Guillen calls A-Rod hypocrite......

[TonyStarks]

I told you folks...this thing is gonna haunt ARod for a long time.
Dominicans & Latinos will hold a grudge for awhile....ARod should have either kept his mouth shut about playing for DR or not played at all as he stated.

____

Guillen calls A-Rod hypocrite in SI for WBC decision

Another spring, another member of the Sox taking shots at Alex Rodriguez. This time, however, it isn't the Boston Red Sox; it's Chicago White Sox manager Ozzie Guillen.

Guillen, in an interview with Sports Illustrated, targeted A-Rod's much-publicized back and forth standing whether to play in the World Baseball Classic for the Dominican Republic or United States.

"Alex was kissing Latino people's asses," Guillen, who's from Venezuela, said in the most recent issue of Sports Illustrated. "He knew he wasn't going to play for the Dominicans; he's not a Dominican!"

Rodriguez, who has dual citizenship in the Dominican Republic and United States, decided to play for the American squad after once saying he wasn't going to play in the WBC because choosing a team was too difficult. Guillen apparently found his wishy-washy attitude to be disingenuous.

"I hate hypocrites: He's full of [expletive]," Guillen told Sports Illustrated. "The Dominican team doesn't need his ass. It's the same with [Nomar] Garciaparra playing for Mexico. Garciaparra only knows Cancun because he went to visit."

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=2332682

[KCGHOST]

You have to admit that Ozzie calls them like he sees them.

[DoubleX]

I wouldn't be surprised if A-Rod encounters some high and tight pitches when he faces the White Sox.

[TonyStarks]

Ohhh....throwback baseball!
I love it.

I may write an open letter to Bud asking him to raise the mound and let teams play.

If Bruce Chen drills Jim Thome...then Contreras should be allowed to drill Miggy Tejada without any interference from Umps....unless he hits him in the head. Only then would an Ump be required to issue a warning.

[Evangelion]

"The Dominican team doesn't need his ass. It's the same with [Nomar] Garciaparra playing for Mexico. Garciaparra only knows Cancun because he went to visit."

I have to admit Guillen is speaking my view on the situation, too. I did find it absolutely ridiculous when I heard Nomar was going to play for Mexico when he's not even Mexican. Mike Piazza playing for Italy? Not sure why he would be playing for Italy. Maybe because his last name ends in a vowel?

I'm aware Nomar pulled out, like he should with his injury history.

Anyway, while A-Rod is Dominican, we all know doesn't act Dominican or even have a strong sense of national pride like players from Dominican Republic like Manny Rameriz and David Ortiz. I did find that media coverage on what team A-Rod was going to play for ridiculous and I find it even more ridiculous he would even be allowed to play for Team Dominican.

He's on Team USA now, but his flip flopping made him look bad. If he went to Team Dominican instead of Team USA, he would be smash. Why didn't A-Rod and Piazza get smashed as hard? They didn't flip flop and said we're thinking about playing this for this country of the other country.

[TonyStarks]

"The Dominican team doesn't need his ass. It's the same with [Nomar] Garciaparra playing for Mexico. Garciaparra only knows Cancun because he went to visit."

I have to admit Guillen is speaking my view on the situation, too. I did find it absolutely ridiculous when I heard Nomar was going to play for Mexico when he's not even Mexican. Mike Piazza playing for Italy? Not sure why he would be playing for Italy. Maybe because his last name ends in a vowel?

Anyway, while A-Rod is Dominican, we all know doesn't act Dominican or even have a strong sense of national pride like players from Dominican Republic like Manny Rameriz and David Ortiz. I did find that media coverage on what team A-Rod was going to play for ridiculous and I find it even more ridiculous he would even be allowed to play for Team Dominican.

He's on Team USA now, but his flip flopping made him look bad. If he went to Team Dominican instead of Team USA, he would be smash. Why didn't A-Rod and Piazza get smashed as hard? They didn't flip flop and said we're thinking about playing this for this country of the other country.


Ev,
The reason Nomar is playing for Mexico is because his parents are Mexican.
Which makes him an American of Mexican desent (sp?). His father named him Nomar...because it's Ramon spelled backwards which I believe is his name.

Mike Piazza is also an American of Italian desent, that's why he's allowed to play for Italy. His parents are Italian not because his last name ends in a vowel.

How do you know ARod doesn't 'act' Dominican or have a sense of Pride for DR? ARod does have a very big sense of Dominican Pride, but he cannot match Pedro's; Manny's or Papi's because they were born on the island...where as ARod was born on the island too, but Manhattan's island.

The media is on ARod's case because he was one of the first to publically say he's going to play on DR's team. Then all of a sudden he didn't want to offend anyone...or so that was said. Had ARod never said this then it wouldn't be such a big deal...and thats why he's getting alot of flack. Players like Tejada, Pedro and now Ozzie have commented on ARod's flip-flopping and I argued about this awhile ago.


I can't really comment on your closing statement...I didn't really understand it. :D

[Mattingly]

I wouldn't be surprised if A-Rod encounters some high and tight pitches when he faces the White Sox.
Ever heard of Randy Johnson? Two can play that game.

Now why would Ozzie command his guys to throw chin music because of a comment that Ozzie himself made about Alex? If it were the other way around, I could see it. But throwing at him would be literally adding insult to injury ... or the other way around.

Someone I know on another board mentioned that Ozzie has become the latest incarnation of Curt Schilling.

First Torre, now A-Rod. How's next? Jeter? I just hope for his sake that he can win it more than once.

[TonyStarks]

Someone I know on another board mentioned that Ozzie has become the latest incarnation of Curt Schilling.



Whooooa there Mattingly.
Lets not get ahead of ourselves...whoever said that doesn't like to hear the truth.

I think you already know my feelings towards Barry Bonds...well Curt Shilling is a notch this big " " below him.

There is no way that Shilling and Guillen are comparable.


But I do agree with you...there is no reason why ChiSox pitchers would be throwing at ARod. ARod's done nothing to the Sox or to Guillen's countrymen.

[Evangelion]

Ev,
The reason Nomar is playing for Mexico is because his parents are Mexican.
Which makes him an American of Mexican desent (sp?). His father named him Nomar...because it's Ramon spelled backwards which I believe is his name.
If you lived in America all or most your life, then you should play for Team USA. You might have another countries blood in you, but you weren't raised there, so how can you represent a country you never or barely lived at? Sure, your parents could teach you their culture, but you still haven't or barely have been in that country to really experience that country and it's culture.

With that type of logic, Team USA should not exist. Everyone has blood that trace back to another country. Since I have little Swedish and Japanese blood in me, I should decide to play for Team Sweden or Japan, even though I have never been to Sweden and barely ever been to Japan.
How do you know ARod doesn't 'act' Dominican or have a sense of Pride for DR? ARod does have a very big sense of Dominican Pride, but he cannot match Pedro's; Manny's or Papi's because they were born on the island...where as ARod was born on the island too, but Manhattan's island.
How can you say he does? If he didn't say he was Dominican, could you tell he was from Dominican Republic? I know you could figure out Pedro, Manny and Papi are wouldn't you? A-Rod was born and raised in the USA, no? I would assume he would have an accent if he born and raised in the Dominican Republic?

As for my last comment, kinda made a bunch of grammar mistakes, so I'll address that paragraph here.

To sum up that messed up final paragraph, Nomar and Piazza were not smash by everybody so hard, because they didn't make a big issue about playing for Team USA or for their ''heritage'' country like A-Rod did, they just decide where they were going to play and end of story. If A-Rod joined USA or DR right away, think people would make this big of issue about it? I doubt it.

My stand on WC is that you play for the country you were raised most, if not your entire life. Not because you have blood of certain country in you.

[TonyStarks]

If you lived in America all or most your life, then you should play for Team USA. You might have another countries blood in you, but you weren't raised there, so how can you represent a country you never or barely lived at? Sure, your parents could teach you their culture, but you still haven't or barely have been in that country to really experience that country and it's culture.

With that type of logic, Team USA should not exist. Everyone has blood that trace back to another country. Since I have little Swedish and Japanese blood in me, I should decide to play for Team Sweden or Japan, even though I have never been to Sweden and barely ever been to Japan.

How can you say he does? If he didn't say he was Dominican, could you tell he was from Dominican Republic? I know you could figure out Pedro, Manny and Papi are wouldn't you? A-Rod was born and raised in the USA, no? I would assume he would have an accent if he born and raised in the Dominican Republic?



