forfeiting the contest. It is going to get worse, I fear, alot worse....

www.amlu.org

[digglahhh]

Suspended 50 games

[KCGHOST]

The IL copped out and only gave him a 50 game suspension and 50 hours of community service.

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=2438919

[The Big C]

I'm glad they did give him some community service time. I would have liked to have seen some mandatory anger management though. Punishment is all well and good, but preventing future problems would be ideal in my opinion. I don't want there to be a Ron Artest of baseball (supremely talented individual who lacks self-control and guidance and becomes a repeat offender).

[efin98]

He may well get anger management forced on him from the Devil Rays for all we know. 50 games and a total loss of pay for that period of time seems just for what he did.

It's precident. He will get more should he do something like that again and a similar punishment will likely follow for anyone who does that same thing to an umpire in the future.