Fans Not Satisfied with Drug Testing, Bonds.

[ESPNFan]

http://abcnews.go.com/Sports/wireStory?id=1882628

WASHINGTON Apr 24, 2006 (AP)— More than half of America's baseball fans say the sport has not done enough to curb the use of steroids and other performance-enhancing drugs, an AP-AOL Sports poll found.

And two-thirds of baseball fans either have unfavorable or mixed views about Barry Bonds, who is under a cloud of suspicion about steroids use as he chases baseball's career record for home runs.

I don't think this would come as a surprise to anyone. I think you open yourself or your organization to criticism when you install a drug testing program that is deemed as less than the best available and this is only done after pressure from Fans the press and the government forced MLB's hand. To me the easiest thing to do would have been to agree to WADA testing and be done with it. I'm not saying WADA testing is perfect either, but if Olympic athletes can still find ways around testing that's regarded as the benchmark for a drug program, how can MLB possibly expect its testing to work long term in curbing drug use?

[Taco De Muerte]

" Fans " should not be satisfied with amphetamines testing either. Any player who wants to continue using amphetamines will get prescriptions. It's as simple as that. All you have to do is find the right doctor.

[ESPNFan]

" Fans " should not be satisfied with amphetamines testing either. Any player who wants to continue using amphetamines will get prescriptions. It's as simple as that. All you have to do is find the right doctor.

Thats not a flaw in the testing. Its a problem with MLB and its oversite on the legal use of banned substances with a perscription/Doctor's consent. It's just another loophole that MLB seems to leave for players to exploit.

WADA also allows athletes to use certain banned substances as well but their rules are much more strict. They are called Therapeutic Use Exemptions I think, but to get them you have to jump through a number of hoops and meet certain criteria on the health need for the substance vs. how it would impact the athletes performance.

Again as I stated above, if MLB adopts the WADA system lots of these problems go away. Its not perfect, but its a major improvement.

[Astro]

This is news to me

[Sultan_1895-1948]

" Fans " should not be satisfied with amphetamines testing either.

That's like expecting society be as sensitive about shop lifters as it is about rapists.

[Knick9]

This is news to me

This is news to me, too. I'm not surprised by this, though. MLB management is too soft in my mind compared to other sports' managements. Change the whole look of the head guys (Selig and company) and you'll see change. That won't happen until 2009, but I wonder if Selig will survive until then.

[Taco De Muerte]

This is news to me

This shouldn't really be new news to you - It's pretty much impossible to stop players/pitchers from " cheating ".

It's incredibly easy to " cheat " by using amphetamines - There are team doctors that will prescribe adderall. It's a very easy way around the testing policy.

Let me also post this article on corked bats - which Wendell says is prevalent in today's game among hitters.
http://www.dailyherald.com/sports/rozner.asp?id=168644

[ESPNFan]

This shouldn't really be new news to you - It's pretty much impossible to stop players/pitchers from " cheating ".

It's incredibly easy to " cheat " by using amphetamines - There are team doctors that will prescribe adderall. It's a very easy way around the testing policy.

Let me also post this article on corked bats - which Wendell says is prevalent in today's game among hitters.
http://www.dailyherald.com/sports/rozner.asp?id=168644


And corked bats has anything to do with what fans are concerned with because?

I really don't understand why you would mention Corked Bats when In that same article Wendel estimates that almost 75% OF HIS TEAM was on steroids. There have been numerous articles here posted that call the advatange of a corked bat into question. Its comparing apples and oranges.

[Astro]

Why dont fans like Barry Bonds? I'm confused

[ESPNFan]

This is news to me, too. I'm not surprised by this, though. MLB management is too soft in my mind compared to other sports' managements. Change the whole look of the head guys (Selig and company) and you'll see change. That won't happen until 2009, but I wonder if Selig will survive until then.

Not only that but as I posted earlier, have you ever seen a governing body of a sport almost go out of its way to protect its players despite the fact that they are breaking the rules of the game? The commisioner's option to keep a violation quite and just administer a fine. Optional Informational testing that only verified that the emperor had no clothes. The 2004 testing where a first offence just put you under confidential observation and treatment. The Testing for the WBC which allowed a player to back out of the WBC and keep a possible failure silent.

Its almost an enabelling relationship because, as the cheaters always have the advantage, the players will beable to stay many steps ahead of what MLB testers employ as opposed to WADA standards.