Evan, Eeeasy man. My parents are of Dominican descent. I was born here in the Queens NY. I was not raised in DR nor ever lived there, just as ARod. I have stayed there for months at a time and with family and friends have fully absorbed the Dominican way of life. If you were bi-lingual in Spanish and you heard me speak it, w/o me telling you…you would know that I was Dominican. I have cousins who came here when they were in their teens and they speak perfect English with no accent or hint of one. If I had JUST met ARod and he didn’t tell me he was Dominican, but I heard him speak…I could tell you that he was Dominican.

It’s not that hard. Dominicans have a certain way in which they speak Spanish and anyone who’s met a Dominican can tell you this.

Since your neither Dominican nor Hispanic, I can understand this is something that you cannot understand or this seems alien/foreign to you and most who are not do not understand this. People born in the Dominican Republic or Puerto Rico for that matter…they have this great sense of Pride of where their Heritage comes. It doesn’t matter if they were born on their island or here in the US. Ask anyone of them, “What are you?” or “Where you from” or “What flag do they represent?” and I can assure you that 9 out of 10 will say DR or PR even if they are Americans born of DR or PR parents. Now this doesn’t by any means mean they do not love America any less, but it’s a pride thing. It’s very similar to the Pride that Italians have or show. It’s nothing personal against the US.

This is a Political argument and we could go on forever with it. But this is a Baseball/Yankee forum and I think we should keep it to just that…unless you want one of the ‘Gods’ to step in and they’ll tell us to get a room. If you want to take it to an outside realm, let me know.

But for the record…if I was playing MLB, I would play for the DR team preferably. But that in no way means I love my Home land, USA, any less.

[DoubleX]

Getting back to baseball...

I think Ozzie Guillen is certainly interesting, but I also think he runs his mouth a bit too much. As a manager of a baseball club, he is a position to be a role model to both his team and the fans, and it's something that is implicit in the job. When he runs his mouth, calling people gay and child molestors, he sending a terrible message, even in jest. Moreover, the fact that he has no qualms about blasting former players is also in very poor taste, such as last year when he really laid into Magglio Ordonez after he left. Things are good right now because the Sox are winning, but when things turn sour (and they probably will sooner than later), who will want to play for a manager that might blast them to the public when he gets a chance.

[TonyStarks]

Getting back to baseball...

I think Ozzie Guillen is certainly interesting, but I also think he runs his mouth a bit too much. As a manager of a baseball club, he is a position to be a role model to both his team and the fans, and it's something that is implicit in the job. When he runs his mouth, calling people gay and child molestors, he sending a terrible message, even in jest. Moreover, the fact that he has no qualms about blasting former players is also in very poor taste, such as last year when he really laid into Magglio Ordonez after he left. Things are good right now because the Sox are winning, but when things turn sour (and they probably will sooner than later), who will want to play for a manager that might blast them to the public when he gets a chance.

DX, I dunno. I think that Ozzie shoots from the hip and tells it like it is.
Ozzie is one of those people that either you get him or you don't.
He can rub ppl the wrong way, but I don't think he means any harm.

[SoxSon]

DX, I dunno. I think that Ozzie shoots from the hip and tells it like it is.
Ozzie is one of those people that either you get him or you don't.
He can rub ppl the wrong way, but I don't think he means any harm.


See, Tony, I tend to agree with XX. I get that Ozzie has opinions, and yes, he has the right to express them, but the question is...why would he? I do think he should set a better example. How does it affect him in any way if ARod was appeasing both sides? Why does he care enough to make a public statement on the issue? He may not mean any true harm, but I'd take a guess that ARod isn't too happy with him right now. He may not care, but I think he should.

[DoubleX]

See, Tony, I tend to agree with XX. I get that Ozzie has opinions, and yes, he has the right to express them, but the question is...why would he? I do think he should set a better example. How does it affect him in any way if ARod was appeasing both sides? Why does he care enough to make a public statement on the issue? He may not mean any true harm, but I'd take a guess that ARod isn't too happy with him right now. He may not care, but I think he should.

I think we should maybe frame this post SoxSon. It's been awhile since we so plainly agreed. :p

[SoxSon]

I think we should maybe frame this post SoxSon. It's been awhile since we so plainly agreed. :p


The most upsetting thing is that we probably agree too often, for a Boston fan and a New York fan. Somewhere, there is a room full of Selig's drones, recording and analyzing this harmony. They don't like it one bit.

[TonyStarks]

See, Tony, I tend to agree with XX. I get that Ozzie has opinions, and yes, he has the right to express them, but the question is...why would he? I do think he should set a better example. How does it affect him in any way if ARod was appeasing both sides? Why does he care enough to make a public statement on the issue? He may not mean any true harm, but I'd take a guess that ARod isn't too happy with him right now. He may not care, but I think he should.


True...but maybe he was asked by the reporter.
I cannot tell you because I have yet to read the entire story.

Only excerpts of the story.

[DoubleX]

Just after reading through the posts in this thread, I accidentally caught Guillen being interviewed HBO's Real Sports. It actually warmed me up a little to Guillen. He's certainly brash and headstrong.

[Evangelion]

Ozzie should be a little aware that he might be offend gay people by using the term ''gay'' in an insulting way.

If asked the question, I don't think Ozzie would ''sugar coat'' his reply to please people. I have no problem with Ozzie's method myself. One problem I did have was showing very little class when he gave the choke sign to Indians after they choked last season. That was a bit low even for him.

Ozzie defend comment on Maggs' comments. Maggs called Guillen his enemy and said he had no desire to see his former manager. At this point, Guillen defend himself by countering Maggs' comments. I had no problem when he did that. As for A-Rod, if he was asked the question and answer, then I honestly don't mind him really saying what he didn't. He doesn't have to sugar coat his opinion. I do like him straying away from business like community MLB has turned into. Instead of worrying about his comments, he just speaks what's on his mind.

TonyStarks, I don't think I would change my stand about WBC. Players should play for country they have lived in for most their life or their entire life. Just my stand that won't change and I doubt your stand will change either, so I'll end there. If I offend, then I apologize. My manner of speaking is a bit blunt and might come off rude.

[TonyStarks]

I see nothing wrong with Ozzie's comments.
They are straight and to the point.

Some might get offended, but honestly people now a days are too damn sensitive and quick to call anyone a racist for even mentioning race. Way too touchy.


Ev, I hear you but I do not agree with you.
I love DR just about as much as I love the US, but giving an opportunity to play for DR I think I may just take them up on the offer.

[TonyStarks]

Anyway, while A-Rod is Dominican, we all know doesn't act Dominican or even have a strong sense of national pride like players from Dominican Republic like Manny Rameriz and David Ortiz. I did find that media coverage on what team A-Rod was going to play for ridiculous and I find it even more ridiculous he would even be allowed to play for Team Dominican.


Ev,
I just found out, through researching and reading more on his Bio, that ARod did in fact live in the Dominican Republic from age 4 until 8 then he came back to the US.

[elpedro]

ARod really wanted to play for the DR team but he was pressure to play for the US...it just came down to business.

[TonyStarks]

ARod really wanted to play for the DR team but he was pressure to play for the US...it just came down to business.

And I don't deny that.
I think that there may have been sponsership pressure on him.
But by playing for the DR team it could have opened him up for more endorsements.

More Latin American/Caribbean endorsements could have come his way.

[Chisox73]

I'll chime in here from a Chicago perspective.

First of all,Ozzie apologized for his comments about A-Rod in his 1st ST press conference this afternoon.

Ozzie was pretty much raked over the coals by many Chitown sports talk radio hosts for those comments,just like he was raked over the coals by those same people for not going to the White House last week.

During his press conference,Ozzie also mentioned about the Nomar statement in which he said that Nomar only wanted to play for Mexico because he went to Cancun once.Ozzie said with his familiar chuckle that he thought that his Nomar statement was funny.

On a personal note,I really enjoyed reading this thread and getting a perspective from the great Yankee fans here at BBF.

[DoubleX]

I'll chime in here from a Chicago perspective.

First of all,Ozzie apologized for his comments about A-Rod in his 1st ST press conference this afternoon.

Ozzie was pretty much raked over the coals by many Chitown sports talk radio hosts for those comments,just like he was raked over the coals by those same people for not going to the White House last week.

During his press conference,Ozzie also mentioned about the Nomar statement in which he said that Nomar only wanted to play for Mexico because he went to Cancun once.Ozzie said with his familiar chuckle that he thought that his Nomar statement was funny.

On a personal note,I really enjoyed reading this thread and getting a perspective from the great Yankee fans here at BBF.

