What Baseball Greats Wore #8???

[cammysosa]

:hp I just got a number 8 jersey, and aside from Yogi Berra, who else has worn number 8? All I can think of are Ron Kumer and Mark Gradzelanek...I am getting depressed. HELP!!!

[BoSox Rule]

A Hall of Famer...
A Red Sox legend..
That last Triple Crown Winner.

Carl Yastrzemski
http://www.onlinesports.com/images/mn-rs67h-8.jpg
http://www.photofile.com/Photos/Albums/Whats_Hot_Page/Legends_Album/images/MLB/Yastrzemski_Legend_jpg.jpg

[ElHalo]

No, no, no, BoSox Rule, he was asking about baseball GREATS, not baseball MEDIOCRES.

By the way... Yogi wore number 8 for the Yanks, but so did Bill Dickey. It's the only number for the Yanks that's currently retired for two players.

That will change, someday, because #42 is retired for Jacky Robinson... but it's also worn by Mariano Rivera.

[cammysosa]

Sorry, I forgot to say I was a kid. I was hoping to find someone who is playing in MLB now, who wasn't a crummy player.

[The Dude]

For previous greats Joe Morgan, Yogi Berra, Yaz, and Ripken Jr. wore 8.

I can't think of anyone prominent in the Majors right now who wears 8 (then again it's 11:30 and I'm really tired).

After doing a little research, the only two everday players that I know of who wear the number 8-
Carlos Guillen, SS on the Detroit Tigers
Mark Loretta, 2B on the San Diego Padres

Javy Lopez wore 8 up until this season ('cause Ripken's 8 is retired of course).

It seems to be a very popular number for backup catchers.

[cammysosa]

I am familiar with Mark Loretta and Javy Lopez; Mark Loretta keeps getting hits off of Nomo and Odalis Perez every time!! Actually, most of the Padres do, even on opening day! :grouchy :grouchy :grouchy :grouchy Let me know if there are any active number 8's that don't suck!!

[BoSox Rule]

El Halo- Yaz his hardly mediocre. If he's mediocre then what is Yogi?

[DODGER DEB]

You guys keep talking about ALL those GREATS like Yogi, Yaz, and Ripkin that wore #8.

Well, in BROOKLYN, WE had the inimitable GEORGE "SHOTGUN" SHUBA who wore #8 for several years. Granted, HE didn't make any record books, but HE was OURS, and truly was "one of a kind"! ;) :D

c.

:radio OUR MOMENT IN TIME - OCTOBER 4, 1955 - 3:43PM :clapping

[Captain Cold Nose]

I am familiar with Mark Loretta and Javy Lopez; Mark Loretta keeps getting hits off of Nomo and Odalis Perez every time!! Actually, most of the Padres do, even on opening day! :grouchy :grouchy :grouchy :grouchy Let me know if there are any active number 8's that don't suck!!


Guillen would be a good choice. He's having a great year, but he wears number 9, according to mlb.com.
Verification on which is correct, please!

You're better off going for the historic greats mentioned, although you seem to know about Loretta. I take it you're not a fan of his, Cammy.

[Bob Hannah]

[QUOTE=DODGER DEB]You guys keep talking about ALL those GREATS like Yogi, Yaz, and Ripkin that wore #8.

Well, in BROOKLYN, WE had the inimitable GEORGE "SHOTGUN" SHUBA who wore #8 for several years..."

Roger Kahn coverd Shuba well in The Boys of Summer, just about the only place you can read about him. Great nickname, described the way the line drives rang off his bat. I like the desciption of Shuba going home after games and practicing hundreds of swings nightly-in his basement, hitting a wad of tape suspended from a cord attached to his basement ceiling. A far cry from todays training methods, but effective enough to keep a job as major leaguer.

[RuthMayBond]

I wish Shuba was nicer. I called him up and asked if I could stop by his place for an autograph and he told me no. Back to #8 - Stargell, GCarter, Dawson, Lombardi.

[ElHalo]

El Halo- Yaz his hardly mediocre. If he's mediocre then what is Yogi?

No harm meant, just ribbing ya. Yaz was of course a great player. 3000 hits, triple crown, all that.

Of course, my most lasting memory of Yaz is him falling to his knees after Bucky Dent's home run.

Great player. Though no Yogi, of course.

[BoSox Rule]

He's better than Yogi. He was also one of the best defensive leftfielders ever.

[ElHalo]

He's better than Yogi. He was also one of the best defensive leftfielders ever.

He is indeed one of the best defensive left fielders of all time. THat's not saying much, however, since you usually stick your worst fielder in Left Field.

And while I won't deny that he was a great player, he was in no way, shape, or form better than Yogi. Yogi deservedly earned a spot on the All - Century team. Yaz, no so much. Yogi won 3 AL MVP awards. Yaz, no so much. Yogi is unquestionably if not the best, then one of the two or three best ever at his position. Yaz, no so much.

Ted Williams was better than Yogi, and Tris Speaker, and Jimmie Foxx. Beyond that, I'd be hard pressed to come up with a Red Sox player better than Yogi Berra.

[RuthMayBond]

He is indeed one of the best defensive left fielders of all time. THat's not saying much, however, since you usually stick your worst fielder in Left Field.

And while I won't deny that he was a great player, he was in no way, shape, or form better than Yogi. Yogi deservedly earned a spot on the All - Century team. Yaz, no so much. Yogi won 3 AL MVP awards. Yaz, no so much. Yogi is unquestionably if not the best, then one of the two or three best ever at his position. Yaz, no so much.What about sticking your worst fielder in right or at first? I'm still working on my hypothetical Gold Gloves project, and Yaz gets close to one many years. I have him winning one in '64 and being considered for other years. Does Bench deserve a spot on the All-Century team? Yes, Berra won 3 MVPs, but I have doubts that he deserved any of them, whereas Yaz probably deserved '65, '67, '68 AND '70. Thank you New York press :grouchy

[Captain Cold Nose]

He is indeed one of the best defensive left fielders of all time. THat's not saying much, however, since you usually stick your worst fielder in Left Field.

And while I won't deny that he was a great player, he was in no way, shape, or form better than Yogi. Yogi deservedly earned a spot on the All - Century team. Yaz, no so much. Yogi won 3 AL MVP awards. Yaz, no so much. Yogi is unquestionably if not the best, then one of the two or three best ever at his position. Yaz, no so much.

Ted Williams was better than Yogi, and Tris Speaker, and Jimmie Foxx. Beyond that, I'd be hard pressed to come up with a Red Sox player better than Yogi Berra.

It's not really a fair comparison, as Berra was a catcher and Yaz a left fielder. Yaz was a converted shortstop, mind you, only because they wanted someone to fill in for Ted Williams after he retired. I doubt they stuck him in left because he would have been a liability elsewhere. He did win a Gold Glove at first, and did make some incredible defenisve plays to justify his regard defensively. He wasn't Dave Kingman.

I would rank both among the top five at their positions, although Berra has a closer argument to Cochrane, Bench, Campanella and whoever than Yaz does with Williams, Bonds and Stan Musial, because of hitting prowess.

I'll be honest, Yaz is my all-time favorite player, but it's easier to replace a player of Yaz's ability at his position than it is to replace Berra at his. In the grand scheme of things, a catcher of Berra's ability will keep you as a contender. Yaz might be a better athlete, he might have done more in terms of overall production, and a great player, but I'd take Berra when building a team.

[BoSox Rule]

Ted Williams was better than Yogi, and Tris Speaker, and Jimmie Foxx. Beyond that, I'd be hard pressed to come up with a Red Sox player better than Yogi Berra.

Red Sox players I would take (are better) than Yogi (and look at the stats before you talk)
Wade Boggs
Joe Cronin
Bobby Doerr
Jimmie Foxx
Nomar Garciaparra (won't even be close when it's said and done)
Jim Rice
Yaz

Two that aren't even remotely close:
Ted Williams
Manny Ramirez

[2Chance]

BoSox Rule: Come in out of the sun, buddy! Hydrate! :waving

[ElHalo]

Red Sox players I would take (are better) than Yogi (and look at the stats before you talk)
Wade Boggs
Joe Cronin
Bobby Doerr
Jimmie Foxx
Nomar Garciaparra (won't even be close when it's said and done)
Jim Rice
Yaz

Two that aren't even remotely close:
Ted Williams
Manny Ramirez

Wow. I've heard of being a homer, but this is insane.

Jim Rice? Bobby Doerr? You kidding me?

Sorry, man, you've got a crazy insane Red Sox bias, and this just simply isn't the case.

[BoSox Rule]

Look at the offensive numbers, then tell me I am biased.

What if I cut the list to
Williams
Ramirez
Garciaparra
Foxx
Yaz

[ElHalo]

Look at the offensive numbers, then tell me I am biased.

What if I cut the list to
Williams
Ramirez
Garciaparra
Foxx
Yaz

I've already said I'd grant you Foxx and Williams.

Manny Ramirez is a much, much greater hitter than Yogi, sure... not even close. But, including this year, he's played all of four years for the Red Sox. I'd like to see a bit more time than that to start saying he's better than Yogi. He's got a shot, though, despite his severe limitations... i.e., he plays left field, and plays it badly.

Garciaparra, no. He's got a career OPS+ of 135, compared to Yogi's 125, but that number is going to go down as Garciaparra goes into his career decline... I'd expect he'd finish somewhere around 130.

And Yaz has a career OPS+ of 130.

The big thing I think you're forgetting here is that Yogi was a CATCHER. All of this short list of guys were better hitters than Yogi, but none of them were catchers. Having a great hitting catcher is a HUGE advantage, because it allows you to put a great hitting left fielder, first baseman, or third baseman out on the field too. If you've got Dave Valle as your catcher, you're stuck with a hole in your lineup. If you've got Yogi, you can stick him in the fifth slot and shove somebody who's a great hitter (say, Moose Skowron) in the lineup in left field, significantly upgrading your offense.

Now, I know you don't care about defense all that much. But Yogi was a GREAT defensive catcher. Absolutely first class. And catcher is the single most important defensive position. All the great defensive left fielders in the world aren't worth a stellar defensive catcher. Nomar's the only guy on the list who played an important defensive position... but catcher's more important than SS, and while Nomar is an above average defensive SS, Yogi was an excellent defensive catcher. Point Yogi.

If Yogi was, say, a rightfielder, then you'd have arguments for all of these guys. As it is, I'll grant you Williams and Foxx (and Speaker, who you're somehow neglecting), and MAYBE Manny if he can keep putting up the numbers he's been putting up for five years or more. They had a big enough advantage offensively over Yogi to overcome the shortcomings of their positions.

But Yaz and Nomar? No, sorry. They were both slightly better at offense than Yogi, but not enough better to make up for the fact that they weren't catchers.

[BoSox Rule]

Hello. Yogi is a catcher. Good argument. NOMAR IS A SHORTSTOP!

[ElHalo]

Hello. Yogi is a catcher. Good argument. NOMAR IS A SHORTSTOP!

You're right. Which would give him major bonus points if we were arguing Nomar v. Yaz.

But Catcher is the most important offensive position... beats out SS, which is second most important.

When Yogi was Nomar's age, Yogi had put up a career OPS+ of 131. Nomar's is currently 135. So Nomar's offensively better... but not by a ton.

When Yogi was Nomar's age, he'd had 6 top 10 RBI seasons. Nomar has 2.

Yogi had 6 top 10 HR seasons. Nomar has 1.

Yogi had 7 top 10 SLG seasons. Nomar has 3.

Yogi had 2 top 10 BA seasons. Nomar has 4.

Yogi'd had 5 top 4 MVP seasons (including 2 wins, and he won another MVP the following year). Nomar's had one... he finished 2nd in 1998.

Yogi had 4 top 10 OPS seasons. Nomar had 2.

Note that I'm not using the numbers for Yogi's whole career; just through the time when he was the same age as Nomar. To make it fair for Nomar.

With the exception of BA, Yogi blows Nomar away.

And Yogi played a more important position (though Nomar plays a very important one himself), AND Yogi was a Gold Glove calibre defender, while Nomar is not.

Sorry. Yogi wins.

But I will give you this: Through today, Nomar's better than Jeter. Though I think that will change by the time their careers are over, since I think Jeter will stay relatively healthy, and I can't say the same of Nomar.

[BoSox Rule]

You sure about that?
Yogi blows him away in everything?

Nomar blows Yogi away in
BA
OBP
SLG
HR
RBI
DOUBLES
RUNS
TRIPLES
TOTAL BASES
STOLEN BASES

that is per year. Where did you get your numbers? I'm not even sure Yogi earned 1 MVP. Forget about winning 3.

Nomar's not that bad a defender, either. Sure as hell better than Jeter.

[mmorgan1b]

Albert Belle wore #8. Albert Belle was the man....until he started running down children on halloween night in his bronco :noidea

[ElHalo]

You sure about that?
Yogi blows him away in everything?

Nomar blows Yogi away in
BA
OBP
SLG
HR
RBI
DOUBLES
RUNS
TRIPLES
TOTAL BASES
STOLEN BASES

that is per year. Where did you get your numbers? I'm not even sure Yogi earned 1 MVP. Forget about winning 3.

Nomar's not that bad a defender, either. Sure as hell better than Jeter.

Two things about this:

One, I'm assuming you're using career numbers per 162 games... which is ludicrous, since a) Nomar hasn't had his career decline yet, and b) Yogi was extraordinarily durable, catching over 140 games (out of a 154 game season) 5 times, and Nomar is extraordinarily injury prone, missing an average of forty one games a season since 1997.

Also, you completely fail to take into account park factors (Fenway inflates numbers, Yankee Stadium lowers numbers for everything except home runs for left handed pull hitters). And you completely fail to take into account era adjustments... the league average OPS in 99-2000, Nomar's two best years, was .801. The league average OPS in 53-54, Yogi's best years, was .726. You can't just wholesale compare raw statistics from one era to the other.

And yes, Nomar's an above average defender. I'm not saying he's bad. But Yogi was a Gold Glove calibre defender (if they'd had Gold Gloves then... I believe RMB's research has shown Yogi would have won a bunch of them... between 3 and 6, can't recall exactly how many). Nomar, while a good defensive shortstop, is far from Gold Glove calibre.

[MetsFan11368]

Best New York Met ever to wear # 8?

That would have to be recently inducted into the HoF catcher Gary Carter.

BTW, # 8 has not been issued to anyone by the Mets since his induction, so maybe there are plans… :)

[RuthMayBond]

But Yogi was a Gold Glove calibre defender (if they'd had Gold Gloves then... I believe RMB's research has shown Yogi would have won a bunch of them... between 3 and 6, can't recall exactly how many). Nomar, while a good defensive shortstop, is far from Gold Glove calibre.Wow, a reference to my completely worthless study :laugh Actually, I've tried to make it as accurate as possible. I have Berra winning GG in '50, 51, 52, 54, 57, 59 (with the caveat that I don't have CS stats, and even if I did, I'm not sure how I'd work it in). I haven't gotten up to Nomar's years yet, but it is difficult to earn a GG when you're injured all the time.

[cammysosa]

Thanks, everyone, so who will it be? My city championship is in a week...I want my game to be a tribute to the greatest #8 ever! I play catcher, and am the closing pitcher. :clapping

[BustaJ2632]

As a Cal fan and Yankee hater I'd have to say
......
......
Yogi. Especially if you're a catcher.

[Imapotato]

What about sticking your worst fielder in right or at first? I'm still working on my hypothetical Gold Gloves project, and Yaz gets close to one many years. I have him winning one in '64 and being considered for other years. Does Bench deserve a spot on the All-Century team? Yes, Berra won 3 MVPs, but I have doubts that he deserved any of them, whereas Yaz probably deserved '65, '67, '68 AND '70. Thank you New York press :grouchy

I am in agreement with El Halo, the worst OF is usually LF nowadays not RF. There are many LH and SH in MLB that its not like Little League and put the worst kid in RF...which is what my kid plays :(, but he has fun and thats whats important :)

A LF has about the same range as a RF but he has a weaker arm...or at least thats what I would look for in a LF

As for greats with #8...in the old days numbers went by batting order so not alot of #8 could ever be considered great, except Bill Dickey who had superstars from 1-7 in the lineup.

[LarrySC]

Another baseball great the wore #8 was Pittsburgh Pirate HOF player, and the leader of the 1979 World Champion "Family"....

http://www.baseballtoddsdugout.com/williecard.jpg

Willie "Pops" Stargell

[sultanofswat3]

You sure about that?
Yogi blows him away in everything?

Nomar blows Yogi away in
BA
OBP
SLG
HR
RBI
DOUBLES
RUNS
TRIPLES
TOTAL BASES
STOLEN BASES

that is per year. Where did you get your numbers? I'm not even sure Yogi earned 1 MVP. Forget about winning 3.

Nomar's not that bad a defender, either. Sure as hell better than Jeter.

Lets not forget THE most important stat of all:

No. of World Championships with Berra was the primary Yankee catcher:8 [funny coincedence huh?]

No. of World Championships with Nomar as the primary Sox SS: well..you know...
:laugh

[Bill Burgess]

Cammysosa,

I, for one, am very highly honored to welcome you to The Fever, site of Baseball's best-informed fans. I am so very inpressed that you could find your way here.

If your choices are Joe Morgan, Yogi Berra, Carl Yaz, and Cal Ripken, I'd say that Yaz is probably the stronget candidate.

And you MUST please forgive the guys here who have completely ignored your efforts to join us. For a 10 yr. old kid to find us and have the guts to just jump in, is so amazing to me! As far as I'm concerned, YOU and not Yogi vs. whoever, is the interesting part.

I hope you feel secure enough to follow along, and chime in with your precious pearls, whenever you feel the urge. Thank you for gracing us with your presence, cammy boy. It's wonderful to have such a bright lad with us!

Bill Burgess

[cammysosa]

Well, I guess we have to look at the total accomplishments of the man, including his driving offense. :dance

[johnoff]

cal ripken jr. wore the jersey #8.

[BoSox Rule]

I was bad.

[Myankee4life]

I was bad.

Yes you were.

[soberdennis]

He's better than Yogi. He was also one of the best defensive leftfielders ever.
Yogi was considered a great defensive catcher and that is a difficult postion defensively, possibly the most difficult.
As for Yaz, this Yankee fan agrees that Yaz was a great left fielder. I have never seen anyone play the wall like Yaz did.