[ESPNFan]

Why dont fans like Barry Bonds? I'm confused

Is this sarcastic? :noidea

[chrismarullo]

This shouldn't really be new news to you - It's pretty much impossible to stop players/pitchers from " cheating ".

It's incredibly easy to " cheat " by using amphetamines - There are team doctors that will prescribe adderall. It's a very easy way around the testing policy.

Let me also post this article on corked bats - which Wendell says is prevalent in today's game among hitters.
http://www.dailyherald.com/sports/rozner.asp?id=168644

Interesting, I take adderall and never thought anyhting of athletes using it. I was told by the Dr. that it was a controlled substance and that if I traveled with it I had to have the perscription bottle because there's a black market for it.

I know it's intended for ADD which is why I take it, but I don't know what the effects would be if someone without ADD took it. I'll ask the Dr. the next time I need a refill.

[#1SportsFan]

These "fans" need to realize there's no foolproof drug test. None. Second, these "fans" need to realize MLB cannot punish players for what they did before the steriods thing blew up. The WADA testing is unnecessary.

[west coast orange and black]

ESPNFan: I think you open yourself or your organization to criticism when you install a drug testing program that is deemed as less than the best available...

this is spot on, man.
what i found most interesting about the poll:

Half the fans in the poll were asked if Bonds should be allowed into the Hall of Fame if he is found to have used steroids or other performance-enhancing drugs.
61% said no.

The other half of the sample was asked if Bonds should be allowed in the Hall if he was found to have used such drugs only before baseball enacted rules against those drugs in 2002.
57% said yes.

[ESPNFan]

ESPNFan: I think you open yourself or your organization to criticism when you install a drug testing program that is deemed as less than the best available...

this is spot on, man.
what i found most interesting about the poll:

Half the fans in the poll were asked if Bonds should be allowed into the Hall of Fame if he is found to have used steroids or other performance-enhancing drugs.
61% said no.

The other half of the sample was asked if Bonds should be allowed in the Hall if he was found to have used such drugs only before baseball enacted rules against those drugs in 2002.
57% said yes.


Hey WCOB just a quick comment on the survey. First off I think the Bonds survey is irrelevant. The guy was a Hall Of Famer if he retired in 1998 IMO. He's going to get elected barring a massively damaging revelation. People are just upset as his steroid use in particular because he is about to break the HR records of Ruth and Aaron. Of course their going to see him negatively. And I doubt the people surveyed know about the Fay Vincent memo which made Steroids against the rules but wasn't practical from an enforceability standpoint.

And to those who say WADA testing is unnecessary.... Then why bother testing? If your going to have a drug policy it behooves your organization to commit to a no tolerance stand point and use every means necessary to do so. Olympic athletes still try to get around WADA/IOC testing. So when the MLB has a testing program that is markedly inferior to that your basically handing the players a blueprint on how to cheat.

After the next Olympics Baseball will cease to be an event in the games and a major reason why is the MLB and more recently the WBC stubborn resistance to the best testing available.

Face facts people, inferior drug testing programs are about as effective as referees in Professional wrestling. Comical, incompetent and there just for show.

[chrismarullo]

Interesting, I take adderall and never thought anyhting of athletes using it. I was told by the Dr. that it was a controlled substance and that if I traveled with it I had to have the perscription bottle because there's a black market for it.

I know it's intended for ADD which is why I take it, but I don't know what the effects would be if someone without ADD took it. I'll ask the Dr. the next time I need a refill.

Okay I talked to a Dr. who is very familiar with adderall-an amphetamine-and he said unless a player had ADD, adderral would have little to no effect on their performance. He said the only benifet they may recieve from the drug would be a little extra pep-but nothing they couldn't get at Starbucks.

[ESPNFan]

Okay I talked to a Dr. who is very familiar with adderall-an amphetamine-and he said unless a player had ADD, adderral would have little to no effect on their performance. He said the only benifet they may recieve from the drug would be a little extra pep-but nothing they couldn't get at Starbucks.


Thanks Chris, its nice to see people at least trying to follow up on these things and do some research.

[Honus Wagner Rules]

I think most fans will not be satisfied with the drug testing until Bonds specifically is caught. :rolleyes:

[Taco De Muerte]

Okay I talked to a Dr. who is very familiar with adderall-an amphetamine-and he said unless a player had ADD, adderral would have little to no effect on their performance. He said the only benifet they may recieve from the drug would be a little extra pep-but nothing they couldn't get at Starbucks.