Ozzie was raked over the coals in Chicago? Wow. What is the perception of Ozzie in Chicago? Does the public/media generally like him? I'm surprised they would chastise him for the A-Rod remarks given that it seems everyone in the past couple of years has had something negative to say about A-Rod, so what's the big deal of Ozzie says it, particularly since everyone knows that he shoots from the hip anyway? Oh well. I am curious though to hear about how the fans perceive Ozzie over there.

[Chisox73]

Out here,White Sox fans generally love Ozzie.The most common thing you'll hear is,"That's Ozzie being Ozzie." Let's face it,he's a very unique character,no question about it.

Most of the sports talkers are basically just trying to stir the pot,that's all.We just let the comments go in one ear,and out the other.

But Ozzie really took a hit from Chicago Mayor Richard Daley for not going to the White House last week.Ozzie was scheduled to be on vacation that week anyway.The White House ceremony was actually moved from a previous date,and it conflicted with Ozzie's vacation.He was so much in demand since last October that he basically had no time for family.

Even Jerry Reinsdorf angrily said on The Score last week that Ozzie not going to the White House was a non-story.Even President Bush joked about it.He said that if he saw the waether that day,he would have skipped the White House himself.

Ozzie by far is the most popular member of the White Sox.A WS title aside,he's put a face on what was once a faceless organization.

[DoubleX]

Out here,White Sox fans generally love Ozzie.The most common thing you'll hear is,"That's Ozzie being Ozzie." Let's face it,he's a very unique character,no question about it.

Most of the sports talkers are basically just trying to stir the pot,that's all.We just let the comments go in one ear,and out the other.

But Ozzie really took a hit from Chicago Mayor Richard Daley for not going to the White House last week.Ozzie was scheduled to be on vacation that week anyway.The White House ceremony was actually moved from a previous date,and it conflicted with Ozzie's vacation.He was so much in demand since last October that he basically had no time for family.

Even Jerry Reinsdorf angrily said on The Score last week that Ozzie not going to the White House was a non-story.Even President Bush joked about it.He said that if he saw the waether that day,he would have skipped the White House himself.

Ozzie by far is the most popular member of the White Sox.A WS title aside,he's put a face on what was once a faceless organization.

I'm happy for the White Sox, and they deserve the attention and praise. Still though, it's amazing how much more coverage the Red Sox winning received than the White Sox.

How are the White Sox comparing the Cubs now that the White Sox are champs while the Cubs still linger? Have the White Sox made up significant ground in Chicago? I've never been there, but I've always had the impression that the White Sox have long been second-fiddle, kind of like the Mets here in New York, but even moreso. In the 80s when the Mets were going strong, they did seem to have the pulse of the city, so perhaps the White Sox can do the same thing with Chicago?

[Chisox73]

To answer your question DoubleX,right now,the White Sox have pretty much grabbed the media spotlight in Chicago,much to the chagrin of many fans in Cub Nation.

The Sox have long been the 2nd team in Chicago for decades.In most years when the Sox have had contending ballclubs,and this goes back to the 1950s mind you,and the Cubs have been the complete opposite,it was the Cubs that have gotten the majority of the attention.

In a way,it would be unfair to blame WGN for this.True,they are bvasically known as "The Cubs Station".But prior to 1967,the carried all Cubs and Sox home games.

But most of the times,it was the White Sox who ended up shooting themsleves in the foot PR wise,and that became very bad for their image,whethere it was leaving WGN in 1967 for a tiny UHF TV station(or as I call it,a double digit station),bumbling ownership,threats of moving in the late 60s through the late 80s,the location of the ballpark,or in some cases,just bad baseball.

As of this posting,the White Sox have already sold over 2 million tickets for the upcoming season.There's a real possibility that both Chicago teams could draw 3 million fans this year.If you were to ask me not even 5 years ago if any Chicago team would ever draw 3 million,I would have laughed in your face.But it will happen this year.

Personally,after seeing the team win the World Series,it really doesn't matter what kind of media coverage we get this year.championships aren't won going through the media,they are won by the players in between the white lines.

I hope this helps you out DoubleX.

[DoubleX]

Interesting ChiSox. Thanks for the insight into Chicago's baseball pulse.

[Chisox73]

No problem.Glad I could help out a fellow fourmer.:)