Ron LeFlore

[Honus Wagner Rules]

Who remembers watching Ron LeFlore play? I vaguely remember him, being so young at the time. Based on his numbers he obviously had amazing speed. How good an outfielder was he? He must have had amazing raw talent given he went from prision to the majors in less than a year and didn't play organized ball until his early 20s. Can a Ron LeFlore story happen today?

[KCGHOST]

Leflore was biasically an average hitter with some doubles power who could run like the dickens. Excellent base stealer (76% success rate). Very mediocre CFer, though.

Could it happen again?? Of course.

[leecemark]

--LeFlore was a horrible outfielder when he first came up. He really didn't know what he was doing out there (which isn't surprising considering the path he took to the majors), but he developed into a solid CFer. Unfortunately, his arm got worse as his fielding got better and that kept him from ever beign a real defensive asset.

[Bench 5]

I watched LeFlore quite a bit when he played for the White Sox in 1981 and 1982. In 1981 he really sparked the team early in the season. He was hitting great and stealing bases. He slowed down after the season picked up after the strike and he wasn't nearly as effective.

He had great speed but he didn't have very good instincts on defense. He misjudged balls and didn't get great jumps. So he had to make up for it with his speed. He had a weak arm and he wasn't very accurate. In one game he misjudged a fly and lost it. The ball wound up bouncing straight off his head ala Jose Canseco. :crazy
LeFlore really lost his skills quickly. Even though he was still fast, he put on some weight when he was with the Sox. He was pretty much done after that.

On offense like many of the Sox players at the time he studied under Charlie Lau and changed his swing ala George Brett. He seemed pretty mechanical at the plate to me. Like I said he hit pretty well at first but he faded quickly and was out of baseball shortly after that. In my opinion if he kept himself in better shape he could have played a few more years but he seemed to let himself go after signing a pretty big contract with the Sox at the time.

[SABR Matt]

Ron LeFlore's defense by PCA:
Age Yr ADWC PRG
26 1974 1.54 61
27 1975 1.42 131
28 1976 4.80 138
29 1977 1.69 150
30 1978 4.98 158
31 1979 1.24 111
32 1980 0.90 122
33 1981 1.35 78
34 1982 0.56 71

As Mark said...when he first came up, he had no idea what a route was or how to run it...but by 1976 he was a gold glove contender...looks like he hit the wall pretty darned early though...

On offense:
Age Yr OWC PA
26 1974 1.24 272
27 1975 2.40 591
28 1976 7.64 603
29 1977 8.92 698
30 1978 7.57 741
31 1979 8.09 654
32 1980 6.37 587
33 1981 1.35 369
34 1982 2.77 357

You can see though that he was a darned good little hitter/baserunner...almost right away...kind of interesting that he showed up out of prison and within a couple of years was a legitimate team MVP candidate...what was he in jail for?

[Bench 5]

One more thing............I think another thing that contributed to the early demise of his career was when Lavar Burton played LeFlore in the made for TV movie about his life. That's almost as bad as when Anthony Perkins played Jimmy Piersall in Fear Strikes Out!! :D

[SABR Matt]

LOL...I didn't know a movie was made about this guy...that's pretty hilarious.

[johnny]

LOL...I didn't know a movie was made about this guy...that's pretty hilarious.

Matt
Actually, this made-for-tv has a nice documentary prison style with decent acting by LeVar Burton as Ron LeFlore. Nice shots of old Tiger Stadium. Plus appearances by Billy Martin Norm Cash Al Kaline Jim Northrup Steve Kemp and Bill Freehan.
Actually, its a pretty impressive real life story. I mean, Michael Jordon couldn't make the jump but this guy did. Nice story of redemption/making good.

[Bench 5]

Yeah, the movie was called "One in a Million". I remember watching it as a kid in the late 70s. Billy Martin played himself in the movie. Actually the movie was pretty good so it's worth renting if it's still available.

[Honus Wagner Rules]

Ron LeFlore's defense by PCA:
Age Yr ADWC PRG
26 1974 1.54 61
27 1975 1.42 131
28 1976 4.80 138
29 1977 1.69 150
30 1978 4.98 158
31 1979 1.24 111
32 1980 0.90 122
33 1981 1.35 78
34 1982 0.56 71

As Mark said...when he first came up, he had no idea what a route was or how to run it...but by 1976 he was a gold glove contender...looks like he hit the wall pretty darned early though...

On offense:
Age Yr OWC PA
26 1974 1.24 272
27 1975 2.40 591
28 1976 7.64 603
29 1977 8.92 698
30 1978 7.57 741
31 1979 8.09 654
32 1980 6.37 587
33 1981 1.35 369
34 1982 2.77 357

You can see though that he was a darned good little hitter/baserunner...almost right away...kind of interesting that he showed up out of prison and within a couple of years was a legitimate team MVP candidate...what was he in jail for?
Armed robbery. What's amazing is that he didn't play any organized ball until he went to prison! I just find that almost impossible to believe. I can see a guy with great speed getting by as backup outfielder but LeFlore somewhow was able to adapt to major league pitching just a year out of prison with handly any baseball experience at all. Wow. :crazy

[Brian McKenna]

a fellow inmate of leflore's knew a bartender who knew - you guessed it - billy martin - leflore was granted a 48-hour furlough in June 1973 to perform for the manager at Tigers Stadium

[Captain Cold Nose]

Copied from the History forum. What memories of LeFlore do you have?

[moldyoldie]

The made-for TV movie "One in a Million" was based on LeFlore's book co-written with Jim Hawkins. It was a fairly well-made docu-drama that did tend to lapse into melodrama, but I remember enjoying it. As I recall, the movie ended with some hecklers shouting down on him about his past as he was positioned in center field at Tiger Stadium.

As a player, LeFlore had all the natural attributes for being a major league outfielder. His bad tendencies were to not get a good jump on the ball and to catch the ball close to his chest. I don't ever remember him being regarded for his throwing arm.

He had pop in his bat, and you could count on a lead-off single being as good as a double. He was never much of a situational hitter, however. He also never mastered how to bunt for a hit; he looked lost in this regard.

LeFlore played on many very mediocre teams under manager Ralph Houk and was eventually traded in the off-season following Sparky Anderson's hire to the Expos for touted young left-handed starter Dan Schatzeder. In his only season with the Expos he had 97 stolen bases but his BA plummeted to .257.

I also remember there being questions concerning his real age; i.e., that he was actually a few years older than stated.

[Bluesteve32]

In the late 1980s, a freind of mine attended the Joe Brinkman Umpires School in Florida. Among the people attending that year was Ron LaFlore. Apperently, LeFlore ran into Marty Springsted, the former AL umpire who was working as an umpire supervisor for the AL, and the two chated a bit.

LaFlore mentioned how he missed the game and Springsted suggested maybe he ought to consider umpiring. LaFlore attended Brinkman's school that winter. La Flore obvoiusly did not make it as an umpire in professional ball, but several other MLB players had fine careers as umpires, Eddie Rommel, Hank O'Day, and Bill Kunkel come to mind right away. Too bad Ron could not have done the same.

[Honus Wagner Rules]

LeFlore had some serious natural talent to go from prison baseball to the majors in just over a year. I think a lot fo LeFlore's defensive problems stemmed form the fact he didn't have any baseball experience as a youth. Things that most playeres learned as youths, and became second nature to them, LeFlore had to learn in the major leagues. And that's tough to do.

[Tigerfan1974]

Ronnie had almost blinding speed.
In the days before Henderson, I remember one announcer stating that if anybody was going to break Lou Brock's record, it would be either Carew, a good runner/stealer, or LeFlore.

Sad how is life after baseball has turned out. But was fun to watch when he played.

[HDH]

Ron LeFlore was my favorite player when I was a young teenager. He gained allot of attention in 1976 when he was hitting near .400 at the all star break. He was voted as a starting OF, along with Rusty Staub who was leading the AL in RBIs at the All Star game. He led off for the AL and singled in the 1st. The other All Star Tiger, SP Mark Fydrich, was the game loser.

He would regularily beat out slow rollers to the left side of the IF and he hit mosly to the right side OF. There were no routine infield outs. He began to hit with more power 77-79. Most of his HR were to RF. The bad was that he struck out often. He was always a league leader in SB even though Ralph Houk kept tight rein on him when he was on base. He didn't get great initial jumps and he wasn't a good slider; he stole from sheer speed.

LeFlore was one of the worst CFs in in the game. He could catchup to almost any fly ball but, he often dropped it. Every fly ball was a potental drop and sometimes just miss the mit completely. His arm was less than average but, he could hit his relay man. The worst OF I ever witnessed was Staub in RF, Alex Johnson in LF, with LeFlore in CF.

When Sparky became the manager, he announced that he would have a winning team in 5 years. However, the team he inherited was only 2 years away so, he actually cost them several championships. He began to dismantle the team that was there to make a statement. Along with LeFlore, he rid the team of Rusty Staub, Jason Thompson, and pre-beaned Steve Kemp. When Kirt Gibson came up, Sparky Anderson crowned his boy Kirt as the fastest man in baseball. Wrong! Ron LeFlore was.

In 1980, LeFlore was traded to Montreal and was the catalyst to the division winners, stealing nearly 100 bases. After 1980, his age, which was always older than listed, began to catch up with him. After Ralph Houk, in the clubhouse, he was considered a bad apple and eventually released for routinely missing various team functions.

[Honus Wagner Rules]

Ron LeFlore was my favorite player when I was a young teenager. He gained allot of attention in 1976 when he was hitting near .400 at the all star break. He was voted as a starting OF, along with Rusty Staub who was leading the AL in RBIs at the All Star game. He led off for the AL and singled in the 1st. The other All Star Tiger, SP Mark Fydrich, was the game loser.

He would regularily beat out slow rollers to the left side of the IF and he hit mosly to the right side OF. There were no routine infield outs. He began to hit with more power 77-79. Most of his HR were to RF. The bad was that he struck out often. He was always a league leader in SB even though Ralph Houk kept tight rein on him when he was on base. He didn't get great initial jumps and he wasn't a good slider; he stole from sheer speed.

LeFlore was one of the worst CFs in in the game. He could catchup to almost any fly ball but, he often dropped it. Every fly ball was a potental drop and sometimes just miss the mit completely. His arm was less than average but, he could hit his relay man. The worst OF I ever witnessed was Staub in RF, Alex Johnson in LF, with LeFlore in CF.

When Sparky became the manager, he announced that he would have a winning team in 5 years. However, the team he inherited was only 2 years away so, he actually cost them several championships. He began to dismantle the team that was there to make a statement. Along with LeFlore, he rid the team of Rusty Staub, Jason Thompson, and pre-beaned Steve Kemp. When Kirt Gibson came up, Sparky Anderson crowned his boy Kirt as the fastest man in baseball. Wrong! Ron LeFlore was.

In 1980, LeFlore was traded to Montreal and was the catalyst to the division winners, stealing nearly 100 bases. After 1980, his age, which was always older than listed, began to catch up with him. After Ralph Houk, in the clubhouse, he was considered a bad apple and eventually released for routinely missing various team functions.

I thought the Phillies were the NL East Division winners in 1980? :confused:The Expos won the East in 1981.

[HDH]

Yes, I'm wrong. My memory is giving way. I remember the Expos and Phillies fighting it out the end of 1980. LeFlore at leadoff then Rodney Scott then Andre Dawson. The 1-2-3 spots stole so many bases. The Expos lost out to the Phillies in the last week. In 1981, Tim Raines replaced LeFlore.

[duffaholic]

Does anyone know of any exisiting game tapes from the Leflore era? I have 2 he played in , the famous 6-28-76 Fidrych Monday night game, and the 1976 all star game, are there any others out there?

www.freewebs.com/forles

[duffaholic]

Ive come across a couple more Leflore games on video, 6-20-78 tigers vs blue jays, and a 1981 exhibition game between the white sox and cubs.

[malt-tones]

Ron Leflore, now that's a blast from the past.

Does anyone know what Twinkle Toes Bosco has been up to lately? or where he is living? How come he doesn't make an appearance at CoPa?

[Paulmcall]

When he last showed up at Tiger Stadium, they hit him up for past child support payments. That might be why he doesn't come around more often.

[HDH]

Is Ron LeFore the 2nd greatest Tiger CF?