Well I'm going to have to disagree based on personal experience myself. During finals I had a tough time focusing - So I had it prescribed to me. I got multiple semesters worth of reading/studying done in a few nights. It was incredible, I was more focused, alert, and felt way more energized.

As for it's effects on " enhancing " a ballplayers performance - Sure, there's not FACTUAL evidence they make a ballplayer better - But many have said they help greatly. A teammate of chad curtis said he couldn't play without them, and a current ballplayer today said they could increase the velocity of a pitchers fastball.

Either these are all huge coincidences, or amphetamines enhance performance. Anyway, they are banned, so regardless of it's effects on performance, if caught, your a cheater, period.

[Sultan_1895-1948]

I think most fans will not be satisfied with the drug testing until Bonds specifically is caught. :rolleyes:

Oh stop. It's not about that. Like many, including myself, have been saying for years, Bonds had the money and resources to take the proper precautions to not get caught by a weak testing system. Not difficult. His tests showed up with a very high level of testosterone, but his masking agent also raised the "epi" levels, which caused a negative test. In my mind, he's already tested positive. Don't need a positive to form an educated opinion.

[west coast orange and black]

so there you have it.
no need for wada testing when there's sultan testing.

[Sultan_1895-1948]

so there you have it.
no need for wada testing when there's sultan testing.

Just stating an opinion. Gather the info, use brainpower and logic, and vuala! You have an opinion. You have yours, I have mine. No need for the snide remark. I refrain from calling you an obsessed Bonds apologists because I think I know you better than that. No, actually I'm sure I know you better than that.

[west coast orange and black]

:lookitup no such thing as a "bonds apologist" :lookitup

[west coast orange and black]

sultan: No need for the snide remark.

It just - voilà - came out after I typed wada testing, so that's my bad.

[Sultan_1895-1948]

sultan: No need for the snide remark.

It just - voilà - came out after I typed wada testing, so that's my bad.

NO, NO, NO ! That COULDN'T have happened! You NEVER make a mistake!

[west coast orange and black]

hmmm... maybe yer right after all.

[Sultan_1895-1948]

hmmm... maybe yer right after all.

~~~funny~~~

[Honus Wagner Rules]

Just stating an opinion. Gather the info, use brainpower and logic, and vuala! You have an opinion. You have yours, I have mine. No need for the snide remark. I refrain from calling you an obsessed Bonds apologists because I think I know you better than that. No, actually I'm sure I know you better than that.
I said most fans. :p

[chrismarullo]

Well I'm going to have to disagree based on personal experience myself. During finals I had a tough time focusing - So I had it prescribed to me. I got multiple semesters worth of reading/studying done in a few nights. It was incredible, I was more focused, alert, and felt way more energized.

As for it's effects on " enhancing " a ballplayers performance - Sure, there's not FACTUAL evidence they make a ballplayer better - But many have said they help greatly. A teammate of chad curtis said he couldn't play without them, and a current ballplayer today said they could increase the velocity of a pitchers fastball.

Either these are all huge coincidences, or amphetamines enhance performance. Anyway, they are banned, so regardless of it's effects on performance, if caught, your a cheater, period.

Well you took it for its intended purpose, to make up for a defficency in your attention span. What I was talking about was taking Adderall just to see if it enhances a player's performance. If a player had ADD or ADHD then Adderall would probably help his performance-but most likley only to that level that he would be if he didn't have ADD.

Also, when you say "they" in your post, are you refering specifically to Adderall or to amphetamines in general?

[Taco De Muerte]

Well you took it for its intended purpose, to make up for a defficency in your attention span. What I was talking about was taking Adderall just to see if it enhances a player's performance. If a player had ADD or ADHD then Adderall would probably help his performance-but most likley only to that level that he would be if he didn't have ADD.

Also, when you say "they" in your post, are you refering specifically to Adderall or to amphetamines in general?

I'm talking about a " real " greenie from Mexico. It worked for me, and I don't have ADD or ADHD.

[ESPNFan]

I'm talking about a " real " greenie from Mexico. It worked for me, and I don't have ADD or ADHD.

So you had a "real" greenie from Mexico perscribed to you so you could study but you don't have ADD or ADHD?

I might consider a different HMO........:rolleyes: